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Author Topic: O’ahu  (Read 5396 times)

oscar

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Re: O’ahu
« Reply #25 on: December 26, 2021, 11:12:01 AM »

DOD worker myself.  If I was alone on the trip I totally would have driven over the bridge and taken H-3 all the way into MCBH.

H-3 ends before the U-turn/parking area turnoff in front of the sentries. So those of us without the "perks of service" (my military dependent ID expired when I turned 21) can clinch H-3 that way.

I took a shuttle to the U.S.S. Missouri on Ford Island, over the Clarey Bridge. No bridge photos allowed, alas. I was able to take some photos of the bridge from land on my first visit to Oahu, But on a later visit (armed with a wider-angle lens so I could cover the entire bridge in one close-up shot) I encountered signs forbidding photography of the bridge. 
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Max Rockatansky

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Re: O’ahu
« Reply #26 on: December 26, 2021, 11:34:13 AM »

DOD worker myself.  If I was alone on the trip I totally would have driven over the bridge and taken H-3 all the way into MCBH.

H-3 ends before the U-turn/parking area turnoff in front of the sentries. So those of us without the "perks of service" (my military dependent ID expired when I turned 21) can clinch H-3 that way.

I took a shuttle to the U.S.S. Missouri on Ford Island, over the Clarey Bridge. No bridge photos allowed, alas. I was able to take some photos of the bridge from land on my first visit to Oahu, But on a later visit (armed with a wider-angle lens so I could cover the entire bridge in one close-up shot) I encountered signs forbidding photography of the bridge.

The signage seems to have been removed.  I didn’t recall seeing anything on the U.S.S. Arizona tour and got a couple nice long shots of the bridge.  That’s not too dissimilar to like signage disappearing/being relaxed from mostly Administrative annexes in the Navy the past decade.  I don’t even recall seeing “photography prohibited” at the last several bases I’ve been too at all.  I was really caught off guard a couple years ago when the Post Grad School in Monterey had staff at the Gateway actively telling people to take photos of the Hotel del Monte.     

Regarding H-3 I was aware of the turnaround.  Several of my passengers (six of them) were already in need of the restroom which necessitated taking the Kaneohe Bay Drive Exit to the Starbucks. 
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oscar

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Re: O’ahu
« Reply #27 on: December 26, 2021, 12:17:03 PM »

Hawaii Route 72:

https://www.gribblenation.org/2021/12/hawaii-route-72-kalanianaole-highway.html

A few questions/notes:

-- Did you see any of these Hawaii 72 markers with the state name on them? AFAIK, there were at some point three of them on Hawaii 72, but nowhere else in Hawaii except on the old-style cutout markers that haven't yet been stolen. The state-named Hawaii 72 marker I'm most familiar with is somewhere south of Kailua, in the counter-clockwise direction. You, and Dan Murphy (Roadwaywiz), traveled the highway clockwise. I haven't had a chance to finish viewing Dan's videos.

-- The Hawaiian prince for whom the Kalanianaole Highway was named, also had "Kuhio" in his name, with streets and highways (most famously Kuhio Avenue on Waikiki) bearing that name. Between those two names, he has more Hawaiian streets and highways named for him than Kamehameha the Great.

-- "Kalanianaole" is one of the hardest-to-pronounce Hawaiian road names. As you note, such names were a major reason for the temporary Hawaii numbered route system the Army established just before and during World War II, to help keep mainland troops from getting lost. The modern-day Queen Liliuokalani Freeway is also up there.

-- Talking about a proposed Hawaii business transaction with an old mainland friend representing the companies in question, I teasingly challenged her to say "Kalanianaole" three times in a row. She couldn't. We had a chuckle about that.
« Last Edit: December 26, 2021, 02:41:14 PM by oscar »
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Max Rockatansky

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Re: O’ahu
« Reply #28 on: December 26, 2021, 01:01:39 PM »

Pertaining to my photos none of them had “Hawaii” in the crest of any 72 shields.  That said, it wouldn’t surprise me if Dan captured something with his video tours.  Once I turned west I was hitting some serious sundown glare which really limited time what I could capture.

Some of the Hawaiian highway and road names are far beyond what I can pronounce accurately.  There was a couple times I avoided saying names on the Roadcast because I didn’t want to butcher a name.  I’ll probably pick up on more of the pronunciations as times go on like I did with French and Spanish beforehand.

