There are quite a few areas that have been bypassed twice and likely more.
I have a few just in Michigan.
Ludington: US-31 went into town for a couple of years, then bypassed via Pere Marquette Hwy, then bypassed via current freeway
Pentwater: US-31 used to follow BUS US-31, then bypassed via Oceana Dr, then bypassed via current freeway (which is closer to Pentwater than Oceana Dr)
Zeeland: M-21 went through town, then was placed on current Chicago Dr, now I-196 bypasses both
Grand Rapids: Division and Fulton were both state highways, then M-114 (now M-11/M-37) bypassed downtown, then US-131, M-21 (now I-196), and US-16 (now I-96) were moved onto freeways, now M-6 bypasses M-11
The construction of I-43 between Milwaukee and Green Bay bypasses some old bypasses of then-US 141.
Port Washington - CTH LL (complete with a folded diamond interchange at WI 33.)
Manitowoc - CTH R was effectively a US 141 bypass of the city
Denmark - CTH R swings around the west side of this small town near Green Bay.
There's also two examples on US 41 in Appleton and Green Bay.
In Green Bay, US 41 used to bypass the core of downtown via Military Ave and Lombardi Ave.
In Appleton, Northland Ave (CTH OO) once served as a US 41 bypass of the Fox Cities before the current freeway.
A few Virginia examples:
In Danville, current US 29 Business used to be a bypass, with current VA 293 once being US 29 Business.
In Warrenton, current US 29 Business was once the bypass, with current US 15 Business through Downtown being the Business Route.
In Lynchburg current US 29 Business (Lynchburg Expressway) used to be the US 29 Bypass. Now it's US 29 Business, with the US 29 Lynchburg/Madison Heights Bypass a few miles to the east.
Would the proposed (but may never be built) northern arc through the Atlanta suburbs be an example? It could be a bypass for I-285. And what about the proposed I-269 around Memphis? That will serve as an alternative to I-240.
Kokomo, Indiana will soon be bypassed by a new US 31 freeway to replace the current US 31 expressway that circles the east side of the city with some 15 stoplights. Maybe INDOT will get it right this time.
* The Gateway Connector, if built, would bypass the IL 3 bypass of Columbia
* Not for sure about it, but I think US 218 had the original Mount Pleasant bypass route (Grand Avenue) bypassed with the current bypass
In McPherson, KS, there is the original route of U.S. 81 which goes directly through the business district (part of which is present-day Business U.S. 81), a bypass route to the west of the business district (part of which is presently Spur K-153 & regular K-153), and Interstate 135 (present-day U.S. 81) to the east of the business district.
http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=McPherson,+KS&aq=0&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=30.185946,86.220703&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=McPherson,+Kansas&ll=38.362118,-97.622795&spn=0.116564,0.3368&z=12 (http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=McPherson,+KS&aq=0&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=30.185946,86.220703&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=McPherson,+Kansas&ll=38.362118,-97.622795&spn=0.116564,0.3368&z=12)
As I understand it, US-49 S between Jackson and the Gulf Coast will have a few BOBs once it's converted to freeway. I don't know if the project to make the upgrade will ever really get off the ground, but from what I've heard there are plans for new bypasses of the old bypasses at Magee and Collins.
triple bypasses are hard to find. Usually you just have the old two-laner, which is bypassed by an expressway, which is then in return bypassed by the Interstate.
The only one I can think of as being a possibility is Portsmouth, NH. I believe US-1A is the oldest alignment, which was bypassed by US-1, which was then bypassed by the appropriately named By-Pass US-1, which was in turn bypassed by I-95.
there is a NH-1B in the same general vicinity, but I believe that's always just been an alternate.
Miami is a good example. They originally built the Palmetto Expressway (SR-826) as a bypass, then further bypassed it with the Homestead Extension of Florida's Turnpike.
Also, they're working on (or at least planning) a new toll bypass around the SW corner of Jacksonville - toll SR-23.
Quote from: agentsteel53 on March 23, 2011, 07:41:53 PM
triple bypasses are hard to find.
Selma, NC might qualify. But I'm not sure all the realignments are bypasses in their own rights.
Look at a map or even Google Earth. The old US 66 corridor had first-generation bypasses throughout its section in Illinois. Then I-55 came along and bypassed most of those old bypasses.
US-6 in Davenport, IA originally went through downtown, but then a bypass (Kimberly Road) was built in the 30s. Now, I-80 is about 3 miles north of the original bypass.
Also, US-66 bypassed many towns in central IL, only to be bypassed by I-55 (this may be true for other states)
Quote from: RoadWarrior56 on March 23, 2011, 09:14:28 PM
Look at a map or even Google Earth. The old US 66 corridor had first-generation bypasses throughout its section in Illinois. Then I-55 came along and bypassed most of those old bypasses.
You know, there are probably some triple bypasses in there. Lexington, for example: http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=40.6425&lon=-88.79033&zoom=16&layers=M (Grove-Wall was 66, and already looks like a bypass). Head northeast and there are similar configurations in Pontiac and Dwight. It's possible that the innermost bypasses were complete by 1926, but they certainly weren't the original through highway.
US 33 in Lancaster, Oh.
Columbus Street was original US 33 (Oh 31 before that), then Memorial Dr. was the first bypass completed in the 1960s, but it's flaw was that all intersections were at-grade (to appease business owners back then). Then after 20 years of debate, the current US 33 Lancaster bypass was opened in 2004.
Would one claim TN 840 as a bypass of I-440 around the south of Nashville?
I wouldn't call SR 840 a bypass of anything that goes straight through Nashville. It's a bypass for angular movements and a suburb-to-suburb highway.
maybe the old National Road has some triple bypasses. any extant routings that are first an 1840s or so one-lane carriage route, bypassed by a 1910s two-lane concrete, then a 1940s four-lane arterial, and a 1960s interstate?
Quote from: agentsteel53 on March 23, 2011, 10:45:28 PM
maybe the old National Road has some triple bypasses. any extant routings that are first an 1840s or so one-lane carriage route, bypassed by a 1910s two-lane concrete, then a 1940s four-lane arterial, and a 1960s interstate?
Eastern Illinois is a good bet. Around Marshall, there's the original brick road, then a nearby city street, then the original US 40 bypass around the town, and then I-70.
http://www.jimgrey.net/Roads/NationalRoadIllinois/03_Marshall.htm
Quote from: Kniwt on March 23, 2011, 10:58:42 PM
Quote from: agentsteel53 on March 23, 2011, 10:45:28 PM
maybe the old National Road has some triple bypasses. any extant routings that are first an 1840s or so one-lane carriage route, bypassed by a 1910s two-lane concrete, then a 1940s four-lane arterial, and a 1960s interstate?
Eastern Illinois is a good bet. Around Marshall, there's the original brick road, then a nearby city street, then the original US 40 bypass around the town, and then I-70.
http://www.jimgrey.net/Roads/NationalRoadIllinois/03_Marshall.htm
Except those aren't all strictly bypasses, at least not in the sense of bypassing built-up areas.
