Will smartphone ownership become a de facto requirement?

[kphoger]

Some things were still in my grandfather's name

My grandmother left a lot of things in her husband's name after he passed.  Partly because she didn't want to advertise to the world that she was a woman who lived alone, partly because she used to get a kick out of telling telemarketers "he's dead" when they'd call and ask to speak with him.

In my grandparents' case, it was that my grandfather was the one who handled all the finances, so my grandmother didn't know anything.  When he died, she just left everything as it was, to the extent she could.

[SectorZ]

When my dad died, my mom tried to get Sprint to change the principal name on the account. Sprint insisted that he be there (which was impossible, since he was dead), so my mom switched from Sprint to Cingular. This was clearly not planned in advance. I don't believe there was a contract at this time, but if there was one, it would have been a larger problem.

It's amazing how some of the seemingly simplest things to do after someone dies can end up being most difficult.  When my grandmother died, my mom was the executor.  Of everything she had to do, the biggest ordeal was canceling my grandma's JC Penney card.

Ditto my mom when my dad died dealing with Comcast. When the goober on the phone asked to speak with him after already being told he was dead. my mother offered to dig him up so they could speak to him.

Nothing else was remotely so difficult despite being much more important.

[kalvado]

*  No-one looks out for the consumer in terms of battery life on remanufactured phones.  If you are forced to accept one as a result of a failed battery replacement, expect battery life to be just as bad as on the old phone.

Looks like battery technology is becoming better in terms of aging. It will be a while before that is noticeable on 5+ year old devices, though.

[abefroman329]

Until yesterday, there were two ways to enter my apartment building:

(1) Key fob
(2) A special smartphone app called ButterflyMX that can also be used to buzz visitors into the building

Well, the management company got rid of (1) as an option yesterday.  Apparently, if you live here, and you don't own a smartphone, you can just go commit a physical impossibility.

Oh, and if you're wondering if the new system broke already: Why yes, yes it did.

Stupid management decision.  If I rented there, I'd be asking my local tenant's rights organization if my apartment's management could really require me to buy an expensive smart phone in order to have access to my apartment.

I'm really surprised this isn't against the local landlord-tenant ordinances, given how renter-friendly they are.

[kalvado]

Until yesterday, there were two ways to enter my apartment building:

(1) Key fob
(2) A special smartphone app called ButterflyMX that can also be used to buzz visitors into the building

Well, the management company got rid of (1) as an option yesterday.  Apparently, if you live here, and you don't own a smartphone, you can just go commit a physical impossibility.

Oh, and if you're wondering if the new system broke already: Why yes, yes it did.

Stupid management decision.  If I rented there, I'd be asking my local tenant's rights organization if my apartment's management could really require me to buy an expensive smart phone in order to have access to my apartment.

I'm really surprised this isn't against the local landlord-tenant ordinances, given how renter-friendly they are.

Most likely once someone complains, management would need to find some other option other than the app.
If I had a penny each time someone is doing things without thinking of an outcome.... 
Vendor site shows pin and QR code as 2 other access options

[JayhawkCO]

A matter of personal choice.
Top line iPhone, latest Galaxy S, BMW, Tesla, Mercedes is top of the line option.
More modest Galaxy A5x, Moto, maybe Pixel,  Subaru, Honda is step below but pretty functional. There is reduced competition in this group of phones as US doesn't like Xiaomi, Huawei or OnePlus.
Galaxy A2x or A1x, infiniti, Ford are closer to bottom of the barrel.
 
I can understand not going for last option if possible, but using top of the line is definitely an indication of some disposable income.

Sure, but as I said before, when the "legacy" providers have these free upgrade plans, the $300 I spent on a top of the line phone 7-8 years ago has turned all the way into a $1,200 phone for free. I've never paid more than $300 for a phone, and now I own one worth 4x that. The "resale value" matters. In the case of phones, the resale value seems to be appreciating.

[J N Winkler]

*  No-one looks out for the consumer in terms of battery life on remanufactured phones.  If you are forced to accept one as a result of a failed battery replacement, expect battery life to be just as bad as on the old phone.

Looks like battery technology is becoming better in terms of aging. It will be a while before that is noticeable on 5+ year old devices, though.

Newer phones are indeed smarter about structuring charging cycles in a way that maximizes usable battery capacity over the life of the phone.  However, in the case of remanufactured phones, the issue is more that nobody checks that fresh batteries are installed as part of the reconditioning process.  It's telling that the cost of a remanufactured six-year-old phone is only slightly higher than that of a brand-new battery for the same model of phone.

[mgk920]

Until yesterday, there were two ways to enter my apartment building:

(1) Key fob
(2) A special smartphone app called ButterflyMX that can also be used to buzz visitors into the building

Well, the management company got rid of (1) as an option yesterday.  Apparently, if you live here, and you don't own a smartphone, you can just go commit a physical impossibility.

