Phoenix Area Highways

[Sonic99]

So is there a break in the wall that the ramp is going through? IIRC the SB-EB ramp is supposed to be the start of the EB C/D road.

[Roadwarriors79]

So is there a break in the wall that the ramp is going through? IIRC the SB-EB ramp is supposed to be the start of the EB C/D road.

For now, the SB ramp is separated from the EB I-10 mainline until the traffic from Broadway joins it. There's a temporary shift where that lane merges into the EB mainline before the US 60 exit.

[Roadwarriors79]

This may be an unpopular opinion, but I think converting the SPUI interchange at Loop 101 and Frank Lloyd Wright Blvd in Scottsdale to a traditional diamond isn't the greatest thing for ADOT to do. I don't see how the surface street traffic at this intersection will improve. Maybe I'm wrong. Next weekend there's a planned closure under the freeway here for bridge and intersection work.

[kernals12]

This may be an unpopular opinion, but I think converting the SPUI interchange at Loop 101 and Frank Lloyd Wright Blvd in Scottsdale to a traditional diamond isn't the greatest thing for ADOT to do. I don't see how the surface street traffic at this intersection will improve. Maybe I'm wrong. Next weekend there's a planned closure under the freeway here for bridge and intersection work.

I wish they would convert the diamond at 60 and Country Club to a SPUI. So annoying having to sit through 2 traffic lights to get onto the freeway.

[Sonic99]

This may be an unpopular opinion, but I think converting the SPUI interchange at Loop 101 and Frank Lloyd Wright Blvd in Scottsdale to a traditional diamond isn't the greatest thing for ADOT to do. I don't see how the surface street traffic at this intersection will improve. Maybe I'm wrong. Next weekend there's a planned closure under the freeway here for bridge and intersection work.

I wonder if needing to accommodate the straight-thru movement on the frontage roads is why they're switching it. It's not really a "true" SPUI since there's two more lights to let the frontage roads through. I've always felt the SPUI's on I-17 between Dunlap and Camelback feel awkward with the really long red cycles to accommodate the frontage roads and that causes traffic to back up on the surface streets.

[howlincoyote2k1]

This may be an unpopular opinion, but I think converting the SPUI interchange at Loop 101 and Frank Lloyd Wright Blvd in Scottsdale to a traditional diamond isn't the greatest thing for ADOT to do. I don't see how the surface street traffic at this intersection will improve. Maybe I'm wrong. Next weekend there's a planned closure under the freeway here for bridge and intersection work.

I wish they would convert the diamond at 60 and Country Club to a SPUI. So annoying having to sit through 2 traffic lights to get onto the freeway.

And Dobson, Alma School, Mesa Dr, Stapley, Gilbert, Val Vista, Higley, Power, and probably Ellsworth and Ironwood too.

I've always been confused why the EV has so few SPUIs; one at L202/Scottsdale, one at L101/Guadalupe, a few in Scottsdale, and that's about it.

[kernals12]

This may be an unpopular opinion, but I think converting the SPUI interchange at Loop 101 and Frank Lloyd Wright Blvd in Scottsdale to a traditional diamond isn't the greatest thing for ADOT to do. I don't see how the surface street traffic at this intersection will improve. Maybe I'm wrong. Next weekend there's a planned closure under the freeway here for bridge and intersection work.

I wish they would convert the diamond at 60 and Country Club to a SPUI. So annoying having to sit through 2 traffic lights to get onto the freeway.

And Dobson, Alma School, Mesa Dr, Stapley, Gilbert, Val Vista, Higley, Power, and probably Ellsworth and Ironwood too.

I've always been confused why the EV has so few SPUIs; one at L202/Scottsdale, one at L101/Guadalupe, a few in Scottsdale, and that's about it.

SPUIs cost more due to the wider bridge needed.

[mrsman]

The problem with the Phoenix loops is there aren't really great control cities to use. Loop 101 is probably the only loop where there are okay cities to use in terms of: Avondale, Glendale, Scottsdale and Chandler.

Loop 202 could use Phoenix, Mesa, Gilbert, Chandler and ???

Red Mountain Fwy:  Tempe
Santan Fwy:  Queen Creek, San Tan Valley, Tempe, Sun Lakes, Gila River Indian Community
South Mountain Fwy:  Gila River Indian Community, Laveen

Loop 303 could use Goodyear and ??? (Peoria, Anthem???, Carefree???)