US 17 Bypass bypasses US 17 around Elizabeth City, NC which bypasses US 17 Business in the city itself
NY 25 bypassed in Riverhead, NY by Suffolk CR 58, but development occurred along CR 58, so a new alignment of the eastern part of NY 24 passes to the south of both. Don't know if that would count...
Quote from: nyratk1 on March 23, 2011, 11:45:36 PM
NY 25 bypassed in Riverhead, NY by Suffolk CR 58, but development occurred along CR 58, so a new alignment of the eastern part of NY 24 passes to the south of both. Don't know if that would count...
How about where you have former NY 27A bypassing an even older section of road (out by a double RR crossing), obviously itself bypassed by the current NY 27 freeway. There's a Long Island example for you.
Surprised not to see Myrtle Beach, where 17 Bypass got so built up that SC 31 was constructed.
And finally, a TRIPLE!!!: Spartanburg, SC. Original US 29 (Main St.) is bypassed by current 29 (St. John St.). That was all bypassed by I-85, but the original alignment of that is now Business 85, and the current I-85 is clearly a triple bypass.
Quote from: AlpsROADS on March 24, 2011, 12:06:38 AM
Quote from: nyratk1 on March 23, 2011, 11:45:36 PM
NY 25 bypassed in Riverhead, NY by Suffolk CR 58, but development occurred along CR 58, so a new alignment of the eastern part of NY 24 passes to the south of both. Don't know if that would count...
How about where you have former NY 27A bypassing an even older section of road (out by a double RR crossing), obviously itself bypassed by the current NY 27 freeway. There's a Long Island example for you.
Yeah, there's quite a few of those with 27/27A. Especially in Moriches with Sunrise Hwy (NY 27)/Montauk Hwy. (CR 80)/Moriches Bypass (CR 98) and my hometown of Bellport (NY 27 once ran along South Country Rd./CR 36 in the 20s until a straight section of Montauk Hwy./old NY 27 was built to bypass that in the 30s and then Sunrise Hwy./NY 27 was built to bypass all of that in the 60s).
old US 66 (Lindbergh) being bypassed by I-270. Now further west there is an arterial MO 141 that is functioning as a bypass of I-270. All three are heavily used roads in west St. Louis County.
Here is a Triple ByPass side by side. Flintstone, MD :D
Old National Road/US 40 now Gilpin Road was bypassed in the early 50's with "new" US 40 now MD 144. In 1991 it was bypassed with I-68.
http://maps.google.com/maps?f=d&source=s_d&saddr=MD-144+W%2FBaltimore+Pike%2FNational+Pike+NE&daddr=Flintstone,+MD+21530&hl=en&geocode=FfCvXQIdjYRR-w%3BFRDSXQIdiCVR-ykjcIFk1WDKiTGJlxpywpxPTg&gl=us&mra=mift&mrsp=0&sz=16&sll=39.694425,-78.540251&sspn=0.01273,0.027487&ie=UTF8&ll=39.694326,-78.543749&spn=0.012796,0.027487&t=h&z=16
Quote from: KillerTux on March 24, 2011, 12:49:13 AM
Here is a Triple ByPass side by side. Flintstone, MD :D
Old National Road/US 40 now Gilpin Road was bypassed in the early 50's with "new" US 40 now MD 144. In 1991 it was bypassed with I-68.
http://maps.google.com/maps?f=d&source=s_d&saddr=MD-144+W%2FBaltimore+Pike%2FNational+Pike+NE&daddr=Flintstone,+MD+21530&hl=en&geocode=FfCvXQIdjYRR-w%3BFRDSXQIdiCVR-ykjcIFk1WDKiTGJlxpywpxPTg&gl=us&mra=mift&mrsp=0&sz=16&sll=39.694425,-78.540251&sspn=0.01273,0.027487&ie=UTF8&ll=39.694326,-78.543749&spn=0.012796,0.027487&t=h&z=16
That's only a double, unless Gilpin is a bypass of something else.
Gilpin Rd. and its bypasses are worth mentioning, if not because Gilpin is the old National Road, then because the view is pretty awesome.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm4.static.flickr.com%2F3298%2F3435310677_cbeb8f0a67.jpg&hash=be8cdbb655bf1479edea9310a387c674f7d91623) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/mobilene/3435310677/)
The view from Gilpin Road (http://www.flickr.com/photos/mobilene/3435310677/) by mobilene (http://www.flickr.com/people/mobilene/), on Flickr
Jasper, AL:
The original US 78 ran through downtown Jasper. In the 1950s a US 78 bypass to the north of town was built. Corridor X would later bypass Jasper to the south (and take US 78 with it.)
You can see numerous such 'bypasses of bypasses' at all of those towns along I-55 between Joliet and Springfield, IL.
First, you had the original road through those towns in the early 20th century, often making intersection turns in those towns due to its rural parts following a major railroad that was built on a diagonal.
Then, along comes US 66 and some of those towns had minor bypasses built, even if they were still on local streets with smoothed curves at the corners (pre-WWII era).
Then, US 66 was upgraded to four lanes divided and all of those towns has new bypasses built that way (WWII though the late 1950s)
Then, I-55 comes along and it bypasses all of that (early 1960s into the late 1970s/early 1980s).
Mike
How about I-64 in the Hampton Roads area. It bypassed US 13 that was a bypass to US 58 that went through Norfolk and Portsmouth! What about I-64 bypassing old VA 168 across the Hampton Roads Harbor? VA 168 (now VA 143) went all the way to VA 33 near West Point to bypass US 60 through the pennisula! Then pre- I-64 alignment of VA 33 (VA 249) completed the way to Richmond!
Quote from: roadman65 on March 24, 2011, 07:03:53 PM
How about I-64 in the Hampton Roads area. It bypassed US 13 that was a bypass to US 58 that went through Norfolk and Portsmouth! What about I-64 bypassing old VA 168 across the Hampton Roads Harbor? VA 168 (now VA 143) went all the way to VA 33 near West Point to bypass US 60 through the pennisula! Then pre- I-64 alignment of VA 33 (VA 249) completed the way to Richmond!
First VA 249 ends in Bottoms Bridge about 15 miles east of downtown Richmond.
Second VA 33 multiplexes with US 60 to Sandston before following Nine Mile Rd which I guess at some point could have been considered a bypass of US 60 from Sandston to Richmond??
Sounds like a stretch to me... I know of an example in Williamsburg, though. Bypass Rd was built for US 60 to bypass Williamsburg, then recently VA 199 was built as a freeway/expressway loop of Williamsburg, connecting to US 60 near each end. I-64 could also arguably serve as the second bypass.
Another thing related to the last three posts: what is now I-64 from the HRBT to north of Williamsburg was originally built and signed as VA 168.