Speaking of Dan, we might continue with the O’ahu series with stuff he got in 2019 that I didn’t.  I want to say between the two of us we might have clinched O’ahu, but I would have to check his video logs.  One omission I plan on going for whenever I revisit O’ahu would be the abandoned Farrington Highway at Ka’ena Point.  It would be neat to document what the 1946 Army Day Map has to say and get a full log of early Hawaii Route and Military Routes.  To my knowledge there isn’t any maps of the other islands showing what WWII era routes might have existed there.

Worth noting, in my discussions with Dan there is some differences between the signage he saw in 2019 versus 2021.  Dan’s video inventory can be found below, he has over 200 entries for O’ahu:

https://m.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLv2139njdKjW8JDvMYBrMS7XKU0ewBmbE
« Last Edit: December 26, 2021, 01:19:27 PM by Max Rockatansky »
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Max Rockatansky

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Re: O’ahu
« Reply #29 on: December 27, 2021, 07:07:00 PM »

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Max Rockatansky

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Re: O’ahu
« Reply #30 on: December 28, 2021, 10:38:46 PM »

Created a hub page for the Gribblenation and Roadwaywiz O'ahu media.  The blog section obviously will expand as I write them:

https://www.gribblenation.org/p/gribblenation-oahu-highways-page.html
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Max Rockatansky

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Re: O’ahu
« Reply #31 on: December 29, 2021, 11:48:21 PM »

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oscar

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Re: O’ahu
« Reply #32 on: December 30, 2021, 01:00:48 AM »

See http://www.hawaiihighways.com/FAQs-page4.htm#Interstate-plans for my take on the proposed Interstate H-4, which is pretty much in line with Max's.

I'd add that possibly dooming the proposal from the get-go was that the proposed viaduct would've had a visual impact on Honolulu's waterfront similar to that of the then-recently-built (and since demolished) Embarcadero Freeway in San Francisco. One striking similarity would've been the viaduct's impact on Honolulu's iconic Aloha Tower, much like how the Embarcadero detracted from San Francisco's Ferry Building and its tower.

So no surprise to me that Hawaii DOT's proposal drew strong local opposition, perhaps stoked by Hawaiians who had seen what the Embarcadero had done to San Francisco's waterfront. That might explain the ill-fated alternative of putting part of H-4 underwater, and other less-developed (but equally doomed) exploration of an offshore "reef highway". But it might also have been that the H-4 proposal simply lost out to mainland proposals competing for newly-authorized Interstate mileage and associated funding, and Hawaii DOT by then had soured on the idea of building H-4 as a non-Interstate with less favorable Federal funding.
« Last Edit: December 30, 2021, 01:35:21 AM by oscar »
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Max Rockatansky

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Re: O’ahu
« Reply #33 on: January 05, 2022, 10:09:43 PM »

^^^

Noted, I'll be sure to link your thoughts on the H-4 page on Gribblenation.

Next up in the series; Hawaii Route 92:

https://www.gribblenation.org/2022/01/hawaii-route-92.html
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oscar

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Re: O’ahu
« Reply #34 on: January 05, 2022, 10:43:48 PM »

Next up in the series; Hawaii Route 92:

https://www.gribblenation.org/2022/01/hawaii-route-92.html

The above notes that route 92 (Nimitz Highway) for a time paralleled route 90 (part of the Kamehameha Highway) north of the airport, before the latter was folded into the former, with the merged route under the new Interstate H-1 Airport Viaduct. Here's a 1951 photo from Hawaii DOT, showing the two routes before they were merged. See also one of my site's photo pages, with some notes on the above photo and the associated history.
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Max Rockatansky

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Re: O’ahu
« Reply #35 on: January 07, 2022, 05:15:23 PM »

Hawaii Route 64:

https://www.gribblenation.org/2022/01/hawaii-route-64.html

HI 64 was actually way more interesting than I thought it might be.  I found a map scan of the low tide road that used to exist between Honolulu and Quarantine Island which was pretty neat to see.
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triplemultiplex

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Re: O’ahu
« Reply #36 on: January 07, 2022, 06:03:12 PM »

I could tell the older of the two bridges used to be a moveable span when I was there.  Nice to learn a little more backstory on the bridge.  Historic maps are cool in areas that now have a lot of landfill.  And that area around the harbor and the airport has its share.  Probably the most Oahu has expanded in the last million years (at present sea level ;) ).

