The Worst of Road Signs

[Gnutella]

The bottom sign is an extruded panel sign. Not sure exactly what term describes the top sign, but it's more like the signage used in North Carolina and in a majority of Virginia installations (a few extruded panel signs have started to pop up in Virginia).

I like extruded panel signs. If the sign gets damaged, only part of it has to be replaced. They look more substantial too. As for the signs in Virginia and North Carolina, the segmentation on them is more consistent than it is on the "inferior" example I illustrated above.

I'm beginning to think that PennDOT quality control largely depends on the district. District 11 and District 12 (Pittsburgh area) seem to be the best, while District 1 (Erie) and District 4 (Scranton/Wilkes-Barre) seem to be the worst.

[Thing 342]

The bottom sign is an extruded panel sign. Not sure exactly what term describes the top sign, but it's more like the signage used in North Carolina and in a majority of Virginia installations (a few extruded panel signs have started to pop up in Virginia).

I like extruded panel signs. If the sign gets damaged, only part of it has to be replaced. They look more substantial too.

You think this now, until you get one of these babies (photo not by me):

[Ian]

The bottom sign is an extruded panel sign. Not sure exactly what term describes the top sign, but it's more like the signage used in North Carolina and in a majority of Virginia installations (a few extruded panel signs have started to pop up in Virginia).

I like extruded panel signs. If the sign gets damaged, only part of it has to be replaced. They look more substantial too. As for the signs in Virginia and North Carolina, the segmentation on them is more consistent than it is on the "inferior" example I illustrated above.

Fun fact: All of the extruded panel signs in PA are made by contractors, while the style of sign seen in the top photos (the more flat back) are the ones made from PennDOT temselves. I found this out from a person who works at PennDOT's sign shop.

[Gnutella]

The bottom sign is an extruded panel sign. Not sure exactly what term describes the top sign, but it's more like the signage used in North Carolina and in a majority of Virginia installations (a few extruded panel signs have started to pop up in Virginia).

I like extruded panel signs. If the sign gets damaged, only part of it has to be replaced. They look more substantial too. As for the signs in Virginia and North Carolina, the segmentation on them is more consistent than it is on the "inferior" example I illustrated above.

Fun fact: All of the extruded panel signs in PA are made by contractors, while the style of sign seen in the top photos (the more flat back) are the ones made from PennDOT temselves. I found this out from a person who works at PennDOT's sign shop.

Which contractors?

[J N Winkler]

The bottom sign is an extruded panel sign. Not sure exactly what term describes the top sign, but it's more like the signage used in North Carolina and in a majority of Virginia installations (a few extruded panel signs have started to pop up in Virginia).

I think it's an extrusheet variant.

These kinds of signs seem to be common in the Pittsburgh, Harrisburg and Philadelphia areas. Whoever fabricates them should get the contract for highway signage all across the Commonwealth, because they do an excellent job of it.

Contractors are contractually required to fabricate signs as instructed in the plans and specifications, so they are only one variable in the process.  PennDOT handles guide sign design on a district-by-district basis, through two main mechanisms:  as part of larger contracts (anything from resurfacing up to major Interstate reconstruction and widening), for which sign panel detail sheets are part of the construction plans, and through on-call sign replacement contracts, for which only a proposal book and an approximate estimate of quantities is furnished to the contractor during bidding.  In the latter case, the actual sign panel detail sheets (generally consisting of one SignCAD drawing per letter-size sheet) are given to the contractor after award as part of a work order.

District 11 (Pittsburgh) generally produces the cleanest sign panel detail sheets; they are consistently pattern-accurate.  District 1 (Erie) is a heavy SignCAD user, so one would ordinarily expect it to produce good sign panel detail sheets and indeed they are nearly always pattern-accurate, but the majority of signing plans I have seen from them have had problems with uppercase/lowercase size mismatch.  Districts 2 and 9 (northern Pennsylvania) are pretty good, Districts 5 (Harrisburg) and 6 (Philadelphia) are pretty hit-and-miss, District 10 (north of Pittsburgh and environs) rarely does pattern-accurate sign panel detail sheets but the ones it does do are generally comparable to District 11 in quality, and District 4 hardly ever does pattern-accurate sheets.

