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[Bobby5280]

At my local AMBUCS civic club meeting last Monday we had the City Manager of Lawton as our guest speaker. Afterward I was talking with him about the city's various needs on street improvements. I half-jokingly told him ODOT regards Lawton as a red-headed step child compared to other cities around the state. It's kind of telling Lawton has a very undesirable status with ODOT and state lawmakers since they would build a regional office in Duncan instead of 25 miles West in a much bigger city on a more important highway junction.

Lawton has a bunch of street and highway improvement needs the local tax base can't cover all on its own. ODOT has its own obligations to corridors in this area, like I-44 and US-62. ODOT built a Super 2 bypass in Duncan that can be eventually upgraded into an Interstate quality freeway. They're going to do the same thing in Chickasha. Meanwhile Lawton has its fake Interstate, Rogers Lane, which now carries the US-62 designation. The road has some dangerous design flaws. Those flaws are going to be magnified after the extension of Goodyear Blvd to US-62 is completed. A lot more trucks will be using Rogers Lane to get to I-44. Lawton has plans to improve Lee Blvd between Goodyear Blvd and I-44. But it's just going to be a higher grade of asphalt. It will take just a little longer for semi trucks to beat the surface to hell. Rogers Lane needs to be upgraded into a real freeway. And Lawton needs a South bypass to route truck traffic from I-44 out to the industrial park on Lawton's West side.

[Plutonic Panda]

ODOT needs to start planning some major projects around Lawton soon. If the state would properly invest in the area and market it they could make a trendy spot to move to. It already has some industry and natural landscape going for it. It’s just held back by severe neglect.

[rte66man]

This isn’t ODOT but since the OTA is more intertwined with ODOT now I don’t want to make a new thread for this.

I was browsing around and discovered an OTA website that looks different from the Pikepass website. I found a section going into detail about modernization efforts and the new districts they will have. Currently they have 7 districts and will consolidate them into a NW, SE, SW, Central, and NE setup making 5 districts. I’ll link the report in below.

What’s weird is they chose Duncan over Lawton for the SW Regional office with Clinton and Altus having smaller offices. Not sure a turnpike near Clinton and Lawton would make more sense as it’s right on I-44. It makes no sense.

Here’s a link. Scroll to the bottom and click on “draft final recommendations report.”  It’s a 127 pages with the regions and office locations on page 96: https://oklahoma.gov/odot/about/transportation-modernization0.html

Since ODOT District 7 is already in Duncan, it makes me wonder if they will office together

[Plutonic Panda]

This isn’t ODOT but since the OTA is more intertwined with ODOT now I don’t want to make a new thread for this.

I was browsing around and discovered an OTA website that looks different from the Pikepass website. I found a section going into detail about modernization efforts and the new districts they will have. Currently they have 7 districts and will consolidate them into a NW, SE, SW, Central, and NE setup making 5 districts. I’ll link the report in below.

What’s weird is they chose Duncan over Lawton for the SW Regional office with Clinton and Altus having smaller offices. Not sure a turnpike near Clinton and Lawton would make more sense as it’s right on I-44. It makes no sense.

Here’s a link. Scroll to the bottom and click on “draft final recommendations report.”  It’s a 127 pages with the regions and office locations on page 96: https://oklahoma.gov/odot/about/transportation-modernization0.html

Since ODOT District 7 is already in Duncan, it makes me wonder if they will office together

Ah, didn’t know that. That’s probably what they’ll do.

[Bobby5280]

ODOT needs to start planning some major projects around Lawton soon. If the state would properly invest in the area and market it they could make a trendy spot to move to. It already has some industry and natural landscape going for it. It’s just held back by severe neglect.

The Medicine Park area next to Lake Lawtonka and the Wichita Mountains is already very trendy. Property prices there have shot up big time, partly due to buyers from the OKC and Tulsa areas "discovering" the place. Medicine Park has some serious growing pains. Its very rudimentary patchwork of streets and lack of adequate parking can't handle the growth in visitor demand.