Sand Island is where one goes to pick up a vehicle shipped from the mainland or drop one off for shipment back to the mainland.  Still have my Matson keychain they gave me when I dropped off our collection vehicle in 2015.
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Max Rockatansky

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Re: O’ahu
« Reply #37 on: January 16, 2022, 08:33:22 PM »

^^^

What I thought was really neat to find was a map showing the low tide road that used to be present before the island was expanded via fill.

Next up, the weirdness of whatever the hell is going on with Hawaii Route 65/Hawaii Route 630:

https://www.gribblenation.org/2022/01/hawaii-route-65-and-630.html
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Max Rockatansky

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Re: O’ahu
« Reply #38 on: January 17, 2022, 05:04:16 PM »

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Max Rockatansky

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Re: O’ahu
« Reply #39 on: January 17, 2022, 10:31:24 PM »

It has been a slow day, so I did a little bit more writing:

Hawaii Route 98
https://www.gribblenation.org/2022/01/hawaii-route-98-vineland-boulevard.html
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Max Rockatansky

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Re: O’ahu
« Reply #40 on: January 18, 2022, 11:33:29 PM »

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Bruce

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Re: O’ahu
« Reply #41 on: January 20, 2022, 09:17:45 PM »

It has been a slow day, so I did a little bit more writing:

Hawaii Route 98
https://www.gribblenation.org/2022/01/hawaii-route-98-vineland-boulevard.html

Isn't it Vineyard Boulevard?

Max Rockatansky

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Re: O’ahu
« Reply #42 on: January 20, 2022, 09:27:34 PM »

It has been a slow day, so I did a little bit more writing:

Hawaii Route 98
https://www.gribblenation.org/2022/01/hawaii-route-98-vineland-boulevard.html

Isn't it Vineyard Boulevard?

Yes, I went back and corrected.  I had been starring at a blog I did on Vineland, Florida since it was apparently viewed 1,600 times this past week right before I started HI 98.  I wonder if that bled into my brain when I was writing since there was about a 80/20 split of Vineland/Vineyard.
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Max Rockatansky

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Re: O’ahu
« Reply #43 on: January 20, 2022, 11:23:11 PM »

Hawaii Route 80:

https://www.gribblenation.org/2022/01/hawaii-route-80.html

Sadly it seems the 1972 spec Hawaii 80 shield Dan saw has since disappeared.
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Max Rockatansky

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Re: O’ahu
« Reply #44 on: January 21, 2022, 05:39:45 PM »

The apparently still field signed Hawaii Route 803:

https://www.gribblenation.org/2022/01/hawaii-route-803.html
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oscar

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Re: O’ahu
« Reply #45 on: January 21, 2022, 07:59:08 PM »

The apparently still field signed Hawaii Route 803:

https://www.gribblenation.org/2022/01/hawaii-route-803.html

Quote
According to hawaiihighways.com Hawaii Route 803 was at one point assigned as Honolulu County Route 803.  It is unclear what the actual status of Hawaii Route 803 is given it is signed with modern Hawaii Route shields.

Hawaii county routes are usually signed (if at all) with route markers identical to state route markers. This is most obvious on Maui, Kauai, and Hawaii (Big Island) islands, which have many more numbered county routes than Oahu.

Hawaii used to have a combined route system, including both state- and county-maintained highways. Around 1968, separate systems were established for state and county routes, with some routes moved from one system to the other. Usually, this was the state fobbing off the worst routes (including the ones it had no plans to ever pave) on the counties. But up to 1968, route markers for both state- and county-maintained highways were all cutouts, so the remnant 803 markers you saw must've postdated the transfer of 803 to Honolulu County.

I found that and other history of the early post-statehood highway system(s) in Hawaii in the state library in Honolulu, and the 5th floor of the main University of Hawaii library. That UH library also had a map collection in the basement, including the Army Day map I photocopied, stitched together as best I could, and posted on my site. Regrettably, soon thereafter a rainstorm flooded the basement, destroying most or all of its contents.

I called the Honolulu County transportation department in the early 2000s, as I was revamping the Hawaii Highways site, about what was included in the county's numbered highway system. I was told that the county no longer maintained a numbered highway system. However, there is one county route (unsigned 7414, part of Middle Street in Honolulu) which was included in the state route log, perhaps because it was included in the National Highway System as a connector to the Ft. Shafter Army base.
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Max Rockatansky

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Re: O’ahu
« Reply #46 on: January 22, 2022, 02:58:52 PM »

The apparently still field signed Hawaii Route 803:

https://www.gribblenation.org/2022/01/hawaii-route-803.html

Quote
According to hawaiihighways.com Hawaii Route 803 was at one point assigned as Honolulu County Route 803.  It is unclear what the actual status of Hawaii Route 803 is given it is signed with modern Hawaii Route shields.

