Street Name Signs/Blades

[Kacie Jane]

WSDOT has, especially through the 90s assigned new routes over existing roadways, so it not being a state highway, because they didn't build it is specious at best.

I said nothing about them not building it.  But nothing I'm reading regarding the loop implies a change of maintenance regarding the roads.  So it's not a state highway, they're still county and locally maintained roads, but the county, city, and WSDOT have agreed to provide better signage along those roads.

[mjb2002]

I'm curious about the prevailing opinion in regards to Street Blades.  More specifically what the opinions are regarding logos on the signs and what your preferred size would be for your traditional street blade on a stop sign?


My city is getting close to needing to replace their street blades, and I want to ensure that whatever happens, they are readable, and won't end up as the worst signs.

Here goes.

FHWA preferred. Arial and Helvetica are the only two alternative fonts.

Preferred size: minimum 18 inches blank, with 12 inch uppercase letters, 9 inch lowercase letters if the speed limit is 45 or higher.  Otherwise: 12 inch blank, with 6 inch uppercase letters, 4.5 inch lowercase letters.

Color: blue with white lettering or midnight green with white lettering.  Although you can use any shade of blue or brown for the signs.  If using green, the shade of green must be below 128 (hexadecimal of 80 or less).  White with black lettering also acceptable.  If using white-on-black, the blank must be at the highest rgb value: 255, 255, 255; and the lettering must be at the lowest rgb value: 0,0,0.

[Zeffy]

If you want my opinion on it...

Fonts: FHWA, or mixed case Clearview, or any legible font that doesn't look extremely ugly. (Arialveticaverstesk if they can manage for it to look nice) If using FHWA fonts, Series C or D is acceptable.

Colors: Green preferred, but blue, brown, white are acceptable*. Text color should be white on everything but a white sign, in which case it should be black.

Letter Size: If the road has a decently high speed limit, I would want 10in letters. Otherwise, 6-8in. letters will work. The designation of the road (I.E. Road, Avenue, Drive, Lane, etc.) can either be in mixed case or all-caps (unless it's Clearview in which case it better be mixed case) and can either be a subscript or it can be the same size as the other parts of the text.

Other: If the sign contains a route shield (common in New Jersey), then the route shield must conform to the standards set by the MUTCD or the State's DOT. City / Boro logos should be omitted from the signs.

Lastly, some examples of what I believe is acceptable:



* This does not include usage of Clearview. If using Clearview, the only acceptable color is green.

Remember, this is my opinion, so if you don't like what I put here, well, that's your own opinion. 

[mjb2002]

If you want my opinion on it...

Fonts: FHWA, or mixed case Clearview, or any legible font that doesn't look extremely ugly. (Arialveticaverstesk if they can manage for it to look nice) If using FHWA fonts, Series C or D is acceptable.

Colors: Green preferred, but blue, brown, white are acceptable*. Text color should be white on everything but a white sign, in which case it should be black.

Letter Size: If the road has a decently high speed limit, I would want 10in letters. Otherwise, 6-8in. letters will work. The designation of the road (I.E. Road, Avenue, Drive, Lane, etc.) can either be in mixed case or all-caps (unless it's Clearview in which case it better be mixed case) and can either be a subscript or it can be the same size as the other parts of the text.

Other: If the sign contains a route shield (common in New Jersey), then the route shield must conform to the standards set by the MUTCD or the State's DOT. City / Boro logos should be omitted from the signs.

Lastly, some examples of what I believe is acceptable:



* This does not include usage of Clearview. If using Clearview, the only acceptable color is green.

Remember, this is my opinion, so if you don't like what I put here, well, that's your own opinion. 

The all caps Street Name signs will have to be limited to low-speed highways. That is not an opinion. That's a fact mentioned in the MUTCD. All-caps can no longer be used on Street Name signs if the speed limit on the highways and streets are 30 mph or higher.

[roadfro]

^ All-caps can no longer be used on street name signs, period--there is no option for all caps at lower speeds. That is a fact from the MUTCD (Sec 2D.43 p03-Standard).

