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Variations of Designations for Former Alignments

Started by CoreySamson, September 14, 2026, 08:26:04 PM

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CoreySamson

It occurred to me the other day that Texas signs former alignments wildly differently depending on the era in which the road was bypassed and which TxDOT district did it. I can think of 9 different ways this has been done in Texas:

1. Bypassing a US Route with an interstate but keeping the US Highway designation on the old route (example: US 90 in Katy)

2a and 2b. Designating a former alignment as a business route, either a US route or state route (example: US 59 Business in Diboll or TX 35 Business in Alvin)

3. Designating a former alignment as an interstate business route and truncating the old highway completely (example: I-45 Business in Ferris [in lieu of US 75])

4. Designating a former alignment as a state highway route (example: TX 75 and TX 132)

5. Designating a former alignment as a state highway loop route (example: TX Loop 521 in Edna)

6. Designating a former alignment as a state highway spur route (example: TX Spur 581 near Derby or TX Spur 407 in Corpus Christi)

7. Designating a former alignment as a secondary state highway (FM road in this case) (example: FM 327 in Elmendorf)

8. Designating a former alignment as a county route (example: CR 288 near Clute, TX)

9. Decommissioning the former alignment altogether down to a city street or "Old Highway __" (example: Washington Avenue in Marshall)

That's a lot of variations! Which method do y'all think is the best for designating a former alignment, especially for today in the 21st century where there is less of a need for "business" routes with modern GPS and mapping services? Moreover, are there any ways that states designate former alignments or bypass alignments that I have not listed?
Buc-ee's and QuikTrip fanboy. Clincher of 49 FM roads. Proponent of the TX U-turn. Unabashed HAWK hater. ORU '26.

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kphoger

I have mixed feelings about Business Route designations.  So maybe or maybe not that.

If it's a state with a secondary state route system (Texas, Missouri, et al.), then I think it's a good use for that.

If not, then maybe a state route number that's higher than typical route numbers.  So, for example, if state routes generally run from 1 to 300, then something above 400 sets it apart as something special.

He Is Already Here! Let's Go, Flamingo!
Dost thou understand the graveness of the circumstances?
Deut 23:13
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: PKDIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

Max Rockatansky

We are way past the era of Business Route designations being useful.  Most were poorly signed even back in the 1990s.

California is big on recycling old state highway alignments into the Letter County Route program.  Some examples:

N2:  Partially aligned on the Old Ridge Route (old US 99)
J1:  Partially aligned over what was once signed as CA 180 along the paved part of Panoche Road
J29: Assigned to a large portion of the original alignment of CA 65

Scott5114

Quote from: Max Rockatansky on September 14, 2026, 11:49:05 PMWe are way past the era of Business Route designations being useful.  Most were poorly signed even back in the 1990s.

Eh, they still have some utility in the slice of the country between I-15 and I-65 or so. They're a helpful indicator that the town you're approaching is big enough to have a few choices of places to stop and eat and get gas or whatever.
uncontrollable freak sardine salad chef

kphoger

Quote from: Max Rockatansky on September 14, 2026, 11:49:05 PMWe are way past the era of Business Route designations being useful.
Quote from: Scott5114 on September 15, 2026, 02:39:46 PMEh, they still have some utility in the slice of the country between I-15 and I-65 or so. They're a helpful indicator that the town you're approaching is big enough to have a few choices of places to stop and eat and get gas or whatever.

I've been to Aguilar, CO...

He Is Already Here! Let's Go, Flamingo!
Dost thou understand the graveness of the circumstances?
Deut 23:13
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: PKDIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

Scott5114

Quote from: kphoger on September 15, 2026, 02:51:33 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on September 14, 2026, 11:49:05 PMWe are way past the era of Business Route designations being useful.
Quote from: Scott5114 on September 15, 2026, 02:39:46 PMEh, they still have some utility in the slice of the country between I-15 and I-65 or so. They're a helpful indicator that the town you're approaching is big enough to have a few choices of places to stop and eat and get gas or whatever.

I've been to Aguilar, CO...

