Coronavirus pandemic

[Eth]

So, what's everyone experiencing in terms of retail prices and product availability?

Gas is up about 10-15 cents/gal from the lowest point, now generally in the $1.70s in my area.

Meat supplies seem to be fine, at least at my local Kroger, with only marginally higher prices than usual (80/20 ground beef going for $5.29/lb instead of $4.99, for instance). There are still signs limiting shoppers to a maximum item count of 3 (not a problem for me, shopping for one person).

Toilet paper inventory seemed to still be a little light, but by no means wiped out. I don't know how bad that got, because this trip was the first time I actually looked for it since...whenever I last bought TP. January, maybe?

[hbelkins]

Damn, does nobody raise cattle in Kentucky? In Oklahoma it's about $6/lb for 90/10. Eye round steak is $11.98/lb.

We haven't had any real shortages of products at the Crest grocery store in Norman since about early April. Major brands are often depleted, but there is always at least a no-name or budget equivalent available. (Colortex toilet paper sucks. At least I only had to buy that once.) Cleaning supplies are available, but they are all brands I've never heard of. Clorox is nowhere to be found, but there is still off-brand bleach. Many of them seem like rush-job packaging from vendors that don't normally sell to consumers; a lot of the labels look like a simple copy-paste of an MSDS or similar sheet, sometimes with a logo hurriedly slapped on.


There are also some instances of businesses that don't normally make cleaning supplies doing so. Crest carries a brand of hand sanitizer made at a brewery in Guthrie, as well as one made at a CBD company in New Jersey.

I've read that Kentucky is the largest cattle-producing state east of the Mississippi, but that doesn't mean that the animals can be slaughtered and processed. Some people are buying beef in bulk, but for those who are new to that, they're having problems finding deep freezes in which to store the beef. And even if they could, people generally don't have enough spare cash to buy a side of beef and a freezer. Add to that the fact that many prefer their meat fresh, not frozen.

A number of our distilleries have started making hand sanitizer, but several of those are bulk-selling to institutions and other facilities (like hospitals and state agencies) and not marketing it to the general public.

[Max Rockatansky]

Another thing to consider is long term consequences. What I heard lat time, about 7% of those recovered are left with degraded health, and that may be another thing to look at

That was actually my focus back in February, since SARS (2003) is correlated with high rates of bone tissue necrosis in survivors.  This is the main reason I've been skeptical of a herd-immunity strategy all along.

One I've noticed in almost all the survivors that had significant symptoms is massive weight loss.  Usually it seems to be in excess of 20 pounds, one nurse in San Francisco apparently lost close to 60.  The unnerving in the last instance was that the dude was (maybe still will be) a triathlete. 

[tradephoric]

I'm skeptical of the government's ability to manage this virus and develop an effective vaccine before herd immunity is reached.  Besides herd immunity sounds like a better strategy than what some governors have been doing - allowing confirmed coronavirus cases to mingle with the most vulnerable populations inside nursing homes while forcing the non-vulnerable to shelter at home.  The social-economic impacts of people being out of work for months can't be understated.  Over the past few months over 40 million Americans have lost their jobs and it's creating a mental health disaster in this country.  One of the Americans to lose his source of livelihood was 46 year-old George Floyd who lost his job as a security guard at a restaurant when Minnesota's governor issued a stay-at-home order.  Now a powder-keg is going off in this country and say bye-bye to social distancing measures.  The same governors who were so concerned about people congregating to protest the stay-at-home measures are largely silent about the dangers of the virus spreading during the George Floyd protests.  If the governors don't want people to congregate in large groups they are doing a horrible job at preventing it.   

[kphoger]

Of Mexico's 32 states, 31 of them are continuing this month in "Maximum risk" mode–a red light on their new four-color stoplight paradigm.  The only state to move beyond red (Zacatecas) only moves to orange or "High risk".

[Max Rockatansky]

I'm skeptical of the government's ability to manage this virus and develop an effective vaccine before herd immunity is reached.  Besides herd immunity sounds like a better strategy than what some governors have been doing - allowing confirmed coronavirus cases to mingle with the most vulnerable populations inside nursing homes while forcing the non-vulnerable to shelter at home.  The social-economic impacts of people being out of work for months can't be understated.  Over the past few months over 40 million Americans have lost their jobs and it's creating a mental health disaster in this country.  One of the Americans to lose his source of livelihood was 46 year-old George Floyd who lost his job as a security guard at a restaurant when Minnesota's governor issued a stay-at-home order.  Now a powder-keg is going off in this country and say bye-bye to social distancing measures.  The same governors who were so concerned about people congregating to protest the stay-at-home measures are largely silent about the dangers of the virus spreading during the George Floyd protests.  If the governors don't want people to congregate in large groups they are doing a horrible job at preventing it.

I think people really need to consider the fact that there might not be a vaccine coming any time soon.  I keep hearing people say "I'll wait for a cure."    That could end up being a huge time frame or not at all, it's definitely not a guarantee. 

