State Lays Out Vision for U.S. 23 Corridor Through Central Ohio

[TempoNick]

Probably not. I don't expect this to be completed in my lifetime.

Well, anybody could die tomorrow, but I fully expect it to get going by 2035, like they said.

[Rothman]

Probably not. I don't expect this to be completed in my lifetime.

Well, anybody could die tomorrow, but I fully expect it to get going by 2035, like they said.

Probably not for me, but I think the question is being asked of the wrong group of people. 

[TempoNick]

What it should really be called is the I-75/I-77 connector!

US-23 >I-71 >I-270 >US-33 >I-77

[NE2]

I see two corridors. Next.

[TempoNick]

I see two corridors. Next.

I see a beautiful way to skip I-75 and Atlanta traffic on the way to Florida that is roughly the same mileage and deserving of a unified number. (Not to mention skipping Cincinnati, Dayton and Northern Kentucky.) Taking some Michigan traffic off of I-75 wouldn't be such a bad thing.

-1,029 miles from Columbus to Tampa via I-75; 1,030 via I-77.
-1,178 miles from Detroit to Tampa via I-75; 1,210 via I-77. I-95 and I-4.
-1,387 miles from Detroit to Miami via I-75 and Florida's Turnpike; 1,346 via I-77 and I-95

[vtk]

The highway is real.

That's a bit premature. The just-completed study may be as far as this goes.

[PColumbus73]

Treating it like a 'Grand Atlanta Bypass' is probably a stretch. I-77 goes through some pretty treacherous terrain through the middle of West Virginia. When I go through the West Virginia Turnpike, I have to be focused the whole time between the Ohio River and Greensboro / Winston-Salem.

[wriddle082]

Treating it like a 'Grand Atlanta Bypass' is probably a stretch. I-77 goes through some pretty treacherous terrain through the middle of West Virginia. When I go through the West Virginia Turnpike, I have to be focused the whole time between the Ohio River and Greensboro / Winston-Salem.

And traffic is generally horrible during most daylight hours on I-77 between Statesville and the top end of I-485 because of the f-ing HOT lanes that nobody asked for and have only made things worse.  Also bad heading south out of Uptown Charlotte to the bottom end of I-485, but 485 can be used as a bypass (though the southbound merge kinda sucks).

Then factor in random slowdowns on I-26 SE of Columbia and I-95 down to the GA line, and it makes the I-75 route about the same, especially during the busy holiday travel periods.  People have started using US 321 and even US 301 to bypass a lot of the backups in SC.

What really needs to happen is Georgia getting on the ball to try to upgrade US 27 to a freeway or something somewhat better than what is there now, to make it a viable alternative to I-75.  Would also promote more economic development in West GA.

[TempoNick]

I would say both ways of getting to Florida are about equal but I still don't like going through Atlanta. And then you have the fog in the Tennessee mountains that aren't great to drive in either. It's also in Ohio's interest to pull traffic off of I-75 if it can to lessen congestion in Cincinnati, Dayton and Northern Kentucky.

In fact, I would fix the road to make it Interstate quality, give it a unified number and then I would put a big green sign up just before Findlay that says both roads take you to Florida. I don't know how much traffic you would be able to divert, but you won't know till you try it.

"I-477 - Columbus Carolinas/Florida" would be a lot more direct than what they were proposing for Ohio 161/37/16 to make it an alternate route to Pittsburgh.

[TempoNick]

The highway is real.

That's a bit premature. The just-completed study may be as far as this goes.

I have no doubt this is going to happen. Everybody understands the need for it except for a bunch of soreheads in Morrow County.

The thing I don't understand is why they would upgrade US 23 before they build the bypass. It seems to me that you build the bypass first and then figure out if you have to do anything to  US 23 south of there.

[vtk]

The thing I don't understand is why they would upgrade US 23 before they build the bypass. It seems to me that you build the bypass first and then figure out if you have to do anything to  US 23 south of there.

