Scariest Road Elements (not bridges)

[Dirt Roads]

Did/Doesn't I-77 have fog warnings south of I-64?  Maybe I'm mixing it up with Virginia south of I-81...

Ouch, my original response went MIA.  Try, try again.

You are indeed mixing it up.  Virginia has lots of fog on most of its assaults on the high passes on the first front of the Blue Ridge:  I-77 Fancy Gap, VA-56 Tye River Gap, US-58 Lover's Leap, I-64 Afton Mountain, US-33 Swift Run Gap and sometimes US-50 Ashby Gap.  Fancy Gap and Afton Mountain in dense fog are on most people's list of <Scariest Road Elements>.  Since I grew up with bad fog, as you say "meh!".

The I-81 assault on Christiansburg Mountain is not near as bad because it is actually ascending the third front (that first front is way over near Bedford and not very high).  Similarly, US-211 over New Market Gap is actually on Massanutten which is the second front and Pass Mountain Gap east of Luray is a fairly low elevation.  Where I used to live, VA-7 through Snickers Gap is too low in elevation to have much fog, but closeby Weather Mountain can get quite a bit of low-hanging fog that looks impressive from folks down in the Loudoun Valley.

I-64 Afton Mountain had all of the original illuminated fog signage and runway lighting mounted in the paint striping.  Eventually, I-77 Fancy Gap got a similar treatment.  I don't know if Afton still has runway lighting, but all of it has been removed over Fancy Gap.  Additionally, Afton got equipped with an early version of VMS specifically for fog warning alerts.  When I-77 got the VMS, it was tied into the VDOT Intelligent Transportation System network and those big VMS were strategically located to facilitate fog alert messages (and more frequent than other sections).  It's been a while since I was on I-64 Afton Mountain, but I'm assuming that VDOT has upgraded to its standard ITS signage (or incorporate those smaller VMSs into the network).

I should add that fog works much differently on the downwind side of the mountains.  For that, someone else needs to talk with a different set of old-timers.

[interstatefan990]

What would it really be called if not "fog line"? The way I learned to drive, I was always told that if you are blinded by an oncoming car's high beams or other obstruction of visibility (e.g., fog), look to the right fog line to guide yourself. Made sense to me that it would be called that.

[Rothman]

What would it really be called if not "fog line"? The way I learned to drive, I was always told that if you are blinded by an oncoming car's high beams or other obstruction of visibility (e.g., fog), look to the right fog line to guide yourself. Made sense to me that it would be called that.

The shoulder line.

[cockroachking]

What would it really be called if not "fog line"? The way I learned to drive, I was always told that if you are blinded by an oncoming car's high beams or other obstruction of visibility (e.g., fog), look to the right fog line to guide yourself. Made sense to me that it would be called that.

The shoulder line.

NYSDOT calls it the "Edge Line."

[NWI_Irish96]

To me, uranium has always been the scariest element.

[The_Ginger]

To me, uranium has always been the scariest element.

But is it a road element?

[Max Rockatansky]

To me, uranium has always been the scariest element.

But is it a road element?

Could have been if the Atomic Energy Commission got their idea approved to blast out a path for I-40 in the Bristol Mountains. 

[PColumbus73]

To me, uranium has always been the scariest element.

But is it a road element?

Uranium Road is the scariest road element

[kphoger]

What would it really be called if not "fog line"?

I've only ever heard it called the "shoulder line", the "edge line", or just the "white line".  I usually call it the "edge line", because that works whether there's a shoulder or not.

This forum is the first time in my life that I've ever heard the term "fog line">

The way I learned to drive, I was always told that if you are blinded by an oncoming car's high beams or other obstruction of visibility (e.g., fog), look to the right fog line to guide yourself. Made sense to me that it would be called that.

I've read in the driver's manual about doing so if someone's brights are blinding you, but it's just not a phenomenon that I specifically connect to fog.  So, until you explained it, I had no idea what the white line had to do with fog.

[interstatefan990]

The shoulder line.

I've only ever heard it called the "shoulder line", the "edge line", or just the "white line".  I usually call it the "edge line", because that works whether there's a shoulder or not.

I agree here, there are plenty of roads with a white line but no shoulder beyond that line, especially here in New York. "Edge line" works far better than "shoulder line".

This forum is the first time in my life that I've ever heard the term "fog line">

Officer Brandon Huntley followed a northbound automobile driven by Fred L. Ross on Interstate 135 near Newton for about 2 miles when he observed Ross' automobile cross over the fog line, the solid white line at the right edge of the outside lane.

Looks like the courts of your state legally use the term "fog line".

[kphoger]

Looks like the courts of your state legally use the term "fog line".

True as that may be, a brief Google search for {"fog line" "kansas"} shows me pretty much zero results that don't have to do with either a small handful of legal cases (but note KSA 8-1522 case annotations 8–10) or else an investigation into possible ethnic profiling by police 16 years ago.  Pretty much nothing else.

