Oddities that defy conventional wisdom - POPULATION edition

[kalvado]

Florida increased by more than 10× from 2010 to 2020? And South Carolina more than tripled.

For SC, looks like population of Folly island /Folly beach is reported inconsistently. There are plenty of houses there, not sure if people live there permanently, though; and how a hurricane would change that.

[webny99]

...
Almost 20 million people for the state, and 20,000 for Grand Island. So a fifth of a percent of NY's island population is on Grand Island.

Yet the NB Grand Island bridge carries upwards of 40,000 VPD on peak days. Double that for SB, and the Grand Island bridges carry up to four times as many vehicles in a single day as the entire island has people! That just seems crazy to me, even knowing how much of that traffic is just passing through.

I'd imagine this is true for thousands of smaller communities that have Interstate access across the country.

In terms of an interstate passing through a small town/city, sure. But those are usually approachable from many different directions. The fact that it's an island with only two ways off and 3-4x the island population in vehicles is also relying on those two bridges just hits different. I'm sure comparable examples can be found, but not many with an island that size.

[kalvado]

...
Almost 20 million people for the state, and 20,000 for Grand Island. So a fifth of a percent of NY's island population is on Grand Island.

Yet the NB Grand Island bridge carries upwards of 40,000 VPD on peak days. Double that for SB, and the Grand Island bridges carry up to four times as many vehicles in a single day as the entire island has people! That just seems crazy to me, even knowing how much of that traffic is just passing through.

I'd imagine this is true for thousands of smaller communities that have Interstate access across the country.

In terms of an interstate passing through a small town/city, sure. But those are usually approachable from many different directions. The fact that it's an island with only two ways off and 3-4x the island population in vehicles is also relying on those two bridges just hits different. I'm sure comparable examples can be found, but not many with an island that size.

Florida keys?

[kphoger]

I expected I-45 to fit the bill, but its AADT is only a little bit above Galveston's population size.

[webny99]

In terms of an interstate passing through a small town/city, sure. But those are usually approachable from many different directions. The fact that it's an island with only two ways off and 3-4x the island population in vehicles is also relying on those two bridges just hits different. I'm sure comparable examples can be found, but not many with an island that size.

Florida keys?

I expected I-45 to fit the bill, but its AADT is only a little bit above Galveston's population size.

The key (pun not intended, but I'll take it) is the through traffic component. It's hard to find one more significant than Buffalo<>Niagara Falls, which also happens to include by extension the entire I-90 corridor in NY<>southern Ontario.

Key Largo is about half the size of Grand Island in both population and area, and its population is exceeded (roughly doubled or tripled) by the combined Overseas Hwy and Card Sound Rd traffic volume. But many of the other Keys are too much smaller to be comparable, and by the time you get to Key West, there's no through traffic component.

[vdeane]

New York is the only state besides Hawaii ...

You must admit, however, that claiming "the majority of people in Hawaii live on an island" is a bit misleading.  It makes it sound like there is a minority in Hawaii who don't live on an island.

Less sensational way of putting it is - states with most population living on the island are: HI - 100%, obviously; if PR ever becomes a state it will also be 100%. Strangely next one is not Rhode Island  but NY with 50%+ living on an island (primarily NYC area - long island, manhattan, staten island; maybe I am missing some? Grand Island with it's 0.1% of NY population may be added for luls)
UPD: Actually, those listed above account for 49.2% of NYS population as far as I can tell. Is there another big island within  NYC? It's another 200k people.

When I added up the four Long Island counties (Suffolk, Nassau, Queens, and Kings) plus New York and Richmond using Google's population figures, I got 50.07% of the population.  Sure, those counties technically comprise more than Long Island, Manhattan Island, and Staten Island... but only other, smaller, islands.  There's also City Island, but it doesn't add a lot, and it's not needed.  Maybe.  Not sure what the population of mainland Manhattan is.

I still get 49.84% after checking all the numbers . It's probably safe to leave it at "about a half" after all.  Looks like LI population is growng faster than NYS in general, so later numbers would favor higher percentage... and I am too lazy to go and dig out by year data

I was just running queries in Google along the lines of "suffolk county ny population" and using whatever number was spit out.  Most used 2021 data (the exceptions were Queens, Richmond, and New York Counties with 2020 data and Marble Hill with 2010 data).  Using the four LI counties plus Manhattan (minus Marble Hill) and Staten Island got me to 50.03%.

Place	Population (millions)
Suffolk County	1.526
Nassau County	1.391
Queens County	2.271
Kings County	2.641
Richmond County	0.476
New York County	1.629
Marble Hill	-0.009*
New York State Total	19.84

*Entered as a negative number due to subtracting this from the population of New York County.

[index]

So looks like the Wikipedia article on US Islands also has a population section, with 2010 numbers. Here goes.