I've been to Glenrio. :P Okay, so they're not foolproof...
uncontrollable freak sardine salad chef

cwf1701

Michigan often with some of its old alignments is to either make them Business routes, or assign them as M-routes. for example, some sections of the old US highway routes become BUS routes if there is a freeway nearby. some like US-25 in Detroit becomes other highways in the state highway system (M-85 for Fort St, M-3 for Gratiot)

Beltway

Quote from: Max Rockatansky on September 14, 2026, 11:49:05 PMWe are way past the era of Business Route designations being useful.  Most were poorly signed even back in the 1990s.
Probably helpful when new Interstate highways were being built in the 1960s and 1970s era. Navigating to and from the town or city to the new highway.

But at least in the eastern seaboard states I don't see the need today.
Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

kphoger

When I see a signed Interstate business loop, if I assume anything about it, I assume there's actually a different exit coming up soon with more and/or better services closer to the interchange.

He Is Already Here! Let's Go, Flamingo!
Dost thou understand the graveness of the circumstances?
Deut 23:13
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: PKDIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

Rothman

Quote from: kphoger on September 15, 2026, 03:38:58 PMWhen I see a signed Interstate business loop, if I assume anything about it, I assume there's actually a different exit coming up soon with more and/or better services closer to the interchange.

Heh.  I do associate business routes with town centers that peaked seventy years ago or so.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position(s) of NYSDOT.

CapeCodder

Quote from: Scott5114 on September 15, 2026, 02:52:42 PM
Quote from: kphoger on September 15, 2026, 02:51:33 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on September 14, 2026, 11:49:05 PMWe are way past the era of Business Route designations being useful.
Quote from: Scott5114 on September 15, 2026, 02:39:46 PMEh, they still have some utility in the slice of the country between I-15 and I-65 or so. They're a helpful indicator that the town you're approaching is big enough to have a few choices of places to stop and eat and get gas or whatever.

I've been to Aguilar, CO...

I've been to Glenrio. :P Okay, so they're not foolproof...

Glenrio amazes me in that it still has a business loop.

Max Rockatansky

Quote from: CapeCodder on September 15, 2026, 05:02:27 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on September 15, 2026, 02:52:42 PM
Quote from: kphoger on September 15, 2026, 02:51:33 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on September 14, 2026, 11:49:05 PMWe are way past the era of Business Route designations being useful.
Quote from: Scott5114 on September 15, 2026, 02:39:46 PMEh, they still have some utility in the slice of the country between I-15 and I-65 or so. They're a helpful indicator that the town you're approaching is big enough to have a few choices of places to stop and eat and get gas or whatever.

I've been to Aguilar, CO...

I've been to Glenrio. :P Okay, so they're not foolproof...

Glenrio amazes me in that it still has a business loop.

The "modern restrooms" are quite the attraction.

GaryV

Quote from: cwf1701 on September 15, 2026, 03:16:22 PMMichigan often with some of its old alignments ...
And there's also this way of doing it, north of Vanderbilt: https://maps.app.goo.gl/wYWCN1DMscMzoWhP6

kphoger

Quote from: kphoger on September 15, 2026, 03:38:58 PMWhen I see a signed Interstate business loop, if I assume anything about it, I assume there's actually a different exit coming up soon with more and/or better services closer to the interchange.
Quote from: Rothman on September 15, 2026, 04:45:53 PMHeh.  I do associate business routes with town centers that peaked seventy years ago or so.

I kind of meant the opposite.  I assume the route is a business loop that joins the main highway a few miles outside of town, but there's a local exit closer to town with more restaurant options and at least one nice gas station.

As a random example, take Dilley, Texas.  There are zero services at either end of the business loop, but there are fast food, gas station, and motel options at both of the exits in between.  That's what I think of when I see a signed business loop.

