Detroit Bridge Wars

[Brandon]

Or, we can be a little sneaky here....why not let Michigan and Ontario build a crossing at Goderich, Ontario to White Rock/Forestville, Michigan. Its a crossing between Port Huron and Sault Ste. Marie, taking traffic out of Detroit, Detroit can be rebuilt, then we're all happy. The highways that it would connect would be M-25 to ON 8/ON 21. Boom.

Not a chance.  That's crossing Lake Huron at a pretty wide and deep point.

[getemngo]

I'm assuming that was a joke (I hope). But even if it wasn't, this topic covers the lack of additional crossings pretty well. It just doesn't make sense anywhere that there isn't a major city.

[Rothman]

There are much older bridges in good condition, so obviously he hasn't been maintaining it properly... and if he can't maintain the bridge he has, why should he be trusted to build a new one?

Besides that, no objection as long as he does this LEGALLY (no unilaterally just doing it like he tried the last time) and tears down the old bridge when done.  It should be a replacement, not a twinning.

Trust a crook once, shame on him...trust a crook twice, shame on me.

[SignGeek101]

Matty Moroun Scores Victory; Council OKs Land Deal (from article)

http://www.deadlinedetroit.com/articles/12830/matty_moroun_scores_victory_council_agrees_to_land_deal#.Vbhc7vlViko

Or, we can be a little sneaky here....why not let Michigan and Ontario build a crossing at Goderich, Ontario to White Rock/Forestville, Michigan. Its a crossing between Port Huron and Sault Ste. Marie, taking traffic out of Detroit, Detroit can be rebuilt, then we're all happy. The highways that it would connect would be M-25 to ON 8/ON 21. Boom.

A bit long I think. But hey, I've suggested a bridge once from Digby Nova Scotia to Lubec Maine through Grand Manan Island. Won't happen now, but with better technology in the future, who knows.

[SteveG1988]

The owner of the Ambassador Bridge is 100% in it for the money.

he charges the US price of fuel at his fuel station in the Duty Free zone. He pockets the difference between wholesale price and taxed price. If gas is 2.61 a gal off the bridge in Detroit, he charges that, but that includes about 54 cents in taxes that isn't paid.

[lordsutch]

Just in case you were bored with the Matty Moroun saga, apparently the Coast Guard has decided to grant a permit for a second parallel Ambassador Bridge span. I can't imagine the traffic volumes warrant building it along with the Gordie Howe span, but I suppose either (a) Moroun will build it out of spite and slash tolls to feed more business to his gas pumps and/or (b) Moroun will build the new span as a de facto replacement for the decaying existing span and not bother repairing it when it becomes structurally deficient.

[JREwing78]

Just in case you were bored with the Matty Moroun saga, apparently the Coast Guard has decided to grant a permit for a second parallel Ambassador Bridge span. I can't imagine the traffic volumes warrant building it along with the Gordie Howe span, but I suppose either (a) Moroun will build it out of spite and slash tolls to feed more business to his gas pumps and/or (b) Moroun will build the new span as a de facto replacement for the decaying existing span and not bother repairing it when it becomes structurally deficient.

And the Canadians will, politely, continue to tell Mouron to go f*** himself.

SM-G900P

[vdeane]

The new span was always intended as a replacement, though I believe he wanted to leave the original in place for detours and such.  The approach is already built on the US side (note that traffic currently shifts over to the bridge from a rather large stub), but I'm not sure where it would end up in Canada.

[MisterSG1]

I've always believed that the Ambassador Bridge is in a more "strategic" spot, especially on the Michigan side, as I've generally seen I-96 as a sort of continuation of the 401, having said that, even if Moroun were to lower his toll rate once the Gordie Howe bridge is built, would that entice drivers to get off at Hwy 3 and use the Ambassador Bridge? Personally I don't think so because a freeway to freeway connection is more seamless. (mind you, people will use the Ambassador Bridge if the Gordie Howe bridge is plugged with a 2 hour wait)

[Joe The Dragon]

what if the Canadian gov body's ban's trucks on the bridge

[cpzilliacus]

N.Y. Times: Canadian Neighborhood Rots in the Shadow of an Unborn Bridge to Detroit

WINDSOR, Ontario – It is a postapocalyptic streetscape that most Canadians associate with American cities like Detroit: boarded-up houses, burned-out roofs, a mess of scattered shingles, peeling paint and crumbling masonry. In some abandoned homes, the only residents are skunks, raccoons, rats and feral cats.

But this vision of urban blight is not in an American city – it is in Canada, just across the border from Detroit.