Hawaii county routes are usually signed (if at all) with route markers identical to state route markers. This is most obvious on Maui, Kauai, and Hawaii (Big Island) islands, which have many more numbered county routes than Oahu.

Hawaii used to have a combined route system, including both state- and county-maintained highways. Around 1968, separate systems were established for state and county routes, with some routes moved from one system to the other. Usually, this was the state fobbing off the worst routes (including the ones it had no plans to ever pave) on the counties. But up to 1968, route markers for both state- and county-maintained highways were all cutouts, so the remnant 803 markers you saw must've postdated the transfer of 803 to Honolulu County.

I found that and other history of the early post-statehood highway system(s) in Hawaii in the state library in Honolulu, and the 5th floor of the main University of Hawaii library. That UH library also had a map collection in the basement, including the Army Day map I photocopied, stitched together as best I could, and posted on my site. Regrettably, soon thereafter a rainstorm flooded the basement, destroying most or all of its contents.

I called the Honolulu County transportation department in the early 2000s, as I was revamping the Hawaii Highways site, about what was included in the county's numbered highway system. I was told that the county no longer maintained a numbered highway system. However, there is one county route (unsigned 7414, part of Middle Street in Honolulu) which was included in the state route log, perhaps because it was included in the National Highway System as a connector to the Ft. Shafter Army base.

I’ll be sure to update said blog with the information regarding the creation of the County Route systems during the late 1960s.  It’s too bad the information you found libraries hasn’t found it’s way online.  I searched the obvious places like archive.org but didn’t come up with much.  But for what it’s worth that is mostly in line with DOT information for most states.  Suffice to say having a wealth of readily available information is an exception and not the rule.  I wonder how easily those state routes logs are to come by these days?  That almost seems like something that would find it’s way onto an DOT website.

Worth noting that Dan did capture a HI 80 shield with “Hawaii” in the crest on what was HI 80/County 801.  I’m to understand since that photo capture in 2019 the shield has since disappeared. 


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Max Rockatansky

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Re: O’ahu
« Reply #47 on: March 05, 2022, 02:33:43 PM »

Back onto O'ahu blogs with Former Hawaii Route 90:

https://www.gribblenation.org/2022/03/former-hawaii-route-90.html
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Re: O’ahu
« Reply #48 on: March 05, 2022, 05:57:42 PM »


-- Did you see any of these Hawaii 72 markers with the state name on them? AFAIK, there were at some point three of them on Hawaii 72, but nowhere else in Hawaii except on the old-style cutout markers that haven't yet been stolen. The state-named Hawaii 72 marker I'm most familiar with is somewhere south of Kailua, in the counter-clockwise direction. You, and Dan Murphy (Roadwaywiz), traveled the highway clockwise. I haven't had a chance to finish viewing Dan's videos.

Oddly, this HI 90 cutout was replaced with a state name shield between 2011-19.

Don't know how rare these are, but while trying to remember where I saw the HI 90 cutout in GMSV a few years back, I ran across this new state named interstate shield, which replaced a mini-unishield state name assembly.
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Max Rockatansky

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Re: O’ahu
« Reply #49 on: March 05, 2022, 06:02:45 PM »


-- Did you see any of these Hawaii 72 markers with the state name on them? AFAIK, there were at some point three of them on Hawaii 72, but nowhere else in Hawaii except on the old-style cutout markers that haven't yet been stolen. The state-named Hawaii 72 marker I'm most familiar with is somewhere south of Kailua, in the counter-clockwise direction. You, and Dan Murphy (Roadwaywiz), traveled the highway clockwise. I haven't had a chance to finish viewing Dan's videos.

Oddly, this HI 90 cutout was replaced with a state name shield between 2011-19.

Don't know how rare these are, but while trying to remember where I saw the HI 90 cutout in GMSV a few years back, I ran across this new state named interstate shield, which replaced a mini-unishield state name assembly.

The State Name Interstate shields aren’t current spec but there is still quite a few on O’ahu.  There are a bunch of older Interstate shields on surface roads, especially in Honolulu.
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