South Carolina

[Mapmikey]

Why was a new alignment of I-85 built around Spartanburg instead of widening the old alignment?

The old alignment was a pre-interstate era freeway that has/had missing exit movements and terrible ramp geometries.  To modernize it would've required more than a simple widening to 6 lanes - would've required a complete rebuild which would've taken out many existing businesses/structures.

It was likely just as easy to build an all new alignment around the city.  There was discussion of changing I-85 Bus to I-685 in 2000 but it would've still cost >$100M to bring the road up to interstate standard, presumably with no widening.

[Alex]

Why was a new alignment of I-85 built around Spartanburg instead of widening the old alignment?

The old alignment was a pre-interstate era freeway that has/had missing exit movements and terrible ramp geometries.  To modernize it would've required more than a simple widening to 6 lanes - would've required a complete rebuild which would've taken out many existing businesses/structures.

It was likely just as easy to build an all new alignment around the city.  There was discussion of changing I-85 Bus to I-685 in 2000 but it would've still cost >$100M to bring the road up to interstate standard, presumably with no widening.

Proposals to upgrade the old freeway started in 1983. Spartanburg initially was against realignment, fearing a loss in economic revenue. Nonetheless FHWA approved the northern realignment, which at the time the estimated cost was just $4 million more than costs to upgrade the old route:

https://www.interstate-guide.com/i-085/

The old alignment was once proposed as I-285, partly so that I-585 would still connect with the Interstate system.

[wriddle082]

Why was a new alignment of I-85 built around Spartanburg instead of widening the old alignment?

The old alignment was a pre-interstate era freeway that has/had missing exit movements and terrible ramp geometries.  To modernize it would've required more than a simple widening to 6 lanes - would've required a complete rebuild which would've taken out many existing businesses/structures.

It was likely just as easy to build an all new alignment around the city.  There was discussion of changing I-85 Bus to I-685 in 2000 but it would've still cost >$100M to bring the road up to interstate standard, presumably with no widening.

Proposals to upgrade the old freeway started in 1983. Spartanburg initially was against realignment, fearing a loss in economic revenue. Nonetheless FHWA approved the northern realignment, which at the time the estimated cost was just $4 million more than costs to upgrade the old route:

https://www.interstate-guide.com/i-085/

The old alignment was once proposed as I-285, partly so that I-585 would still connect with the Interstate system.

Little by little they're still fixing parts of 85 Business.  Right now the bridge over the Hearon Circle interchange (Exit 4) is closed down for a complete rebuild.  I think that's scheduled to be finished by June of next year.  They'll probably/hopefully add shoulders to the new bridge, but I'm sure it won't be upgraded to full interstate standards.  The original bridge dates back to the 50's, possibly early 50's.

[architect77]

Does anyone know when the I-85 widening project will be finished? It's not fun to navigate the work zone, and I feel like I've had to do it a dozen times.

[VTGoose]

Did the Florida-Virginia trip home on Sunday, slogging up I-95/I-26/I-77 through South Carolina. Luckily traffic wasn't bad and we moved right along. Somewhere around Hardeeville there were two smallish text-heavy signs next to the interstate about public comment wanted. Not sure how anyone was supposed to read the signs at 70+ MPH, but they apparently refer to the call for comments the on the I-95 Widening Project in Jasper County between MM 8 -MM 21 (see https://www.scdot.org/projects/press-releases-MileMarker8-MM21.aspx). Per the news release, preliminary engineering will be done this year but construction won't start until 2026. There is also another call for comments on the next section from MM 21 to exit 33 (see https://www.scdot.org/projects/press-releases-MileMarker21-MM33.aspx). That construction won't start until 2028. Perhaps (if interstates still matter) I-95 will be widened for its entire length in South Carolina by the turn of the next century.

[D-Dey65]

Did the Florida-Virginia trip home on Sunday, slogging up I-95/I-26/I-77 through South Carolina. Luckily traffic wasn't bad and we moved right along. Somewhere around Hardeeville there were two smallish text-heavy signs next to the interstate about public comment wanted. Not sure how anyone was supposed to read the signs at 70+ MPH, but they apparently refer to the call for comments the on the I-95 Widening Project in Jasper County between MM 8 -MM 21 (see https://www.scdot.org/projects/press-releases-MileMarker8-MM21.aspx). Per the news release, preliminary engineering will be done this year but construction won't start until 2026. There is also another call for comments on the next section from MM 21 to exit 33 (see https://www.scdot.org/projects/press-releases-MileMarker21-MM33.aspx). That construction won't start until 2028. Perhaps (if interstates still matter) I-95 will be widened for its entire length in South Carolina by the turn of the next century.

"Comments will be accepted until the close of business on August 11, 2022."
Damn! If I only knew about this before then. 

I was hoping there would be more details on their PDF files. I'm also disappointed they're not covering anything south of Exit 8. Today I reconsidered a replacement for the northbound off-ramp at Exit 5 that included the entrance to the Welcome Center.

[D-Dey65]

Here's my idea for the new Exit 5, more or less:
https://imgur.com/a/3AUpkoI

Hey, did you know that the majority of Bridge Reports for bridges in Jasper County are rated at either fair or poor condition, including those along I-95?
https://bridgereports.com/sc/jasper/exhibit/

[Ted$8roadFan]

Does anyone know when the I-85 widening project will be finished? It's not fun to navigate the work zone, and I feel like I've had to do it a dozen times.

Still in progress as of late October. Not fun to travel indeed.

[gbgoose]

Does anyone know when the I-85 widening project will be finished? It's not fun to navigate the work zone, and I feel like I've had to do it a dozen times.

Still in progress as of late October. Not fun to travel indeed.