This corner of Windsor, a neighborhood called Sandwich, was settled in 1783 and was once a terminal for the Underground Railroad bringing American slaves to freedom in Canada. Many of its tree-lined streets boasted majestic 19th-century houses. The area around Indian Road, built largely in the last century, was a thriving neighborhood favored by professors from an adjacent university.

But now Indian Road runs through a ghost neighborhood of over 100 boarded-up houses and three abandoned apartment buildings punctuated by a few, lonely occupied homes, a result of a long-running battle between an American businessman and Canadian governments at various levels.

[on_wisconsin]

Yawn... Wake me up when the concrete starts pouring...

[Alex]

N.Y. Times: Canadian Neighborhood Rots in the Shadow of an Unborn Bridge to Detroit

WINDSOR, Ontario – It is a postapocalyptic streetscape that most Canadians associate with American cities like Detroit: boarded-up houses, burned-out roofs, a mess of scattered shingles, peeling paint and crumbling masonry. In some abandoned homes, the only residents are skunks, raccoons, rats and feral cats.

But this vision of urban blight is not in an American city – it is in Canada, just across the border from Detroit.

This corner of Windsor, a neighborhood called Sandwich, was settled in 1783 and was once a terminal for the Underground Railroad bringing American slaves to freedom in Canada. Many of its tree-lined streets boasted majestic 19th-century houses. The area around Indian Road, built largely in the last century, was a thriving neighborhood favored by professors from an adjacent university.

But now Indian Road runs through a ghost neighborhood of over 100 boarded-up houses and three abandoned apartment buildings punctuated by a few, lonely occupied homes, a result of a long-running battle between an American businessman and Canadian governments at various levels.

FYI, The article linked goes to a Richmond Times-Dispatch story about a Navy helicopter crash at Newport News.

[vdeane]

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/13/world/americas/windsor-residents-caught-in-shadow-of-bridge-that-isnt-built-yet.html

[7/8]

http://windsorstar.com/news/local-news/final-piece-of-moroun-lawsuit-against-howe-bridge-dismissed

U.S. District Judge Rosemary Collyer last fall dismissed nearly all claims against the government entities.

But she left one claim outstanding – that the U.S. Department of State violated procedure when it granted a presidential permit in April, 2013 for the Howe bridge to be constructed.

Moroun's lawyers alleged approval of the Howe crossing agreement was "arbitrary, capricious and contrary to the U.S. Constitution."

Collyer on Monday released a 38-page ruling that detailed the lengthy process and public feedback periods undertaken by the U.S. government leading to approval of the permit for the Howe bridge.

She concluded the U.S. state department did act within the confines of authority grant by Congress and had a rational basis for approving the agreement.

^ Looks like Moroun's big law suit is finally over 

http://windsorstar.com/news/local-news/howe-bridge-project-appears-stalled

A $50-million early works project to prepare the customs plaza site in Windsor was launched a year ago by the bridge authority – a government-backed body assigned to oversee construction.

The first stage of the bidding process to select a global consortium to build the project was also triggered.

Everything remained on schedule and moving at a quick clip until last fall's federal election and change in government. A short list of three consortiums, from the six which applied, was released in January – over a month late.

The final bidding phase, known as a request for proposals, was to follow within a few weeks. Six months later, the bridge authority has not issued the request for proposals and given no explanation for the delay.

Federal Infrastructure Minister Amajeet Sohi responded to Masse's questions in the House of Commons a couple weeks ago, but provided no answers about the delay, saying the request for proposals will be released soon.

^ I was hoping to find news about how far the construction has gotten, and instead I find this 

[7/8]

Not too surprising...
http://windsorstar.com/news/local-news/a-2020-opening-of-the-new-windsor-detroit-bridge-is-looking-like-a-long-shot

A 2020 completion date for the Gordie Howe International Bridge is looking increasingly doubtful as challenges persist in getting the multibillion-dollar crossing between Windsor and Detroit to the next stage.

The biggest hurdle? About 30 properties needed for the new crossing on the U.S. side  – 20 of them belonging to Ambassador Bridge owner Manuel "Matty"  Moroun –  but considered "problematic"  to acquire, according to Dwight Duncan, interim chairman of the Windsor-Detroit Bridge Authority.

"I won't be held to a date,"  he told the Star on Friday, the first time he has addressed the delay.

Duncan said a request for proposals to be issued to three short-listed international consortia is "ready to go"  but that the 3,000-page document won't be sent out until the bridge authority is confident all the potential risks have been mitigated.

