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Author Topic: Alaska officials look to resurrect Juneau road project  (Read 7676 times)

Beltway

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Re: Alaska officials look to resurrect Juneau road project
« Reply #50 on: July 20, 2018, 06:20:48 AM »

Whoop-de-do.   

All that work on conducting an EIS/location study, FHWA issues a Record of Decision, and it is "no build".  What a waste of time and resources.  Never heard of "having to pay back Federal funds already spent on the project" that hasn't been built.

« Last Edit: July 20, 2018, 06:23:38 AM by Beltway »
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Rothman

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Re: Alaska officials look to resurrect Juneau road project
« Reply #51 on: July 20, 2018, 08:12:34 AM »

Whoop-de-do.   

All that work on conducting an EIS/location study, FHWA issues a Record of Decision, and it is "no build".  What a waste of time and resources.  Never heard of "having to pay back Federal funds already spent on the project" that hasn't been built.
Ten year PE rule from FHWA:  If you authorized funds on a project for design, you must obtain ROW or go to construction within ten years.  Otherwise, you must pay back the federal funds.

There's also some crazy 20 year rule about ROW authorizations, but at least here in NY, those have been less of an issue.

FHWA has only strictly enforced the 10 year PE rule over the past couple of years. They have also implemented a waiver process to get extensions. 
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Rothman

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texaskdog

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Re: Alaska officials look to resurrect Juneau road project
« Reply #53 on: July 20, 2018, 08:23:04 AM »

Do it right and build a highway that would connect Juneau to the continental highway system.
No ferry segment. 
No excuses.
Fritz Owl would put a freeway in

With 8 lanes!   :clap:

Only question is would he tunnel through the mountains or have a big Lake Ponchotrain type bridge?

Come on.  It's Fritzowl.  You know the answer is both, plus two more freeways you haven't thought of yet.


One NB on the water, one SB on the water, one NB on land, one SB on land!
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Beltway

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Re: Alaska officials look to resurrect Juneau road project
« Reply #54 on: July 20, 2018, 09:38:42 AM »

All that work on conducting an EIS/location study, FHWA issues a Record of Decision, and it is "no build".  What a waste of time and resources.  Never heard of "having to pay back Federal funds already spent on the project" that hasn't been built.
Ten year PE rule from FHWA:  If you authorized funds on a project for design, you must obtain ROW or go to construction within ten years.  Otherwise, you must pay back the federal funds.
There's also some crazy 20 year rule about ROW authorizations, but at least here in NY, those have been less of an issue.
FHWA has only strictly enforced the 10 year PE rule over the past couple of years. They have also implemented a waiver process to get extensions. 

Those rules would not obviate ADOT from having to pay back the PE funding for this project.

The US-29 Whoville Bypass and the Fredericksburg Outer Connector NWQ would be in those categories, but FHWA has not requested payback of PE funding from VDOT. 
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Rothman

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Re: Alaska officials look to resurrect Juneau road project
« Reply #55 on: July 20, 2018, 12:16:39 PM »

Right.  Unless ADOT got a waiver or extension to the 10 year PE rule, they would have to pay it back.

Same goes for the VDOT projects you mentioned:  Enforcement of the rule is dependent upon the FHWA division and waivers/extensions can be obtained.
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Beltway

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Re: Alaska officials look to resurrect Juneau road project
« Reply #56 on: July 20, 2018, 01:00:20 PM »

Right.  Unless ADOT got a waiver or extension to the 10 year PE rule, they would have to pay it back.
Same goes for the VDOT projects you mentioned:  Enforcement of the rule is dependent upon the FHWA division and waivers/extensions can be obtained.

Yeah, but the whole thing stinks --
"Since 2016, the Alaska Department of Transportation & Public Facilities (DOT&PF) has worked with the FHWA to complete the supplemental environmental impact statement in a manner that allows the state to avoid repaying federal funds spent to date on the project. "

An SEIS could easily cost several million dollars to conduct and prepare.  So they spend all this money on a project that for several decades has proposed an alternative to build a new highway to connect Juneau to the continental highway system, and in the end they conduct an SEIS to declare "no build alternative"!

I am also troubled at the many times over the last 40-some years that I have heard of major differences in practices, processes, regulation and enforcement in the various FHWA division offices (the FHWA office in a state that interfaces with that state's DOT, for those readers who don't know what a FHWA division office is).
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Rothman

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Re: Alaska officials look to resurrect Juneau road project
« Reply #57 on: July 20, 2018, 01:02:44 PM »

There must be some quite tangled political pressures associated with the ADOT project.

Totally agree with you regarding differences between FHWA Divisions.
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vdeane

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Re: Alaska officials look to resurrect Juneau road project
« Reply #58 on: July 20, 2018, 01:23:49 PM »

It's also possible that ADOT may have done a PEL study instead of using PE money.
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