Florida

[Max Rockatansky]

New quest, people;

According to Historic Aerials, US 92 used to be a one-way pair in Auburndale until sometime in the 1960's. Westbound US 92 ran along Bridgers Avenue and had the hidden State Road 600, while eastbound US 92 ran along the current path but also had a hidden extension of State Road 544, which also included what is now Old Winter Haven Road and Jersey Road.

All I need are the dates for these designations. Besides Historical Aerials, the usual online source (UF Digital Collection) isn't telling me anything.

Have you tried archive.org for FDOT materials (there is a lot) and maybe even the AASHTO database?

I can't trust archive.org for too much anymore other than a few old short films. Far too often I try to look for something there, and they given me an error message, or say that it's flat out not archived.

All the volumes of Florida Highways and a bunch of other stuff is available searching for Florida State Road Department:

https://archive.org/search.php?query=Florida%20State%20road%20department&sin=TXT

[UCFKnights]

Was in South Florida this past week and saw this odd style of gantry on I-95 in Pompano Beach. Is this typical of FL express lane installs? And are there more like this?

There are a few more amongst the HOV to express lane conversions. The early HOV to express lane conversions garnered a lot of complaints from FHP that it was too difficult to pull people over and they couldn't respond to accidents, partly because the only shoulder on the left narrowed too much to travel at all, too frequently with every gantry, this new design reduces the intrusion into their pull over/emergency lane. Here's a mixed one:

https://www.google.com/maps/@26.223247,-80.1364804,3a,90y,349.27h,101.28t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sRZ9ldYyHN8wgk-WR30-FoQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?hl=en

[roadman65]

https://goo.gl/maps/9TFysb273g1vBaTC7
I'd like to know what is the white Pilar on the New Pensacola Bay Bridge?

[Mapmikey]

https://goo.gl/maps/9TFysb273g1vBaTC7
I'd like to know what is the white Pilar on the New Pensacola Bay Bridge?

The Feb 2022 view shows what it is for...

[MASTERNC]

I returned to Jacksonville for the first time in 12 years and the one thing I noticed is the I-295/I-95 interchange north of the city is still under construction. Granted, when I was last there in 2009, the east side of the beltway was not signed as I-295, and the work was mainly on the SB flyover to the east leg of the beltway, but it's still crazy that interchange wasn't all done at once by now.

Oh, and there is a 4 mile advanced BGS with arrows on I-295 approaching I-95 from the NE side. That is the most advanced warning I've seen for a diagrammatical BGS.

[VTGoose]

I returned to Jacksonville for the first time in 12 years and the one thing I noticed is the I-295/I-95 interchange north of the city is still under construction. Granted, when I was last there in 2009, the east side of the beltway was not signed as I-295, and the work was mainly on the SB flyover to the east leg of the beltway, but it's still crazy that interchange wasn't all done at once by now.

That seems to be the Florida way. The Starke and Baldwin bypasses took years to complete and work is still going on at the I-10/U.S. 301 interchange. By the time some of these projects are done, some of the early workers who stick with the project will marry, have kids, and be ready to send at least one kid off to college.

[edwaleni]

I returned to Jacksonville for the first time in 12 years and the one thing I noticed is the I-295/I-95 interchange north of the city is still under construction. Granted, when I was last there in 2009, the east side of the beltway was not signed as I-295, and the work was mainly on the SB flyover to the east leg of the beltway, but it's still crazy that interchange wasn't all done at once by now.

Oh, and there is a 4 mile advanced BGS with arrows on I-295 approaching I-95 from the NE side. That is the most advanced warning I've seen for a diagrammatical BGS.

Construction was delayed at first when a worker found skeletons and skulls in some of the fill dirt. FDOT had to first make sure they didn't upset an Indian gravesite (they didn't). Then they had to back trace where the fill dirt had been. The second delay is all covid based.

Seems one of the dirt contractors was using a off job site to store the dirt when it came in during the off hours and it was a abandoned cemetery.  Then when the contractor picked up the dirt to take it to the job site they disturbed the remains below and it was taken out and poured. That is when a worker saw the skulls and bones.

As for the lengthy BGS distance is because that NE quadrant of I-295 supports a large number of logistics trucks coming in and out of Jaxport. The separation for the Heckscher Drive exit is sooner than a standard exit ramp, so they start warning early so the trucks will be in position.

[Alex]

I received an email from D2 regarding a map change I submitted for the next update of the State of Florida Map regarding an incorrect placement of an SR A1A shield on the St. Augustine inset. As an aside, the RCI Coordinator wrote that Florida has requested for the removal of U.S. 1 Business to AASHTO, as FDOT and the City of St. Augustine are in negotiations for the transfer of maintenance of King Street and Cathedral Place from the state.