The government-appointed bridge authority has received legal advice from both sides of the border and is confident "we'll get access to these properties,"  he said. The risky part is how long it could take if there's resistance and the matter has to be fought out in court.

Duncan sat down with the Star to explain why a request for proposals release, initially promised for January, still hasn't happened.

The request for detailed design proposals starts the clock ticking on the project, said the former Ontario finance minister. But getting the construction ball rolling before there's sufficient assurance all the necessary properties are in hand can have "huge cost implications down the road – in the multimillion dollars a month,"  said Duncan.

As of this week, 423 of 963 properties on the Michigan side had been purchased, but bridge authority officials feel only 30 of those are at risk of being challenged legally.

A number of the Moroun holdings are key properties. They include a portion of the 42-acre Central Transport truck terminal, the former Yellow Freight hub at 7701 W. Jefferson Ave. in Delray acquired by Moroun in 2010 after the new public crossing was first announced.

[7/8]

A question for those more familiar with the area...

Do you think the new bridge will increase traffic on M-39 (Southfield Rd)? I'm thinking some people will use I-75 south to M-39 to get to I-94 west (and vice versa). Or do you think more people will go I-75 north to I-96 west to I-94 west?

Also, if you think M-39 will get more traffic, do you think the current road will be satisfactory for the new demand?

[lordsutch]

Apparently there's  recent speculation that the Marouns may be willing to sell the Ambassador Bridge to the Canadian government. Whether this is just a ploy to drag out the purchase negotiations for the Michigan-side properties the Marouns control or a serious offer, though, remains to be seen.

[The Ghostbuster]

Maybe the new bridge will have to wait until Maroun dies before it can be constructed.

[JREwing78]

A question for those more familiar with the area...

Do you think the new bridge will increase traffic on M-39 (Southfield Rd)? I'm thinking some people will use I-75 south to M-39 to get to I-94 west (and vice versa). Or do you think more people will go I-75 north to I-96 west to I-94 west?

Also, if you think M-39 will get more traffic, do you think the current road will be satisfactory for the new demand?

I suspect most would follow the freeways. M-39 isn't particularly easy to get on and off again, and it's not much of a shortcut. Following I-75 north to I-94 west, they wouldn't have to deal with stoplights and such. It looks out of the way on a map, but in actual driving it would function more smoothly than using M-39.

Now, if MDOT ever punched a 6-lane freeway through the existing M-39 section and built a gigantic interchange, traffic would favor that. But my bet is the only time M-39 in its current configuration would see a significant increase in traffic is if I-94 or I-75 near downtown turned into a parking lot.

[7/8]

A question for those more familiar with the area...

Do you think the new bridge will increase traffic on M-39 (Southfield Rd)? I'm thinking some people will use I-75 south to M-39 to get to I-94 west (and vice versa). Or do you think more people will go I-75 north to I-96 west to I-94 west?

Also, if you think M-39 will get more traffic, do you think the current road will be satisfactory for the new demand?

I suspect most would follow the freeways. M-39 isn't particularly easy to get on and off again, and it's not much of a shortcut. Following I-75 north to I-94 west, they wouldn't have to deal with stoplights and such. It looks out of the way on a map, but in actual driving it would function more smoothly than using M-39.

Now, if MDOT ever punched a 6-lane freeway through the existing M-39 section and built a gigantic interchange, traffic would favor that. But my bet is the only time M-39 in its current configuration would see a significant increase in traffic is if I-94 or I-75 near downtown turned into a parking lot.

Thanks JREwing78

------

I found this article from August 5th:
http://windsorstar.com/news/local-news/howe-bridge-authority-lost-its-way-threatens-project-masse-says

Local MP Brian Masse called it "troubling"  and "alarming"  how Dwight Duncan – interim Windsor-Detroit Bridge Authority chair – has staged talks with Ambassador Bridge owner Matty Moroun on a possible sale when he should be focused on finishing the Gordie Howe International Bridge.

"When did this project go from build to buy?"  Masse said at a news conference on Friday.

The mandate of the authority and interim chairman is to "get the job done of building a new crossing in the most transparent and quickest way possible,"  he said.

"Why are you engaging in these different conversations? It undermines the credibility of the position."

In a three-page letter sent Friday to Canada's Infrastructure Minster Amarjeet Sohi, Masse called on the federal government to launch a full evaluation of both Duncan and the authority which he said are "eroding public confidence in the project."