Quote from: deathtopumpkins on March 25, 2011, 11:16:41 AM
Sounds like a stretch to me... I know of an example in Williamsburg, though. Bypass Rd was built for US 60 to bypass Williamsburg, then recently VA 199 was built as a freeway/expressway loop of Williamsburg, connecting to US 60 near each end. I-64 could also arguably serve as the second bypass.
Actually now that you mention it there were more bypasses! US 60 either used Lafayette Street or Francis Street through the historic area before the current US 60 was built there! VA 168 was built as the outer bypass before I-64 and VA 199.
Quote from: froggie on March 25, 2011, 02:08:28 PM
Another thing related to the last three posts: what is now I-64 from the HRBT to north of Williamsburg was originally built and signed as VA 168.
Actually VA 143 (Jefferson Avenue, Merrimac Trail) was old 168. Only I-64 west of Williamsburg to VA 30 was built as VA 168 then upgraded to freeway in the 80's. VA 30 from its eastern end to VA 33 was part of it. There was a VA 168Y that was near the current US 60 and VA 30 intersection that was connector from 168 to 60.
I'm aware that Jefferson Ave was old 168. My point was that it was relocated onto what is now I-64 south of Williamsburg.
Devil's Elbow, MO
US 66 was bypassed/rerouted by a 4-lane segment that was later bypassed by I-44
Also Pine Bluff, AR
The Martha Mitchell Expressway was a bypass of old US 65 which in turn was bypassed by I-530
Bloomington-Normal, IL:
"Old 66" - original route thru town
I-55 Business Loop (Vet's Parkway) - 1st east side bypass, late 1950's.
I-55/74 - 1st west side bypass, late 1960's.
Towanda-Barnes Road - 2nd east side bypass, upgraded to 5 lanes, late 1990's/early 2000's?
Proposed East Side Bypass - 3rd east side bypass, EIS in progress
It could also be argued that Mitsubishi Motorway (US 150) acts as a 2nd west side bypass, although it terminates at IL 9 and only serves the northern half of the metroplex.
In San Jose, US 101 originally ran along First Street and Santa Clara Street; this was bypassed by the Bayshore Highway in the 1940s, first as a separate Bypass route (both surface street and then freeway versions), then as the main route post-1964, with the old surface streets becoming Route 82.
The 1990s Route 85, which loops between south San Jose and Mountain View, is a bypass of the Bayshore route. One could also argue that I-280 serves as a Peninsula bypass for US 101 travelers, so this may be a case of triple-bypassing (depending on how this case is defined).
880/580 can also be considered a 101 bypass, to avoid downtown San Francisco. but that's getting a bit distant.
for a similar example, we can go with old two-lane US-99 in the central valley (let's say Front Street in Selma as a random example), which was bypassed by the four-lane Golden State Blvd in the 30s, which then was bypassed by the Golden State Freeway in the 60s... which was then bypassed between Wheeler Ridge and Sacramento by I-5???
Quote from: Rick Powell on March 28, 2011, 04:44:06 PM
Bloomington-Normal, IL:
It could also be argued that Mitsubishi Motorway (US 150) acts as a 2nd west side bypass, although it terminates at IL 9 and only serves the northern half of the metroplex.
I think the county is doing a study on extending Mitsubishi Motorway all the way down to Shirley Road. If this is done, it truly will be the 2nd western bypass of B-N, a town with more N-S bypasses than you can shake a stick at.
Quote from: agentsteel53 on March 29, 2011, 03:25:17 PM
880/580 can also be considered a 101 bypass, to avoid downtown San Francisco. but that's getting a bit distant.
It does follow much of the old US 101E so there COULD be an argument there, albeit a bit tenuous...
One could argue that US 50 in Sacramento has been double-bypassed or more:
original route: Folsom Boulevard, then into downtown/midtown via Capitol Avenue, then 15th/16th Street south to Broadway, Broadway east to Stockton, Stockton south
Bypass US 50: shortcut via 65th Street and 14th Avenue connecting Folsom and Stockton
later US 50 route: Folsom Boulevard west to what was then I-80, then I-80 west to Route 99 south
current US 50 route: El Dorado Freeway west to Business 80, and then concurrent with Business 80 to West Sacramento
Quote from: NE2 on March 24, 2011, 12:52:02 AM
Quote from: KillerTux on March 24, 2011, 12:49:13 AM
Here is a Triple ByPass side by side. Flintstone, MD :D
Old National Road/US 40 now Gilpin Road was bypassed in the early 50's with "new" US 40 now MD 144. In 1991 it was bypassed with I-68.
http://maps.google.com/maps?f=d&source=s_d&saddr=MD-144+W%2FBaltimore+Pike%2FNational+Pike+NE&daddr=Flintstone,+MD+21530&hl=en&geocode=FfCvXQIdjYRR-w%3BFRDSXQIdiCVR-ykjcIFk1WDKiTGJlxpywpxPTg&gl=us&mra=mift&mrsp=0&sz=16&sll=39.694425,-78.540251&sspn=0.01273,0.027487&ie=UTF8&ll=39.694326,-78.543749&spn=0.012796,0.027487&t=h&z=16
That's only a double, unless Gilpin is a bypass of something else.
If you look at Gilpin below the green A marker you'll see the bend has been straightened. This makes it three :colorful:
Quote from: Truvelo on March 30, 2011, 04:50:38 AM
Quote from: NE2 on March 24, 2011, 12:52:02 AM
Quote from: KillerTux on March 24, 2011, 12:49:13 AM
Here is a Triple ByPass side by side. Flintstone, MD :D
Old National Road/US 40 now Gilpin Road was bypassed in the early 50's with "new" US 40 now MD 144. In 1991 it was bypassed with I-68.
http://maps.google.com/maps?f=d&source=s_d&saddr=MD-144+W%2FBaltimore+Pike%2FNational+Pike+NE&daddr=Flintstone,+MD+21530&hl=en&geocode=FfCvXQIdjYRR-w%3BFRDSXQIdiCVR-ykjcIFk1WDKiTGJlxpywpxPTg&gl=us&mra=mift&mrsp=0&sz=16&sll=39.694425,-78.540251&sspn=0.01273,0.027487&ie=UTF8&ll=39.694326,-78.543749&spn=0.012796,0.027487&t=h&z=16
That's only a double, unless Gilpin is a bypass of something else.
If you look at Gilpin below the green A marker you'll see the bend has been straightened. This makes it three :colorful:
Yep. Check out a historical photo of that bend being by-passed.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm4.static.flickr.com%2F3165%2F2297249288_24eb63e51b.jpg&hash=cc6cd0728f6468da05858f9f81a8d367fe04f268) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/cbustapeck/2297249288/)
National Road on Polish Mountain (http://www.flickr.com/photos/cbustapeck/2297249288/) by Christopher Busta-Peck (http://www.flickr.com/people/cbustapeck/), on Flickr
Is it me or is the new road in that photo just one lane wide? It doesn't look any wider than the old road.