He Is Already Here! Let's Go, Flamingo!
Dost thou understand the graveness of the circumstances?
Deut 23:13
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: PKDIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

pderocco

Quote from: Max Rockatansky on September 15, 2026, 05:09:59 PM
Quote from: CapeCodder on September 15, 2026, 05:02:27 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on September 15, 2026, 02:52:42 PM
Quote from: kphoger on September 15, 2026, 02:51:33 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on September 14, 2026, 11:49:05 PMWe are way past the era of Business Route designations being useful.
Quote from: Scott5114 on September 15, 2026, 02:39:46 PMEh, they still have some utility in the slice of the country between I-15 and I-65 or so. They're a helpful indicator that the town you're approaching is big enough to have a few choices of places to stop and eat and get gas or whatever.

I've been to Aguilar, CO...

I've been to Glenrio. :P Okay, so they're not foolproof...

Glenrio amazes me in that it still has a business loop.

The "modern restrooms" are quite the attraction.
This one wasn't quite up to snuff: https://maps.app.goo.gl/qDE9qNhNuSc2VkZbA

kphoger


He Is Already Here! Let's Go, Flamingo!
Dost thou understand the graveness of the circumstances?
Deut 23:13
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: PKDIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

Max Rockatansky

Quote from: pderocco on September 16, 2026, 01:25:36 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on September 15, 2026, 05:09:59 PM
Quote from: CapeCodder on September 15, 2026, 05:02:27 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on September 15, 2026, 02:52:42 PM
Quote from: kphoger on September 15, 2026, 02:51:33 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on September 14, 2026, 11:49:05 PMWe are way past the era of Business Route designations being useful.
Quote from: Scott5114 on September 15, 2026, 02:39:46 PMEh, they still have some utility in the slice of the country between I-15 and I-65 or so. They're a helpful indicator that the town you're approaching is big enough to have a few choices of places to stop and eat and get gas or whatever.

I've been to Aguilar, CO...

I've been to Glenrio. :P Okay, so they're not foolproof...

Glenrio amazes me in that it still has a business loop.

The "modern restrooms" are quite the attraction.
This one wasn't quite up to snuff: https://maps.app.goo.gl/qDE9qNhNuSc2VkZbA

So modern that it still can function as a restroom without continued human maintenance.

pderocco

Quote from: kphoger on September 15, 2026, 06:05:02 PM
Quote from: kphoger on September 15, 2026, 03:38:58 PMWhen I see a signed Interstate business loop, if I assume anything about it, I assume there's actually a different exit coming up soon with more and/or better services closer to the interchange.
Quote from: Rothman on September 15, 2026, 04:45:53 PMHeh.  I do associate business routes with town centers that peaked seventy years ago or so.

I kind of meant the opposite.  I assume the route is a business loop that joins the main highway a few miles outside of town, but there's a local exit closer to town with more restaurant options and at least one nice gas station.

As a random example, take Dilley, Texas.  There are zero services at either end of the business loop, but there are fast food, gas station, and motel options at both of the exits in between.  That's what I think of when I see a signed business loop.
This past month, I drove dozens of business loops/spurs (including Glenrio and Aguilar), and the most common setup is three exits per town, with the business loop going from the first to the third. The middle one is often some other US route that the town is a junction for.

As to Glenrio, I'm not just surprised it has no businesses, I'm surprised that it still has a name.

pderocco

Quote from: Max Rockatansky on September 16, 2026, 01:37:46 PM
Quote from: pderocco on September 16, 2026, 01:25:36 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on September 15, 2026, 05:09:59 PM
Quote from: CapeCodder on September 15, 2026, 05:02:27 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on September 15, 2026, 02:52:42 PM
Quote from: kphoger on September 15, 2026, 02:51:33 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on September 14, 2026, 11:49:05 PMWe are way past the era of Business Route designations being useful.
Quote from: Scott5114 on September 15, 2026, 02:39:46 PMEh, they still have some utility in the slice of the country between I-15 and I-65 or so. They're a helpful indicator that the town you're approaching is big enough to have a few choices of places to stop and eat and get gas or whatever.

I've been to Aguilar, CO...

I've been to Glenrio. :P Okay, so they're not foolproof...

Glenrio amazes me in that it still has a business loop.

