Road Numbering Changes

[kphoger]

That highway number, according to SCT logs, is MEX-001-BCS.  It is an integrated federal/state highway, of which there are four in Baja California Sur.  These are highways that have some federal segments and some state segments.

Weird, the signs around Bahía Tortuga only show BCS Shields

It's possible that they're using state shields on state portions and federal shields on federal portions.

It's also possible that a bunch of them are error shields.  State/federal shield mix-ups are pretty common in Mexico, from my experience.

Edit:  Actually, that zero-km post you shared is actually for the intersecting road out to the airport.  Here's the 1-km marker, exactly 1 kilometer later:  https://maps.app.goo.gl/pf7CQ8LXdxNxJsDr8

[kphoger]

https://maps.app.goo.gl/bv5rD8A7FbYztJSM8

https://maps.app.goo.gl/UU8GY9pVgVH1j7dX9

Weird, the signs around Bahía Tortuga only show BCS Shields

https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/17714677#map=10/27.5793/-114.1412 OSM calls "BCS 1"

Shields are a mix-match.

Starting from Bahía Tortugas:

km-170 = unable to locate on Google Maps
km-165 = old faded BCS shield with no number
km-160 = MEXICO 1 shield
km-155 = MEXICO 1 shield
km-150 = marker does not include route shield
km-145 = BCS shield with no number
km-140 = BCS shield with no number
km-135 = MEXICO shield with no number (westbound) / BCS shield with no number (eastbound)
km-130 = BCS shield with no number
km-125 = BCS shield with no number, but the 'k' has managed to move up into the shield blank somehow
km-120 = MEXICO 1 shield
km-115 = BCS shield with no number
km-110 = BCS shield with no number
km-105 = BCS shield with no number

And I got bored searching at that point.

[Jhoan Seb]

So, the number 53 is obviously coming from somewhere.  I just checked my 2011 Guía Roji atlas, which admittedly isn't 100% reliable for numbering, and it labels the road as BCS-53.  And I can find multiple websites labeling it as BCS-53 as well.  However, I am still unable to find any SCT documentation of its being anything other than BCS-001.

https://wiki.aaroads.com/wiki/Draft:List_of_highways_in_Baja_California_Sur

Are there more marked routes on that map? I wonder if there are numbers for certain roads. BCSDOT does not tend to mark routes; in fact, there are a lot of blue signs indicating tourist attractions. I am trying to find out if "Camino Cabo Este" or the route that leads to Punta Abreojos, San Miguel de Comondú, and Puerto Adolfo Lopez Mateos has a number.

[kphoger]

So, the number 53 is obviously coming from somewhere.  I just checked my 2011 Guía Roji atlas, which admittedly isn't 100% reliable for numbering, and it labels the road as BCS-53.  And I can find multiple websites labeling it as BCS-53 as well.  However, I am still unable to find any SCT documentation of its being anything other than BCS-001.

https://wiki.aaroads.com/wiki/Draft:List_of_highways_in_Baja_California_Sur

Yeah, I call baloney.  Your sources are just OpenStreetMap links and an online newspaper article from less than two years ago.  And you claim BCS-53 was formed in 2024—yet, as I said, the road is labeled BCS-53 on an atlas I have from 2011.  Please don't put crap like that up on AARoads without real documentation.

Are there more marked routes on that map? I wonder if there are numbers for certain roads. BCSDOT does not tend to mark routes; in fact, there are a lot of blue signs indicating tourist attractions. I am trying to find out if "Camino Cabo Este" or the route that leads to Punta Abreojos, San Miguel de Comondú, and Puerto Adolfo Lopez Mateos has a number.

This portion of "Camino Cabo Este" is an unnumbered state highway.  I don't think the rest of it is a state highway at all.

The road to Punta Abreojos is an unnumbered state highway.

I don't think the road to San Miguel de Comondú is a state highway at all.

The road to Puerto Adolfo López Mateos is an unnumbered state highway.