An obvious bypass of a bypass that I don't think has been mentioned in this thread so far...............Lafayette-West Lafayette, IN. US 52 presumably originally went through the heart of town. The original bypass was constructed norht and east sometime in the 30's or 40's for US 52 to bypass Lafayette and West Lafayette. Anybody familiar with this area (I was a Purdue student for 4+ years, not possible to forget), knows that the so-called US 52 bypass is a 4-lane urban throughfare full of driveways and signals. Come the 1970's, I-65 bypasses that old bypass, also on the east. Now you have US 231 gradually bypassing the area on the west side.
ME88 is old US1; US1 in that corridor is bypassed by I-295.
I-294 was built as a bypass of Chicago, and 39's main purpose was to be a "super" bypass of Chicago for St. Louis-Wisconsin traffic. In the middle of that, I-355 was built, and the Prairie Parkway and the Illiana Expressway are being studied. I'm not sure what surface streets were built as bypasses, but now they have a bypass of a bypass of a bypass all inside a bypass in the plans. Truly mind-boggling!
There have long been plans to build a new US-29 bypass in Charlottesville to bypass the existing bypass, which itself is no longer much of a bypass because it dumps you into an area with heavy commercial development on both sides for several miles north of town (an area that was predominantly rural when the bypass was built).
I have my doubts as to whether the new bypass will ever be built. Aside from the fact that it's been discussed since the 1980s, the odds are seriously against it because its proposed path would have a negative effect on the reservoir unless they went so far out of the way as to increase the cost big-time.
What about I-264 and 265 around Louisville?
Would E-470 Count? Originally the Denver bypass to the east was I-225 and I-270. Once E-470 opened up it now carries the bypass traffic that is dumb enough to pay the exorbitant tolls. :pan:
Buffalo, WY
http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&ll=44.355953,-106.691322&spn=0.041056,0.10025&t=m&z=14 (http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&ll=44.355953,-106.691322&spn=0.041056,0.10025&t=m&z=14)
Beebe, AR
Quote from: NE2 on March 23, 2011, 10:13:53 PM
I wouldn't call SR 840 a bypass of anything that goes straight through Nashville. It's a bypass for angular movements and a suburb-to-suburb highway.
That's also how I see I-270 around Columbus and certainly the potential Superbelt / Outer-Outerbelt. MORPC has dismissed the latter concept, saying another bypass isn't the answer, but I say we'll still need more suburb-to-suburb highways as the metro region grows.
US 40 in Ohio has several 1940's and 50's bypasses of small towns like Etna, which are now obsoleted by I-70. But I am not sure that really counts, because I-70 was not built specifically to bypass those already-bypassed towns, as is being done with US 31 in Indiana.
Quote from: Zmapper on May 23, 2011, 11:36:09 PM
Would E-470 Count? Originally the Denver bypass to the east was I-225 and I-270. Once E-470 opened up it now carries the bypass traffic that is dumb enough to pay the exorbitant tolls. :pan:
I was wondering the same about Beltway 8/Sam Houston Tollway here in Houston. same for the Grand Parkway when it's completed, which will be a bypass of a bypass of a bypass.
When the new US 31 freeway around Kokomo, IN will be completed it will bypass the existing part of US 31 that was built in the 50's to bypass the original route that went straight through the heart of the city.
Call it a future bypass of a current bypass, but in two years it will fit this topic.
US81, McPherson KS
Here in Appleton, Northland Ave was built in the late 1930s to carry US 41 on a routing that bypassed an older through-town routing.
In 1960, the east-west section of the present-day US 41 freeway was built to bypass that Northland Ave routing due to urban development and the resulting traffic congestion along that surface road.
Mike
I-25 around Las Cruces NM. Originally, U.S. 85 through downtown was bypassed on the west by an unnumbered bypass along Valley Drive (marked "TRUCK BYPASS"). This is now NM-188. Of course, I-25 bypasses the whole city, as well as old U.S. 85 through and north of Las Cruces. At the U.S. 70 junction, NM-188 changes to NM-185. Not sure why, since it's a straight-across intersection.
Houston, TX
Current road: US-90A(old US90) runs through downtown, down mains street through Medical Center, and out the south west side.
Current road: I-10/US-90, by passing Texas Medical Center
Current road: I-610, bypassing Houston circa 1950, downtown and all wards
Current road: Beltway 8/Sam Houston Tollway, bypassing what was then Houston all together(currently the city limits extend 5 to 10 miles outside the beltway)
Under constrction: Texas 99/Grand Parkway, bypassing Houston and Suburbs, but still inside the metro area.
Thats some Inception mess right htere.
Quote from: realjd on March 23, 2011, 07:44:27 PM
Miami is a good example. They originally built the Palmetto Expressway (SR-826) as a bypass, then further bypassed it with the Homestead Extension of Florida's Turnpike.
Also, they're working on (or at least planning) a new toll bypass around the SW corner of Jacksonville - toll SR-23.
The portion from I-10 to SR 21 is in process... parts are 4 lane part super 2 and part 2 lane county road. at grade intersections now but there are stakes with orange tape going up to complete this portion. Once it is freeway it will be tolled but the portion between SR21 and I-95 will probably not be done for another 50 years
U.S. 54 and U.S. 69 at Fort Scott. 54 could count as a double bypass and 69 as a triple.
54:
* - Original route: Entered from the west on what is now Humboldt St., turned south at National Ave., then east at Wall St.
* - First bypass: U.S. 54 moved one mile to the north most of the way from Bronson to Fort Scott, following a curve that becomes National Ave., then turning east on Wall.
* - Current route: Bypassing the curve and going another half mile to the East, then curving southbound to the Wall St. exit.
69:
* - Original route: Entered from the north on what is now 215th St. (County road), following curves east then south to meet 54 at Humboldt. Following 54 1 block east to National, then over the Marmaton River bridge to Wall St. Continuing south from there, curving at East National before turning south again to leave town.
* - First bypass: Joining 54 one mile north of where it previously did. Following 54's first bypass to Wall St., then its original route.
* - Second bypass: Joining U.S. 54 at the same point, then following the current 54 bypass to Wall St. before leaving town southbound among the remainder of the bypass route.
* - Current route: Moved one mile to the east, joining current 54 where it curves south to head to wall. Leaving town the same way as it did in the second bypass.
Lincoln IL looks like a bypass-of-a-bypass situation.
Providence RI: US6 was moved from Point St, to old I-195, to new I-195.
US1, Brunswick, West Bath, and Bath, ME
1926: Old Bath Rd, Old Brunswick Rd, Lincoln St
1938, 1st bypass: Bath Rd, State Rd (AKA Witch Spring Hill Rd), Court St
~1947: Leeman Hwy opens, bypassing Court St (2nd bypass) and Centre St (1st bypass)
~1959, 2nd bypass: Bath viaduct bypasses the bits of Leeman Hwy that bypassed Centre St
~1967, 2nd bypass: Freeway bypasses Bath Rd & State Rd.