State	Island Population	Total Population	Percentage
HI	1360301	1360301	100.00%
NY	9571129	19378102	49.39%
AK	63847	710231	8.99%
RI	67821	1052567	6.44%
WA	167922	6724549	2.50%
ME	30895	1328361	2.33%
SC	52020	4625364	1.12%
NJ	57457	8791894	0.65%
VT	3651	625741	0.58%
DE	4001	897934	0.45%
MA	24451	6547629	0.37%
MD	20813	5773552	0.36%
FL	53540	18801310	0.28%
NC	26508	9535483	0.28%
TX	60991	25145561	0.24%
CA	77512	37253956	0.21%
MI	13337	9883640	0.13%
AL	1371	4779736	0.03%
OR	1078	3831074	0.03%
LA	1005	4533372	0.02%
WI	845	5686986	0.01%

Huh. I have no idea why I wasn't able to find that. I did look. I did all that for nothing lol

[hotdogPi]

Those numbers (not just the two states I mentioned) are so different from the GIS tool, plus they're 13 years outdated, that I wouldn't trust them.

[GaryV]

Florida increased by more than 10× from 2010 to 2020? And South Carolina more than tripled.

The only islands included in the list for Florida are Amelia, Key Largo, Marco, Pine, and Sanibel. I'm sure it's probably missing some. (Key West obviously comes to mind.)

Miami Beach, Palm Beach, various other "Beach" names.

[newyooper]

I actually ran some numbers with a mapping/GIS tool after seeing a few posts asking which states came in what place, and this is what I came up with for states with the most people on islands by percent:

This includes true islands, areas of land which are functionally islands (connected to land but only accessible by bridge over water or via ferry), and peninsulas which were formerly islands and are still referred to and treated as such.

   
• Hawaii: 100%
• New York: 50.8%
• Alaska: 9.67%
• Rhode Island: 6.55%
• Florida: 4.37%
• South Carolina: 3.99%
• Washington: 2.79%
• Maine: 2.59%
• New Jersey: 1.37%
• Vermont: 1.15%
• Louisiana: 0.99% (This one was a bit tough since the landscape there kind of blurs what is and isn't an island together)
• North Carolina: 0.72%
• Georgia: 0.63%
• Massachusetts: 0.59%
• Maryland: 0.51%
• Alabama: 0.37%
• Texas: 0.34%
• Michigan: 0.22%
• California: 0.20%
• Wisconsin: 0.15%
• West Virginia: 0.138%
• New Hampshire: 0.137%
• Oregon: 0.10%
• Tennessee: 0.08%
• Virginia: 0.058%
• Delaware: 0.056%
• Minnesota: 0.04%
• Connecticut: 0.038%
• Ohio: 0.02%
• Illinois: 0.019%
• Arkansas: 0.016%
• Iowa: 0.0157%
• Pennsylvania: 0.011%
• Mississippi: 0.010%
• Arizona: 0.008%
• Indiana: 0.007%
• Missouri: 0.00003%

And the rest have no population on islands. This probably isn't super accurate, I did a lot of eyeballing and rough estimates as well.

For some reason, South Dakota and Dells Island (sometimes called Quarry Island for the quartzite quarry there) didn't make the list:

https://mapcarta.com/35120852

If at least 70 people live on the island, for South Dakota's current population, that would be about 0.01%.  Looking a Google Earth, probably no...

[Scott5114]

New York is the only state besides Hawaii ...

You must admit, however, that claiming "the majority of people in Hawaii live on an island" is a bit misleading.  It makes it sound like there is a minority in Hawaii who don't live on an island.

Here's a population oddity for you—1% of Clark County, Nevada's population is Native Hawaiian or Pacific Islander. Which is odd, because what would cause a bunch of people from a tropical island to end up in the desert?

Apparently this started because a casino magnate had a vacation home in Hawaii. One of his properties was struggling, so, in the 1970s, he got the idea to market it toward Hawaiians. (The original idea was to market it to Californians, but it didn't take, thus why the property was struggling.) Since Hawaii is itself a vacation destination, he reasoned people in Hawaii probably didn't have an obvious place to go on vacation themselves. So he started offering them all-inclusive vacation packages, running shuttle flights between Honolulu and Las Vegas, and replacing the buffet with Hawaiian food.

It worked so well that it ended up going beyond a marketing scheme. Cultural ties started forming between the two states—after all, Nevada and Hawaii are both well known for being in the tourism industry, so they had more in common than it seemed at first. So when housing prices in Hawaii started rising, Hawaiians started moving to Las Vegas, to the point that now it's sometimes called the "ninth island of Hawaii".

So if you wanted to indulge in a bit of creative license, I suppose you could say that there are a minority of Hawaiians who don't live on an island after all.

(source)

[kphoger]

You must admit, however, that claiming "the majority of people in Hawaii live on an island" is a bit misleading.  It makes it sound like there is a minority in Hawaii who don't live on an island.

So when housing prices in Hawaii started rising, Hawaiians started moving to Las Vegas ... So if you wanted to indulge in a bit of creative license, I suppose you could say that there are a minority of Hawaiians who don't live on an island after all.

Note how I carefully worded my post to avoid that exact sort of response.   

[DTComposer]

Relevant XKCD from yesterday. I remember as an early mapgeek discovering the Chicago Canal and realizing that sorta made the eastern chunk of the country an island.

[kalvado]

Relevant XKCD from yesterday. I remember as an early mapgeek discovering the Chicago Canal and realizing that sorta made the eastern chunk of the country an island.