Meanwhile, Goodyear is one of the biggest employers in the Lawton area. That factory out West of Lawton is freaking huge. It's one of the biggest tire production factories in the world and was at least at one time the biggest tire factory in the world (if it isn't still the biggest). Goodyear management and shipping companies that deal with Goodyear have been pretty disgusted lately about the degradation of highway infrastructure surrounding the plant. The $16 million project to extend Goodyear Blvd up to US-62 is one attempt to deal with the anger. Still, Rogers Lane isn't a very truck-safe route due to its design flaws and amount of local stop-and-go traffic. 82nd Street is the main route South from the plant down to OK-36 and I-44. Drive that stretch just once and your vehicle will need a wheel realignment due to all the road damage. The situation is bad enough that Goodyear has made noises about relocating future expansion efforts to other plants and even reducing operations at the Lawton plant. Damage to trucks is that bad.

But ODOT is fixated on Duncan and Chickasha as well as the US-81 corridor for some odd reason. Lawton can basically go f*** itself as far as they're concerned.

[rte66man]

ODOT needs to start planning some major projects around Lawton soon. If the state would properly invest in the area and market it they could make a trendy spot to move to. It already has some industry and natural landscape going for it. It’s just held back by severe neglect.

But ODOT is fixated on Duncan and Chickasha as well as the US-81 corridor for some odd reason. Lawton can basically go f*** itself as far as they're concerned.

Can't really argue with that. Makes me wonder why the area Senators and Reps have been so ineffective in getting more done there.

The only project I see in the 8 Year plan is for "safety improvements" to Rogers Lane in FFY2027.

[Bobby5280]

Can't really argue with that. Makes me wonder why the area Senators and Reps have been so ineffective in getting more done there.

Those reps think the Norman area passes for Southwest Oklahoma. As if the f***king H.E. Bailey Turnpike incomplete extension is a "gift" for people in Lawton.

The only project I see in the 8 Year plan is for "safety improvements" to Rogers Lane in FFY2027.

It's literally going to take a multi-fatality accident on Rogers Lane to get ODOT to do anything. I don't even know how they could have legally moved the US-62 designation from Cache Road up to Rogers Lane due to all the flaws that are still present.

Not only does the road lack shoulders, but there are curbs at the edge of the right lane. You can't pull over to the side if a police car lights you up; you have to drive to the next intersection and find a parking lot. If you break down you'll either be stopped in the right lane or you can hop the curb into the grass and risk starting a brush fire. The median is bare minimal, very easy to hop. No barrier or anything.

The 38th & Rogers Lane intersection needs to be converted to a limited access exit. The traffic signal causes big traffic back-ups. The intersection is hidden in a valley. Speeding cars can come over the hill and be surprised by a traffic jam they couldn't see just ahead.

There is a concrete sound wall that creates a terrible blind spot for Eastbound Rogers Lane traffic approaching the NW 67th Street intersection. Motorists turning right from 67th onto EB Rogers Lane also have to be very careful. That intersection needs to be a freeway exit too. That intersection is really going to be bad once a lot of trucks going to/from Goodyear, Bar-S, Silverline Plastics, etc start using it.

[Plutonic Panda]

Oklahoma to Receive an Extra $191 Million in Federal Funding

https://www.roadsbridges.com/funding/news/21384200/oklahoma-to-receive-an-extra-191-million-in-federal-funding

[Bobby5280]

I'm sure they'll figure out how to spend most of that $191 million in the Tulsa area.

[swake]

I'm sure they'll figure out how to spend most of that $191 million in the Tulsa area.

Good

[Bobby5280]

Yeah, because f*** the rest of this state, right? Maybe they can sink that nearly $200 million into the white water rapids park thing on the Arkansas River.

[In_Correct]

I Hate " Accept All Cookies. " :

FUNDING

Oklahoma to Receive an Extra $191 Million in Federal Funding

September 08, 2022

The extra funding will help speed up some infrastructure projects



The Oklahoma Department of Transportation (ODOT) is set to receive an extra $191 million in federal funding.

The extra $191 million are funds that didn't get spent in the fiscal year, so it gets sent out across the country, according to ODOT Executive Director Tim Gatz as he addressed the transportation commission on Tuesday.

Gatz noted that it isn’t unusual to receive additional funding, though this extra allocation is significantly higher than normal. Gatz added that the amount is usually between $30 and $70 million.

"There are a lot of complexities in the way that the federal funding operates," Gatz said. "It always comes with strings attached, funding buckets, criteria that you've got to meet."

