Interstate 169 (Texas)

[Interstate 69 Fan]

Did a search, only found one thread asking if I-169 was signed.

What's the status of I-169? Does it still only exist from I-69E to Old Alice Road, or does it finally extend to TX 48?

[Hurricane Rex]

Yes, it currently still ends at Old Alice Road (according to every source I've found), and a full opening date is still unknown. Toll revenue is keeping the project back.

[wxfree]

It's been designated for the length of the continuous freeway, and will presumably be extended as the continuous freeway is lengthened.

[The Ghostbuster]

Other than 169 and 369, are there any other x-69 three-digit Interstate routes proposed for Texas?

[Jim]

As of a month ago when I was in the area, I-169 didn't get any mention from mainline I-69E in either direction.

[Interstate 69 Fan]

Other than 169 and 369, are there any other x-69 three-digit Interstate routes proposed for Texas?

Nope.

[sparker]

Other than 169 and 369, are there any other x-69 three-digit Interstate routes proposed for Texas?

Nope.

Several years ago when the path of I-69 through Houston metro hadn't been finalized, it was thought that the number I-669 would be applied to whatever alignment (at that time the choices were Loop 99 and the existing US 59 through-town route) was not selected (at least according for the Alliance for I-69 Texas, the Houston-based group spearheading the I-69 effort down there); but since US 59 was eventually selected, any impetus for an Interstate-signed bypass seems to have dissipated.  However, if the downtown realignment effort involving both I-69 and I-45 is indeed implemented -- with the inevitable congestion stemming from its construction -- there might be a reactive "push" to sign a bypass route (I would hardly think that anyone would think of adding any more load to I-610 as an interim solution!) as a through-traffic alternative; this might revive the "I-669" concept for at least the west and north quadrants of that loop system.   

[Bobby5280]

There is a one large I-69 bypass corridor being planned for Houston, which does incorporate the South and East quadrants of the Grand Parkway. If this bypass is ever built (presumably sometime near or after the Grand Parkway is completed) there is not much guarantee the bypass would be signed as a 3-digit Interstate route. With states now having to come up with more of the funding for highways that makes it less of a priority to put Interstate shields on the finished route. The same goes with toll roads. Chances are strong this large bypass would be signed as a Texas toll route. The Grand Parkway and Loop 8 both aren't going to carry Interstate designations any time soon. This one probably won't either.

Regarding other I-x69 possibilities, I thought TX-44 from Corpus Chrisi to Robstown, Alice & Freer might have been a 3 digit I-69 route. But that could end up being I-6 as well. Some of the freeways in Corpus Chrisi could carry Interstate designations. I could see the "I-6" thing being signed on TX-358 through Corpus Christi onto the North end of Padre Island. The loop highway around Victoria could end up being an I-x69 route. Same goes for Nacogdoches and Carthage.

[Grzrd]

When the Loop 20 project is completed (current estimate about eight years (p. 6/18 of pdf)), there may be some rumblings to make Loop 20 from Saunders Street to SH 359 an I-x69. The rumblings will be even louder if construction is started on the fifth international bridge, which Laredo officials showcased the site as recently as August:

Two members of the association's board of directors visited Nuevo Laredo on Monday and Laredo on Tuesday, Saenz said. At the World Trade Centers Association board meeting in September, the two men will present Laredo and Nuevo Laredo as one region. One city would have a main office and the other city would have a satellite office, Saenz said.
In Laredo, the city took the two board members on a helicopter ride around town, touring from above the bridges, industrial parks, warehousing, and the site in south Laredo where a potential fifth international bridge could go, Saenz said.

The bridge would presumably tie in to the southern end of the Cuatro Vientos Road section of Loop 20 and perhaps jumpstart the long-term plans for an upgrade to Cuatro Vientos Road..

Looooong term, this could all be eventually I-2.

[MaxConcrete]

The TxDOT commission has an agenda item for this month's meeting to make the designation official. That took a while. It does make me wonder if TxDOT was slow because the route is tolled (and this will be the only tolled interstate in Texas). But in the end, TxDOT probably acceded to local desires to have the interstate designation.

