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Illiana Corridor progress

Started by Rick Powell, February 11, 2012, 01:47:20 PM

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Rick Powell

Illiana Corridor Record of Decision is up at the public website.

http://www.illianacorridor.org/tier_2/tier2_rod.aspx


Brandon

WOOT!  Take that Chicago and your Sierra Club allies!  We want the road, it will be built, and there's not a fucking thing you fuckers can do!  :thumbsup:  :cheers:
"If you think this has a happy ending, you haven't been paying attention." - Ramsay Bolton, "Game of Thrones"

"Symbolic of his struggle against reality." - Reg, "Monty Python's Life of Brian"

ARMOURERERIC

Quote from: Brandon on December 11, 2014, 06:30:31 AM
WOOT!  Take that Chicago and your Sierra Club allies!  We want the road, it will be built, and there's not a fucking thing you fuckers can do!  :thumbsup:  :cheers:

Do not taunt the Happy Fun Ball

froggie

QuoteWOOT!  Take that Chicago and your Sierra Club allies!  We want the road, it will be built, and there's not a fucking thing you fuckers can do!

Still gotta figure a way to pay for it.  Until that happens, I would put ZERO guarantees on it being built.

Brandon

Quote from: froggie on December 12, 2014, 09:22:26 AM
QuoteWOOT!  Take that Chicago and your Sierra Club allies!  We want the road, it will be built, and there's not a fucking thing you fuckers can do!

Still gotta figure a way to pay for it.  Until that happens, I would put ZERO guarantees on it being built.

That's already in the pipeline, Froggie.  It will be built if the county board has anything to say about it (and they have plenty).
"If you think this has a happy ending, you haven't been paying attention." - Ramsay Bolton, "Game of Thrones"

"Symbolic of his struggle against reality." - Reg, "Monty Python's Life of Brian"

froggie

In my experience, being "in the pipeline" and being finalized are two very different things.

Brandon

Quote from: froggie on December 12, 2014, 09:31:55 AM
In my experience, being "in the pipeline" and being finalized are two very different things.

Well, contrary to the opinions of the Chicago Tribune and a few people from Chicago, it is a very necessary piece of the regional infrastructure.
"If you think this has a happy ending, you haven't been paying attention." - Ramsay Bolton, "Game of Thrones"

"Symbolic of his struggle against reality." - Reg, "Monty Python's Life of Brian"

silverback1065

Quote from: Brandon on December 12, 2014, 10:46:26 AM
Quote from: froggie on December 12, 2014, 09:31:55 AM
In my experience, being "in the pipeline" and being finalized are two very different things.

Well, contrary to the opinions of the Chicago Tribune and a few people from Chicago, it is a very necessary piece of the regional infrastructure.
With it's current route i doubt it but we'll see. If it went from 55 east past 65 and tied into 94 and 90/80 near michigan city I'd say it would be useful and necessary. But that's just my opinion.

skluth

Quote from: Brandon on December 12, 2014, 09:24:04 AM
Quote from: froggie on December 12, 2014, 09:22:26 AM
QuoteWOOT!  Take that Chicago and your Sierra Club allies!  We want the road, it will be built, and there's not a fucking thing you fuckers can do!

Still gotta figure a way to pay for it.  Until that happens, I would put ZERO guarantees on it being built.

That's already in the pipeline, Froggie.  It will be built if the county board has anything to say about it (and they have plenty).

Last I heard, Illinois was practically broke and they elected a fiscally conservative governor. There's not even enough left to embezzle in the coffers.

Brandon

Quote from: skluth on December 13, 2014, 01:21:34 AM
Quote from: Brandon on December 12, 2014, 09:24:04 AM
Quote from: froggie on December 12, 2014, 09:22:26 AM
QuoteWOOT!  Take that Chicago and your Sierra Club allies!  We want the road, it will be built, and there's not a fucking thing you fuckers can do!

Still gotta figure a way to pay for it.  Until that happens, I would put ZERO guarantees on it being built.

That's already in the pipeline, Froggie.  It will be built if the county board has anything to say about it (and they have plenty).

