Carmakers like VW are bringing back buttons because drivers loathe all the touch

Started by ZLoth, April 27, 2023, 04:53:42 PM

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jeffandnicole

Quote from: kalvado on April 10, 2024, 08:48:26 AM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on April 10, 2024, 08:44:43 AMSo...none with local law enforcement tracking your car's movements via GPS.
Primarily because that capability is fairly limited so far.
Couple of stories about gps device planted on a car, phone spoofing, ezpass off label use are there.
Quote from: mgk920 on April 10, 2024, 10:47:19 AMAlso cheating spouses/significant others.   :nod:

Mike

Another big one was for evidence in those entering the Capitol on Jan 6, 2020.  For those going to DC, especially from the Northeast, investigators used EZ Pass records attributable to the car or person, showing they were driving to or from DC on or about Jan 6.

But, like the other examples above, these are all intentional reviews of GPS and other electronic equipment to determine the whereabouts of a specific person, with known reasons to monitor them.  They weren't random lookups as traffic was passing by to try to guess what someone may be doing in real time.


kalvado

Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 10, 2024, 11:25:08 AMBut, like the other examples above, these are all intentional reviews of GPS and other electronic equipment to determine the whereabouts of a specific person, with known reasons to monitor them.  They weren't random lookups as traffic was passing by to try to guess what someone may be doing in real time.
It is really about (lack of) capabilities. Those will be brought up under "we are looking for terrorists" reasons and then definition will be expanded....

vdeane

Quote from: kalvado on April 10, 2024, 11:31:21 AM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 10, 2024, 11:25:08 AMBut, like the other examples above, these are all intentional reviews of GPS and other electronic equipment to determine the whereabouts of a specific person, with known reasons to monitor them.  They weren't random lookups as traffic was passing by to try to guess what someone may be doing in real time.
It is really about (lack of) capabilities. Those will be brought up under "we are looking for terrorists" reasons and then definition will be expanded....
Agreed.  It hasn't happened yet (as far as anyone is aware of, at least) because the technology didn't exist until the terrorism panic died down.  Now imagine if we had the same AI, GPS, and camera capabilities we have now (or that we imagine we might five years from now) immediately after 9/11, when Congress was passing the Patriot Act and creating the NSA...
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

Scott5114

Quote from: SEWIGuy on April 10, 2024, 08:44:43 AMSo...none with local law enforcement tracking your car's movements via GPS.

Original post was about license plates, not GPS.
uncontrollable freak sardine salad chef

kalvado

Quote from: Scott5114 on April 10, 2024, 01:01:17 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on April 10, 2024, 08:44:43 AMSo...none with local law enforcement tracking your car's movements via GPS.

Original post was about license plates, not GPS.
I would say that the current discussion is about what kind of information can be collected, specifically under "it's in plain view!" assumption. License plates are very low hanging fruit, face recognition is also up there by now. toll tags readout may be a bit less simple. GPS data would require a bit more legalize wording to get.

vdeane

In other car tech/privacy news, Tesla employees are violating the privacy of Tesla drivers and people who happen to go anywhere near one by looking at the images the car's cameras record.

https://www.reuters.com/technology/tesla-workers-shared-sensitive-images-recorded-by-customer-cars-2023-04-06/
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

ZLoth

From TechCrunch:

Rivian's chief software officer says in-car buttons are 'an anomaly'
QuoteThe trend of big touchscreens in cars has left many yearning for the not-so-distant days when most user interactions happened with physical buttons. But Rivian's chief software officer Wassym Bensaid believes using buttons in a car is an "anomaly."

"It's a bug. It's not a feature," Bensaid said Wednesday at TechCrunch Disrupt 2024. "Ideally, you would want to interact with your car through voice. The problem today is that most voice assistants are just broken."
FULL ARTICLE HERE
Don't Drive Distrac... SQUIRREL!

GCrites

Touchscreens are cheap. Taking away buttons and knobs is not luxe, it's cost-saving.

SectorZ

Quote from: ZLoth on October 31, 2024, 05:26:51 PMFrom TechCrunch:

Rivian's chief software officer says in-car buttons are 'an anomaly'
QuoteThe trend of big touchscreens in cars has left many yearning for the not-so-distant days when most user interactions happened with physical buttons. But Rivian's chief software officer Wassym Bensaid believes using buttons in a car is an "anomaly."

"It's a bug. It's not a feature," Bensaid said Wednesday at TechCrunch Disrupt 2024. "Ideally, you would want to interact with your car through voice. The problem today is that most voice assistants are just broken."
FULL ARTICLE HERE

He is right about voice assistants being broken. Siri is significantly less functional 12 years after its introduction. It's amazing the level of regression.

vdeane

Quote from: ZLoth on October 31, 2024, 05:26:51 PMFrom TechCrunch:

Rivian's chief software officer says in-car buttons are 'an anomaly'
QuoteThe trend of big touchscreens in cars has left many yearning for the not-so-distant days when most user interactions happened with physical buttons. But Rivian's chief software officer Wassym Bensaid believes using buttons in a car is an "anomaly."