[Jhoan Seb]

Yeah, I call baloney.  Your sources are just OpenStreetMap links and an online newspaper article from less than two years ago.  And you claim BCS-53 was formed in 2024—yet, as I said, the road is labeled BCS-53 on an atlas I have from 2011.  Please don't put crap like that up on AARoads without real documentation.

Sorry, I said it was 2024 because technically that's the year it was signposted and only a tag was added to OSM. I apologize for spreading misinformation. I didn't know that BCS-53 had existed prior to that. But yet again, that's why drafts exist before they are published. Similar to how I accidentally got the O routes in the Faroe Islands wrong.  (Since I don't have full atlas, maps or documents, I tend to create drafts before publishing because they can be errors like this)


I found a document from 2008 that mentions the existence of the BSC 53.

"Partiendo de la ciudad de La Paz, se toma la carretera federal México 1 Transpeninsular que va hasta Tijuana, y en el cruce de Villa Insurgentes se toma la carretera estatal que va hacia La Purísima (BCS 53), y al llegar a este poblado se toma la desviación que lleva hasta San Juanico" (Page 31) from "http://sinat.semarnat.gob.mx/dgiraDocs/documentos/bcs/estudios/2008/03BS2008FD148.pdf"

https://www.iberlibro.com/9789706212924/Baja-California-State-Map-Guia-9706212922/plp

Baja California Sur and Norte were skipped because there is not enough documentation to create proper logs (That's the reason why they are drafts). Mexico's national park service refers to MEX-11 as a "State Highway": https://www.gob.mx/conanp/documentos/area-de-proteccion-de-flora-y-fauna-balandra?state=published And the SICT route logs do not match the roads; even their maps only show federal routes and not state routes in BCS.

The only thing I'm unsure about is the existence of BCS 1 (Present in OSM) and BCS 3 (Present in OSM and Google Maps) Apart from that I only have three confirmed routes for the state.

[Jhoan Seb]

* https://www.jecbcs.gob.mx/transparencia/st/03-003-18.pdf
* https://www.jecbcs.gob.mx/transparencia/st/04-004-18.pdf

Apparently, the agency that regulates the maintenance of the state road network in Baja California Sur is called the "Junta Estatal de Caminos" abbreviated as JEC, and has its own numbering system.

[Jhoan Seb]

It's also possible that a bunch of them are error shields.  State/federal shield mix-ups are pretty common in Mexico, from my experience.

https://www.inegi.org.mx/contenidos/productos/prod_serv/contenidos/espanol/bvinegi/productos/geografia/imagen_cartografica/map_top_municipal/794551122174_geo.pdf

I am researching maps published by INEGI. The road leading to Bahía Tortugas is marked with the shield BCS 1. (Although curiously, other areas of the state still use that shield, see the Purisima area, when technically it is BCS 53, they mark it with BCS 1).

Baja California Sur is quite odd. I have created a section called "Branch Highways" in AARW (Note: The article is still in draft form and may contain errors that may be corrected in the future).

For some reason, "Ramal a San Francisco de la Sierra" has a MEX-1 Shield on Km 10 (https://maps.app.goo.gl/8rCVLnnyNkSunvM38)

[kphoger]

https://www.inegi.org.mx/contenidos/productos/prod_serv/contenidos/espanol/bvinegi/productos/geografia/imagen_cartografica/map_top_municipal/794551122174_geo.pdf

I am researching maps published by INEGI. The road leading to Bahía Tortugas is marked with the shield BCS 1. (Although curiously, other areas of the state still use that shield, see the Purisima area, when technically it is BCS 53, they mark it with BCS 1).

Apparently, I need to explain this more explicitly.

The highway to La Purísima is route BCS-001 according to SCT route logs..  So that shield is correct.  This is a Baja California Sur state highway (part of the Red Estatal Libre).  I still have yet to see anything official that says this road "technically is BCS 53".

