Traffic signal

[cl94]

Thinking about it, I lived a couple blocks east of one in Columbus. Main St at Alum Creek Dr. I think it's a city installation based on ODOT's use of protected double lefts, but (at least when I lived there) Main Street east of this point was plowed and salted by ODOT, so it's anyone's guess.

[roadman65]

Why does not the fiber optic lights for permissive lefts that NJDOT uses at some places not be used nationwide?  As we all know we use either the doghouse or tower for the added yellow and green arrows for these movement set ups, but some places in NJ used fiber optic lights so that both the green and yellow would be inside the same lens.

In fact Vermont used it in Downtown Bennington at the intersection of US 7 and VT 9 for its protected left needing only a two part head, and Arlington County used it on VA 120 at I-395 back in the 80's behind a 3M lens for a permissive turn there.

I would think the fiber optic would have been easier to maintain and less housing required as you would only need one lens for two orientations.

[jeffandnicole]

Why does not the fiber optic lights for permissive lefts that NJDOT uses at some places not be used nationwide?  As we all know we use either the doghouse or tower for the added yellow and green arrows for these movement set ups, but some places in NJ used fiber optic lights so that both the green and yellow would be inside the same lens.

In fact Vermont used it in Downtown Bennington at the intersection of US 7 and VT 9 for its protected left needing only a two part head, and Arlington County used it on VA 120 at I-395 back in the 80's behind a 3M lens for a permissive turn there.

I would think the fiber optic would have been easier to maintain and less housing required as you would only need one lens for two orientations.

The first generation multi-color arrows were fiber optics. They've been LEDs for about 15 years or longer now.

That said, it is surprising more transportation departments haven't used them.

[cl94]

Why does not the fiber optic lights for permissive lefts that NJDOT uses at some places not be used nationwide?  As we all know we use either the doghouse or tower for the added yellow and green arrows for these movement set ups, but some places in NJ used fiber optic lights so that both the green and yellow would be inside the same lens.

In fact Vermont used it in Downtown Bennington at the intersection of US 7 and VT 9 for its protected left needing only a two part head, and Arlington County used it on VA 120 at I-395 back in the 80's behind a 3M lens for a permissive turn there.

I would think the fiber optic would have been easier to maintain and less housing required as you would only need one lens for two orientations.

The first generation multi-color arrows were fiber optics. They've been LEDs for about 15 years or longer now.

That said, it is surprising more transportation departments haven't used them.

NYSDOT used them quite extensively until recently, with some regions (notably 4 and 9) still making use of them in new installations. R4 is moving to FYAs for most new PPLT installations, but I've seen newish multi-color arrows.

Note that Erie County still uses them exclusively for PPLT/RT situations, as does R5 for PPRTs.

[roadfro]

Why does not the fiber optic lights for permissive lefts that NJDOT uses at some places not be used nationwide?  As we all know we use either the doghouse or tower for the added yellow and green arrows for these movement set ups, but some places in NJ used fiber optic lights so that both the green and yellow would be inside the same lens.

In fact Vermont used it in Downtown Bennington at the intersection of US 7 and VT 9 for its protected left needing only a two part head, and Arlington County used it on VA 120 at I-395 back in the 80's behind a 3M lens for a permissive turn there.

I would think the fiber optic would have been easier to maintain and less housing required as you would only need one lens for two orientations.

I think it has to do with a preference for having different colors in separate housings to provide a visual "jump" between signal indications, which also helps for colorblind drivers. I believe this was one of the reasons why the FYA was made a 4-section signal head and not using the yellow arrow for permissive and clearance in the same housing (but why they made the allowance for a 3-section variant where the steady green and FYA can be in the same section, since the steady yellow still provides the jump).

[Bruce]

Strange two-light signals in California City, CA, the third largest in California by area and largely just vacant desert land:

https://www.google.com/maps/@35.1257403,-117.9857137,3a,75y,39.79h,94.28t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sZEiDIBb0fd6ILv4JN8Ybyw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!6m1!1e1

[SignBridge]

Maybe they're just flashing red and yellow?

[cl94]

Strange two-light signals in California City, CA, the third largest in California by area and largely just vacant desert land:

https://www.google.com/maps/@35.1257403,-117.9857137,3a,75y,39.79h,94.28t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sZEiDIBb0fd6ILv4JN8Ybyw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!6m1!1e1

Maybe they're just flashing red and yellow?

Dual flashing red. Western New York loves these.

[freebrickproductions]

Strange two-light signals in California City, CA, the third largest in California by area and largely just vacant desert land:

https://www.google.com/maps/@35.1257403,-117.9857137,3a,75y,39.79h,94.28t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sZEiDIBb0fd6ILv4JN8Ybyw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!6m1!1e1

Maybe they're just flashing red and yellow?

Dual flashing red. Western New York loves these.