Last I heard, Illinois was practically broke and they elected a fiscally conservative governor. There's not even enough left to embezzle in the coffers.

That's why the building be by a P3.  There's already at least 3 proposals on the table.
"If you think this has a happy ending, you haven't been paying attention." - Ramsay Bolton, "Game of Thrones"

"Symbolic of his struggle against reality." - Reg, "Monty Python's Life of Brian"

mukade

Quote from: Brandon on December 12, 2014, 10:46:26 AM
Quote from: froggie on December 12, 2014, 09:31:55 AM
In my experience, being "in the pipeline" and being finalized are two very different things.

Well, contrary to the opinions of the Chicago Tribune and a few people from Chicago, it is a very necessary piece of the regional infrastructure.

I would maintain that it is unnecessary and financially risky - especially for Indiana. Read this article from Streetsblog. I don't generally subscribe to what this organation supports, but the inflated projections for toll roads this article describes clearly have been a problem, and that article does a good job documenting them.

If the the Indiana Toll Road - which is experiencing a decline in traffic, is underused and bankrupt, why would another toll road that is 20 miles south, would not serve commuters at all, and would be a bypass to a free route, be successful? In the sense that it could possibly support serve multi-modal terminals, draw new businesses at some interchanges, and serve as an alternative for congestion on the Borman or to bypass things like snow squalls, it would have limited value. If the route would be ten miles further north in Indiana, it would indeed be a great bypass for US 30. As planned, it is about 12 miles south of US 30.

Another way to look at it, what percentage of I-65 traffic in south Lake County is headed for for areas of Chicagoland that would be served by this highway? Probably at least half of the traffic is local going no further than Merrillvile. Some would be going east to Porter County or to Gary or Hammond. Of the thru traffic going toward Chicago, how many of those drivers will pay toll (especially if it is high) instead of using the free alternatives? How many major employers would this road directly serve? I think if you do the math, you might see yet another optimistic traffic volume projection is being made.

Theoretically, it could also carry shoppers from Cedar Lake to the Southlake area if they are willing to pay. I doubt that would amount to anything significant.

Indiana got a great deal when they leased the ITR, but now, ironically because of the success of that deal, we might be put at risk by an over-hyped project. At least ITHSA is a system with heavily used highways so the other tollways could subsidize it, but I am afraid Indiana would be putting itself at risk financially.

Quote from: silverback1065 on December 12, 2014, 10:49:11 AM
With it's current route i doubt it but we'll see. If it went from 55 east past 65 and tied into 94 and 90/80 near michigan city I'd say it would be useful and necessary. But that's just my opinion.

I would apply the same test - how much traffic would use this toll road when the ITR is already experiencing significant declines? Also, looking at the route, if I were a using this as an east-west bypass, I would consider how far south this road would take me. That also has both a financial cost and would add time.

andy3175

Quote from: Brandon on December 13, 2014, 07:13:37 AM
Quote from: skluth on December 13, 2014, 01:21:34 AM
Quote from: Brandon on December 12, 2014, 09:24:04 AM
Quote from: froggie on December 12, 2014, 09:22:26 AM
QuoteWOOT!  Take that Chicago and your Sierra Club allies!  We want the road, it will be built, and there's not a fucking thing you fuckers can do!

Still gotta figure a way to pay for it.  Until that happens, I would put ZERO guarantees on it being built.

That's already in the pipeline, Froggie.  It will be built if the county board has anything to say about it (and they have plenty).

Last I heard, Illinois was practically broke and they elected a fiscally conservative governor. There's not even enough left to embezzle in the coffers.

That's why the building be by a P3.  There's already at least 3 proposals on the table.