~1803: Depending on your reckoning, you mad add n+1 to the "nth bypass"es not involving Centre St.
The old Governor King's Turnpike is still out there, mostly in West Bath. Bits are being overtaken by nature, encroached on by tree-cutting operations, bisected by the US1 freeway, or Posted on private property; other bits are still perfectly walkable/bikeable, seeing occasional use by horses or ATVs, especially north of the freeway. Remnants of an old bridge can be found in the wide part of the freeway median.
Remains of ancient bridges predating the eventual Bath Rd & Old Bath Rd routes are to their respective south and north as well.
louisville has 2 bypassess
Quote from: sr641 on May 07, 2012, 11:39:04 AM
louisville has 2 bypassess
no it has two loopssess neither one is really a bypassess
Quote from: Steve on May 07, 2012, 09:10:33 PM
Quote from: sr641 on May 07, 2012, 11:39:04 AM
louisville has 2 bypassess
no it has two loopssess neither one is really a bypassess
ya they are bypasses
Isn't the point of this thread to discuss bypasses that were later succeeded by yet another bypass? What does Louisville have to do with this?
Quote from: sr641 on May 08, 2012, 05:55:50 AM
Quote from: Steve on May 07, 2012, 09:10:33 PM
Quote from: sr641 on May 07, 2012, 11:39:04 AM
louisville has 2 bypassess
no it has two loopssess neither one is really a bypassess
ya they are bypasses
It has neither. I used to make deliveries in Louisville all the time, and I know all the main roads in and out. See the map below, and tell me which road is a bypass or a loop:
http://g.co/maps/epvfq (http://g.co/maps/epvfq)
You all are consistently misspelling Loserville. :-D
Quote from: PurdueBill on May 08, 2012, 09:08:51 AM
Isn't the point of this thread to discuss bypasses that were later succeeded by yet another bypass? What does Louisville have to do with this?
nothing. sr641 is just being a troll.
Quote from: agentsteel53 on May 08, 2012, 10:34:46 AM
Quote from: PurdueBill on May 08, 2012, 09:08:51 AM
Isn't the point of this thread to discuss bypasses that were later succeeded by yet another bypass? What does Louisville have to do with this?
nothing. sr641 is just being a troll.
I'm starting to wonder if "sr641" is another former member with a new name.
^He does seem rather "Ethan-manic".
Louisville has 2 bypasses. Interstate 264 and Interstate 265. Interstate 264 is a bypass for Interstate 64 and once the Ohio River Bridge is finished on Interstate 265, it will be a bypass for Interstates 64, 65, and 71.
Quote from: sr641 on May 08, 2012, 04:55:54 PM
Louisville has 2 bypasses. Interstate 264 and Interstate 265. Interstate 264 is a bypass for Interstate 64 and once the Ohio River Bridge is finished on Interstate 265, it will be a bypass for Interstates 64, 65, and 71.
you need to be bypassed.
Quote from: agentsteel53 on May 08, 2012, 05:09:31 PM
Quote from: sr641 on May 08, 2012, 04:55:54 PM
Louisville has 2 bypasses. Interstate 264 and Interstate 265. Interstate 264 is a bypass for Interstate 64 and once the Ohio River Bridge is finished on Interstate 265, it will be a bypass for Interstates 64, 65, and 71.
you need to be bypassed.
I started a poll to see if louisville has 2 bypasses.
Quote from: sr641 on May 08, 2012, 05:14:38 PM
I started a poll to see if louisville has 2 bypasses.
I noticed.
Quote from: kphoger on May 08, 2012, 09:10:38 AM
Quote from: sr641 on May 08, 2012, 05:55:50 AM
Quote from: Steve on May 07, 2012, 09:10:33 PM
Quote from: sr641 on May 07, 2012, 11:39:04 AM
louisville has 2 bypassess
no it has two loopssess neither one is really a bypassess
ya they are bypasses
It has neither. I used to make deliveries in Louisville all the time, and I know all the main roads in and out. See the map below, and tell me which road is a bypass or a loop:
http://g.co/maps/epvfq (http://g.co/maps/epvfq)
We are talking about Louisville, KY not Louisville, IL!
Quote from: sr641 on May 08, 2012, 05:27:19 PM
We are talking about Louisville, KY not Louisville, IL!
Forgive me. My powers of telepathy have been a bit below par lately.
louisville, ky has 2 bypassses
I was going to make a Louisville, Ohio reference but will let it slide. (Louisville, Ohio is pronounced "Lewis-ville", not "Looey-ville", regardless of what you hear on TV sometimes by people unfamiliar with it.
Will the new routing of US 52 around the west side of Lafayette/West Lafayette qualify? Sagamore Parkway (S, N, and W) once was "The Bypass" but now is every bit as congested as the streets through town, if not more so. The new road (carrying 231 and 52) will bypass the area on the other side.
Quote from: PurdueBill on May 08, 2012, 08:46:25 PM
I was going to make a Louisville, Ohio reference but will let it slide.
In point of fact, you did make a Louisville, Ohio, reference. :pan:
Quote from: PurdueBill on May 08, 2012, 08:46:25 PM
(Louisville, Ohio is pronounced "Lewis-ville", not "Looey-ville", regardless of what you hear on TV sometimes by people unfamiliar with it.
All of this Louisville talk is making me nauseous.
Saint Louis, MO:
I-55 from Sikeston (MO) to Chicago (IL)
Bypassed by I-255
Further bypassed by I-57
OK, now for a somewhat serious one.....
I-270 around northern Saint Louis is a bypass for Illinois-bound motorists.
Signs on I-70 coming in from the west indicate (or at least used to) that Illinois-bound traffic should use MO-370 instead.
Quote from: PurdueBill on May 08, 2012, 08:46:25 PM
Will the new routing of US 52 around the west side of Lafayette/West Lafayette qualify? Sagamore Parkway (S, N, and W) once was "The Bypass" but now is every bit as congested as the streets through town, if not more so. The new road (carrying 231 and 52) will bypass the area on the other side.
I don't think so, to me it's just another bypass, albeit on another side of town. The US 231 bypass is a new bypass that isn't replacing a previous one. As for the Lafayette area, I would think of I-65 more of a bypass of a bypass, especially given that it replaced the US 52-US 41 route for Indy to Chicago traffic.
Quote from: kphoger on May 08, 2012, 08:49:18 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on May 08, 2012, 08:46:25 PM
I was going to make a Louisville, Ohio reference but will let it slide.
In point of fact, you did make a Louisville, Ohio, reference. :pan:
Quote from: PurdueBill on May 08, 2012, 08:46:25 PM
(Louisville, Ohio is pronounced "Lewis-ville", not "Looey-ville", regardless of what you hear on TV sometimes by people unfamiliar with it.