PennDOT also seems to practice local option with regard to sign design software.  SignCAD is definitely preferred in some districts, notably District 1.  I am unsure how extensively GuidSIGN is used.  PennDOT also appears to have its own in-house sign design software, for which the characteristic output is a letter spacing table immediately beneath the sign drawing that has data for each letter on its own line.  This is used quite extensively in Districts 6 and 11.  It imitates the traditional presentation of sign drawings in the pure signing contracts which PennDOT did from the 1960's to the 1980's, during the heyday of initial Interstate construction.  Those plans were drawn up by a specialist sign design unit working out of PennDOT headquarters in Harrisburg, and are a key reason older nonreflective button-copy laminated-panel large guide signs in Pennsylvania are cleaner and more consistent in appearance than newer signs.

[WillWeaverRVA]

The bottom sign is an extruded panel sign. Not sure exactly what term describes the top sign, but it's more like the signage used in North Carolina and in a majority of Virginia installations (a few extruded panel signs have started to pop up in Virginia).

I like extruded panel signs. If the sign gets damaged, only part of it has to be replaced. They look more substantial too.

You think this now, until you get one of these babies (photo not by me):

This reminds me, the HOV lane extension project on I-95 has led to a couple other Frankensigns made out of previously gantry-mounted signs that were disassembled, welded together, and mounted on poles. I'll see if I have any pictures.

[VCB02FromRoblox]

The bottom sign is an extruded panel sign. Not sure exactly what term describes the top sign, but it's more like the signage used in North Carolina and in a majority of Virginia installations (a few extruded panel signs have started to pop up in Virginia).

I like extruded panel signs. If the sign gets damaged, only part of it has to be replaced. They look more substantial too.

You think this now, until you get one of these babies (photo not by me):

The interesting thing about this sign is it looks as if there's not enough space for there to be an "O" between the "T" and extruded "N".

[jakeroot]

The bottom sign is an extruded panel sign. Not sure exactly what term describes the top sign, but it's more like the signage used in North Carolina and in a majority of Virginia installations (a few extruded panel signs have started to pop up in Virginia).

I like extruded panel signs. If the sign gets damaged, only part of it has to be replaced. They look more substantial too.

You think this now, until you get one of these babies (photo not by me):

The interesting thing about this sign is it looks as if there's not enough space for there to be an "O" between the "T" and extruded "N".

It appears the new 4-section sign covers an old sign (not sure if it too was 4-section). When the far-right segment fell off, it revealed the old sign. Not sure what the old sign said, but "Washington" was at least further left.

With that said, the sign is still odd because the new, now missing right-most section must not have been a very good sign in regards to keeping some distance from the border. The "on" must have been damn near on the border (not to mention the "TH" in "north".

[PurdueBill]

Was the "new" 4-section sign wider than the old, extending further to the right?  It would seem like it would have to have.

There used to be some good examples of similar layering on some signs on I-70 in Ohio, near the OH 49 exits and between Hilliard-Rome and Plain City exits.  One such sign lost a panel once and scars of old button copy, like the shadows in the I-95 sign above, were visible on the previous green layer covered with later sheeting.
At least some of those signs are gone now; the one that lost a panel while still in service was fully replaced (resulting in button copy and Clearview next to each other on the same gantry).

[apeman33]

DSC04057 by okroads, on Flickr

On I-65 North in Homewood, AL, there is this unusual merge sign. Photo taken by me on 3-22-14.

For a few moments I thought that the sign was just rotated oddly. Then I realized what was really going on. I wonder if it was intended to be mounted that way or if the crew mounting it realized the arrow would be pointing the wrong way and decided on their own to rotate the sign so that the arrow was pointing in the correct direction.

[vtk]

The bottom sign is an extruded panel sign. Not sure exactly what term describes the top sign, but it's more like the signage used in North Carolina and in a majority of Virginia installations (a few extruded panel signs have started to pop up in Virginia).

I like extruded panel signs. If the sign gets damaged, only part of it has to be replaced. They look more substantial too.

You think this now, until you get one of these babies (photo not by me):

The interesting thing about this sign is it looks as if there's not enough space for there to be an "O" between the "T" and extruded "N".

I think this sign was 12" wider before it got damaged.

[PHLBOS]

It appears the new 4-section sign covers an old sign (not sure if it too was 4-section). When the far-right segment fell off, it revealed the old sign. Not sure what the old sign said, but "Washington" was at least further left.