Alabama is a big fan of double beacons as well:
https://www.google.com/maps/@34.705009,-86.554241,3a,66.8y,34.99h,90.78t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1s1BXEHNTa99wsuxne6M5upA!2e0
https://www.google.com/maps/@34.728929,-86.767734,3a,66.8y,270.25h,91.72t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sHJ55-l_RvUKjaXn_NE_UFw!2e0
https://www.google.com/maps/@34.81208,-86.930299,3a,66.8y,59.16h,97.18t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1s01bb_juByHPZdONa7j5F4Q!2e0
https://www.google.com/maps/@34.75591,-87.973224,3a,66.8y,331.48h,106.52t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1swmi_y0kabKBhiwaV2JZraA!2e0
https://www.google.com/maps/@34.588142,-86.458945,3a,66.8y,351.33h,92.96t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1s-tpSnZFbSXRFqK1kxwEr7g!2e0
https://www.google.com/maps/@34.440826,-85.724044,3a,66.8y,280.24h,126.53t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1s_dHcJGczAEuqzx_NLniPXg!2e0
In fact, I only know of a few beacons around here in Huntsville that aren't double beacons, and as far as I'm aware, Madison only uses double beacons. However, Fort Payne still has a ton of single-section beacons as a lot of them are the old 4-way beacons.

[jeffandnicole]

Strange two-light signals in California City, CA, the third largest in California by area and largely just vacant desert land:

https://www.google.com/maps/@35.1257403,-117.9857137,3a,75y,39.79h,94.28t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sZEiDIBb0fd6ILv4JN8Ybyw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!6m1!1e1

They're mostly strange looking because they don't have the visors on them.  The advantage of these 2 light setups is if a bulb goes out, the 2nd one should still remain flashing.

As was pointed out, they're not terribly uncommon.  A few in NJ:

https://goo.gl/maps/KwqSGYBpwQy

https://goo.gl/maps/AXGgWwGV8nT2

[jakeroot]

Overhead signals aren't unheard of in England, but I've never seen one wire-hung:

213 Bingley Rd, Shipley BD18 4DH

[steviep24]

Rare 12-8-8 signal on NY 33 in Rochester, NY.

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.1372747,-77.7655202,3a,15y,91.86h,94.09t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sgrv3craRpU46wXkUZrzIyg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en

[busman_49]

Ten signal heads for a relatively simple exit ramp configuration; SIX facing the ramp:

I-75 SB exit to Cincinnati-Dayton Rd (3) by Ryan busman_49, on Flickr

Zoomed out:
I-75 SB exit to Cincinnati-Dayton Rd (1) by Ryan busman_49, on Flickr

I could see maybe 3 or 4 for the ramp approach, but 6?

[noelbotevera]

I can see 10.

[freebrickproductions]

Rare 12-8-8 signal on NY 33 in Rochester, NY.

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.1372747,-77.7655202,3a,15y,91.86h,94.09t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sgrv3craRpU46wXkUZrzIyg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en

Those appear to be poly-LFE signals too.

[busman_49]

I can see 10.

I changed the description

[busman_49]

Rare 12-8-8 signal on NY 33 in Rochester, NY.

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.1372747,-77.7655202,3a,15y,91.86h,94.09t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sgrv3craRpU46wXkUZrzIyg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en

Those appear to be poly-LFE signals too.

Neat setup!

[steviep24]

Stop sign with red flashers on the sign post. This is a NYSDOT installation. I've seen a few other rural intersections in western Monroe and Orleans counties with this setup but without the overhead beacons that this particular intersection has.

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.1791087,-77.8543853,3a,37.5y,287.83h,85.37t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sd1PEYrBo1-q_7q8pwqHc7w!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en

[cl94]

Rare 12-8-8 signal on NY 33 in Rochester, NY.

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.1372747,-77.7655202,3a,15y,91.86h,94.09t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sgrv3craRpU46wXkUZrzIyg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en

What's so rare about them? 12-8-8 is quite common in developed areas. Even more common in Ontario.

[freebrickproductions]

Rare 12-8-8 signal on NY 33 in Rochester, NY.

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.1372747,-77.7655202,3a,15y,91.86h,94.09t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sgrv3craRpU46wXkUZrzIyg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en

What's so rare about them? 12-8-8 is quite common in developed areas. Even more common in Ontario.

In some parts of the US, especially here in Alabama, 12-8-8s are rather uncommon and even rare. In fact, I only know of two cities here in the Tennessee Valley that have 12-8-8 signals, and only one of them still has theirs in service.

[steviep24]

Rare 12-8-8 signal on NY 33 in Rochester, NY.

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.1372747,-77.7655202,3a,15y,91.86h,94.09t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sgrv3craRpU46wXkUZrzIyg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en

What's so rare about them? 12-8-8 is quite common in developed areas. Even more common in Ontario.

In some parts of the US, especially here in Alabama, 12-8-8s are rather uncommon and even rare. In fact, I only know of two cities here in the Tennessee Valley that have 12-8-8 signals, and only one of them still has theirs in service.

Most older signals here in Rochester, NY are 8 inch signals but the 12-8-8 was used on occasion. 12 inch signals have been the standard for NYSDOT for quite some time and Region 4 has replaced most of the old signals with 12 inch signals in recent years.