According to the i-85 South Carolina site, MM 98-106 is scheduled for completion next month.  The rest of it not until late 2024.

Fixed quote
- Alex

[wriddle082]

Does anyone know when the I-85 widening project will be finished? It's not fun to navigate the work zone, and I feel like I've had to do it a dozen times.

According to the i-85 South Carolina site, MM 98-106 is scheduled for completion next month.  The rest of it not until late 2024.
Still in progress as of late October. Not fun to travel indeed.

Indeed, a couple of weeks ago I went through going northbound.  After you cross the Broad River, you have three striped asphalt lanes with barrels blocking the right lane.  So much smoother than the temporary patchwork work zone pavement, and even though the lanes aren't fully opened, it's nice to not have the claustrophobic feeling that the cattle chutes give.

One reason why the rest of it is taking longer, IMO, is because it's mostly being built in concrete.  Also they have been fixing some of the superelevation issues.

[quantumzirconium]

I've been to South Carolina and Convey so many times. They have fine roads.
I like the local nature.

[VTGoose]

Another "Mountains to the Gulf" trip to see the grandson, which mandated driving through South Carolina. I-77 has signs all around Columbia announcing the closure of the northbound lanes for bridge work. The huge vacant field on the east side of the highway, close to the I-26 interchange, appears to be the staging area for all the equipment needed for the work.

On I-26 and I-95 (which was misbehaving with micro-passers and bad speed differentials) it appears that the major project is removal of any and all standing vegetation from right-of-way fence to right-of-way fence. There must be some rationale for doing that, but it seems like the money could be better spent.

[chrisdiaz]

On I-26 and I-95 ... it appears that the major project is removal of any and all standing vegetation from right-of-way fence to right-of-way fence.

The same is occurring on I-20 as well. I guess it could do with making maintenance easier.

[sprjus4]

This happened some years ago further north on I-95 in SC I believe as well... I believe the purpose was to reduce fatal accidents of vehicles driving into the forested median.

Virginia has installed cable barrier along the clear zones between the forested median and the left shoulder in some areas. I've noticed this on I-64 particularly. This is likely another mitigation tactic without actually tearing out the trees.

[wriddle082]

There were several fatal accidents involving the median trees in recent years that SCDOT has decided that eliminating the trees is now a priority.  But I believe they are making back some of the money they are spending by selling the timber.

As for the I-77 total closures, they are to fix the terrible bridge decks between mm's 0 and 5.  They had a northbound closure recently that began on the evening of 3/24 and ended one day early on the evening of 4/1, and the bridge decks are much improved.  The same closure will happen for southbound starting this Friday 4/14 evening and is scheduled once again for 9 days.

[kernals12]

Were there ever any plans for a crosstown freeway in Charleston?

[Mapmikey]

Were there ever any plans for a crosstown freeway in Charleston?

Yes.  See pg. 38 at https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=ien.35556030781793&view=1up&seq=38 for a 1972 EIS of the proposed Inner Belt Freeway

[The Ghostbuster]

Did Charleston have a freeway revolt like other cities did?

[kernals12]

Did Charleston have a freeway revolt like other cities did?

Does the controversy over the extension of 526 to John's Island count?

That 1972 EIS is the only documented evidence I've seen of proof that a Crosstown freeway was seriously contemplated in an official capacity.

I'm guessing that lack of funds was the reason it never got built.

[ran4sh]

I don't see how it wouldn't count, especially since the exit numbering of I-526 has always included the mileage of that section in the numbering. (I wish they would at least post the missing numbers on the west half of the route though, even if it doesn't end at mile 0 as is.)

[kernals12]

It's very bizarre I-95 doesn't go through Charleston and Myrtle Beach. Is that because of the difficulty of building in wetlands?

[74/171FAN]

It's very bizarre I-95 doesn't go through Charleston and Myrtle Beach. Is that because of the difficulty of building in wetlands?

Well I-73's southern end was supposed to be in Charleston.   

[Mapmikey]

It's very bizarre I-95 doesn't go through Charleston and Myrtle Beach. Is that because of the difficulty of building in wetlands?

There was definitely a contingent trying to route I-95 closer to Charleston in the 1960s.  One logistical issue was Lake Marion and Lake Moultrie being in the way which would've made I-95 much, much longer through SC.  In the 1980s there were news articles about a proposal to build a freeway that looped off I-95 to get much closer to Charleston.

I was actually surprised to find the 1972 EIS for those proposed freeways including one along today's Crosstown Expwy.  I lived in the Charleston area 1975-95 (age 5-25) and do not recall seeing or hearing anything about those proposals. SC highway stuff is very difficult to research because not much is online.  Lots of MPOs like CHATS nationwide had pie in the sky proposals that never got approval by the state DOTs whether $ was a factor or not.  But I will say the oil crisis and inflation/stagflation in the 1970s put the brakes on many freeway proposals in the US.

[ran4sh]

It's very bizarre I-95 doesn't go through Charleston and Myrtle Beach. Is that because of the difficulty of building in wetlands?

I would say it's because of general anti-South bias as well as the fact that Charleston and especially MB are a lot less important than the larger cities that I-95 needs to serve such as Washington DC and the Florida coast, so I-95 simply goes relatively straight from Washington/Richmond toward Savannah/Florida.

[kernals12]

It's very bizarre I-95 doesn't go through Charleston and Myrtle Beach. Is that because of the difficulty of building in wetlands?

I would say it's because of general anti-South bias as well as the fact that Charleston and especially MB are a lot less important than the larger cities that I-95 needs to serve such as Washington DC and the Florida coast, so I-95 simply goes relatively straight from Washington/Richmond toward Savannah/Florida.

But Charleston and MB are clearly more important cities than Florence