The highway to Bahía Tortugas is route MEX-001-BCS according to SCT route logs.  So that shield is also correct.  This is an integrated highway with some federal portions and some state portions (one of the Carreteras Integradas por Tramos Federales y Estatales).

I found a document from 2008 that mentions the existence of the BSC 53.

"Partiendo de la ciudad de La Paz, se toma la carretera federal México 1 Transpeninsular que va hasta Tijuana, y en el cruce de Villa Insurgentes se toma la carretera estatal que va hacia La Purísima (BCS 53), y al llegar a este poblado se toma la desviación que lleva hasta San Juanico" (Page 31) from "http://sinat.semarnat.gob.mx/dgiraDocs/documentos/bcs/estudios/2008/03BS2008FD148.pdf"

For some reason, that link isn't working for me.

But anyway, if it's from 2008, then maybe the the highway was renumbered at some point between 2008 and now, from BCS-53 to BCS-001.

For some reason, "Ramal a San Francisco de la Sierra" has a MEX-1 Shield on Km 10 (https://maps.app.goo.gl/8rCVLnnyNkSunvM38)

You're relying too much on route shields posted in the field.  I've seen way too many error shields in my time to trust the numbers on them.

Anyway, the highway to San Fco de la Sierra was reportedly started in 2005, but then, before completion, the project was abandoned for a decade.  It was finally taken up again and completed in 2023.

It's possible that some of these roads are actually state highways but just not listed in the logs I'm looking at.  On the SCT map for Baja California Sur, for example, this one and also the roads to San Miguel de Comondú and the rest of Camino Cabo Este are labeled as state highways but without shields.

[kphoger]

But anyway, if it's from 2008, then maybe the the highway was renumbered at some point between 2008 and now, from BCS-53 to BCS-001.

I'm thinking more and more that this is what happened.  I found a very large spreadsheet with directions to what appear to be individual watershed locations throughout Mexico from 2005–2007, and a great many of them refer to this particular highway as 'BCS 53'.

[kphoger]

* https://www.jecbcs.gob.mx/transparencia/st/03-003-18.pdf
* https://www.jecbcs.gob.mx/transparencia/st/04-004-18.pdf

Apparently, the agency that regulates the maintenance of the state road network in Baja California Sur is called the "Junta Estatal de Caminos" abbreviated as JEC, and has its own numbering system.

I don't see any route numbers in those documents.

[Jhoan Seb]

* https://www.jecbcs.gob.mx/transparencia/st/03-003-18.pdf
* https://www.jecbcs.gob.mx/transparencia/st/04-004-18.pdf

Apparently, the agency that regulates the maintenance of the state road network in Baja California Sur is called the "Junta Estatal de Caminos" abbreviated as JEC, and has its own numbering system.

I don't see any route numbers in those documents.

It's the "Num" column, although I assume they are projects. I emailed the BCS JEC to confirm whether the numbers that appear in those documents refer to the projects or the highway numbers. For example, it says there that the road between San Isidro and San José de Comondú is 98. But it could perfectly well be "Project 98" for highway repairs within their operating plan.

[Jhoan Seb]

It's possible that some of these roads are actually state highways but just not listed in the logs I'm looking at.  On the SCT map for Baja California Sur, for example, this one and also the roads to San Miguel de Comondú and the rest of Camino Cabo Este are labeled as state highways but without shields.

https://www.google.com.co/books/edition/S%C3%ADntesis_geogr%C3%A1fica_del_estado_de_Baja/0PiMDwAAQBAJ?hl=es&gbpv=1&dq=%22Carretera+Estatal%22+%22Baja+California+Sur%22&pg=PA11&printsec=frontcover

I believe that SICT began to reform the road numbering system based on the growth of Baja California Sur. In the 1990s, INEGI published a map showing that the road between Benito Juárez and El Arco (Baja California Norte) was MEX-018.