For more than a decade, Moroun has launched countless court challenges on the both sides of the border to stop the Howe bridge project which he fears threatens revenues at his privately owned Windsor-Detroit bridge.

At the end of July, Duncan detailed to The Star how both he and bridge authority CEO Michael Cautillo have indeed recently met informally with Moroun and his son Matthew.

"We had two good meetings,"  Duncan said. "I recommended to the government of Canada that it's worth further discussions."

Duncan said he was dispatched by government leaders to find out "how serious they are."

He also said the federal government can no longer "be held"  to the 2020 completion date for the Howe bridge and that discussions with the Moroun family were a factor.

"Why has the distraction to acquire the Ambassador Bridge become an issue for the authority?,"  Masse said.

The MP called it "critical"  both Duncan and the authority stick to what they were put in place to accomplish given how both the national and local economies are at stake and are relying on the long-awaited bridge project to meet its scheduled 2020 opening.

The authority said Friday that Duncan was not be available to respond. He also did not return a phone message from The Star.

Duncan also had blamed delays on the dozens of properties required for the bridge plaza on the Detroit side that are not yet in hand, including a few owned by Moroun.

That also angered Masse.

Several properties remained outstanding in Windsor prior to construction of the Herb Gray Parkway. They were expropriated and settled in court — years later in some cases.

"The U.S. side is not complicated,"  Masse said. "They have a condemnation process. To have that thrown in our face is curious to say the least."

A spokeswoman for the Windsor-Detroit Bridge Authority said it remains "fully committed"  to the bridge project.

"WDBA is committed to bringing the Gordie Howe International Bridge into service as quickly as possible while prudently managing all the risks associated with a project of this magnitude,"  Heather Grondin said in an email. "The RFP will be released to the proponents in due course."

Masse said he was not conducting a "witch hunt,"  but wants both Duncan and bridge authority to be held accountable.

"It's been a bloody war to get here and this is not the way to approach this,"  Masse said.

[JREwing78]

Makes you wonder how much money exchanged hands between Mouron and Duncan during these "informal" meetings.

SM-G900P

[bulldog1979]

There have been a few cases over the decades where the powers that be could have bought the Ambassador Bridge out. The first was the original bankruptcy in the 1930s, when the builders defaulted on the construction bonds, and the bondholders were paid off in stock in a newly organized, publicly traded corporation. I think they're missed opportunities, and if one of them had been exercised early enough, it would be part of I-96 and Hwy 401 by now.

[7/8]

An article posted today. A bit long, but I thought it was interesting:
http://www.metrotimes.com/detroit/politics-and-prejudices-why-arent-they-building-the-new-bridge/Content?oid=2460363

By this time, earth-moving equipment should be crawling over all the approaches leading to where the new Gordie Howe International Bridge is to rise.

Crews should be working to relocate utility lines as needed. Workers should be signing up for jobs – thousands of good-paying, construction jobs that will last for years.

More than four years ago, in what likely is the best thing he ever will have done as governor, Rick Snyder figured out a way to get around a legislature owned by Matty Moroun, the billionaire who owns the rickety Ambassador Bridge.

Every business interest in both Michigan and Ontario has known for years that a new bridge is essential. This is the two nations' economically most important border crossing.

Billions in trade, mainly heavy manufacturing components, moves across the old bridge every week. This is stuff that can't go through the tunnel. There is no backup system; if this bridge fails, it would be devastating to our economy. The structure may indeed be literally falling apart; it sent a shower of concrete into Windsor streets last fall.

On top of that, the Ambassador Bridge is in a lousy place for a major economic trade route. There are more than a dozen traffic lights between the end of the bridge and Highway 401, Canada's most important freeway. Moroun's contention that he should be allowed to build a second bridge next to his old one makes no sense logistically or environmentally.

The last thing the people who live in the wretched neighborhoods near the Ambassador need is to breathe more diesel exhaust and suffer through more noise pollution.

The new bridge has now won every approval necessary – presidential, parliamentary, environmental.

Enraged at first that someone was actually trying to make him play fair, Matty Moroun filed federal lawsuit after federal lawsuit attempting to block the new bridge from being built.

The only winners were the lawyers who billed him by the hour. He lost every count on every case. Meanwhile, the Canadians have built a system of beautiful access roads that will swiftly convey traffic from the Gordie Howe directly to 401.

The area is artfully landscaped, and partly concealed barriers are in place to shield residents from noise pollution.

But on this side of the border, nothing – except a little preliminary work at the site of what is to be the future U.S. customs plaza. Two weeks ago, Gregg Ward, the co-owner of the Detroit-Windsor Truck Ferry, took me on a tour of the entire bridge area on both sides of the border. The contrast was huge.