Even with the bypass, US 23 will still carry a lot of commuter traffic in southern Delaware county. The safety improvements are needed there, regardless.

[TempoNick]

The thing I don't understand is why they would upgrade US 23 before they build the bypass. It seems to me that you build the bypass first and then figure out if you have to do anything to  US 23 south of there.

Even with the bypass, US 23 will still carry a lot of commuter traffic in southern Delaware county. The safety improvements are needed there, regardless.

I'm just trying to think this through logically. If 22,000 cars a day will be using the bypass, sounds to me like US 23 in the Lewis Center area will be just fine as is or with much scaled down improvements. In fact, maybe there's an argument for leaving US 23 alone as an incentive to use the bypass. It would be a far more efficient use of resources.

[GCrites]

Treating it like a 'Grand Atlanta Bypass' is probably a stretch. I-77 goes through some pretty treacherous terrain through the middle of West Virginia. When I go through the West Virginia Turnpike, I have to be focused the whole time between the Ohio River and Greensboro / Winston-Salem.

And traffic is generally horrible during most daylight hours on I-77 between Statesville and the top end of I-485 because of the f-ing HOT lanes that nobody asked for and have only made things worse.  Also bad heading south out of Uptown Charlotte to the bottom end of I-485, but 485 can be used as a bypass (though the southbound merge kinda sucks).

Then factor in random slowdowns on I-26 SE of Columbia and I-95 down to the GA line, and it makes the I-75 route about the same, especially during the busy holiday travel periods.  People have started using US 321 and even US 301 to bypass a lot of the backups in SC.

What really needs to happen is Georgia getting on the ball to try to upgrade US 27 to a freeway or something somewhat better than what is there now, to make it a viable alternative to I-75.  Would also promote more economic development in West GA.

Don't forget Orlando traffic in the Tampa-Sarasota-Naples use case. Orlando traffic ain't nothin' to F with

[Hot Rod Hootenanny]

Probably not. I don't expect this to be completed in my lifetime.

Well, anybody could die tomorrow, but I fully expect it to get going by 2035, like they said.

US 33 will be full freeway from I-70 to Athens before I-73 gets built between US 23 & I-71

[TempoNick]

US 33 will be full freeway from I-70 to Athens before I-73 gets built between US 23 & I-71

A complete I-73 whether you call it that or not? Maybe.

A pretty much complete freeway between Upper Sandusky and I-71. It's happening because it has to happen. (Remove at-grade crossings from Upper Sandusky to Findlay over time.)

A US-33 freeway from I-70 to Athens? No, but from I-270 to Athens is pretty likely. (Unless that project around Petzinger Road counts as freeway. I don't think it does, but maybe it is.)

Besides, isn't another 25 or 30 miles past Athens going to be freeway? That means all except the last 30 miles to I-77/West Virginia will be freeway.

[carbaugh2]

US 33 will be full freeway from I-70 to Athens before I-73 gets built between US 23 & I-71

A complete I-73 whether you call it that or not? Maybe.

A pretty much complete freeway between Upper Sandusky and I-71. It's happening because it has to happen. (Remove at-grade crossings from Upper Sandusky to Findlay over time.)

A US-33 freeway from I-70 to Athens? No, but from I-270 to Athens is pretty likely. (Unless that project around Petzinger Road counts as freeway. I don't think it does, but maybe it is.)

Besides, isn't another 25 or 30 miles past Athens going to be freeway? That means all except the last 30 miles to I-77/West Virginia will be freeway.

To clarify, the current Petzinger Road project is only doing 2/3 the work. It is creating a RCUT at Petzinger but is also reworking the James Road and SR 104 weave. There will be a separate project to allow the ramp from I-70 East to bypass the Petzinger Rd intersection. In addition, the Sugar Grove traffic light needs converted to an interchange (needs another study; see post #373 in the related US 33 thread), the US 374 intersecton conversion needs to be completed at a cost of ~$140 million, and there will need to be a lot of intersections closed and frontage roads built between Nelsonville and Athens. I'm not sure that these projects will succeed in getting TRAC money quickly.