U.S. 1 Business is not a complete loop currently anyway, with state maintenance ending from the south at SR 16.

[edwaleni]

I received an email from D2 regarding a map change I submitted for the next update of the State of Florida Map regarding an incorrect placement of an SR A1A shield on the St. Augustine inset. As an aside, the RCI Coordinator wrote that Florida has requested for the removal of U.S. 1 Business to AASHTO, as FDOT and the City of St. Augustine are in negotiations for the transfer of maintenance of King Street and Cathedral Place from the state.

U.S. 1 Business is not a complete loop currently anyway, with state maintenance ending from the south at SR 16.

Very interesting. I agree that the US 1 Business is pointless now. Perhaps back in 1966, but not now.

I am wondering when FDOT will drop ALT US-90 in Jacksonville. Yes, it exists because US-90 uses the Alsop (Main Street) draw bridge to cross the St John's, but now the Acosta crosses in a more simplified manner negating the use of an ALT.

[Max Rockatansky]

FDOT is actually bothering to petition the AASHTO Executive Committee on a Business Route being deleted?  Most DOTs just remove the signage and never bother with the AASHTO.  I would half expect a snarky response from the Executive Committee for an intrastate request if it makes it to the AASHTO Database.

[74/171FAN]

FDOT is actually bothering to petition the AASHTO Executive Committee on a Business Route being deleted?  Most DOTs just remove the signage and never bother with the AASHTO.  I would half expect a snarky response from the Executive Committee for an intrastate request if it makes it to the AASHTO Database.

I doubt it.  Arkansas and Michigan have been doing it for a while.  Missouri just did it with US 54 BUS (Lake of the Ozarks) at the last meeting.

[Max Rockatansky]

FDOT is actually bothering to petition the AASHTO Executive Committee on a Business Route being deleted?  Most DOTs just remove the signage and never bother with the AASHTO.  I would half expect a snarky response from the Executive Committee for an intrastate request if it makes it to the AASHTO Database.

I doubt it.  Arkansas and Michigan have been doing it for a while.  Missouri just did it with US 54 (Lake of the Ozarks) at the last meeting.

Interestingly I'm not sure if California (the state I do by far my most research on in the Database) has ever formally made explicit requests to decommission a US Route Business Loop.  I would be kind of interested in figuring out on the whole how many Business Routes are still on AASHTO log books but are not actually field signed? 

[bassoon1986]

FDOT is actually bothering to petition the AASHTO Executive Committee on a Business Route being deleted?  Most DOTs just remove the signage and never bother with the AASHTO.  I would half expect a snarky response from the Executive Committee for an intrastate request if it makes it to the AASHTO Database.

I doubt it.  Arkansas and Michigan have been doing it for a while.  Missouri just did it with US 54 (Lake of the Ozarks) at the last meeting.

Interestingly I'm not sure if California (the state I do by far my most research on in the Database) has ever formally made explicit requests to decommission a US Route Business Loop.  I would be kind of interested in figuring out on the whole how many Business Routes are still on AASHTO log books but are not actually field signed?

You should make a new thread on that. I'm sure enough of us know which ones are and aren't in our areas.


iPhone

[rickmastfan67]

I am wondering when FDOT will drop ALT US-90 in Jacksonville. Yes, it exists because US-90 uses the Alsop (Main Street) draw bridge to cross the St John's, but now the Acosta crosses in a more simplified manner negating the use of an ALT.

Alt US-90 doesn't even bypass the Main Street bridge anymore.
https://travelmapping.net/hb/showroute.php?units=miles&u=null&r=fl.us090altjac

[edwaleni]

I am wondering when FDOT will drop ALT US-90 in Jacksonville. Yes, it exists because US-90 uses the Alsop (Main Street) draw bridge to cross the St John's, but now the Acosta crosses in a more simplified manner negating the use of an ALT.

Alt US-90 doesn't even bypass the Main Street bridge anymore.
https://travelmapping.net/hb/showroute.php?units=miles&u=null&r=fl.us090altjac

Ah, I asked an old timer who used to drive trucks. He said ALT US-90 is due to a clearance issue when Beach Boulevard (US-90) goes under the Commodore Point Expressway, aka Hart Bridge Expressway.

I went and looked online and it doesn't even have a clearance marker or notification of height.  This can't be right.

As for my confusion on river crossings, that be that "other" ALT in Jacksonville, ALT US-1.

It starts at Philips Hwy and Emerson, goes east to the Hart Expressway, crosses the St. Johns turns north and is part of the MLK Expwy until it reaches Main Street on the north side of town.

I was always told that ALT US-1 will remain due to US-1 also crossing the Main Street bridge co-signed with US-90.



Talk about confusion. Shouldn't ALT US-90 also avoid the drawbridge as ALT US-1 does?