Google maps is identifying it as I-169.

http://ftp.dot.state.tx.us/pub/txdot/commission/2020/0326/agenda.pdf

Cameron County- In Brownsville, consider designating a segment of the state highway system as I-169, concurrent with SH 550
(MO) This minute order designates a segment of the state highway system as I-169, concurrent with SH 550 from Old Alice Road to approximately 0.4 mile east of FM 1847 in Brownsville, a distance of approximately 2.5 miles. The Brownsville Metropolitan Planning Organization, American Association of State Highway and Transportation Officials, and the Federal Highway Administration have approved the designation of this segment.

[Bobby5280]

If they do sign it as I-169 only the first couple or so miles of the route would be eligible for signing as an Interstate. It's Interstate quality 4-lane divided from the I-69E interchange to the FM-1847 exit. After that it turns into a pair of frontage roads with a blank median. The toll road that follows is just a 2 lane road with a Jersey Barrier on the center line. They have a lot of work to do to bring the rest of that up to Interstate standards.

[Thegeet]

If they do sign it as I-169 only the first couple or so miles of the route would be eligible for signing as an Interstate. It's Interstate quality 4-lane divided from the I-69E interchange to the FM-1847 exit. After that it turns into a pair of frontage roads with a blank median. The toll road that follows is just a 2 lane road with a Jersey Barrier on the center line. They have a lot of work to do to bring the rest of that up to Interstate standards.

I apologize for Bumping. However, google maps has updated street view. SH 550 is also signed SH 169, no interstate shield.
https://goo.gl/maps/ZqYpumn1mFgRJ6CQ7
Once again. I apologize for bumping.
Edit: 9/11/2021 10:47CDT, there is also a few I-169 shields (interstate shield design) on the ground level intersection of I-69E/US 77 with SH 550/I-169/FM 511.

[bwana39]

If they do sign it as I-169 only the first couple or so miles of the route would be eligible for signing as an Interstate. It's Interstate quality 4-lane divided from the I-69E interchange to the FM-1847 exit. After that it turns into a pair of frontage roads with a blank median. The toll road that follows is just a 2 lane road with a Jersey Barrier on the center line. They have a lot of work to do to bring the rest of that up to Interstate standards.

I apologize for Bumping. However, google maps has updated street view. SH 550 is also signed SH 169, no interstate shield.
https://goo.gl/maps/ZqYpumn1mFgRJ6CQ7
Once again. I apologize for bumping.
Edit: 9/11/2021 10:47CDT, there is also a few I-169 shields (interstate shield design) on the ground level intersection of I-69E/US 77 with SH 550/I-169/FM 511.

This is consistent with the current practice throughout Texas.  To make it an interstate is not consistent with the current Texas practice.

[Thegeet]

On a side note, additional construction is set to start for SH 550 next year. Currently, the road is a super 2 lanes. I kinda feel bad that they would need to take down some relatively young bridge structures if they were to simply widen the road by paving new lanes on the edge of the current lanes.

[bwana39]

On a side note, additional construction is set to start for SH 550 next year. Currently, the road is a super 2 lanes. I kinda feel bad that they would need to take down some relatively young bridge structures if they were to simply widen the road by paving new lanes on the edge of the current lanes.

Texas has a fairly large history of widening girder/ stringer deck bridges.  A couple of decades ago, there was extensive widening from 30' to 38' or 40' on most of the rural 2x 2 interstates throughout Texas.  The bridges can be widened. It WOULD be a pity if they are unable to be widened for whatever reason.

Even if they are widening by pasting a lane on each side (so to speak), they can and have split them off at the bridge sites and adding a separate bridge, then merging the tracks back together . 

[Thegeet]

On a side note, additional construction is set to start for SH 550 next year. Currently, the road is a super 2 lanes. I kinda feel bad that they would need to take down some relatively young bridge structures if they were to simply widen the road by paving new lanes on the edge of the current lanes.

Texas has a fairly large history of widening girder/ stringer deck bridges.  A couple of decades ago, there was extensive widening from 30' to 38' or 40' on most of the rural 2x 2 interstates throughout Texas.  The bridges can be widened. It WOULD be a pity if they are unable to be widened for whatever reason.

Even if they are widening by pasting a lane on each side (so to speak), they can and have split them off at the bridge sites and adding a separate bridge, then merging the tracks back together .