Gatz said ODOT will use some of the money to complete ongoing projects. It could even lead to some road work being finished much earlier than expected.

"At the end of the day, it's going to move some projects forward faster,”  Gatz said.

----------------------------------

Source: ODOT

[Rothman]

Ah, August redistiribution.  It's really isn't as simple as the article made it out to be.  This is redistribution of obligation limitation, rather than apportionment.  So, it isn't a matter of more money -- it's just an increase in how much current funding can be used in the current FFY for conversion from "advanced construction" to obligation.

This will not be used for new projects, but to obligate funding on current projects.  That's not so bad, actually, as if OK had hit its annual obligation limitation, this will allow work to progress and bills paid on those projects, rather than waiting to next FFY to be able to do so.

The idea is that most core apportionments  can roll from year to year, but FHWA puts a cap on how much of the apportionment can actually be used within an FFY.  August redistribution just raises that cap.

Getting more obligation limitation than expected can actually be a stress for a DOT, since they have to find projects to use it up on and quickly.

[swake]

Yeah, because f*** the rest of this state, right? Maybe they can sink that nearly $200 million into the white water rapids park thing on the Arkansas River.

You really think Tulsa gets all the highway funds? What? The largest metro in the nation without non-tolled interstate access? Every highway in every direction out of Tulsa is tolled. The big project in Tulsa now is replacing the I-44/US-75 interchange which at over 60 years old is the very oldest interstate interchange in the entire state.

[Scott5114]

Yeah, because f*** the rest of this state, right? Maybe they can sink that nearly $200 million into the white water rapids park thing on the Arkansas River.

You really think Tulsa gets all the highway funds? What? The largest metro in the nation without non-tolled interstate access? Every highway in every direction out of Tulsa is tolled. The big project in Tulsa now is replacing the I-44/US-75 interchange which at over 60 years old is the very oldest interstate interchange in the entire state.

Bobby lives in Lawton........

[swake]

Yeah, because f*** the rest of this state, right? Maybe they can sink that nearly $200 million into the white water rapids park thing on the Arkansas River.

You really think Tulsa gets all the highway funds? What? The largest metro in the nation without non-tolled interstate access? Every highway in every direction out of Tulsa is tolled. The big project in Tulsa now is replacing the I-44/US-75 interchange which at over 60 years old is the very oldest interstate interchange in the entire state.

Bobby lives in Lawton........

I see that.

He's upset of the lack of a limited access exit in Lawton at 38th St. He should check out US-75 at 141st St in Glenpool. US-75 is the main truck route between Dallas and Tulsa and it carries double the traffic count of that on US-62. I checked traffic on Google Maps just now and the stoplight at 141st is backed up half a mile going north into Tulsa and a mile and a half going south from Tulsa, and the downtown work traffic hasn't even gotten there yet.

Oklahoma has crappy roads to spare, it's all over.

[Scott5114]

I'm not sure you're entirely cognizant of exactly how bad Lawton is, though. It is a quarter of the size of Tulsa, yet only has one freeway serving it (which, like Tulsa, is tolled in both directions when you leave the metropolitan area). The major east-west corridor is US-62/Rogers Lane, which is like someone looked at SH-9 in Norman and was like "how could we do that, but even worse"?

Oklahoma does have crappy roads in all regions, but at least in Oklahoma City and Tulsa the state has been investing money into fixing the most problematic spots. In both cities, the freeway network is something resembling modern, at least. Lawton has yet to see any meaningful investment in its transportation network at all. It still very much feels like driving around Oklahoma City felt in the 1990s, or Tulsa in the mid-2000s.

[Bobby5280]

He's upset of the lack of a limited access exit in Lawton at 38th St. He should check out US-75 at 141st St in Glenpool. US-75 is the main truck route between Dallas and Tulsa and it carries double the traffic count of that on US-62. I checked traffic on Google Maps just now and the stoplight at 141st is backed up half a mile going north into Tulsa and a mile and a half going south from Tulsa, and the downtown work traffic hasn't even gotten there yet.

There is no arguing the Tulsa region does get disproportionately favored by the state government and state agencies, maybe even more than OKC. I have no doubt much of that $191 million of redistribution funding will go to NE OK. I expect little if any going to SW OK. That doesn't mean I have any obligation to smile about it.