While Great Loop is certainly something I am almost envious about... You almost can spit from one "island" to the other in some places.

[Road Hog]

I would have thought Washington State would be higher on the list because a number of Seattle suburbs are on islands in Puget Sound.

[bing101]

Oh the Urbanity cited that Los Angeles is the most dense urban area in the USA. I know I would have Guessed Chicago and New York as my first picks within the top 3 but that is not the case. 2nd and 3rd place for most dense urban areas are San Jose and San Francisco as seen here.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_urban_areas

https://www.census.gov/newsroom/press-releases/2022/urban-rural-populations.html

https://www.census.gov/programs-surveys/geography/guidance/geo-areas/urban-rural.html


https://www.census.gov/programs-surveys/geography/guidance/geo-areas/urban-rural/2020-ua-facts.html

Here are the sources they cited for the video.

[Chris]

Bangkok has a metropolitan population of 14.6 million inhabitants.

It is over 100 times greater than the largest city in Thailand that is not in the Bangkok metro area (Hat Yai), making it the world's most dominant city in one country (a primate city).


A number of countries have relatively recently crossed the 100 million mark: the Philippines, Vietnam, Egypt, Ethiopia & the Democratic Republic of the Congo. In 1989 there were 10 countries over 100M. Today, there are 16.

In 1989, Pakistan had a population of 107M. Today it has 241M. In 1989 Indonesia had a population of 175M, today it has 279M.

While not necessarily defying conventional wisdom, the world has changed quite rapidly over the past couple of decades.

On the other hand, the birth rate is declining quicker than previous estimates. Even countries like India, Bangladesh and Indonesia have dropped to replacement level of 2.1 children per woman. Iran and Turkey are below that. Some estimates put China at 0.8 now, it has declined much faster than anticipated.

[index]

I actually ran some numbers with a mapping/GIS tool after seeing a few posts asking which states came in what place, and this is what I came up with for states with the most people on islands by percent:

This includes true islands, areas of land which are functionally islands (connected to land but only accessible by bridge over water or via ferry), and peninsulas which were formerly islands and are still referred to and treated as such.

   
• Hawaii: 100%
• New York: 50.8%
• Alaska: 9.67%
• Rhode Island: 6.55%
• Florida: 4.37%
• South Carolina: 3.99%
• Washington: 2.79%
• Maine: 2.59%
• New Jersey: 1.37%
• Vermont: 1.15%
• Louisiana: 0.99% (This one was a bit tough since the landscape there kind of blurs what is and isn't an island together)
• North Carolina: 0.72%
• Georgia: 0.63%
• Massachusetts: 0.59%
• Maryland: 0.51%
• Alabama: 0.37%
• Texas: 0.34%
• Michigan: 0.22%
• California: 0.20%
• Wisconsin: 0.15%
• West Virginia: 0.138%
• New Hampshire: 0.137%
• Oregon: 0.10%
• Tennessee: 0.08%
• Virginia: 0.058%
• Delaware: 0.056%
• Minnesota: 0.04%
• Connecticut: 0.038%
• Ohio: 0.02%
• Illinois: 0.019%
• Arkansas: 0.016%
• Iowa: 0.0157%
• Pennsylvania: 0.011%
• Mississippi: 0.010%
• Arizona: 0.008%
• Indiana: 0.007%
• Missouri: 0.00003%

And the rest have no population on islands. This probably isn't super accurate, I did a lot of eyeballing and rough estimates as well.

For some reason, South Dakota and Dells Island (sometimes called Quarry Island for the quartzite quarry there) didn't make the list:

https://mapcarta.com/35120852

If at least 70 people live on the island, for South Dakota's current population, that would be about 0.01%.  Looking a Google Earth, probably no...

Good catch. Per South Dakota's population data and census blocks, 17 people live on the island.

[KCRoadFan]

Another thread about this topic already exists - one that I created: https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=33202.0

[vdeane]

Another thread about this topic already exists - one that I created: https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=33202.0

That doesn't seem like the same thing.  That one appears to be about if individual cities are bigger or smaller than an individual forum user expected.  This one is more general.\

Plus, if you really want to play that game... this thread is older.

[Bruce]

I would have thought Washington State would be higher on the list because a number of Seattle suburbs are on islands in Puget Sound.

Really only Mercer and Bainbridge (both of which are island-cities). Vashon and Whidbey are mostly rural, and the other islands are tiny.

[kkt]

Carrot cake is a vegetable and zucchini bread is a fruit.

What?  No.  They are mostly flour with some sugar and oil, just like other cakes and sweet breads.

[JayhawkCO]

What?  No.  They are mostly flour with some sugar and oil, just like other cakes and sweet breads.

Sweetbreads are a meat.

[Rothman]

What?  No.  They are mostly flour with some sugar and oil, just like other cakes and sweet breads.

Sweetbreads are a meat.

Questionable meat.

[JayhawkCO]

What?  No.  They are mostly flour with some sugar and oil, just like other cakes and sweet breads.

Sweetbreads are a meat.

Questionable meat.

Delicious, questionable meat.