The ROD focused on the planned corridor between I-55 and I-65. Has there been any discussion among media, politicians, etc. to extend it east at least to the Indiana Toll Road? Or is this the final corridor? Back when I lived in the Chicago area, I always felt what is now called the Illiana corridor would incorporate a link to I-80/90; otherwise, who wants to drive 80 west, 65 south, Illiana west, 55 north, and 80 east? I get there is usefulness if you want to go south on 55, but it's not easy to drive through Lake Station where 80, 90, and 94 converge.
Regards,
Andy

www.aaroads.com

Rick Powell

Quote from: andy3175 on December 15, 2014, 01:52:11 AM
Quote from: Brandon on December 13, 2014, 07:13:37 AM
Quote from: skluth on December 13, 2014, 01:21:34 AM
Quote from: Brandon on December 12, 2014, 09:24:04 AM
Quote from: froggie on December 12, 2014, 09:22:26 AM
QuoteWOOT!  Take that Chicago and your Sierra Club allies!  We want the road, it will be built, and there's not a fucking thing you fuckers can do!

Still gotta figure a way to pay for it.  Until that happens, I would put ZERO guarantees on it being built.

That's already in the pipeline, Froggie.  It will be built if the county board has anything to say about it (and they have plenty).

Last I heard, Illinois was practically broke and they elected a fiscally conservative governor. There's not even enough left to embezzle in the coffers.

That's why the building be by a P3.  There's already at least 3 proposals on the table.

The ROD focused on the planned corridor between I-55 and I-65. Has there been any discussion among media, politicians, etc. to extend it east at least to the Indiana Toll Road? Or is this the final corridor? Back when I lived in the Chicago area, I always felt what is now called the Illiana corridor would incorporate a link to I-80/90; otherwise, who wants to drive 80 west, 65 south, Illiana west, 55 north, and 80 east? I get there is usefulness if you want to go south on 55, but it's not easy to drive through Lake Station where 80, 90, and 94 converge.

The I-65 interchange is configured to be expandable to a full interchange accommodating an eastern extension.  There was no other consideration in this study to going further east, but it could be considered in a future study.

3467

http://capitolfax.com/2015/01/13/rauners-spending-freeze/#comments

Well Pat Quinn is gone and it looks like the Illiana is going with him. I assume the Macomb Bypass would be included. I hope the Beardstown bridge is not I did not realize the new head of IDOT hated the Illiana .  There are several stories linked here . There is almost no funding for any other new construction projects in the 5 year plan anyway . One poster here put Illinois 336 between Monmouth and Peoria . I assure you I-74 is still there .

Joe The Dragon

The tollway can just take over for the Illiana.

3467

The Tollway could but it wont happen for years because neither it nor the Prairie  Parkway would make money . I would hope the corridor of both would be protected so that option will exist

US 41

Quote from: 3467 on January 13, 2015, 08:28:59 PM
http://capitolfax.com/2015/01/13/rauners-spending-freeze/#comments

Well Pat Quinn is gone and it looks like the Illiana is going with him. I assume the Macomb Bypass would be included. I hope the Beardstown bridge is not I did not realize the new head of IDOT hated the Illiana .  There are several stories linked here . There is almost no funding for any other new construction projects in the 5 year plan anyway . One poster here put Illinois 336 between Monmouth and Peoria . I assure you I-74 is still there .

So Illinois isn't going to build it now!? If that's so will Indiana still build their section?
Visited States and Provinces:
USA (48)= All of Lower 48
Canada (5)= NB, NS, ON, PEI, QC
Mexico (9)= BCN, BCS, CHIH, COAH, DGO, NL, SON, SIN, TAM

silverback1065

Quote from: US 41 on January 13, 2015, 09:36:11 PM
Quote from: 3467 on January 13, 2015, 08:28:59 PM
http://capitolfax.com/2015/01/13/rauners-spending-freeze/#comments

Well Pat Quinn is gone and it looks like the Illiana is going with him. I assume the Macomb Bypass would be included. I hope the Beardstown bridge is not I did not realize the new head of IDOT hated the Illiana .  There are several stories linked here . There is almost no funding for any other new construction projects in the 5 year plan anyway . One poster here put Illinois 336 between Monmouth and Peoria . I assure you I-74 is still there .

So Illinois isn't going to build it now!? If that's so will Indiana still build their section?

I don't see why INDOT would, I really dont think Indiana even wanted it anyway. There are so many projects way more important in Indiana right now.