With the legislature's priority appearing to be I-73 and their power to control the purse and direct money to the connector as a separate line item in the transportation budget, I am leaning towards the connector being completed first.

Side note: After Athens, the section of US 33 between SR 681 and SR 7, or Darwin to Pomeroy, will not have controlled access. That leaves around 20 miles of divided highway and a bridge replacement at Ravenswood to complete the corridor.

[PColumbus73]

Side note: It's amusing to see I-73 gaining more attention in Ohio since the overall consensus was that the state didn't have an interest. Assuming Ohio does build out I-73 in the far future, how West Virginia upgrades US 35 to I-64 remains to be seen. The various accesses to private property along US 35 would be difficult to accommodate given the terrain.

[The Ghostbuster]

I would've thought US 35 in West Virginia would be as upgraded as it will ever need to be. As for US 35 in Ohio, the most I see potentially happening is non-freeway segments being upgraded into freeways.

[PColumbus73]

The section between Richmond Dale and Jackson would be challenging to convert to a freeway with a creek running alongside US 35.

[TempoNick]

I would've thought US 35 in West Virginia would be as upgraded as it will ever need to be. As for US 35 in Ohio, the most I see potentially happening is non-freeway segments being upgraded into freeways.

Side note: It's amusing to see I-73 gaining more attention in Ohio since the overall consensus was that the state didn't have an interest. Assuming Ohio does build out I-73 in the far future, how West Virginia upgrades US 35 to I-64 remains to be seen. The various accesses to private property along US 35 would be difficult to accommodate given the terrain.

Too many miles in West Virginia to convert, 35 miles I think, and as others have said, US 35 past Richmond Dale might be a challenge.

I love how ODOT had to basically be dragged kicking and screaming before they embraced the connector and (maybe) I-73. It's the right thing to do given how Columbus has grown. Even if it stops growing, I think it and the "outer-outerbelt" in general is a good project. 

I saw a video once that basically said that I-73 was actually several different projects and it was not necessary to have them all under I-73. And that's where my I-477 comes in!

[carbaugh2]

Side note: It's amusing to see I-73 gaining more attention in Ohio since the overall consensus was that the state didn't have an interest. Assuming Ohio does build out I-73 in the far future...

Ohioans living along the US 23 corridor from Marion to Toledo have been clamoring to have a direct freeway connection to Columbus for decades. Toledo leaders continue to be peeved that Akron has an interstate connection (76 to 71) despite having 70,000 less in population. The weekday drive on US 23 from Circleville to I-270 on the south side of Columbus is now reminiscent of how it looked going to Delaware back in the 1990s. While we all laugh about South Bloomfield, its population has doubled from 2,100 to 4,200 since 2020 (relinking the Axios article from post 202)).

There have also been changes in where the political leadership resides. When I-73 was studied in the 1990s, the Republican leadership had its strongholds in the suburbs. Currently, more of them reside in the rural areas. For example, the Ohio House Budget Committee Chairman lives in Circleville, and after seeing the last chairman (Jay Edwards from Nelsonville) get the money set aside to pay for the Athens to Ravenswood expansion of 33, I'm not surprised to see that there is so much focus on upgrading 23 on both sides of Columbus.

[GCrites]

Driving on 23 around Circleville and Delaware really is similar. You've got the river on one side and the cities on the other. You can see the old towns well from the freeways. And you've got the suburban/highway-type businesses like Wal-Mart and gas stations snugged up against the highways on the edge of the towns. Both towns got Wal-Marts right on 23 very early for the Columbus metro, late '80s in Circleville and early '90s in Delaware. Wal-Mart didn't do much in the Columbus metro at all until the 2000s since we already had so many K-Marts and Meijers. Most exits on 270 had K-Marts nearby.