I could only find one article on WegenWiki that mentions this highway, but it disappeared in the 2000s. I guess SICT couldn't manage to rehabilitate the road, so they decided to remove the numbering.

https://www.wegenwiki.nl/Carretera_federal_18_in_Mexico

Also Mexico Federal Highway 4 was originally located between Ciudad Constitución and Puerto San Carlos but they re-numbered to MEX-22.

Looking even deeper, I found a map of 1960s Baja California made by some people from Los Ángeles.

https://cdn.bajabound.com/images/content/1962_baja_map_63817.jpg

* State Highway 13 = La Paz-Los Planes
* State Highway 9 = La Paz-Todos Los Santos
* State Highway 11 = San Antonio - San José de los Cabos

[kphoger]

It's the "Num" column, although I assume they are projects. I emailed the BCS JEC to confirm whether the numbers that appear in those documents refer to the projects or the highway numbers. For example, it says there that the road between San Isidro and San José de Comondú is 98. But it could perfectly well be "Project 98" for highway repairs within their operating plan.

They're definitely not route numbers.  There are different numbers for 5km stretches of the same road.

[Jhoan Seb]

Yes, I chatted about this on the Aaroads Discord server and confirmed that it is Project Number, not Route Number. Anyway, we eventually have to outsource information from the BCS JEC to confirm budget data and state network maintenance.

https://wiki.aaroads.com/w/index.php?title=Draft%3AList_of_highways_in_Baja_California_Sur&type=revision&diff=637165&oldid=637149

With Baja California Sur, I've noticed that a lot of important roads don't have proper numbering. So I had to add a section called "Branch Highways." I plan to create a subsection called "Historical Routes" for the routes between the Cordillera de la Giganta.

[kphoger]

With Baja California Sur, I've noticed that a lot of important roads don't have proper numbering.

Some states love to number their highways, other states don't.  It's OK to just accept that fact.

Anyway, I figure now's a good time to share this with you:

https://micrs.sct.gob.mx/infraestructura/direccion-general-de-servicios-tecnicos/datos-viales/

[kphoger]

I found the online map for you:

https://gaia.inegi.org.mx/mdm6/

Click on any highway segment, and it will tell you whether it's federal or state, and also what route number it is if it has one.

[Jhoan Seb]

https://www.google.com.co/books/edition/Datos_viales/mPFFAAAAYAAJ?hl=es&gbpv=1&bsq=%22Ruta:+BCS-023%22&dq=%22Ruta:+BCS-023%22&printsec=frontcover

I found a route log from 1985, it seems that the BCS-53 it was called BCS-023 according to SICT.

https://www.cibnor.gob.mx/images/stories/eventos/MAPA_BCS.pdf I found a map from Centro de Investigaciones Biológicas del Noroeste (CIBNOR) which shows the road signed as BCS-53.

I am researching former road numbering. INEGI previously showed MEX-22 as MEX-4 and also showed the existence of MEX-18 (Google Maps has it, but SICT did not ratify the route that appears on those old INEGI maps).

[kphoger]

https://www.cibnor.gob.mx/images/stories/eventos/MAPA_BCS.pdf I found a map from Centro de Investigaciones Biológicas del Noroeste (CIBNOR) which shows the road signed as BCS-53.

Must have been using old information.  That map cannot be from any earlier than 2012.

[Jhoan Seb]

https://gyo.tc/1sRTF

While researching, I found a Facebook account dedicated to promoting the BCS-53. It seems that local authorities have placed a shield on the route, but it's somewhat unprofessional, so to speak. They used the Federal Highway shield as a basis but removed the Mexico label and changed it to BCS.