"It's a bug. It's not a feature," Bensaid said Wednesday at TechCrunch Disrupt 2024. "Ideally, you would want to interact with your car through voice. The problem today is that most voice assistants are just broken."
FULL ARTICLE HERE
Why would anyone want that?  I certainly don't want a microphone listening to every word I say in the car, and I definitely don't want it guessing at what I want.  Computers have a habit of getting it wrong when they try to guess.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

kkt

There's all sorts of noise in cars!  The radio, conversations, noises from the road, wind, and outside.  Voice recognition would not work very well at all.  Buttons are fine, there's no need for something else.

I suppose Google would love to sell all the conversations in your car to the highest bidder, including your insurance company...

GaryV

My voice recognition story: My wife and I were driving, talking about another couple on vacation. She said they were now in Australia. Suddenly Australia popped up on my phone's GPS. Fortunately it didn't try to route us there. (Or maybe unfortunately, it would have been interesting to see.)

Big John


ZLoth

Or you speak in a specific accented version of English, like Welsh....


Thank you, I prefer my touchscreen, and I understand the need for a haptic feedback in the form of physical buttons as part of a vehicle's user experience.
Don't Drive Distrac... SQUIRREL!

kalvado

There are physical interfaces - encoder with integrated push comes to mind - which makes touchscreen look as  a great user friendly feature

GCrites

Quote from: kkt on November 01, 2024, 01:37:07 AMThere's all sorts of noise in cars!  The radio, conversations, noises from the road, wind, and outside.  Voice recognition would not work very well at all.  Buttons are fine, there's no need for something else.

I suppose Google would love to sell all the conversations in your car to the highest bidder, including your insurance company...


Apparently companies can't do wide-scale voice recording because the files are too big.

SEWIGuy

I use voice recognition when dialing hands free on a call. It works fine for that. But that's about it.

Rothman

I hate it when voice recognition works, but the process has too many steps in it.

"Speak a command."
"Call my wife."
"Showing results for 'My wife'" [single result]
[I hit the screen]
"Is this the number you want to call?"
[displays number]
Me, driving on a crowded Interstate: "Grrrr..."
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position(s) of NYSDOT.

vdeane

Quote from: GCrites on November 01, 2024, 09:51:55 AM
Quote from: kkt on November 01, 2024, 01:37:07 AMThere's all sorts of noise in cars!  The radio, conversations, noises from the road, wind, and outside.  Voice recognition would not work very well at all.  Buttons are fine, there's no need for something else.

I suppose Google would love to sell all the conversations in your car to the highest bidder, including your insurance company...


Apparently companies can't do wide-scale voice recording because the files are too big.
If Tesla can do wide-scale video recording, I'm sure anyone can do wide-scale voice recording.

https://www.reuters.com/technology/tesla-workers-shared-sensitive-images-recorded-by-customer-cars-2023-04-06/

Quote from: Rothman on November 01, 2024, 11:10:12 AMMe, driving on a crowded Interstate: "Grrrr..."
"I'm sorry, I did not understand you.  Please repeat."
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

JayhawkCO

Quote from: Rothman on November 01, 2024, 11:10:12 AMI hate it when voice recognition works, but the process has too many steps in it.

"Speak a command."
"Call my wife."
"Showing results for 'My wife'" [single result]
[I hit the screen]
"Is this the number you want to call?"
[displays number]
Me, driving on a crowded Interstate: "Grrrr..."

With Android Auto, I just press the button and say "Call Mrs. JayhawkCO" and it starts dialing. Can't get too much easier than that.

SEWIGuy

Quote from: JayhawkCO on November 01, 2024, 01:28:55 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 01, 2024, 11:10:12 AMI hate it when voice recognition works, but the process has too many steps in it.

"Speak a command."
"Call my wife."
"Showing results for 'My wife'" [single result]
[I hit the screen]
"Is this the number you want to call?"
[displays number]
Me, driving on a crowded Interstate: "Grrrr..."

With Android Auto, I just press the button and say "Call Mrs. JayhawkCO" and it starts dialing. Can't get too much easier than that.

Yeah, that's mine as well.

ZLoth

That's partially why I want Android Auto integration in my vehicle. It's voice recognition is better than my 2013's vehicle's voice recognition.
Don't Drive Distrac... SQUIRREL!

kkt

Quote from: ZLoth on November 01, 2024, 08:30:13 AMOr you speak in a specific accented version of English, like Welsh....


Thank you, I prefer my touchscreen, and I understand the need for a haptic feedback in the form of physical buttons as part of a vehicle's user experience.

"Ten" should be recognisable even in Scottish.  Then walk up a flight of stairs.

SEWIGuy

Quote from: ZLoth on November 01, 2024, 08:30:13 AMOr you speak in a specific accented version of English, like Welsh....


Thank you, I prefer my touchscreen, and I understand the need for a haptic feedback in the form of physical buttons as part of a vehicle's user experience.

To me, it is much easier to use buttons while driving.

kalvado

Quote from: kkt on November 01, 2024, 04:36:38 PM
Quote from: ZLoth on November 01, 2024, 08:30:13 AMOr you speak in a specific accented version of English, like Welsh....


Thank you, I prefer my touchscreen, and I understand the need for a haptic feedback in the form of physical buttons as part of a vehicle's user experience.

"Ten" should be recognisable even in Scottish.  Then walk up a flight of stairs.

Assuming your badge would allow that



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