Oh, and if you're wondering if the new system broke already: Why yes, yes it did.

Stupid management decision.  If I rented there, I'd be asking my local tenant's rights organization if my apartment's management could really require me to buy an expensive smart phone in order to have access to my apartment.

I'm really surprised this isn't against the local landlord-tenant ordinances, given how renter-friendly they are.

Most likely once someone complains, management would need to find some other option other than the app.
If I had a penny each time someone is doing things without thinking of an outcome.... 
Vendor site shows pin and QR code as 2 other access options

My sense is that around here, the state fire codes require that emergency response crews have an easy way to get in, the usual way is with metal door keys that are kept in a 'Knox box' by the main entrance doors.  Post Office letter carriers also use similar key boxes to be able to get in and do their things.

Mike

[kalvado]

Until yesterday, there were two ways to enter my apartment building:

(1) Key fob
(2) A special smartphone app called ButterflyMX that can also be used to buzz visitors into the building

Well, the management company got rid of (1) as an option yesterday.  Apparently, if you live here, and you don't own a smartphone, you can just go commit a physical impossibility.

Oh, and if you're wondering if the new system broke already: Why yes, yes it did.

Stupid management decision.  If I rented there, I'd be asking my local tenant's rights organization if my apartment's management could really require me to buy an expensive smart phone in order to have access to my apartment.

I'm really surprised this isn't against the local landlord-tenant ordinances, given how renter-friendly they are.

Most likely once someone complains, management would need to find some other option other than the app.
If I had a penny each time someone is doing things without thinking of an outcome.... 
Vendor site shows pin and QR code as 2 other access options

My sense is that around here, the state fire codes require that emergency response crews have an easy way to get in, the usual way is with metal door keys that are kept in a 'Knox box' by the main entrance doors.  Post Office letter carriers also use similar key boxes to be able to get in and do their things.

Mike

In theory, they could get QR code prints in that box to scan on camera. But the follow-up question is - what would happen if there is no power? Would the door just unlock (security issue) or nobody can get in any more? UPS may only be part of the answer, not the ultimate one.

[kphoger]

So, if your phone dies or you lose it...  you just can't get into your home?

[kalvado]

So, if your phone dies or you lose it...  you just can't get into your home?

How is that different from loosing or damaging a metal key or plastic card?

[ZLoth]

When my dad died, my mom tried to get Sprint to change the principal name on the account. Sprint insisted that he be there (which was impossible, since he was dead), so my mom switched from Sprint to Cingular. This was clearly not planned in advance. I don't believe there was a contract at this time, but if there was one, it would have been a larger problem.

It's amazing how some of the seemingly simplest things to do after someone dies can end up being most difficult.  When my grandmother died, my mom was the executor.  Of everything she had to do, the biggest ordeal was canceling my grandma's JC Penney card.

Ditto my mom when my dad died dealing with Comcast. When the goober on the phone asked to speak with him after already being told he was dead. my mother offered to dig him up so they could speak to him.

Nothing else was remotely so difficult despite being much more important.

Unfortunately, policy and procedures are in place to prevent fraud and generally BLEEP up someone's life. Hell hath no fury like someone who can't access their Internet or watch their favorite television shows.

[kphoger]

So, if your phone dies or you lose it...  you just can't get into your home?

How is that different from loosing or damaging a metal key or plastic card?

1.  Metal or plastic keys don't require a paid subscription.  Or can you use the app without a cellular plan?

2.  Getting a new phone often takes longer and is more expensive than getting a replacement metal or plastic key.

3.  If you lose your metal or plastic key, it's still possible to buzz your visitor in.  But, re-reading the post, I now see it didn't actually say that option was being removed from the building.

[JayhawkCO]

2.  Getting a new phone often takes longer and is more expensive than getting a replacement metal or plastic key.

When I bought my Jeep, it only came with one key, and I wanted another. It took 3 weeks to get the key shipped to me and get it programmed. When I upgraded my phone, I filled out the form online and picked it up in store a few hours later.

[kalvado]

So, if your phone dies or you lose it...  you just can't get into your home?

How is that different from loosing or damaging a metal key or plastic card?

1.  Metal or plastic keys don't require a paid subscription.  Or can you use the app without a cellular plan?

2.  Getting a new phone often takes longer and is more expensive than getting a replacement metal or plastic key.

3.  If you lose your metal or plastic key, it's still possible to buzz your visitor in.  But, re-reading the post, I now see it didn't actually say that option was being removed from the building.

1. apartment rental (or HOA membership for condo) is still a paid subscription. Having phone number for anything, from delivery to doctor's callback, was always a paid subscription as well. Nothing really free in this world - but despite high cost of living, it is still popular. 
3. True, but likely a secondary problem for most people

[kphoger]

2.  Getting a new phone often takes longer and is more expensive than getting a replacement metal or plastic key.

When I bought my Jeep, it only came with one key, and I wanted another. It took 3 weeks to get the key shipped to me and get it programmed. When I upgraded my phone, I filled out the form online and picked it up in store a few hours later.