I tried to investigate and it seems that the BCS-53 originated in 1988. (https://www.google.com.co/books/edition/Datos_viales/DvJFAAAAYAAJ?hl=es&gbpv=1&bsq=%22CD+.+INSURGENTES+-+LA+HIGUERA+RUTA+:+B.C.S.-+053%22&dq=%22CD+.+INSURGENTES+-+LA+HIGUERA+RUTA+:+B.C.S.-+053%22&printsec=frontcover) vs (https://www.google.com.co/books/edition/Datos_viales/mPFFAAAAYAAJ?hl=es&gbpv=1&bsq=%22RUTA+:+BCS-023%22&dq=%22RUTA+:+BCS-023%22&printsec=frontcover)

The first mention of BCS-286 is in the 1988 Route Log too (https://www.google.com.co/books/edition/Datos_viales/DvJFAAAAYAAJ?hl=es&gbpv=1&bsq=%22RUTA+:+BCS-286%22&dq=%22RUTA+:+BCS-286%22&printsec=frontcover)

According to them, the terminology "1-53" is used to refer to the two sections of the highway. The sections of Fed Highway 1 that run from Santa Rita to Ciudad Insurgentes and the sections of BCS 53 that run from Ciudad Insurgentes to Pabellon (at the intersection with Barrancas).

[kphoger]

According to them, the terminology "1-53" is used to refer to the two sections of the highway. The sections of Fed Highway 1 that run from Santa Rita to Ciudad Insurgentes and the sections of BCS 53 that run from Ciudad Insurgentes to Pabellon (at the intersection with Barrancas).

That's what I was assuming.  Except that the route is no longer BCS-53.

[Jhoan Seb]

Trying to research Baja California Former Road Numbering. I found a bunch of maps on Viva Baja.
https://vivabaja.com/automobile-club-maps/

Between 1975-1978, the BCS-9 Highway became the Federal Highway 9
* https://octopup.org/img/media/maps/baja/1975--Baja-California--Map--AAA.jpg
* https://octopup.org/img/media/maps/baja/1978--Baja-California--Map--AAA.jpg

In 1979, the government transformed the BCS-4 into Federal Highway 22. In addition, that the Federal Highway 9 was renumbered to 19. Also, Mexican Federal Highwy 18 started to appear.
* https://octopup.org/img/media/maps/baja/1978--Baja-California--Map--AAA.jpg
* https://octopup.org/img/media/maps/baja/1979--Baja-California--Map--AAA.jpg

In 1985, the BCS-13 became BCS-286
* https://octopup.org/img/media/maps/baja/1984--Baja-California--Map--AAA.jpg
* https://octopup.org/img/media/maps/baja/1985--Baja-California--Map--AAA.jpg

[kphoger]

Trying to research Baja California Former Road Numbering. I found a bunch of maps on Viva Baja.

Yeah, I'd seen those too.  But, because they didn't help with the whole BCS-53/BCS-1 issue, I only glanced through them a little bit.

[Jhoan Seb]

It's really strange. According to road data from the 1980s, the route has existed since that decade (Although there was a route log published that marked as BCS-23 in the same decade), but SICT decided to rename it BCS-1 in the 2000s. I think a lot of Mexican agencies are using outdated road numbering, so that's the reason why they use BCS-53 and not BCS-1 for this road,

INEGI is one example I can think of where they published maps with MEX-4 in the 1990s, but the SCT converted BCS-4 to MEX-22 in the 1970s. Same with BCS-286/BCS-246, the government of Baja California Sur used the original route number instead of the newer one imposed by SICT in their current logs.

[Jhoan Seb]

https://bnn-news.com/latvia-to-spend-120000-euros-on-changing-road-signs-pointing-to-russia-and-belarus-277218

Replacement of certain signs, or improvement of route indications through the use of road numbering and European route designations.

I wonder if that means they are going to remove the labels (RUS) and (BY) from their road signs and replace them with the name of the European or local route. Not sure if they are gonna change their current road numbering.

https://xcancel.com/DakdaR22/status/2024045914353013166 It seems they are removing the labels to Russian and Belorussian cities since February 2026.

[kphoger]

I don't remember if we've had a thread about ghosted cities/states/countries yet.