And "Arialveticaverstesk" shouldn't be on signs either...let's stick to FHWA fonts, or Clearview where approved and designed appropriately.

[TEG24601]

If using Clearview, the only acceptable color is green.

Thanks for the diagram and example.  Is there a specific reason that Clearview couldn't be on a Blue sign (the existing signs are Blue to differentiate them from the county on the roads/streets that have different jurisdictions on different sides)?  I'm actually partial to Clearview, having been exposed to it a lot whilst living in Michigan, but the FHWA fonts look awesome as well.  I've always found the current signs to be difficult to read, especially in the inclement weather we get so often in Washington.


Just for reference, there is only one road in the city over 25MPH, and it has no intersecting roads until it is out of the city.


Would there be any real downside to larger signs and fonts, or would would they look out of scale?

[Anthony_JK]

* This does not include usage of Clearview. If using Clearview, the only acceptable color is green.

Funny, but doesn't Baton Rouge use blue blades w/ Clearview for their most recent street sign update?? And...doesn't NOLA also use blue blades w/ Clearview, too?

Here in Opelousas, we still have the basic black on reflective white ALL CAPS, with some of the blades mixed with street numbers and some not so much. The parish roads still use white-on-green ALL CAPS as well. Probably the usual laziness mixed with the popular "Why fix what we don't think is broken" mentality.

[Zeffy]

I wouldn't allow Clearview on a blue street sign because it's not allowed on normal blue service signs to begin with.

^ All-caps can no longer be used on street name signs, period--there is no option for all caps at lower speeds. That is a fact from the MUTCD (Sec 2D.43 p03-Standard).

And "Arialveticaverstesk" shouldn't be on signs either...let's stick to FHWA fonts, or Clearview where approved and designed appropriately.

I didn't know that the MUTCD forbid all-caps on street name signs. Guess that's why my Township is replacing all of their all-caps street signs to mixed case Clearview signs. As for the Arialveticaverstesk, I've actually seen some signs where they are fully legible at the speed for the roadway - which is < 35MPH. Now anything higher should definitely use the FHWA fonts. I think that provided the sign is legible from a distance and at the posted speed of the roadway, the font should not matter. Besides, I don't think the FHWA has ever done a study on the legibility of Arial / Helvetica on road signs (which I'm guessing is not good).

[NE2]

I wouldn't allow Clearview on a blue street sign because it's not allowed on normal blue service signs to begin with.

Duh, blue service signs are all-caps.

[jakeroot]

I think my favorite street blades are in British Columbia, this one in West Vancouver:



I just prefer blue over green, really just a personal preference. I also tend to favor Clearview on signs, but this sign was installed before clearview was rolled out widely across BC, back when they used some custom font on their signs, perhaps "Arialveticaverstesk"?

[mjb2002]

^ All-caps can no longer be used on street name signs, period--there is no option for all caps at lower speeds. That is a fact from the MUTCD (Sec 2D.43 p03-Standard).

And "Arialveticaverstesk" shouldn't be on signs either...let's stick to FHWA fonts, or Clearview where approved and designed appropriately.

They allow for an all-caps option on historic highways with a speed limit of 25 or lower. That change was added in 2012.

If FHWA is to be the sole font for street name signs, then only Series D, E or E(M) should be used.

[Zeffy]

If FHWA is to be the sole font for street name signs, then only Series D, E or E(M) should be used.

Why not C? I think C looks fine on street signs. I don't think EM should really be used on those, but E is fine.

[myosh_tino]

I think my favorite street blades are in British Columbia, this one in West Vancouver:

image clipped

I just prefer blue over green, really just a personal preference. I also tend to favor Clearview on signs, but this sign was installed before clearview was rolled out widely across BC, back when they used some custom font on their signs, perhaps "Arialveticaverstesk"?

I also like blue over green street blades.  I also don't mind if the blades use a typeface other than FHWA or Clearview.  My city's street blades look like this...



... and street blades on traffic signal mast arms look like this...



The typeface used for both signs is Bookman.

Prior to this change over which happened in the late 90's, no signs were mounted on mast arms and the street blades used all caps Series C on a borderless blue blade.