[TempoNick]

Driving on 23 around Circleville and Delaware really is similar. You've got the river on one side and the cities on the other. You can see the old towns well from the freeways. And you've got the suburban/highway-type businesses like Wal-Mart and gas stations snugged up against the highways on the edge of the towns. Both towns got Wal-Marts right on 23 very early for the Columbus metro, late '80s in Circleville and early '90s in Delaware. Wal-Mart didn't do much in the Columbus metro at all until the 2000s since we already had so many K-Marts and Meijers. Most exits on 270 had K-Marts nearby.

Maybe this will be a lesson learned to prevent letting another Delaware happen again. Build it while you still can. Or at least acquire the land so that it is ready to go. US 22 east of Circleville is pretty impressive in that way. It would be pretty easy to drop a freeway into that corridor.

I look at the upgrades to 23 North of Columbus and 33 southeast of Columbus is basically mirroring I-71. I-71 diagonally crosses one part of the state and this new set of roads will diagonally cross the opposite parts of the state.

They should scrap the US 23 surface Road upgrade and just work on the connector and the highways.

[carbaugh2]

I'm quoting from the Ohio thread, but it makes more sense to bring this part of the conversation back to our US 23 conversation.

US 33 doesn't need to be an Interstate, nor does US 35. I doubt Ohio needs any additional Interstate designations.

Multilane divided highways without traffic signals are adequate for most of Ohio's needs. Here's a summary of Ohio's multilane divided highways, this should include all of the notable corridors:

Divided highways with traffic signals:

• US 33 between I-70 in Columbus and Athens
• US 23 and OH 15 between Portsmouth and Findlay

I'm focusing on these two segments as they are in the process of having the traffic signals and at grade intersections upgraded to limited access with interchanges. Regardless of the outcome of the I-73 corridor study, ODOT District 1 has been working on the US 23/SR 15 corridor through spot safety improvement projects (see this project and another that gets halfway there). I will caveat on the US 33 corridor by saying that I think it will be upgraded in the nearer future to full freeway from I-270 to Nelsonville. District 10 already has a design from the Hocking County line to the current freeway start at SR 180 while District 5 is in the middle of the project to convert the Pickerington Rd intersection to an interchange. Unfortunately, District 5 is not as far along on getting a preliminary design for the traffic light at Sugar Grove. Further, I don't see the upgrade of 33- mostly frontage roads and access closures- from Nelsonville to Athens happening in the next decade or so. While District 10 can use the Hocking Hills tourism (~7 million visitors annually) to help with the Hocking County project, the traffic numbers aren't there for the Nelsonville-Athens segment. That will have to wait for more truck traffic.

I counted about 11 at-grade crossings that need to be upgraded between Findlay and Marion. Most of them look like you could easily close them and redirect traffic without building any frontage roads. In other words, you probably need all 11 as things exist right now, but build a couple of interchanges and you could easily close them off and redirect traffic to those new access points. A project that once seemed pretty daunting now seems pretty doable with the connector.

In the video at the bottom of the US 23/SR 294 interchange project page (the first link I shared), the presentation indicates that the 3 at grade crossings between SR 294 and SR 231 and the TR 65 intersection will all be closed after the completion of the new interchange. The video stated that they are not addressing the CR 113/TR 124 intersection, which leads me to believe that ODOT wants to build an overpass but can't address it in this project due to financial constraints. Those access closures would cover 4 of the 11 you identified.

[Dirt Roads]

Too many miles in West Virginia to convert, 35 miles I think...

I might be wrong these days, but its been my impression that if either Ohio or Kentucky were to push for a new freeway into West Virginia, the DOH would find the political means to play the "Match Game".  (It's only been 15 years since that happened with the Pennsylvania Turnpike Commission, something that nobody in West Virginia really thought would ever happen: "Who needs a freeway to Uniontown").  Historically, the DOH can get some additional funding from the Appalachian Regional Commission for such projects (even if not on an official AHDS Corridor).

At that pace that Ohio is going, the DOH might get pressed into both a US-33 freeway and a US-35 freeway in roughly the same timeframe (ergo, next 20 years or so).