Oh, I wasn't considering that the metal key would have a chip embedded.  I was thinking of the sort that building management could simply copy at the local hardware store.

[hbelkins]

And now old-style 'flip' phones are becoming popular again with the younger crowd, an older friend of mine told me a few days ago that his Android phone just died and that he'll likely be going with a flip phone because he cannot justify the $1.4K dost of a replacement android phone.  I'm also wondering how this will mesh with major sports stadia that have gone to all-smartphone based game ticketing.

Mike

What? I can get a very good iPhone SE 2nd Generation phone off eBay for around $150. Why would anyone need a phone that costs $1,400?

[kphoger]

1. apartment rental (or HOA membership for condo) is still a paid subscription. Having phone number for anything, from delivery to doctor's callback, was always a paid subscription as well. Nothing really free in this world - but despite high cost of living, it is still popular. 

It's the difference between having an apartment lease and a cellular subscription and having only an apartment lease.  1+1 is still more than 1+0.

For what it's worth...  At my work, field techs have metal security keys for various things, which it's Not Very Cool to lose.  To discourage them losing their keys, we charge them back $50 for a lost key.  Not exactly a subscription, but it sure seems to work pretty well.

[mgk920]

Well, barring all of that, fire or EMT crews can do a forced entry, although it will likely be a bit time consuming (a critically short commodity in that case) and very expensive for the landlord/insurance company to fix afterwards.

Mike

[kalvado]

1. apartment rental (or HOA membership for condo) is still a paid subscription. Having phone number for anything, from delivery to doctor's callback, was always a paid subscription as well. Nothing really free in this world - but despite high cost of living, it is still popular. 

It's the difference between having an apartment lease and a cellular subscription and having only an apartment lease.  1+1 is still more than 1+0.

For what it's worth...  At my work, field techs have metal security keys for various things, which it's Not Very Cool to lose.  To discourage them losing their keys, we charge them back $50 for a lost key.  Not exactly a subscription, but it sure seems to work pretty well.

Returning to original one.. Looks like there are many cases where smartphone ownership is assumed as a given.
Somewhat reminds me of the story from 90s when a guy tried to apply for janitor job at Microsoft and couldn't do that without e-mail address....

[kkt]

So, if your phone dies or you lose it...  you just can't get into your home?

How is that different from loosing or damaging a metal key or plastic card?

Metal keys are attached to my key ring which lives in my pocket.  Phones don't fit in a pocket very well.

[1995hoo]

So, if your phone dies or you lose it...  you just can't get into your home?

How is that different from loosing or damaging a metal key or plastic card?

Metal keys are attached to my key ring which lives in my pocket.  Phones don't fit in a pocket very well.

I almost always stick my iPhone X in a pocket (usually a rear pants pocket or an inside pocket on a jacket; less often a shirt's front pocket). Fits just fine.

[kalvado]

So, if your phone dies or you lose it...  you just can't get into your home?

How is that different from loosing or damaging a metal key or plastic card?

Metal keys are attached to my key ring which lives in my pocket.  Phones don't fit in a pocket very well.

Between metal keys on the ring, wallet with work keycard, and smartphone, I certainly don't have a fool-proof option as I have experience with forgetting/misplacing either option.
Garage opener in a car is a bit safer, but not completely fail safe as once upon a time I managed to loose my car...     

[JayhawkCO]

And now old-style 'flip' phones are becoming popular again with the younger crowd, an older friend of mine told me a few days ago that his Android phone just died and that he'll likely be going with a flip phone because he cannot justify the $1.4K dost of a replacement android phone.  I'm also wondering how this will mesh with major sports stadia that have gone to all-smartphone based game ticketing.

Mike

What? I can get a very good iPhone SE 2nd Generation phone off eBay for around $150. Why would anyone need a phone that costs $1,400?

I don't need mine per se, but here's some reasons I like having the phone I do:

1) I use it a lot for work and having it be very fast makes me more efficient
2) I have a 16-month-old, so being able to take "DSLR quality" photos with something in my pocket is important to me
3) I travel out of the country a lot, and being able to use an eSim on my phone will save me money and headaches getting local SIMs
4) The sound quality of the speakers is better than a cheap phone, which is nice when watching shows with my kiddo
5) I am a tall dude with big hands, and having a larger phone just feels more natural in my hands. Cheaper phones don't have the plus sizes
6) I use my phone as a GPS when I'm camping/backpacking, and having lots of storage for online maps is necessary

I'm sure I'll think of something else and edit this.

[kphoger]

I'm sure I'll think of something else and edit this.

Depending on one's carrier, GSM capability can be a deciding factor for international travel.  I know it has been for me.  Fortunately, I've always been able to find affordable options, even through Verizon.