[Roadgeek Adam]

Some of the stuff I've seen recently:

Clifton, New Jersey (Passaic 621/Valley Road - not on my list of likeable ones.)


Stillwater, New York (NY 423 at Blizzard Road - yuck)


Essex Fells, New Jersey (Park Lane at Roseland Avenue (CR 527) - personally I've never been a fan of these, but I know others who do.)


Verona has the strange VERONA|Bloomfield Avenue. They are now converting to Mixed case.

[mjb2002]

Some of the stuff I've seen recently:

Clifton, New Jersey (Passaic 621/Valley Road - not on my list of likeable ones.)


Stillwater, New York (NY 423 at Blizzard Road - yuck)


Essex Fells, New Jersey (Park Lane at Roseland Avenue (CR 527) - personally I've never been a fan of these, but I know others who do.)


Verona has the strange VERONA|Bloomfield Avenue. They are now converting to Mixed case.

No matter what, that Stillwater, N.Y. sign is total yuck. One, just like Anderson and Florence counties here in South Carolina, they use two signpoles instead of one for street name sign. I am not in favor at all of using more than one signpole per street name sign.

Two, the colors.

[roadfro]

^ All-caps can no longer be used on street name signs, period--there is no option for all caps at lower speeds. That is a fact from the MUTCD (Sec 2D.43 p03-Standard).

And "Arialveticaverstesk" shouldn't be on signs either...let's stick to FHWA fonts, or Clearview where approved and designed appropriately.

They allow for an all-caps option on historic highways with a speed limit of 25 or lower. That change was added in 2012.

That's not really an "all-caps option" though. 2D.43 p24 is an Option statement that reads:
On lower speed roadways, historic street name signs within locally identified historic districts that are consistent with the criteria contained in 36 CFR 60.4 for such structures and districts may be used without complying with the provisions of Paragraphs 3, 4, 6, 9, 12 through 14, and 18 through 20 of this section.

The language used in the final rule of the Federal Register document (which governs the change to the MUTCD that added the above statement) seems to indicate that this is meant to apply to existing, non-conforming signs. The explanation even states "If
a community decides to use the new OPTION to retain existing historic Street Name signs within a historic district...", which seems to validate this view.

This option allows municipalities to exempt historic signs from the all-caps, size, color, font, etc. requirements for street name signs. 36 CFR 60.4 covers the criteria for adding historic districts to the National Register of Historic Places. So the change was meant to allow communities to keep 'historic' street name signs within established historic districts (or areas meeting the requirements of such a district if not recognized), in order to maintain the historic character of the neighborhood. The final rule also strongly suggests that such signs should still be useable for navigation if retained, going so far to suggest that these should be externally lit at night...

[brownpelican]

Funny, but doesn't Baton Rouge use blue blades w/ Clearview for their most recent street sign update?? And...doesn't NOLA also use blue blades w/ Clearview, too?

I don't know about New Orleans, but Baton Rouge does use Clearview on some of the newest illuminated signs...mainly along Airline and on the south side of town.

[hm insulators]

So San Dimas, California will have to replace their street blades (which use an "Old West"-style font) with MUTCD-compliant ones at some point?

It'll probably be the same with Redondo Beach, CA with the little sailboats on their street signs.

[JoePCool14]

Northbrook, IL:
OLD:


NEW:


One town near me use Arial BOLD for theirs not to mention, the main road's sign isn't as tall as the minor road's sign!

[CANALLER]

M.J.B.:  N.Y.S. specs require all signs wider than 3O" to have 2 posts.  And although designers often forget (or don't know), 4 panels are required for each assembly.  Their total area far exceeds the rated capacity for 1 post.  Signs, reference markers, guard rail and such in the Catskills and Adirondacks have been brown and yellow for decades, so although the colors may appear strange to you, they're very much appropriate for their setting.

Joe:  Monroe County has also taken the approach of having different heighth street signs.  They are allowed, as the approach speed at a stop sign is technically -O-, but they look just like what they are: cheap short-cuts.