[SEWIGuy]

I'm skeptical of the government's ability to manage this virus and develop an effective vaccine before herd immunity is reached.  Besides herd immunity sounds like a better strategy than what some governors have been doing - allowing confirmed coronavirus cases to mingle with the most vulnerable populations inside nursing homes while forcing the non-vulnerable to shelter at home.  The social-economic impacts of people being out of work for months can't be understated.  Over the past few months over 40 million Americans have lost their jobs and it's creating a mental health disaster in this country.  One of the Americans to lose his source of livelihood was 46 year-old George Floyd who lost his job as a security guard at a restaurant when Minnesota's governor issued a stay-at-home order.  Now a powder-keg is going off in this country and say bye-bye to social distancing measures.  The same governors who were so concerned about people congregating to protest the stay-at-home measures are largely silent about the dangers of the virus spreading during the George Floyd protests.  If the governors don't want people to congregate in large groups they are doing a horrible job at preventing it.   

Actually many governors have stated that protestors should be masked and otherwise safe, but clearly that has gotten lost given everything else that is happening.

And are you somehow trying to indirectly blame Minnesota's safer at home orders for Floyd's death?

[kphoger]

... sounds like a better strategy than what some governors have been doing - allowing confirmed coronavirus cases to mingle with the most vulnerable populations inside nursing homes while forcing the non-vulnerable to shelter at home.

Highlighted below are those states I've seen reference to requiring long-term care facilities to accept patients with the virus.  Of course, saying that the one necessarily led to the other could be a case of post hoc ergo propter hoc, but I provide the numbers for you nevertheless.

[Scott5114]

The other employees I saw were wearing masks, but it was very refreshing to actually see our waitress's smile as she served us.  It was like a human interaction, almost like normal life.

It's been very refreshing to get to wear a mask at work, because I don't have to deal with people bitching about me not smiling enough.

For some reason, they don't like it when I concentrate on contorting my face into a fake smile instead of what I'm doing and short them $20 as a result, either.

[mgk920]

How many of these price increases are due to the money supply being increased by the 'stimulus'?  The amount of money that was 'printed' by that reduced the value of all of the money that was already in circulation in proportion to how much that 'printing' increased the supply - that is the very definition of 'inflation'.

Mike

[kphoger]

Got a pocket full
Of government issued cures for poverty

[Roadgeekteen]

I hope that there is not a huge spike in two weeks.

[Bruce]

How many of these price increases are due to the money supply being increased by the 'stimulus'?  The amount of money that was 'printed' by that reduced the value of all of the money that was already in circulation in proportion to how much that 'printing' increased the supply - that is the very definition of 'inflation'.

Mike

Reuters (April 16): Americans are spending coronavirus checks on rent and groceries

[MikieTimT]

I've read that Kentucky is the largest cattle-producing state east of the Mississippi, but that doesn't mean that the animals can be slaughtered and processed. Some people are buying beef in bulk, but for those who are new to that, they're having problems finding deep freezes in which to store the beef. And even if they could, people generally don't have enough spare cash to buy a side of beef and a freezer. Add to that the fact that many prefer their meat fresh, not frozen.

A number of our distilleries have started making hand sanitizer, but several of those are bulk-selling to institutions and other facilities (like hospitals and state agencies) and not marketing it to the general public.

I got fed up with the pricing and availability of beef to the point that I bought an 1100lb steer Saturday morning, had it delivered to my cousin's decommissioned meat processing shop, and we shot it, hung it, and butchered it right there from the winch in about 4.5 hours.  Left him with the head, hooves, hide, stomach, spleen, intestines, and one of the rear hindquarters for his services and hauled the rest on ice in 2 100 gallon water tanks in my box trailer back home for my wife and her sisters to further process and package, and we had steak Saturday night that was mooing 9 hours earlier.  And had some Laotion pho with the bones and some sliced chuck roast the next night.  Still processing the ground beef and packaging, but that steer is feeding 4 families for several months, and at only $1.30/lb. on the hoof.

[SEWIGuy]

How many of these price increases are due to the money supply being increased by the 'stimulus'?  The amount of money that was 'printed' by that reduced the value of all of the money that was already in circulation in proportion to how much that 'printing' increased the supply - that is the very definition of 'inflation'.

Mike

From what I understand, the price issues are mostly due to lack of supply.

My anecdotal experience is that the price of beef is whacky high, but it has been high for awhile.  But the price of produce, and other meat like chicken, isn't that much different than pre-pandemic. 

I also read something where a lot of the stimulous money hasn't actually been spent yet.  That those people who are employed and can still pay their bills, stuck it in savings accounts for a later date.  Which means any inflationary aspects will likely be played out over time.

[tradephoric]

And are you somehow trying to indirectly blame Minnesota's safer at home orders for Floyd's death?

Swatting an insignificant mosquito can change the course of history.  Who knows what happens if Minnesota (or any other state for that matter) doesn't enact their safer at home orders.  George Floyd losing his job is a significant event in his life no doubt.  What we do know is 40 million jobs have been lost, large groups of people are protesting in the streets, and some disenfranchised groups are rioting.  All this and the virus is still prevalent in America with over 20,000 new cases a day. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZT7gzEM56s

[J N Winkler]

FWIW, my stimulus payment is sitting in my credit union account.

