Wilshire Boulevard in MacArthur Park

[Plutonic Panda]

Another Issaac Newton idea from our wonderful leaders at the LADOT to completely close vehicle traffic through the park. What are your thoughts?

https://www.msn.com/en-us/travel/news/it-s-bold-l-a-moves-to-close-wilshire-boulevard-through-macarthur-park/ar-BB1pJl7g?ocid=msedgntp&pc=DCTS&cvid=ecbb8f7ed3684437adbfe2ce9a1aa74e&ei=23#comments

[Plutonic Panda]

Another article: https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/la-s-2-5-million-plan-to-close-road-in-macarthur-park-raises-local-eyebrows/ar-BB1pKeNY?ocid=BingNewsSearch&cvid=64568674214e44bbbb68925e4b7e61ff&ei=15

[LilianaUwU]

Utterly stupid and pointless.

[Rothman]

Somebody left a cake out in the rain.

[Max Rockatansky]

I'm aware that Wilshire used to end at the park until 1934.  While I'm indifferent to whether or not Wilshire is closed to traffic I don't really get how it is "bold."  Getting rid of the road doesn't magically fix the problems the park has.

I mostly think of MacAuthur Park (and visited it) in relation to the scenes it featured in Falling Down.

[pderocco]

Tunnel.

[Max Rockatansky]

A tunnel isn't going to cost $2,500,000.

[mrsman]

From a crime and safety perspective, simply closing Wilshire isn't going to do much.  This is a dangerous neighborhood in an increasingly dangerous city.  There are a lot of issues beyond the scope of traffic that do need to be addressed first to improve the situation.

From a traffic perspective, I don't believe that this is going to be the disaster that some people upthread portend. As it is, Wilshire already ends at Grand, so it is really only accessible to about half of the Downtown area.  Traffic on Wilshire will have to turn on Figueroa, Flower, Hope, or Grand to reach 4th, 6th, 7th or 9th.  If they have to turn off Wilshire anyway, they might as well do so at Park View to reach either 6th or 7th.

Fortunately, Park View is quite wide.  If the diagonal parking were replaced with parallel parking, the street could be two lanes of traffic in each direction.  Two lanes of Wilshire turning left onto two lanes of Park View and then two lanes of 6th into Downtown.  (Right lane right turn only, left lane left or right).  One lane of Wilshire turning right onto Park View and at 7th, the left lane will turn left and the right lane will turn right.

Once Wilshire is broken, the section between Grand and Alvarado will naturally be far less busy so there would be fewer traffic problems there.  Once people have turned onto 6th or 7th via Park View, there is little reason that they would head back to Wilshire, unless their destination were on that 1.5 mile section of street.  I can see a need for a spot widening of Alvarado, so that cars can make a left onto 6th.

Will this impact traffic?  Yes.  Will it be absolutely horrendous?  Given L.A.'s numerous other problems, this is workable.

[bing101]

Make the city festive apparently. But there's more to this that we cannot see yet.

[Plutonic Panda]

What about narrowing the street by removing the street parking, And then depressing the Road a little bit and placing a part cap over it? I mean houston made tunnels. Why can't LA do it

[SeriesE]

What about narrowing the street by removing the street parking, And then depressing the Road a little bit and placing a part cap over it? I mean houston made tunnels. Why can't LA do it

There are train tunnels underneath Wilshire on the west side of the park, so lowering the road might not be an option

[Road Hog]

Somebody left a cake out in the rain.

That was inevitable.

[Rothman]

Somebody left a cake out in the rain.

That was inevitable.

I was going to eat that cake, but now it's all wet and I don't think I want any.

[NWI_Irish96]

Somebody left a cake out in the rain.

Jurassic Park is frightening in the dark
All the dinosaurs are running wild
Someone shut the fence off in the rain

[cahwyguy]

I wanted to wait until all the gnashing and wailing was done before commenting.

Think about Wilshire at this point. It isn't a major thoroughfare. If you want to cross the city, you're either on the Santa Monica Freeway or Olympic (which is MUCH faster). The local users are primarily transit users. The city wants to encourage people to use transit, and one way to do that is to make driving less attractive. Thus, this proposal.

If I were doing it, I'd make one little mod: Two BUS ONLY BRT lanes through the park. No cars. This makes transit even more attractive, and serves the resident population that uses the buses better.

[Plutonic Panda]

Lots of people drive through the stretch. I'm one of them. 6th, 3rd, 7th and James Wood can all get backed up. This kind of mentality of oh it's just this one section it's not a big deal will just lead to more of this nonsense. They've talked about closing Hollywood between orange and highland before. It's just one stretch. There alternatives like Franklin, Hawthorn, and Sunset.

[cahwyguy]

There are alternatives, and people do adapt.

[Plutonic Panda]

There are alternatives, and people do adapt.

That doesn't mean it has to be closed and to me that's not a valid reason. This is just part of a crusade to eliminate as much car infrastructure as possible. This has nothing to do with reconnecting a park that's already heretically by a tunnel as is.