Hooray! Someone got it. :P
Quote from: tdindy88 on May 08, 2012, 09:40:41 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on May 08, 2012, 08:46:25 PM
Will the new routing of US 52 around the west side of Lafayette/West Lafayette qualify? Sagamore Parkway (S, N, and W) once was "The Bypass" but now is every bit as congested as the streets through town, if not more so. The new road (carrying 231 and 52) will bypass the area on the other side.
I don't think so, to me it's just another bypass, albeit on another side of town. The US 231 bypass is a new bypass that isn't replacing a previous one. As for the Lafayette area, I would think of I-65 more of a bypass of a bypass, especially given that it replaced the US 52-US 41 route for Indy to Chicago traffic.
Yeah, that's why I'm not sure if it fit the criteria of the thread. The new road is more 231 than 52, with 52 sorta coming along for the ride. What I find weird is how (an albeit small) part of the "new" 231 south of West Lafayette is already getting torn up to tie in to the western bypass; concrete that was probably built to last more than 50 years and is only 11 years old getting ripped out seems to suggest a lack of planning (or at least a change of plans--although 15 years ago around there I don't remember hearing about the western bypass as an idea even).
I'm do not believe it was lack of planning on the US 231 bypass. It seems to have moved along very fast from multiple alternative routes to construction in very few years. I don't believe it was seriously considered when the existing divided highway section was built. If it was not for Major Moves, it would certainly not be under construction now. The long range planning map does show the bypass continuing north from US 52 to I-65.
Quote from: kphoger on May 08, 2012, 08:56:51 PM
Signs on I-70 coming in from the west indicate (or at least used to) that Illinois-bound traffic should use MO-370 instead.
Signage on the outer loop of I-270 indicates that MO 370 is an alternate route to I-70 west to Kansas City.
Quote from: kphoger on May 08, 2012, 08:49:18 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on May 08, 2012, 08:46:25 PM
I was going to make a Louisville, Ohio reference but will let it slide.
In point of fact, you did make a Louisville, Ohio, reference. :pan:
Quote from: PurdueBill on May 08, 2012, 08:46:25 PM
(Louisville, Ohio is pronounced "Lewis-ville", not "Looey-ville", regardless of what you hear on TV sometimes by people unfamiliar with it.
I live near Louisville, and PurdueBill is right. Moving on...
Here's one that some may not know: US-11 in Lexington, VA has a Super-2 bypass around the city (with a partial interchange at old US-11 and a diamond interchange at US-60). Now I-81 bypasses that.
I-12 of I-610 of I-10
This past week, I was looking for the location of a railroad crossing in a YouTube video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q56Q2Qg984s) I had watched along US 22 in Lewistown, PA. As I was zooming in, I noticed the business route, which looks like it curves away from an old alignment (http://maps.google.com/?ll=40.589515,-77.563004&spn=0.022389,0.045447&t=m&z=15). After looking at old topographic maps on Historic Aerials (too many to link here, use the search box on the site), I'm guessing that US 22 was first on Main St, then on the current business alignment along the river, then finally on the current Lewistown Bypass.
I believe Marshalltown, Iowa has one of those. US 30, when it was simply the Lincoln Highway, used to go right to downtown Marshalltown. Later, they built the current business route on the south side of town and now they have the freeway even farther south.
Tama and Toledo, Iowa is similar. It used to go straight thru downtown Tama over the famous Lincoln Highway bridge. There then became the current business route and now there is a brief freeway section between Tama and Toledo.
In Des Moines, Iowa, US 6 used to follow Grand Avenue straight through town. Later, it followed the current Euclid Avenue/Merle Hay/Hickman Road alignment. Then they built I-80, which completely bypasses Des Moines altogether.
I believe US 6 in Lincoln, NE is similar, but I don't offhand know what the original route of US 6 (or US 38 before that) through Lincoln was. But Cornhusker Highway is clearly a much later highway, and I-80 even later than that.
Not sure if it was mentioned already, but in Dover, DE, current US 13 was a bypass of Dover, but that wasn't a freeway, and backed up from development along it. Then DE 1 was built, bypassing that, with a short connector from it to US 13 on the south side.
I think I have one: US 77 thru Waco. I have (or have seen) maps that show it used to be a street currently called "Old Dallas Road" which was bypassed by the "New Dallas Hwy", the current Business 77. US 77 itself is contiguous with I-35, bypassing the older US 77, now Business 77.
The former US 81 followed these same realignments (if I am reading my old maps correctly).
Reidsville, NC - US-29 down Scales Ave became US-29 Business when the US-29 Freeway was built to the west. Then, that was bypassed by the new US-29 Bypass to the east, so the US-29 freeway became US-29 Business, and the first US-29 Business was decommissioned.
As read at the NCRoads Annex.
http://www.vahighways.com/ncannex/route-log/us29b.html
I just stumbled on one in Selinsgrove, PA. Based on looking at various years on HistoricAerials (http://www.historicaerials.com/aerials.php?scale=5&lon=-76.86871779980565&lat=40.78164315257874&year=2008), the original road was the current South Market Street. It looks like a one-way northbound bypass of the main road was added by 1951. The 1957 topographic map indicates that the bypass became the main road for both directions. The 1967 topographic map shows the road back on it's original alignment, and the bypass is shown as a secondary highway. The current Selinsgrove Bypass opened in 1977.
Burbank, California has been bypassed twice times. The first was in 1950 along Front Street and Providencia St, where US 99 went around the CBD. In 1959, the current Golden State Freeway was built along a similar alignment to the 1950 bypass. Gorman and Castaic, also both along US 99, had similar histories.
Quote from: Perfxion on April 14, 2012, 03:18:57 PM
Houston, TX
Current road: US-90A(old US90) runs through downtown, down mains street through Medical Center, and out the south west side.
Current road: I-10/US-90, by passing Texas Medical Center
Current road: I-610, bypassing Houston circa 1950, downtown and all wards
Current road: Beltway 8/Sam Houston Tollway, bypassing what was then Houston all together(currently the city limits extend 5 to 10 miles outside the beltway)
Under constrction: Texas 99/Grand Parkway, bypassing Houston and Suburbs, but still inside the metro area.
Thats some Inception mess right htere.
Dallas is working on a similar thing.
You had the original U.S. highways serving the city, then you had Loop 12 as the original bypass. Then I-635 (LBJ) was built as a second bypass in conjunction with I-20 and the Mid-Cities freeways to the west. Last year, the George Bush Turnpike was completed around the north half of Dallas as the third bypass. Now plans are being worked on for another bypass that will connect I-35 north of Denton to I-30 somewhere around Royse City.
A quadruple bypass!