Glendale, Surprise, Sun City West.

I agree with the above for 101.

Another possibility is for certain loops that function as bypass to use the control cities for the 2di highways that it intersects with.  This is very popular in the Midwest and the Southeast.  Example Chicago as a control on I-270 surrounding St Louis or Birmingham as a control on I-285 surrounding Atlanta.

Admittedly, this works best on what is the outer bypass, or AZ-303.  So Los Angeles, Las Vegas (eventual I-11), and Flagstaff as controls for 303.

This could also work for South Mountain 202:  Los Angeles and Tucson (or Chandler-Tucson)

Much of the rest of 202 is difficult and there is no clear best option, other than using (Downtown) Phoenix for the WB Red Mountain, as it does feed directly into the Papago Fwy.

[kernals12]

The ramps (and the 3 outer lanes) on the Superstition Freeway EB between Dobson and Gilbert are going to be closed this weekend for maintenance. This is important because it impacts me. Can't wait for the traffic snarls on Baseline Road.

[mrsman]

The problem with the Phoenix loops is there aren't really great control cities to use. Loop 101 is probably the only loop where there are okay cities to use in terms of: Avondale, Glendale, Scottsdale and Chandler.

Loop 202 could use Phoenix, Mesa, Gilbert, Chandler and ???

Red Mountain Fwy:  Tempe
Santan Fwy:  Queen Creek, San Tan Valley, Tempe, Sun Lakes, Gila River Indian Community
South Mountain Fwy:  Gila River Indian Community, Laveen

Loop 303 could use Goodyear and ??? (Peoria, Anthem???, Carefree???)

Glendale, Surprise, Sun City West.

I agree with the above for 101.

Another possibility is for certain loops that function as bypass to use the control cities for the 2di highways that it intersects with.  This is very popular in the Midwest and the Southeast.  Example Chicago as a control on I-270 surrounding St Louis or Birmingham as a control on I-285 surrounding Atlanta.

Admittedly, this works best on what is the outer bypass, or AZ-303.  So Los Angeles, Las Vegas (eventual I-11), and Flagstaff as controls for 303.

This could also work for South Mountain 202:  Los Angeles and Tucson (or Chandler-Tucson)

Much of the rest of 202 is difficult and there is no clear best option, other than using (Downtown) Phoenix for the WB Red Mountain, as it does feed directly into the Papago Fwy.

Slight reconsideration of the above.

The 2dis in Arizona use the right choices.  Large regional cities that are relatively well-known.  I do take exception though with the change of control as soon as you cross the Phoenix city line.  The control should not change to Tucson when you are still more than 10 miles away from reaching Downtown Phoenix.  Central Phoenix (or Downtown Phoenix) should be a control that should guide people towards the central loop of freeways, and specifically to the stretch of I-10 between I-17 (western interchange) and CA-51 just north of Downtown.

303: NB: Flagstaff.  SB: Goodyear until Camelback, but then the control should be "To I-10" and then south of I-10 "To Cotton Lane South"

Northern Pkwy:  EB: Glendale (with surface street signage guiding toward the stadium near 101).  WB: Waddell (with guidance signing toward 303 north and then toward Peoria Ave)

101 Clockwise: Glendale (until Camelback), Peoria (until Northern), Desert Ridge (until Bell Rd), Desert Ridge/Scottsdale (until Tatum), Scottsdale/Tempe (until Scottsdale Rd), Tempe (until northern 202), Chandler (until Elliot Rd), To 202

101 Counterclockwise: Tempe/Scottsdale (until US 60), Scottsdale (until McDowell), Desert Ridge (until Scottsdale Rd), Glendale/Peoria (until 51 Ave), Peoria/Glendale Sport District (until Bell Rd), Glendale Sports District/Avondale (until Northern Ave), Avondale (until Camelback), To I-10

51 NB: Desert Ridge  SB: Central Phoenix

143 SB: To I-10 / US 60.  NB: Sky Harbor Airport (until Sky Harbor Blvd), TO 202 WEST, To Mc Dowell Rd  (In all honesty, the existing signage seems pretty good as the road is just a short connector)

202 Clockwise: Tempe (until Priest), Red Mountain Park (until Brown), Chandler (until Gilbert Rd), Los Angeles

202 Counterclockwise: Chandler (until 101), Red Mountain Park (until Brown), Tempe/Central Phoenix (until 101), Central Phoenix

24 WB: Chandler EB: Ironwood Rd.  (Guidance to Phoenix via 202 north to US 60 west)

[kernals12]

I found this map in an old planning document about the Piestewa Freeway. Apparently Loop 303 was originally supposed to go further East.