As for US-75 and the at-grade intersection with 141st Street in Glenpool, the powers that be in the Tulsa area have about a million times greater chance of converting that intersection into a limited access exit than anything happening down here in Lawton. I do think the US-75 corridor between Tulsa and I-40 should be a limited access corridor. The only thing I can figure is there could be local resistance from businesses next to US-75 that don't want to be displaced by new frontage roads and/or exit ramps.

US-62/Rogers Lane in Lawton may not have the traffic count of US-75 going South of Tulsa. Nevertheless Rogers Lane does get pretty busy and is a sub-standard highway with dangerous flaws. The intersection of US-75 and 141st Street in Glenpool has flat, clear sight lines. The intersection of 38th Street and Rogers Lane is down in a valley that can literally hide traffic back-ups from approaching vehicles going 50mph or faster. This and other issues along Rogers Lane are going to get quite a lot worse once Goodyear Blvd is extended up to US-62. That's going to put a lot more trucks from the big industrial park West of Lawton onto Rogers Lane. Cars and pick-up trucks can stop a lot faster in response to blind spot issues than an 18-wheel semi. The trucks are definitely going to take Rogers Lane because Lee Blvd thru Lawton is beat to shit, and SW 82nd Street (the backdoor route down to OK-36 and I-44) is in far worse shape. Trucks literally get damaged going that way.

I've watched a lot of fairly serious upgrade projects take place on I-35, I-40 and I-44 elsewhere in the state. In the Lawton area the "best" thing I've seen from ODOT is them basically doing a patch job on the existing I-44/2nd Street/Cache Road interchange a few years ago. The paint job they did on the old tri-level bridge already has lots of rust streaks bleeding through it. Any problem in Lawton gets a very minimal solution.

[Scott5114]

I've watched a lot of fairly serious upgrade projects take place on I-35, I-40 and I-44 elsewhere in the state. In the Lawton area the "best" thing I've seen from ODOT is them basically doing a patch job on the existing I-44/2nd Street/Cache Road interchange a few years ago. The paint job they did on the old tri-level bridge already has lots of rust streaks bleeding through it. Any problem in Lawton gets a very minimal solution.

I just looked at that interchange on GSV. It looks like they painted it the specific shade of red they did to try to cover up the rust. It didn't work.

[Bobby5280]

Yeah, it's pretty awful. The paint job and added-on buffalo relief graphics looked good for about a year. Then the rust started bleeding through. It's starting to look really bad now. Maybe if they painted the whole thing that dark burgundy color that might have done more to hide rust, but it would have looked pretty harsh. Rust really shows through that light tan EIFS color. I think that tri-level bridge for Cache Road running into I-44 was built sometime back in the 1960's. I'm surprised ODOT hasn't just replaced those things. They've done so with so many old bridges of similar designs elsewhere in Oklahoma.

[Scott5114]

It's older than that, even–a photo of it appears on the back of the 1956 state highway map. I'm guessing it was built as part of the southern H.E. Bailey turnpike segment.

[Alps]

Yeah, it's pretty awful. The paint job and added-on buffalo relief graphics looked for about a year. Then the rust started bleeding through. It's starting to look really bad now. Maybe if they painted the whole thing that dark burgundy color that might have done more to hide rust, but it would have looked pretty harsh. Rust really shows through that light tan EIFS color. I think that tri-level bridge for Cache Road running into I-44 was built sometime back in the 1960's. I'm surprised ODOT hasn't just replaced those things. They've done so with so many old bridges of similar designs elsewhere in Oklahoma.

https://goo.gl/maps/othSKx7fktnC1R5S7 eh

[rte66man]

It's older than that, even–a photo of it appears on the back of the 1956 state highway map. I'm guessing it was built as part of the southern H.E. Bailey turnpike segment.

No, most of it was already there when the Bailey was built ca 1964. ODOT tacked on the eastern ramps so US277 (before it was I-44) could bend east into the Cache Creek floodplain. Cheaper to build there than to plow straight south along 2nd.

[Plutonic Panda]

The new 8yr plan is live. It is the 2023-2030 plan: https://oklahoma.gov/odot/programs-and-projects/8-year-construction-work-plan.html

[bugo]

The traffic light in Glenpool is in the plan.