[rickmastfan67]

At one point, there was an Alt US-90 that went along the Mathews Bridge/Arlington Expressway and then back down Southside Blvd (FL-115).  But that route is no-more.

A lone sign for it lasted till ~Apr '11 per StreetView: https://goo.gl/maps/VWizdcaUjCsN5FPz6

==

As for clearance, maybe it was for the Emerson Street Expressway bridge? (Just corrected the name.) Historical StreetView from Jan '17 shows a painted on 'Clearance 15'-4"' on the bridge. https://goo.gl/maps/Vwook9FkoRnwRQFQ9  By the next time StreetView went through the area, it had been painted over.

[edwaleni]

At one point, there was an Alt US-90 that went along the Mathews Bridge/Arlington Expressway and then back down Southside Blvd (FL-115).  But that route is no-more.

A lone sign for it lasted till ~Apr '11 per StreetView: https://goo.gl/maps/VWizdcaUjCsN5FPz6

==

As for clearance, maybe it was for the Hart Expressway bridge?  Historical StreetView from Jan '17 shows a painted on 'Clearance 15'-4"' on the bridge. https://goo.gl/maps/Vwook9FkoRnwRQFQ9  By the next time StreetView went through the area, it had been painted over.

This is the bridge clearance problem he was pointing at to me, its where US-90 goes under the Hart Expressway. No clearance signs!

[NE2]

At one point, there was an Alt US-90 that went along the Mathews Bridge/Arlington Expressway and then back down Southside Blvd (FL-115).  But that route is no-more.

A lone sign for it lasted till ~Apr '11 per StreetView: https://goo.gl/maps/VWizdcaUjCsN5FPz6

One sign hangs on downtown: http://www.google.com/maps/@30.333185,-81.6575642,3a,75y,209.44h,89.66t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sK2nsBnH6tte0FAqa8NwdfA!2e0!5s20220201T000000!7i16384!8i8192 (there were previously others pointing left from State onto Laura)

[NE2]

Speaking of Jax, it looks like the erroneous TO 17/228 is finally disappearing (the APL in front is newer, and presumably the signs in back are coming down). I never realized it had a companion going the other way, implying FDOT was seriously considering taking 17/228 on Forest-Riverside.

[rickmastfan67]

As for clearance, maybe it was for the Emerson Street Expressway bridge?  Historical StreetView from Jan '17 shows a painted on 'Clearance 15'-4"' on the bridge. https://goo.gl/maps/Vwook9FkoRnwRQFQ9  By the next time StreetView went through the area, it had been painted over.

This is the bridge clearance problem he was pointing at to me, its where US-90 goes under the Hart Expressway. No clearance signs!

I knew which bridge you were referring to.  Looking back at historical StreetView, that bridge did have clearance signs in the past. https://goo.gl/maps/eEJY994xmELkuPp58
It was 15'-3".  So, an inch lower than the Emerson Street Expressway one. (fixed my original post)

[roadman65]

US 90 ALT made more sense on its original alignment than now. 

I do miss the days when US 1 ALT concurred with it on both Baymeadows and the Arlington as it was neat to see the red and blue shields signed together back then.


In St. Augustine the removal of Business US 1 is something no one will miss, especially now with the historical area having a garage for pubic parking along US 1 mainline. No one needs to loop along King Street, Avenida Menedez, Castillo Drive, and San Marco Avenue to reach the various points and search for parking.

IMO extend SR 16 along San Marco to SR A1A so the part from the current east terminus to A1A could still be in the system to connect SR 16 to the Beach areas.

https://goo.gl/maps/rEuMFxKe6FBqvoEx6
This sign along US 1 sort of creates a de facto spur anyway to avoid the loop.

[TheHighwayMan3561]

pubic parking

I mean, it is Florida, after all...

[D-Dey65]

I see FDOT is building a test area along US 301 in Clay County.  They are building a third carriage way for the four lane divided highway to make a six lane double divided highway.
https://www.fdot.gov/docs/default-source/materials/pavement/research/reports/stateroad/301.pdf

I should've taken pictures of that when I was coming back from Folkston, GA in mid-March. I actually tried, but I couldn't get any good shots.

[D-Dey65]

While so many of you have been on the subject of Jacksonville, can anybody figure out what this sign said before the lower lines were banged out of existence?

BTW, the abrupt endings of SR 211 and SR 13 sucks ass!

[hotdogPi]

While so many of you have been on the subject of Jacksonville, can anybody figure out what this sign said before the lower lines were banged out of existence?

BTW, the abrupt endings of SR 211 and SR 13 sucks ass!

The last line is HEIGHT PICKUPS. I moved forward one to see it closer, although that one has a GSV stitching error in the second line.