San Francisco (Apple's new font) on road signs

[jbnv]

Would somebody be so kind as to mock up some road signs with Apple's new San Francisco font?

For those who aren't familiar with it: Apple created the new font to be its system font in its products, particularly the Apple Watch. From Apple's Watch Human Interface Guidelines.

The system font was designed specifically for legibility on Apple Watch. At large sizes, the font's slightly condensed letters are set tight to take up less horizontal space. But at small sizes, they are spaced more loosely and have bigger apertures in glyphs like 'a' and 'e' to make these easier to read at a glance. Punctuation is also proportionally larger when the font gets smaller. And as text size changes, Apple Watch dynamically switches between fonts to maintain clarity and legibility at all times.

What does this have to do with roadsigns? We have discussed ad nauseum how Clearview works well in large block text but doesn't work so well in small sizes or in all-capitals text. I'm just curious to see how it would work on a road sign. Can't judge until you try it out.

[kkt]

Lots of fonts have been designed for legibility under marginal conditions.  Times New Roman was commissioned by the Times newspaper of London for legibility on cheap newsprint with cheap 'n fast printing.  Other things being equal, it would be a good idea for highway departments to use cheaply available fonts instead of ones that are expensive to license.

[roadman]

Lots of fonts have been designed for legibility under marginal conditions.  Times New Roman was commissioned by the Times newspaper of London for legibility on cheap newsprint with cheap 'n fast printing.  Other things being equal, it would be a good idea for highway departments to use cheaply available fonts instead of ones that are expensive to license.

Of course, this will be a moot point in a year or so.  The Apple watch is destined to be the texting generation's New Coke fiasco.

[noelbotevera]

Lots of fonts have been designed for legibility under marginal conditions.  Times New Roman was commissioned by the Times newspaper of London for legibility on cheap newsprint with cheap 'n fast printing.  Other things being equal, it would be a good idea for highway departments to use cheaply available fonts instead of ones that are expensive to license.

Of course, this will be a moot point in a year or so.  The Apple watch is destined to be the texting generation's New Coke fiasco.

This topic will be so controversial...
Houston, we have a problem.

[briantroutman]

I was confused by talk of Apple's new "San Francisco"  typeface recently–because that was one of the city-named typefaces included with the original Macintosh in 1984. (I haven't seen it since the days of System 7, though.)



Interesting piece of PA-related trivia: the Mac's typefaces were originally going to have names like Overbrook and Ardmore after stops on the SEPTA R5 train. Susan Kare, the designer of the typefaces, spent her high school years in suburban Montgomery County. Apparently Steve Jobs scuttled the suburban Philadelphia town names when he saw them, saying that they needed world class cities.

[kkt]

Yes, I remember the original Mac's San Francisco... and wondering who thought it was useful enough to include in every single Mac.

[briantroutman]

You have to put it in historical perspective. A generation of computer users had come to expect this as state-of-the-art digital typography:



So I think that fonts like San Francisco and Venice–tacky and cringe-worthy as they are today–were within the "because we can"  category in 1984. Kind of like all the skeuomorphism on the original iPhone OS.

[kkt]

That's what the screen would look like, although almost everyone had lowercase available and many had different colors.  Printed output for home and small business users was daily wheel, much like a good electric typewriter of the day.  Professional publishing houses had phototypesetters that could make output as good or better than a linotype.

So why are sentences typed at the OS prompt not giving error messages?

[odditude]

So why are sentences typed at the OS prompt not giving error messages?

Code Select Expand

@echo off
cls
echo A:\^>
echo A:\^>WHEN YOU TYPED ON AN OLD COMPUTER
echo.
echo A:\^>LIKE AN 8088
echo.
echo A:\^>THIS IS WHAT YOU WOULD SEE

[briantroutman]

I dunno–I just did a Google image search for "green phosphor" , and that came up early in the results. I'm guessing it's a mockup.

You're right about daisy wheels and typesetters–and the slow, screeching 72 dpi output of the original ImageWriter was quite awful. But for a less than wealthy person, being able to buy a reasonably affordable computer for the home, type "Smith Family Newsletter" , make a couple of clicks and see Smith Family Newsletter, instantly–then print out exactly what you saw on screen–was quite remarkable if not exactly revolutionary.

[1995hoo]

Lots of fonts have been designed for legibility under marginal conditions.  Times New Roman was commissioned by the Times newspaper of London for legibility on cheap newsprint with cheap 'n fast printing.  Other things being equal, it would be a good idea for highway departments to use cheaply available fonts instead of ones that are expensive to license.

Of course, this will be a moot point in a year or so.  The Apple watch is destined to be the texting generation's New Coke fiasco.

I find the Apple Watch to be a mildly interesting concept as a way to keep up on e-mail in workplaces that restrict the use of personal iPhones or iPads (or other similar device), but the idea of spending $500 just to circumvent a restriction like that seems like a serious extravagance, plus wearing watches on both wrists (I'd have to wear the Apple Watch on my right wrist since I already have five conventional watches I like very much) seems really weird.

[CtrlAltDel]

I'm just curious to see how it would work on a road sign. Can't judge until you try it out.

Well, here you go.

[english si]

I find the Apple Watch to be a mildly interesting concept as a way to keep up on e-mail in workplaces that restrict the use of personal iPhones or iPads (or other similar device)

Similar devices need a different smart watch - which came first (my brother was on his second one when the Apple Watch was announced. He just laughed at how behind the times Apple now is).

but the idea of spending $500

I'm looking at non-Apple ones at around $150 new. Under $300 for a decent top-of-the-line one.

just to circumvent a restriction like that seems like a serious extravagance,

Or to allow you to keep access to many of you phone's functions while your huge phone (that is nearly as big as many people's tablets) is in a bag or pocket, saving the in-out-in-out aspect of it.

plus wearing watches on both wrists (I'd have to wear the Apple Watch on my right wrist since I already have five conventional watches I like very much) seems really weird.

They are designed to replace watches. Or rather, get those people who'd stopped wearing them when smart phones came out to wear them once more.

[1995hoo]

I'm not replacing the watches I have. Period, regardless of what the tech companies might intend. Especially not the newest one my wife gave me last year as a birthday present. Hence why I'd be wearing two devices.

[lordsutch]

Well, here you go.

You'd need a much heavier stroke weight to be legible at highway speeds in a negative contrast application. Maybe Apple will have a bold display weight at some point (like its kissing cousin, Google's Roboto, does).

Honestly typefaces designed for public signage (Frutiger, Johnston, FHWA Series, Transport, Clearview 5/6...) are going to be superior to anything designed to be legible at small sizes for actual signs in the field.

[jbnv]

You'd need a much heavier stroke weight to be legible at highway speeds in a negative contrast application. ... Honestly typefaces designed for public signage (Frutiger, Johnston, FHWA Series, Transport, Clearview 5/6...) are going to be superior to anything designed to be legible at small sizes for actual signs in the field.

Valid point. What about positive-contrast applications?