The "modern restrooms" are quite the attraction.
This one wasn't quite up to snuff: https://maps.app.goo.gl/qDE9qNhNuSc2VkZbA

So modern that it still can function as a restroom without continued human maintenance.
The desert creatures maintain it to their satisfaction.

wxfree

Until 1990, they would designate the route as a loop, often to be signed as a business route.  The official map would have a loop number that wasn't on any signs.  Then in 1991 they established business routes as official designations and a rule that the signs must match the designations.

To me, a business route doesn't mean "businesses," it means "the old route."  I have a road-heavy way of thinking.  Where anyone else would say "turn left after McDonald's," I would say "turn left on Oak Street."  To me, the turn is at a certain street, not before or after a certain business.  When I see a primary route and a business route, I think of a business route that probably goes through downtown on a narrower road and a bypass that may be a country freeway but may also be a congested but wider road through the main business district on the newer side of town.  I think about it as a type of road, not where business are located.

If it's a bypass around a small town, it may run through the newer and bigger commercial zone, especially if it's not a freeway.  It may have more traffic and take longer to get through.  If it's a bypass around a bigger town, especially if it's a freeway outside of town, I would think that it's a quicker way around, while the business district is along the old route.

My thinking is more aligned with something I've seen in Oklahoma, bypass routes rather than business routes.  That labels the road type, not the business district.  From there, you can use what you've learned over the years to guess which way to go, depending on whether you want to stop.  A freeway outside of town, when the town is bigger and likely has heavy commercial development along the old route (where it's closer to the locals), is likely to be a quicker way.  A non-freeway that's not far from the old route is likely to pass through a newer and bigger commercial district that grew up around it.
I'd like to buy a vowel, Alex.  What is E?

All roads lead away from Rome.

Two wrongs don't make a right, but three rights do make a left.

I-55

When Indiana relocates a US route but still maintains the old alignment, the route is typically numbered in the 900s. SR 930, 931, and 933 follow this pattern. Bannered routes in general are few and far between, gradually disappearing over time, with questionable legitimacy where they exist. When bypasses are constructed, the through route is typically moved onto the bypass (see US 31 in Kokomo). If the state does not maintain the old route, then the old route, now locally maintained, is usually called "Old Hwy/US/SR XX" (see Old SR 28 in Tipton Co), sometimes just "CR XX" if SR XX was truncated (see CR 327 & 427 in Dekalb County). In places where there was a separate local name (like Sagamore Parkway on US 52 in Lafayette) the decommissioned route will simply use the local name.

Mississippi does the same for old US alignments that are still state maintained except with numbers in the 100s (and 245 for the old alignment of Alt 45 between Egypt and Shannon).

Purdue Civil Engineering '24
Quote from: I-55 on April 13, 2025, 09:39:41 PMThe correct question is "if ARDOT hasn't signed it, why does Google show it?" and the answer as usual is "because Google Maps signs stuff incorrectly all the time"

hbelkins

How does Kentucky do it?

It's a hodge-podge. Sometimes the route keeps its original designation and the new alignment gets a "By-Pass" banner. (See US 127 in Lawrenceburg, Harrodsburg, and Danville). Other times, the designation stays on the new route and the old route gets a "Business" banner. (See US 127 in Jamestown and Albany). Sometimes it becomes a continuation of an existing route. (See the former US 150 in Stanford, which once was Business US 150 but is now KY 78 and KY 300.) Sometimes it gets an entirely new four-digit designation. (See former US 27 between Stanford and Burnside, which became KY 1247). And sometimes it becomes a county route. (See countless old routes near relocated segments across Kentucky).
Government would be tolerable if not for politicians and bureaucrats.

elsmere241

Quote from: kphoger on September 15, 2026, 03:38:58 PMWhen I see a signed Interstate business loop, if I assume anything about it, I assume there's actually a different exit coming up soon with more and/or better services closer to the interchange.

As Alisa and I have traveled around the western states over the years, there's an increasingly common scenario: Walmart will put a Supercenter complete with gas pumps at one of the business loop exits.