I knew they could create a second bridge, but I didn't know it was possible to widen an existing super 2 bridge. I assume that would involve more beams, drilling shafts, and relocation of concrete guards.

On a side note, I found that the SH 550 SE of the existing I-169 has a bridge for FM 511 that goes over SH 550. Would they need to remove the drilled shafts supporting the bridge? Because last time I checked, they are configured in a way that two lanes won't fit between any gap. Please excuse me if I missed something from your previous reply. Here's the bridge at FM 511. https://goo.gl/maps/BCcKc2qZSFP7pmCF9

[bwana39]

On a side note, additional construction is set to start for SH 550 next year. Currently, the road is a super 2 lanes. I kinda feel bad that they would need to take down some relatively young bridge structures if they were to simply widen the road by paving new lanes on the edge of the current lanes.

Texas has a fairly large history of widening girder/ stringer deck bridges.  A couple of decades ago, there was extensive widening from 30' to 38' or 40' on most of the rural 2x 2 interstates throughout Texas.  The bridges can be widened. It WOULD be a pity if they are unable to be widened for whatever reason.

Even if they are widening by pasting a lane on each side (so to speak), they can and have split them off at the bridge sites and adding a separate bridge, then merging the tracks back together .

I knew they could create a second bridge, but I didn't know it was possible to widen an existing super 2 bridge. I assume that would involve more beams, drilling shafts, and relocation of concrete guards.

On a side note, I found that the SH 550 SE of the existing I-169 has a bridge for FM 511 that goes over SH 550. Would they need to remove the drilled shafts supporting the bridge? Because last time I checked, they are configured in a way that two lanes won't fit between any gap. Please excuse me if I missed something from your previous reply. Here's the bridge at FM 511. https://goo.gl/maps/BCcKc2qZSFP7pmCF9

The overpasses are a totally different problem.  As to widening the two lane bridges to four, you have it generally right.

49Toll in Tyler (TX) built 2-lane overpasses over the tollway that clearly will not handle 4 lanes. Made no sense to me, but obviously they did cost less to build.

[Thegeet]

On a side note, additional construction is set to start for SH 550 next year. Currently, the road is a super 2 lanes. I kinda feel bad that they would need to take down some relatively young bridge structures if they were to simply widen the road by paving new lanes on the edge of the current lanes.

Texas has a fairly large history of widening girder/ stringer deck bridges.  A couple of decades ago, there was extensive widening from 30' to 38' or 40' on most of the rural 2x 2 interstates throughout Texas.  The bridges can be widened. It WOULD be a pity if they are unable to be widened for whatever reason.

Even if they are widening by pasting a lane on each side (so to speak), they can and have split them off at the bridge sites and adding a separate bridge, then merging the tracks back together .

I knew they could create a second bridge, but I didn't know it was possible to widen an existing super 2 bridge. I assume that would involve more beams, drilling shafts, and relocation of concrete guards.

On a side note, I found that the SH 550 SE of the existing I-169 has a bridge for FM 511 that goes over SH 550. Would they need to remove the drilled shafts supporting the bridge? Because last time I checked, they are configured in a way that two lanes won't fit between any gap. Please excuse me if I missed something from your previous reply. Here's the bridge at FM 511. https://goo.gl/maps/BCcKc2qZSFP7pmCF9

The overpasses are a totally different problem.  As to widening the two lane bridges to four, you have it generally right.

49Toll in Tyler (TX) built 2-lane overpasses over the tollway that clearly will not handle 4 lanes. Made no sense to me, but obviously they did cost less to build.

It will be interesting to see how the rest is handled. Also, I don't know why there aren't direct connectors from I-69E NB to I-169, and I-169 to I-69E SB.

Still, I see the official signing of I-169 as a win. Thanks Google maps for finally updating the Texas street view.
PS: They've also updated I-69W/US 59/Loop 20, US 77 (from FM 665 to I-37), and US 281. They've also added updated captures of US 59 in Victoria, South of Cleveland, and at Loop 224 in Nacogdoches.