Afterward, over lunch, he sighed. "I'm worried that it is being deliberately stalled," he said of the bridge.

He's not alone. Brian Masse, the member of Canada's parliament who represents Windsor, is suspicious as to whether the new Liberal government led by Justin Trudeau is as committed to the bridge as the Conservative Prime Minister Stephen Harper was before he was defeated last fall.

Masse, who as a New Democrat is a member of neither party, has accused the Windsor-Detroit Bridge Authority of "losing focus," and was alarmed that Dwight Duncan, the interim head of the authority, has expressed interest in perhaps trying to buy the Ambassador Bridge, which he accurately described as an "aging, crumbling piece of infrastructure."

(Earlier discussions about buying the bridge collapsed when Moroun insisted on an unreasonable price. Apparently, Canada would buy it not to avoid building a new bridge, but to put an end to Moroun's interference.)

Ward's suspicions as to why things are stalled center around Detroit Mayor Mike Duggan, who has been playing footsie for many months with Matty Moroun, who the mayor has made a controversial deal with over Riverside Park.

"Every year this project is delayed means more millions for Moroun," said Ward. He wonders why the mayor hasn't signed off to transfer jurisdiction over roads and easements in the area to the bridge authority, so they could begin requiring utilities to relocate lines, etc. as needed for the bridge.

When asked about all this, the Duggan administration's response was less than reassuring. After two days, I received a response from Jed Howbert, the executive director of the Jobs & Economic Team. "We continue to support the Gordie Howe bridge, and are committed to ensuring the needs of those who live in the community are addressed."

That raises the question of community benefits, often a sore point when it comes to development in the city.

There's little question that those who live near developments in Detroit have often been given short shrift when it came to how they were treated. Two different community benefits ordinances will be on the Detroit ballot this year.

Indeed, Ward told me, MDOT, the Michigan Department of Transportation, seems to have no intention of erecting the sort of noise barriers Canada has to shield the mostly poor people on the U.S. side who will be living within the shadow and the "noise footprint" of the Gordie Howe bridge.

Alan Ackerman is an attorney who represents most of the business owners in the bridge area. He is sympathetic to community benefits – but says "Duggan came a little late to the party, after Coleman Young and Kwame gave so much away."

His clients, most of whom were struggling to begin with, are not benefiting from the delay. "I've never seen anything like the power of Matty Moroun. He gets anything he wants," said Ackerman, who has been practicing law in the city for 44 years.

Canada recently began to back away from the previous insistence that the bridge would be finished and open by 2020.

Ackerman's guess is that it will be 2023 – and that it won't happen until all parties conclude an agreement with Moroun.

The biggest reason for the delay is that the Detroit-Windsor Bridge Authority still has to acquire many parcels of land, 30 or so of which are owned by – yep – Matty Moroun.

Ackerman is perhaps the area's foremost expert on eminent domain; he won the Michigan Supreme Court's historic "Poletown" ruling in 2004 that made it harder for economic development organizations to take homeowners' land.

Here, he thinks eminent domain could be used if needed in the case of the Moroun properties, but that things could be dragged out indefinitely unless a deal is reached with the state's greediest and most obnoxious billionaire.

Driving through New Jersey, he told me "You'll know it will happen when one day you hear that they've made a deal with Moroun." Hundreds of miles away, sitting at Johnny Noodle King, a short drive from his docks, Ward also agrees.

The new bridge will happen; it's too economically important to the region. As a human being, Ward is sort of the anti-Moroun. Looked at one way, he should be against any new bridge. His truck ferry exists because the rickety Ambassador isn't safe for trucks carrying hazardous materials.

The new bridge will be, and will put Ward, the 56-year-old single father of an autistic son, out of business.

Yet a new bridge is essential if we are to have a future. One thing working in its favor is biology.

Ward doesn't say so, but he knows in a few years, the 89-year-old Moroun will be dead.

Yet he also can look back at years of failed and thwarted attempts and delays, and a region sold out time and again.

"I worry," Ward said.

We all should.

[cbeach40]

An article posted today. A bit long, but I thought it was interesting:
http://www.metrotimes.com/detroit/politics-and-prejudices-why-arent-they-building-the-new-bridge/Content?oid=2460363

The same day that editorial asks why work hasn't started on the new bridge, another article posts about the work that has been underway for a while on the new bridge.

http://windsorite.ca/2016/08/gordie-howe-bridge-work-progressesing/