[The Ghostbuster]

Does anyone think Loop 303 should've been extended further east? I know there isn't a lot of development east of the Interstate 17/Loop 303 interchange, but that may change in the future.

[kernals12]

Does anyone think Loop 303 should've been extended further east? I know there isn't a lot of development east of the Interstate 17/Loop 303 interchange, but that may change in the future.

I do. It's rather annoying trudging through all those stop lights to get to Cave Creek.

[Max Rockatansky]

That's the idea.  Cave Creek residents aren't too interested in letting the plebeians get access too easily. 

[kernals12]

When and why did they decide to number Phoenix's loops as 101, 202, and 303?

[Max Rockatansky]

They all changed during the late 80s when they were being planned.  I've never seen a specific rationale but there was a lot of route numbers which would have been used.  I suspect someone came to the conclusion that having crap like 216, 217 and 218 was kind of sill in lieu of a single Loop number.

[pderocco]

Why not 1, 2, and 3? Arizona doesn't have any single-digit route numbers, except I-8, which wasn't theirs to choose.

[Max Rockatansky]

The interesting thing is that all the state highways were originally in the 60-99 range.  They more or less were consecutively branching off the original US Routes designated for the state.  The initial loop road numbers kinda of would have done something similar using I-17 as the jumping off point.

[KeithE4Phx]

Does anyone think Loop 303 should've been extended further east? I know there isn't a lot of development east of the Interstate 17/Loop 303 interchange, but that may change in the future.

Tatum Ranch blocks the section of that proposed freeway between Cave Creek Rd and Scottsdale Rd.  There's also development near I-17.

[kernals12]

I looked through newspaper archives and there is no mention at all of this "Northeastern Loop".

This leads into another interesting question: why is there so little development in the Northeast Valley? Is it due to flooding issues?

The real wildcard in all this is going to be the TSMC plant. Speculators are already betting on new residential and commercial development on the West side of 17, and some spillover to the east is inevitable.

[Max Rockatansky]

Cave Creek and Carefree residents largely don't want sprawl.  Both towns have been hugely against infrastructure development and don't even have Valley Metro services. Both incorporated in the 1980s supposedly to avoid being annexed by Phoenix.  I'd imagine the annexation of Sunnyslope was still a sore subject given it was within living memory.   That area was relatively neglected by Phoenix in favor of newer development and surrounding sprawl.

[Roadwarriors79]

So I-10 WB through the Broadway Curve is flowing a little bit better this week. The mainline has 3 general lanes and 1 HOV lane going now from US 60 to right around 40th St. 2 more lanes from the C/D road join the mainline west of there. Another full closure of WB I-10 is planned this weekend (Fri 9/13 to Mon 9/16), so this could look different next week.

[kernals12]

Cave Creek and Carefree residents largely don't want sprawl.  Both towns have been hugely against infrastructure development and don't even have Valley Metro services. Both incorporated in the 1980s supposedly to avoid being annexed by Phoenix.  I'd imagine the annexation of Sunnyslope was still a sore subject given it was within living memory.   That area was relatively neglected by Phoenix in favor of newer development and surrounding sprawl.

I'm not even talking about Cave Creek and Carefree, the far northern reaches of Phoenix and Scottsdale become very sparse north of the CAP canal.

[kernals12]

They all changed during the late 80s when they were being planned.  I've never seen a specific rationale but there was a lot of route numbers which would have been used.  I suspect someone came to the conclusion that having crap like 216, 217 and 218 was kind of sill in lieu of a single Loop number.

I like to think that they picked 101 because of the glamour of US 101 and then just added 202 and 303 for continuity.

[kernals12]

https://azdot.gov/news/loop-101-widening-project-meeting-scheduled-sept-19-glendale

ADOT is holding a public meeting on the 19th regarding the widening of 101 from I-17 to 75th avenue. Work starts on September 27.

This means there will be 5 different widening projects going on in Maricopa County simultaneously, 6 if you count the replacement of bridges in advance of the Wild Horse pass widening.