On the other hand, I can find plenty of county and city manuals that define the term roadway as being "from shoulder line to shoulder line".

My point stands that normal people around here don't talk about the "fog line", even if the occasional journalist or lawyer does.

For what it's worth, I think engineers tend to use the term "shoulder line" to refer to the edge of the shoulder pavement, not the line that divides travel lane from shoulder.

[Dirt Roads]

What would it really be called if not "fog line"? The way I learned to drive, I was always told that if you are blinded by an oncoming car's high beams or other obstruction of visibility (e.g., fog), look to the right fog line to guide yourself. Made sense to me that it would be called that.

The shoulder line.

NYSDOT calls it the "Edge Line."

Totally missed this definition in the course of the thread until midday yesterday.  So it is ironic that one of my replies is actually on target.  The old runway lighting in the lane striping has indeed been removed on Afton Mountain, presumably replaced by the statewide rumble stripes along the edges.  And as a followup, the old small fog alert VMS signs have been replaced with the statewide ITS version as well.  [Funny seeing a lot of truckers speed past the Google camcar on this steep upgrade].

While I'm rambling, note that the term "lane striping" is more inclusive than the term "fog line" since it includes the double yellow down the middle and the dashed white lines separating lanes in the same direction.  And for some of us old-timers, those "double lines down the middle" were supposed to be white to allow us to pass tractors and motorcycles.

[wxfree]

To me, uranium has always been the scariest element.

But is it a road element?

Gold is a road element.

This is the text of a Texas historic marker along US 81 south of Ringgold.  I can't link to it because the information displays as a pop-up on the map.

From the immemorial man has searched for a land where streets were paved with gold. As early as the 16th Century he was in Texas, lured by Indian reports of "Seven Cities of Gold." They never were found. But they provided the basis for legends of untold riches--stories still spun by some Texans. Surprisingly, perhaps, many of the "tall tales" are more fact than fiction. For instance, both this section of U.S. Highway 81 and a portion of adjacent U.S. Highway 287 are actually paved with gold! The story began in 1936 when the Texas Highway Department was paving the two highways here in Montague County. Sand for the concrete was taken from a nearby pit, opened three years earlier. The grains glistened with such intensity as they were mixed that a closer examination seemed prudent. So a small supply was sent to a Fort Worth laboratory for assay. Back came the report: the sand contained gold. The news sent the owner of the pit in feverish search of the mother lode. But in vain. Top assays on his extensive "soundings" came to no more than 54 cents per ton of ore. His ardor was cooled further when he learned the gold was not free but deeply imbedded in the sand. Disheartened, he settled back into routine sand production. From his pit, however, eventually came $250,000 in gold--all part of the sand. It has been reckoned that as much as $31,000 is distributed along 39 miles of roadway. Some $25,000 in U.S. Highway 81 and $6,000 in U.S. Highway 287. The remainder has gone into other construction in the region, including numerous buildings in which concrete has been used. So it is that today's motorist has discovered the highways paved with gold and the "golden" cities which his predecessors sought in vain. (1963)

The map is here: https://atlas.thc.texas.gov/Map

It's "Mahn tayg" County, not "Mahn t'gyoo"

[Big John]

^^ Simpsons episode where the roads were literally paved with gold and the cars crash for having no traction?

[Dirt Roads]

Gold is a road element.

It is a common teaching in North Carolina that "the roads in Charlotte were once paved with gold".  Not completely untrue, as many of the streets in South Charlotte sit atop a huge goldmine district from the 1830s and 1840s.  Since it was difficult for roads to be constructed in the area due to sandy soils, the roads were covered with what coalminers call "gob" or "gob out" (ergo, the waste rock that easily separates from the "ore").  In this case, it was waste from gold ore (no quotation marks required).  And that byproduct is indeed a type of poor quality gold ore that was used to help stabilize the sandy roadbeds.

Local folklore states that the gold-paved streets were eventually dug up by Charlotte residents.  If these two articles are true, the gold ore gob out is still buried beneath the streets of South Charlotte.  (Go to the end of Part II for the punchline, if you don't want to wade through the history section). 

I don't know if there is much alchemy out there to create gold from cheap metal these days, but there are huge businesses sifting through catalytic waste and producing sufficient amounts of silver to supply the datacenter chip industry (shoutout to Nvidia).  Grab your pickaxe and start digging!

[kphoger]

So... Charlotte is no longer heavenly?

[NWI_Irish96]

So... Charlotte is no longer heavenly?

That depends on whether or not she puts out on the first date.

[LilianaUwU]

those who say they're scared of fog on roads when i drop a motherlode of atomic bombs on their car:

[Beltway]

those who say they're scared of fog on roads when i drop a motherlode of atomic bombs on their car:

You see a blinding flash of light and then a mushroom cloud.

[kphoger]

fog on roads when i drop a motherlode of atomic bombs on their car

This sounds like an obtuse euphemism for farting.

[interstatefan990]

The fog on roads isn't always physical. Sometimes the fog is in the heads of drivers. Especially left lane campers.