Here's one in the Middletown area in Louisville:
http://maps.google.com/maps?q=Middletown,+Louisville,+KY&hl=en&ll=38.239057,-85.529423&spn=0.042538,0.075445&sll=38.204195,-85.535431&sspn=0.170235,0.301781&gl=us&hnear=Middletown,+Jefferson,+Kentucky&t=m&z=14
Old Shelbyville Road was the original US 60 through town, followed by the current Shelbyville Road on the north side. Of course years later, I-64 bypassed both routings, but a mile to the south.
That's just a simple relocation, not a bypass.
The Seattle area is served by I-5, with I-405 bypassing it to the east and serving the cities of Bellevue and Redmond. I-405 is really congested, so a bypass of the whole metro area is needed...in comes the mostly un-built I-605, proposed since 1968. WA-18 is already a freeway from I-5 to I-90 to the south of Seattle and would become a section of I-605.
Quote from: Bruce on March 22, 2013, 02:38:39 AM
The Seattle area is served by I-5, with I-405 bypassing it to the east and serving the cities of Bellevue and Redmond. I-405 is really congested, so a bypass of the whole metro area is needed...in comes the mostly un-built I-605, proposed since 1968. WA-18 is already a freeway from I-5 to I-90 to the south of Seattle and would become a section of I-605.
WA-18 still has some substandard short merges and short lines of sight, and there's not a full interchange with the Valley Freeway. The northern part of proposed I-605 was very controversial and probably won't get built anytime soon, and the whole project takes money Washington doesn't have, what with the WA-99 tunnel and the 520 bridge.
Nelsonville, Ohio has a bypass under construction. However...
QuoteIronically, soon-to-be-bypassed Canal Street was the first bypass of the old downtown business district. A federal Works Progress Administration project filled in and paved over the 19th-century canal ditch in 1939 and designated it as Rt. 33.
From http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/local/2012/09/16/nelsonville-folks-turn-in-favor-of-bypass.html
Quote from: vtk on March 25, 2013, 12:11:58 AM
Nelsonville, Ohio has a bypass under construction. However...
QuoteIronically, soon-to-be-bypassed Canal Street was the first bypass of the old downtown business district. A federal Works Progress Administration project filled in and paved over the 19th-century canal ditch in 1939 and designated it as Rt. 33.
From http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/local/2012/09/16/nelsonville-folks-turn-in-favor-of-bypass.html
From aerials, looks like it went Washington-Jefferson-Watkins-Chestnut.
3 I can think of offhand:
- Fort Wayne, IN - Original US 30 followed what I believe is Jefferson Blvd through town. Then a Bypass US 30 (now IN 930) was built via Coliseum Blvd. Finally, US 30 now follows I-469 and I-69 around Fort Wayne.
- Reading, PA - Original US 222 followed US 222 Business up Lancaster Ave, through center city and up 5th Street Highway. A US 222 Bypass was then built following US 422 from the Lancaster Ave exit and up to the PA 12 Interchange, then up PA 12 and then North on US 222 Business. Finally, US 222 was placed on the outer bypass it is now, and after the construction south of Reading, the south end was moved from a duplex with 422 east of the PA 12 interchange to west of the PA 12 interchange.
- Corning, NY - I believe original routing of NY 17 actually involved NY 417 in this area, but then followed NY 415 through Painted Post and into Corning City. New York moved NY 17 onto what is now NY 352 Dension Parkway, and then finally in the mid 90s, NY 17 was moved onto the current Corning Bypass before receiving the I-86 designation in 1999.
NY 417 is just old 17 renumbered. NY 415 east of NY 417 is too; the rest is old 15. Almost all of NY 352 is also old 17 (ditto for NY 17C and NY 17M to the east as well).
I think shifting the routing of a highway from one street to a pre-existing street doesn't really count as a bypass. Generally a bypass is a new road built primarily for the purpose of allowing traffic to get around a congested area. Although I suppose a bypass can incorporate some pre-existing roads into it, if improvements are made to streamline it as a through route.
How about US-1 in the area of Langhorne, PA?
Old Lincoln Highway (orginal route); Lincoln Highway (Present Day Business Route 1); US Route 1 Super Highway (Present Day Route 1)
I see three bypasses of Greencastle IN: SR 240, US 40, and I-70. The innermost, SR 240, is the most recent. I think the National Road followed US 40, but the railroad came through Greencastle and made it an important town.
Quote from: tdindy88 on March 23, 2011, 04:50:10 PM
Kokomo, Indiana will soon be bypassed by a new US 31 freeway to replace the current US 31 expressway that circles the east side of the city with some 15 stoplights. Maybe INDOT will get it right this time.
How old is the current bypass of kokomo?
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 07, 2013, 09:38:34 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on March 23, 2011, 04:50:10 PM
Kokomo, Indiana will soon be bypassed by a new US 31 freeway to replace the current US 31 expressway that circles the east side of the city with some 15 stoplights. Maybe INDOT will get it right this time.
How old is the current bypass of kokomo?
Your answer is here: http://www.in.gov/indot/projects/2378.htm (http://www.in.gov/indot/projects/2378.htm)
QuoteThe current U.S. 31 facility represents a bypass of the original U.S. 31 route that once passed through downtown Kokomo until 1952.
By the time I was passing through Kokomo as a child in the late '50s, the bypass was already congested, and jokes were made that Kokomo had just moved their downtown out to the bypass. It was already apparent that the lack of access control was lunacy. It just kept getting worse every year.
Quote from: theline on June 07, 2013, 04:09:51 PM
By the time I was passing through Kokomo as a child in the late '50s, the bypass was already congested, and jokes were made that Kokomo had just moved their downtown out to the bypass.
one of the first "ring around the collar" districts. that endless stream of box stores, car dealers, etc, which always seem to pop up at about 3-6 miles out of the city center.
Quote from: agentsteel53 on June 07, 2013, 04:20:57 PM
Quote from: theline on June 07, 2013, 04:09:51 PM
By the time I was passing through Kokomo as a child in the late '50s, the bypass was already congested, and jokes were made that Kokomo had just moved their downtown out to the bypass.
one of the first "ring around the collar" districts. that endless stream of box stores, car dealers, etc, which always seem to pop up at about 3-6 miles out of the city center.
This will soon be the fate of the new US 231/52 bypass of West Lafayette, Indiana. As soon as they said they were building it, the mayor of WL immediately started plans with annexing land so that the new city limits would include the new bypass. I find this annoying, I understand it can bring economic benefits, but it really defeats the purpose of the bypass. It's supposed to avoid all of the businesses and congestion of a city. In a few years it will be like Kokomo. What do you guys think? Should DOTs do something to mitigate this type of stuff happening? (I'm not familiar with the zoning laws, so I'm not sure if DOTs could do anything)
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 07, 2013, 05:40:56 PM
Quote from: agentsteel53 on June 07, 2013, 04:20:57 PM
Quote from: theline on June 07, 2013, 04:09:51 PM
By the time I was passing through Kokomo as a child in the late '50s, the bypass was already congested, and jokes were made that Kokomo had just moved their downtown out to the bypass.
one of the first "ring around the collar" districts. that endless stream of box stores, car dealers, etc, which always seem to pop up at about 3-6 miles out of the city center.