The old sign likely had the same 95 NORTH Washington message but had the left turn arrow centrally-located below the destination listing and may not have had any EXIT ONLY references.

[1995hoo]

BTW, here is a Street View of what's at that spot in Richmond now....

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Richmond,+VA/@37.586759,-77.475217,3a,75y,107.66h,86.91t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sFjUX3UZtYEZ7uPuA4tvCeA!2e0!4m2!3m1!1s0x89b111095799c9ed:0xbfd83e6de2423cc5

[Big John]

^^ And why a skewed gantry?  It would read better perpendicular to the road.

[jakeroot]

^^ And why a skewed gantry?  It would read better perpendicular to the road.

I think it's the angle. A couple more clicks down the road and it appears normal.

[dfnva]

BTW, here is a Street View of what's at that spot in Richmond now....

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Richmond,+VA/@37.586759,-77.475217,3a,75y,107.66h,86.91t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sFjUX3UZtYEZ7uPuA4tvCeA!2e0!4m2!3m1!1s0x89b111095799c9ed:0xbfd83e6de2423cc5

Interesting an extruded panel sign was used in this case (I didn't know it was called that until reading this thread). I wonder in VDOT does the same thing as PA -- that contractors make the extruded panel signs and VDOT (in house) makes the traditional bolted-together signs ?  i.e. In some cases (road construction projects projects like I-495 HOT lanes, VA-286 grade separation in Fair Lakes), extruded panel signs are used, but in others, the traditional style is used (new BGS's to replace damaged ones or damaged gantries, BGS refreshes on I-395).

[J N Winkler]

Interesting an extruded panel sign was used in this case (I didn't know it was called that until reading this thread). I wonder in VDOT does the same thing as PA -- that contractors make the extruded panel signs and VDOT (in house) makes the traditional bolted-together signs ?  i.e. In some cases (road construction projects projects like I-495 HOT lanes, VA-286 grade separation in Fair Lakes), extruded panel signs are used, but in others, the traditional style is used (new BGS's to replace damaged ones or damaged gantries, BGS refreshes on I-395).

I don't think such a neat distinction exists--VDOT has done large signing projects by contract with both types of sign substrate.

[jakeroot]

I'm not going to jump to the conclusion that this is a worst-of sign, but is there anything glaringly wrong with this setup? Sort of an APL but a bit different because it indicates both an immediate and upcoming exit.



Also, don't worry, the colors are the normal yellow and green. Sun slightly distorts the color.

[Zeffy]

I think the I-5 shields are oversized, Bremerton is not perfectly aligned (same with EXIT 132A), and the super small 1/2, but no, nothing really that would strike this sign as being the Worst Of.

[jakeroot]

nothing really that would strike this sign as being the Worst Of.

Good. Just wanted to make sure. Honestly had no idea what other thread would be better suited for such a question. I believe I had heard this gantry come up before but wanted to ask to see if it truly was bad. I pass by it regularly and I really like it, but alas, you can't please everyone.

[PHLBOS]

nothing really that would strike this sign as being the Worst Of.

Good. Just wanted to make sure. Honestly had no idea what other thread would be better suited for such a question. I believe I had heard this gantry come up before but wanted to ask to see if it truly was bad. I pass by it regularly and I really like it, but alas, you can't please everyone.

This thread might've been a more appropriate place to post that I-5 pic.

[jakeroot]

nothing really that would strike this sign as being the Worst Of.

Good. Just wanted to make sure. Honestly had no idea what other thread would be better suited for such a question. I believe I had heard this gantry come up before but wanted to ask to see if it truly was bad. I pass by it regularly and I really like it, but alas, you can't please everyone.

This thread might've been a more appropriate place to post that I-5 pic.

And that's where it shall go.

[okroads]

DSC06217 by okroads, on Flickr

On Interstate 74 East in Morton, IL. Photo taken by me on 5-16-14.

[Brandon]

^^ Oh dear lord, contractor signage. 

[Zeffy]

Taken from GMSV in sucktacular quality, I noticed that this is a blatant example of font stretching and why you shouldn't do it. Unfortunately, you can't really tell how bad it looks from this picture, but, believe me, this is ugly in real life. I'm honestly not even sure the font is right.



This is on US 202 crossing into Pennsylvania from New Jersey, right before the toll booths.