[bassoon1986]

Sorry to bump, but I did not see any other more recent threads devoted to I-169. As I'm browsing Google Maps and street view, I've never seen the phenomenon where the interstate shield is signed on the frontage road as with I-169. Usually it's TX Toll on the mainlines and SR __ on the frontage roads. Street view shows TX Toll 550 and sometimes TX Toll 169 both on entrance ramps and I-169 with FM 511 on the frontage roads for a good distance leaving I-69E.

Is that how it will signed once it's completed?

[Bobby5280]

I-169 is a work in progress. For now it's only signed as I-169 at exits for Old Alice Road and Paredes Line Road. East of that point the road drops below Interstate quality. I don't think the road is going to be fully signed as I-169 until it is properly upgraded down to the TX-48 intersection, maybe even with a directional Y interchange built there.

[bwana39]

Sorry to bump, but I did not see any other more recent threads devoted to I-169. As I'm browsing Google Maps and street view, I've never seen the phenomenon where the interstate shield is signed on the frontage road as with I-169. Usually it's TX Toll on the mainlines and SR __ on the frontage roads. Street view shows TX Toll 550 and sometimes TX Toll 169 both on entrance ramps and I-169 with FM 511 on the frontage roads for a good distance leaving I-69E.

Is that how it will signed once it's completed?

Per Texas SOB, the toll road main lanes are NEVER designated as the hwy number Interstate or otherwise.  This road SHOULD either be an interstate or a toll road. I guess if the frontages are controlled access, that would work if not, this should not even be considered as an Interstate.

[The Ghostbuster]

Does anyone know if Interstate 169's/TX 550's exits will eventually be numbered?

[bwana39]

Other than 169 and 369, are there any other x-69 three-digit Interstate routes proposed for Texas?

Nope.

Several years ago when the path of I-69 through Houston metro hadn't been finalized, it was thought that the number I-669 would be applied to whatever alignment (at that time the choices were Loop 99 and the existing US 59 through-town route) was not selected (at least according for the Alliance for I-69 Texas, the Houston-based group spearheading the I-69 effort down there); but since US 59 was eventually selected, any impetus for an Interstate-signed bypass seems to have dissipated.  However, if the downtown realignment effort involving both I-69 and I-45 is indeed implemented -- with the inevitable congestion stemming from its construction -- there might be a reactive "push" to sign a bypass route (I would hardly think that anyone would think of adding any more load to I-610 as an interim solution!) as a through-traffic alternative; this might revive the "I-669" concept for at least the west and north quadrants of that loop system.   

Whether it is numbered as Interstate 669 or I-4W, or Toll-99 or a name like Warren Moon Toll Road, it will still be there. Mapping software will still consider it. Currently as a miss downtown route, it is about 15 miles farther and 10 minutes longer to use loop 99 ( at faster speeds). Not that terrible, but it does add significant tolls.

using I-610 is only 3 or four miles longer than only using the through downtown I-69 route and has no tolls. Depending on the time of day, It can be faster. This route does not have tolls either.

Using Beltway 8 is almost exact time and mileage added using I-610. It adds tolls.

Back to LP-99Toll.  The only advantage as a downtown bypass is that at least now, there are rarely any traffic jams regardless of the time of day on LP-99. BW-8 and I-610 can have as much traffic and significant gridlock especially between US-59 (on the northeast side) to I-10 as going through downtown on I-69.

You guys wanting everything to be an interstate....

[Bobby5280]

I can't recall ever seeing anything suggested that the Grand Parkway would be dubbed "I-669." If Texas toll road authorities (and their partners) are largely paying for a toll road's construction they appear extremely hesitant to apply an Interstate number to the finished product. Houston, DFW and Austin have numerous toll roads that could have been signed as Interstate highways long ago, but that has never happened. Unless there is some major philosophical change in the Texas state government I wouldn't expect Interstate signs to appear on the Grand Parkway any time soon, if ever.

The only potential possibility I see for the Grand Parkway getting any Interstate signage is if US-290 between Austin and Houston was fully developed into an Interstate corridor, such as a second I-12. That could be carried over the North portion of the Grand Parkway and then even on to Beaumont. Given Texas' history it might be just as likely the corridor would get upgraded to Interstate quality but with current designations, such as US-290, staying put.

[The Ghostbuster]

The Grand Parkway doesn't need an Interstate designation. Leave it TX 99.