Meat availability here has remained good.  There have been no empty shelves in the meat department at the Dillons near me, although there are purchase limits and we have more or less given up on being able to buy flatiron steak on sale until this crisis works itself out.

On the other hand, it has been a month since I have been able to buy linguine.  This is apparently a result of the pasta mills ceasing production of specialty pastas in favor of spaghetti.

[Max Rockatansky]

And are you somehow trying to indirectly blame Minnesota's safer at home orders for Floyd's death?

Swatting an insignificant mosquito can change the course of history.  Who knows what happens if Minnesota (or any other state for that matter) doesn't enact their safer at home orders.  George Floyd losing his job is a significant event in his life no doubt.  What we do know is 40 million jobs have been lost, large groups of people are protesting in the streets, and some disenfranchised groups are rioting.  All this and the virus is still prevalent in America with over 20,000 new cases a day. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZT7gzEM56s

Ehh...I've really tried to stay out of this but I'll opine just this once.  I haven't really haven't looked the circumstances that brought George Floyd into contact with Minneapolis PD.  What I did see for what I briefly watched (I wasn't interested in watching a man die) was a blatant case of excessive force.  From all the  accounts I've seen the officer was a hot head who I'm to understand didn't have a squeaky clean track record.  Yeah, a series of Pandemic domino effects might have contributed to bringing the parties together but it doesn't change the fact that George Floyd is dead.  It's hard for me to look at what happened with the police officer and not think that it would have just happened to someone else had there been no pandemic.  To me associating what happened to George Floyd is missing the point that it was a clear case of excessive force. 

[SEWIGuy]

And are you somehow trying to indirectly blame Minnesota's safer at home orders for Floyd's death?

Swatting an insignificant mosquito can change the course of history.  Who knows what happens if Minnesota (or any other state for that matter) doesn't enact their safer at home orders.  George Floyd losing his job is a significant event in his life no doubt.  What we do know is 40 million jobs have been lost, large groups of people are protesting in the streets, and some disenfranchised groups are rioting.  All this and the virus is still prevalent in America with over 20,000 new cases a day. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZT7gzEM56s

Or, how about the cop doesn't kill him regardless.

[CoreySamson]

My church held in-person services for the first time since mid-March yesterday. Some things that were different:

- They had two services, divided by last name (A-M went at 9am while N-Z went at 10:30am)
- Every pew had tape on one side (so each pew had one entrance from the aisles, alternating sides)
- Groups were set three to four pews apart
- Offering plates were set at the entrance to church
- The hymnals and Bibles were removed from the pews, with the hymns being sung on that day printed out in the bulletin
- Communion was done by family group, with the elder setting out a wafer and wine for each person on a napkin

My church also started yesterday. Things I noticed:
- Every other pew was blocked off.
- No Communion at church right now
- Dropboxes for offering were installed all around the church.
- No childcare for the foreseeable future.
- Pretty low attendance, it probably looked like more than it was because everyone was spread out.

[ixnay]

And are you somehow trying to indirectly blame Minnesota's safer at home orders for Floyd's death?

Swatting an insignificant mosquito can change the course of history.  Who knows what happens if Minnesota (or any other state for that matter) doesn't enact their safer at home orders.  George Floyd losing his job is a significant event in his life no doubt.  What we do know is 40 million jobs have been lost, large groups of people are protesting in the streets, and some disenfranchised groups are rioting.  All this and the virus is still prevalent in America with over 20,000 new cases a day. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZT7gzEM56s

Uh, what does all that have to do with the Simpsons becoming Flanderized (one of my favorite Treehouse of Horror scenes)?

ixnay

[Max Rockatansky]

Kings Canyon National Park and Sequoia National Park to reopen on the 4th sans Campgrounds:

https://www.nps.gov/seki/planyourvisit/conditions.htm

I guess that I know what I'll be doing next week or maybe even Friday.  Now it Yosemite reopens I'll be pretty much set to resume my full list of outdoor activities I had planned for this year. 

[ftballfan]

It looks like Isle Royale National Park might not open at all this summer: https://www.nps.gov/isro/planyourvisit/conditions.htm
It might be partly budgetary reasons, but that isn't mentioned. Isle Royale has a very short season to begin with (in a normal year, it doesn't open until around Memorial Day weekend and closes in September)

[Max Rockatansky]

It looks like Isle Royale National Park might not open at all this summer: https://www.nps.gov/isro/planyourvisit/conditions.htm
It might be partly budgetary reasons, but that isn't mentioned. Isle Royale has a very short season to begin with (in a normal year, it doesn't open until around Memorial Day weekend and closes in September)

In other National Park news Yosemite won't open until California hits Phase 3 and you'll have to buy a pass off recreation.gov if you are using a western entrance.  Apparently Death Valley is reopening during Phase 3 also.  Much of Channel Islands National Park was reopen as of yesterday and Island Packers have begun operating boat shuttles again.

[tradephoric]

California cases are trending higher even as people are filling the streets to protest.  At this rate in a few weeks California will have more daily cases than New York had at its peak.  California is quickly losing control of the situation.