This will soon be the fate of the new US 231/52 bypass of West Lafayette, Indiana. As soon as they said they were building it, the mayor of WL immediately started plans with annexing land so that the new city limits would include the new bypass. I find this annoying, I understand it can bring economic benefits, but it really defeats the purpose of the bypass. It's supposed to avoid all of the businesses and congestion of a city. In a few years it will be like Kokomo. What do you guys think? Should DOTs do something to mitigate this type of stuff happening? (I'm not familiar with the zoning laws, so I'm not sure if DOTs could do anything)
The only thing that I'm aware of that a DOT can do to stop development from happening on the road itself is to make a freeway bypass instead of a divided highway with traffic signals.
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 07, 2013, 05:40:56 PM
Quote from: agentsteel53 on June 07, 2013, 04:20:57 PM
Quote from: theline on June 07, 2013, 04:09:51 PM
By the time I was passing through Kokomo as a child in the late '50s, the bypass was already congested, and jokes were made that Kokomo had just moved their downtown out to the bypass.
one of the first "ring around the collar" districts. that endless stream of box stores, car dealers, etc, which always seem to pop up at about 3-6 miles out of the city center.
This will soon be the fate of the new US 231/52 bypass of West Lafayette, Indiana. As soon as they said they were building it, the mayor of WL immediately started plans with annexing land so that the new city limits would include the new bypass. I find this annoying, I understand it can bring economic benefits, but it really defeats the purpose of the bypass. It's supposed to avoid all of the businesses and congestion of a city. In a few years it will be like Kokomo. What do you guys think? Should DOTs do something to mitigate this type of stuff happening? (I'm not familiar with the zoning laws, so I'm not sure if DOTs could do anything)
I think the suburban strip mall style development comes because there's cheap land that suddenly has freeway access. Whether that land gets annexed by a city doesn't seem to make much difference, unless the city's taxes are a lot higher.
Quote from: Brandon on June 07, 2013, 06:47:31 PM
The only thing that I'm aware of that a DOT can do to stop development from happening on the road itself is to make a freeway bypass instead of a divided highway with traffic signals.
Precisely! That's where INDOT fell down with the first bypass. There are many other such instances in Indiana and elsewhere, I'm sure, as well. It seems INDOT has learned the lesson finally with such projects as US 31 near Kokomo, South Bend and Indy.
Quote from: kkt on June 07, 2013, 06:52:16 PM
I think the suburban strip mall style development comes because there's cheap land that suddenly has freeway access. Whether that land gets annexed by a city doesn't seem to make much difference, unless the city's taxes are a lot higher.
I can't speak for other states, but Indiana cities can closely control the use of land within their limits through zoning, if they do it wisely. Zoning is not done outside city limits. This is why it's probably a good thing that West Lafayette is annexing out to the new bypass. Kokomo has done the same thing with their new BP. In Indiana at least, annexation may help to some degree control sprawl.
It doesn't matter if it's a freeway or not so much as whether access is controlled.
Do Indiana counties not have zoning powers?
Quote from: NE2 on June 07, 2013, 09:03:10 PM
It doesn't matter if it's a freeway or not so much as whether access is controlled.
Do Indiana counties not have zoning powers?
You can zone to your heart's content, but you have to control the access. That's the important part. Here, in Illinois, some municipalities are better at it than others for limiting the number of driveways onto a street. But, if the road is not limited or controlled access, driveways can pop up anywhere. And then we have developers who ask for traffic signals for every damned shopping center and subdivision along the road, even when access is limited.
Quote from: NE2 on June 07, 2013, 09:03:10 PM
It doesn't matter if it's a freeway or not so much as whether access is controlled.
Do Indiana counties not have zoning powers?
The controlled access comment is correct. In the case of the new US 231 (US 52 re-route) western bypass of Lafayette, access is controlled - there will never be any driveway cuts on that road. From what I see, there will be traffic lights every half to full mile. In the end, this won't be like the original Kokomo US 31 bypass because of the controlled access, but it won't be as nice as the new US 31 Kokomo bypass which is a full freeway. I personally don't think the US 231 bypass needs to be a freeway at this point. What is really needed is an extension northward to I-65.
Indiana counties do have zoning powers, but often have no decent master plan. You tend to get spotty zoning due to the ease of rezoning from agricultural to business or manufacturing. In the end, you can have a mess like you see on US 30 from Valparaiso to Hobart (Southlake Mall). Some cities and towns aren't a whole lot better, though.
Quote from: theline on June 07, 2013, 08:56:23 PM
I can't speak for other states, but Indiana cities can closely control the use of land within their limits through zoning, if they do it wisely. Zoning is not done outside city limits. This is why it's probably a good thing that West Lafayette is annexing out to the new bypass. Kokomo has done the same thing with their new BP. In Indiana at least, annexation may help to some degree control sprawl.
There is nothing stopping Indiana cities and counties from working together so the county conforms to a city's future master plan, and I believe this has happened. Whether it actually happens or not is usually a matter of politics.
Whether or not the land along a new highway is inside of a city or is unincorporated (from the midwestern USA POV) has zero effect on whether or not it will be developed after the new bypass highway is built - it depends 100% on the provisions of access. Here in the Appleton, WI area, *ALL* of land along US(I)-41 from about North St in Neenah to Richmond St (WI 47) in Appleton is entirely *unincorporated*.
If anything, IMHO, the fact that that land is in unincorporated townships made matters much worse than had it been in the cities of Appleton and Neenah precisely because until very recently (and even now it is only a rudimentary level of planning control), the townships took a 'look the other way' hands-off approach to land use and zoning along it - resulting in a total mish-mash chaos of highway-related development.
------------------------
OTOH, When WisDOT built the US 10 freeway westward from US(I)-41 (it opened west of WI 76 in December of 2003), it was purposely designed with only two interchanges between US(I)-41 (Bridgeview Interchange) and US 45 (Winchester Interchange) - and none at all west of WI 76 - so as to prevent that sort of premature development.
So far so good. :nod:
Mike
One (non-freeway or expressway) route that came to mind was NV-320 around the west side of Pioche. US-93 bypasses to the east. Am I doing it right?
Quote from: Rover_0 on June 10, 2013, 01:56:56 PM
One (non-freeway or expressway) route that came to mind was NV-320 around the west side of Pioche. US-93 bypasses to the east. Am I doing it right?
Not quite, in the sense that SR 320 was not meant to bypass Pioche but provide access to several mines near Pioche on the opposite side of the mountain west of the town (NDOT calls this route the "Caselton Mine Loop"). If 320 were built as a bypass, then it would qualify (as SR 321, running through Pioche, was the original US 93 before the current eastern bypass of the town along present US 93 was constructed).
SR 320 is the longest of the available routes, and takes the most time to traverse, according to the Goog.