Incidentally, the signals I posted replaced an old 12-8-8 setup when they did an LED conversion about 10 years ago or so but NYSDOT kept the 12-8-8- configuration due to clearance issues with the old span wire. Otherwise they would have went with an all 12 in. installation. This installation's days are numbered anyway due to the age of the poles (which are not galvanized and are very rusty and are probably around 50-60 years old) plus the intersection itself is outdated.

[roadman65]

https://www.google.com/maps/@40.6442597,-74.2736223,3a,75y,349.4h,76.66t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sDT1J09ebTmGpynTGeTmx3w!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!6m1!1e1
This signal installation always bugged me.  Being I grew up four miles away from this intersection, I used to pass through it constantly. 

Notice that they wasted a mast arm as you can see two of them on the right side.  Instead of the signal head that is on the near side right arm being on the far side mast arm its here with both signal heads being on the same side of the intersection and mostly on the wrong side.

Is it me, or should the far right side mast arm have the signal head that is on the near side right arm?  Also is there any advantage to have the two opposite mast arms together on the same side?  Remember this is NJ where on typical two lane arterials the two overhead signal heads are on opposite sides of the road instead of both mounted to the same arm, so this is unusual for NJ in this case.

[jeffandnicole]

https://www.google.com/maps/@40.6442597,-74.2736223,3a,75y,349.4h,76.66t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sDT1J09ebTmGpynTGeTmx3w!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!6m1!1e1
This signal installation always bugged me.  Being I grew up four miles away from this intersection, I used to pass through it constantly. 

Notice that they wasted a mast arm as you can see two of them on the right side.  Instead of the signal head that is on the near side right arm being on the far side mast arm its here with both signal heads being on the same side of the intersection and mostly on the wrong side.

Is it me, or should the far right side mast arm have the signal head that is on the near side right arm?  Also is there any advantage to have the two opposite mast arms together on the same side?  Remember this is NJ where on typical two lane arterials the two overhead signal heads are on opposite sides of the road instead of both mounted to the same arm, so this is unusual for NJ in this case.

You want to see a waste of a mast arm?  At this intersection: https://goo.gl/maps/Xo98rRn9GXE2 , the mast arm's sole purpose is to hold a visual traffic detector camera...which could had easily been installed on one of the other mast arms at the intersection!

[jakeroot]

https://www.google.com/maps/@40.6442597,-74.2736223,3a,75y,349.4h,76.66t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sDT1J09ebTmGpynTGeTmx3w!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!6m1!1e1
This signal installation always bugged me.  Being I grew up four miles away from this intersection, I used to pass through it constantly. 

Notice that they wasted a mast arm as you can see two of them on the right side.  Instead of the signal head that is on the near side right arm being on the far side mast arm its here with both signal heads being on the same side of the intersection and mostly on the wrong side.

Is it me, or should the far right side mast arm have the signal head that is on the near side right arm?  Also is there any advantage to have the two opposite mast arms together on the same side?  Remember this is NJ where on typical two lane arterials the two overhead signal heads are on opposite sides of the road instead of both mounted to the same arm, so this is unusual for NJ in this case.

You want to see a waste of a mast arm?  At this intersection: https://goo.gl/maps/Xo98rRn9GXE2 , the mast arm's sole purpose is to hold a visual traffic detector camera...which could had easily been installed on one of the other mast arms at the intersection!

Are you sure it wasn't just moved after the intersection was re-aligned? Granted, the mast arm looks pretty new, but that's just monumentally stupid otherwise.

[roadman65]

I used to see many weird things in New Jersey with signals.  I used to like when NJ would give you a protected left turn without an arrow.  Just green and it would be red on the other side of the road.  I believe Laurel Avenue at NJ 36 in Hazlet still has that particular set up.

Then you have NJ 28 E Bound stop for Faitoute Avenue in Roselle Park where there is a left turn signal giving a green arrow in the same direction with the other side no left turns allowed along with it being a three way intersection.  Basically no one passes across you and there is no reason to stop.

Also in Linden, Southbound US 1 & 9 has a signal that stops traffic for no reason at the Refinery Entrance.  Again no traffic crosses into your lanes there, and for years it never turned red at all until a paving project back in 1988 which after that caused traffic to stop.  I do not know if it still that way now, but I know of last year it still was.   Of course non road geeks will not complain about their gas being wasted and even those politicians who complain that car exhaust is part of the Climate Change problem, let NJDOT time those two signals the way they are.

NYC also has plenty of one way streets from Central Park West that stop you for potential foot traffic.  However, in Manhattan practically every intersection is signalized so one more stop is really unnoticeable.  If you do not stop there you sure will stop at the next light that has car traffic cross the street.    You could argue that the gas would be wasted the next block as all lights on Central Park West are timed together and stay red for the same amount of time as well.

Anyway, I have seen some mast arms around in many places where the last signal head is not mounted to the end of the arm.  In New Jersey I have seen that too just as Jeff pointed out with that wasted arm as shorter mast arms could be used if some of it will hang further than it needs to be.