There's also other alternatives to increase connectivity, then just closing this road that I use a lot and so do a lot of other people.

[cahwyguy]

That doesn't mean it has to be closed and to me that's not a valid reason. This is just part of a crusade to eliminate as much car infrastructure as possible. This has nothing to do with reconnecting a park that's already heretically by a tunnel as is.

"already heretically by a tunnel" What does that even mean?

First and foremost, it's not all about you, and your potential inconvenience. Often, from your posts, you make it seem that way. It's about the specific community in that area; the area bisected by the park. Quoting from the original article: "The $2.5-million effort in MacArthur Park is mostly covered by a federal grant. It's part of a larger campaign to redress the harm caused by building roads that fractured communities, often cutting through low-income or already segregated areas."

Wilshire did not originally go through the park -- read the Kevin Roderick book. So the issue is how to make that community better. THat's a community that tends to be a park desert, other than MacArthur. So increasing the greenbelt does make life better for that neighborhood.

I can cite numerous examples of highway projects that have divided or destroyed low income neighborhoods, all for the convenience of the traveler (often who is higher income). Hollenbeck Park was hurt by the construction of I-5, Route 60, and I-10 in that area. West Adams by the I-10. Barrio Logan in San Diego. The impacts on Oakland from I-980. I just found an article on the impacts on the Asian American community from the western half of the Stockton Crosstown Freeway.

So it's not all about you, unless you are living on the edge of the park. Commuting through the area? There are other routes.

There's also other alternatives to increase connectivity, then just closing this road that I use a lot and so do a lot of other people.

Again, "I use a lot". The concern is the impact on the neighborhood.

But, if you don't like it, it is in the early planning stages. From the article: "City leaders announced the first step Tuesday toward eliminating vehicles on a less than half-mile stretch of Wilshire Boulevard bisecting MacArthur Park. Over the coming year, planners will seek community input, draft environmental documents and test closures in a bid to permanently shut down that portion of road."

Provide that community input. They are legally required to address it in the DEIR.

[Max Rockatansky]

So this is a problem mostly because you use Wilshire through the park? 

[FredAkbar]

Maybe they'll consider just closing it to traffic on weekends or other off-peak times. That's what SF did with JFK Drive through Golden Gate Park (though they later closed it 24/7 permanently, post-COVID). Downside is you still have to maintain the road as opposed to replacing it, but that can be a good thing: people can use the hard, maintained surface for walking, biking, rollerskating, etc.

[Plutonic Panda]

So this is a problem mostly because you use Wilshire through the park? 

It's like you guys are not even bothering to read what I post. I clearly said I use Wilshire Park as well to go and walk around.

[Max Rockatansky]

And how does the road being closed to traffic affect your ability to walk around the park?

[Plutonic Panda]

So this is a problem mostly because you use Wilshire through the park? 

OK, I went back and reread my post. I wasn't clear enough. I actually do use this park. This park, Echo Park, Griffith, Runyon, and The recently redone Los Angeles State Park are parks that I frequent. But that doesn't mean anything.

This park is already connected by a tunnel. I don't know why that is unclear to that other guy who's asking what do I mean by that? I think it's fairly obvious what that means.

And a big reason why I want Wilshire to remain open because I do use it a lot. I'm not the only one either. How often do you visit MacArthur Park? Because I'll be the first to tell you if you haven't been filled in, Removing Wilshire Boulevard to the park, won't even begin to scratch the surface of the problems that place is plagued by.

In fact, if anything, I think you could make the case, the park would be safer by keeping the road open so more people are going through it but removing street parking so the park is more visible. Now that I would support. When I go to MacArthur Park, I don't even park my car there because that is the only place other than San Francisco where I've had my car broken into multiple times. I take the red line to the MacArthur Park when I go there.

Every time we have this conversation about roads and connectivity, you act like it's just some sort of selfish act that I have where I want the road open for me. It really just seems like you're playing Devils Advocate to just argue with me.

[Plutonic Panda]

And how does the road being closed to traffic affect your ability to walk around the park?

OK, I'm not even gonna respond to post like this dude because that doesn't make any sense. Where did I say it's going to affect my ability to walk around the park? It's not going to affect my ability to walk around the park. My ability to walk around the park is just fine. There's this magical thing called a tunnel, the connects both sides of the park. As I said in the reply that I posted while you were replying to me, One of the biggest issues with the park, security and safety.

This could be solved by a number of ways, One of which I've always thought street parking should be removed as I said in another one of my post. Extend the sidewalks or the park a little bit to fill-in the park a little closer to the road and narrow the road a little little bit, but keep it four lanes.

My other idea is a full-time ranger station to park rangers there. They do this at scissor park in Oklahoma City.

Now this also goes into a deeper conversation that teeters On the edge of getting political so I want to be careful how I phrase this but I'm sure you know LA has a huge homeless problem, And there are other issues that need to be addressed because it stands MacArthur Park is a pretty large homeless encampment a lot of areas.

There's a running joke around the area that you could catch a fish in the park and catch every STD known to man if you ate it.