US 41

Quote from: silverback1065 on January 13, 2015, 09:42:06 PM
Quote from: US 41 on January 13, 2015, 09:36:11 PM
Quote from: 3467 on January 13, 2015, 08:28:59 PM
http://capitolfax.com/2015/01/13/rauners-spending-freeze/#comments

Well Pat Quinn is gone and it looks like the Illiana is going with him. I assume the Macomb Bypass would be included. I hope the Beardstown bridge is not I did not realize the new head of IDOT hated the Illiana .  There are several stories linked here . There is almost no funding for any other new construction projects in the 5 year plan anyway . One poster here put Illinois 336 between Monmouth and Peoria . I assure you I-74 is still there .

So Illinois isn't going to build it now!? If that's so will Indiana still build their section?

I don't see why INDOT would, I really dont think Indiana even wanted it anyway. There are so many projects way more important in Indiana right now.

I'm actually kind of happy about this news.
Visited States and Provinces:
USA (48)= All of Lower 48
Canada (5)= NB, NS, ON, PEI, QC
Mexico (9)= BCN, BCS, CHIH, COAH, DGO, NL, SON, SIN, TAM

silverback1065

Me too this roads usefulness is debatable. I don't think it goes east enough in indiana to make any sense

andy3175

This article more or less says the same thing and is a bit more explicit about the Illiana Expressway:

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/I/IL_ILLIANA_EXPRESSWAY_ILOL-?SITE=ILBLO&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT

QuoteA planned 47-mile expressway between Illinois and Indiana is on hold after new Illinois Gov. Bruce Rauner issued an executive order aimed at addressing the state's deep budget problems.

In his first act after taking office Monday, the Republican suspended planning and development of any major interstate construction projects pending a "careful review" of costs and benefits. Rauner spokesman Lance Trover said Tuesday the planned Illiana Expressway is among the projects that fall under the executive order, adding that it's part of "a broader review to maximize taxpayer investment in infrastructure."
Regards,
Andy

www.aaroads.com

Rick Powell

Quote from: silverback1065 on January 13, 2015, 09:42:06 PM
Quote from: US 41 on January 13, 2015, 09:36:11 PM
Quote from: 3467 on January 13, 2015, 08:28:59 PM
http://capitolfax.com/2015/01/13/rauners-spending-freeze/#comments

I don't see why INDOT would, I really dont think Indiana even wanted it anyway. There are so many projects way more important in Indiana right now.

Actually, this was Mitch Daniels' initiative all the way, with Illinois coming in a few years later after they saw more economic development opportunities if it was extended to I-55.  Daniels' INDOT original concept connected I-57 with I-80/94, and was truncated back to I-65 after opposition from Porter and LaPorte Counties.  INDOT's feasibility study went from I-57 to I-65, and IDOT later contracted with the same consulting firm to do a less detailed study of the economics of extending it to I-55.   

Brandon

Quote from: Rick Powell on January 14, 2015, 06:12:22 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 13, 2015, 09:42:06 PM
Quote from: US 41 on January 13, 2015, 09:36:11 PM
Quote from: 3467 on January 13, 2015, 08:28:59 PM
http://capitolfax.com/2015/01/13/rauners-spending-freeze/#comments

I don't see why INDOT would, I really dont think Indiana even wanted it anyway. There are so many projects way more important in Indiana right now.

Actually, this was Mitch Daniels' initiative all the way, with Illinois coming in a few years later after they saw more economic development opportunities if it was extended to I-55.  Daniels' INDOT original concept connected I-57 with I-80/94, and was truncated back to I-65 after opposition from Porter and LaPorte Counties.  INDOT's feasibility study went from I-57 to I-65, and IDOT later contracted with the same consulting firm to do a less detailed study of the economics of extending it to I-55.   

Daniels and the Will County Board.  Which, I hope the county board can find a way to push this forward as it is needed.
"If you think this has a happy ending, you haven't been paying attention." - Ramsay Bolton, "Game of Thrones"

"Symbolic of his struggle against reality." - Reg, "Monty Python's Life of Brian"

thenetwork

When serious talks about a 3rd Chicago-area airport south of town start gaining traction, then the pressure will be on to take the Illiana off the back burner. 

ARMOURERERIC

Maybe getting the airport authority to build it will become an option



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