IN: US 31 South Bend to Plymouth Upgrade report

[NWI_Irish96]

I was just reading on the website's FAQ page that they were able to give away the former (will be former) US 31 to Marshall County and Lapaz and South Bend but not able to do so within St. Joseph County outside of South Bend and that that stretch will still be under INDOT control. Anyone heard anything about this and whether it means this will be a new highway?

Since Indiana does discontinuous segments of the same number, it would most likely be another 931, though as was noted above may not get signed. 

[silverback1065]

wont this be an island sr?  I don't think it will connect to anything on either end, or even cross another sr for that matter.

[NWI_Irish96]

I don't know if there will be direct access to Old 31 from the Kern Rd. interchange, but if not, it would be only a couple hundred feet away.

The road will still intersect 4 in Lakeville.

If the southern end is the Marshall/St. Joseph line, then no, it wouldn't connect to anything at that end.  It would be 2 miles away from US 6.

[silverback1065]

I don't know if there will be direct access to Old 31 from the Kern Rd. interchange, but if not, it would be only a couple hundred feet away.

The road will still intersect 4 in Lakeville.

If the southern end is the Marshall/St. Joseph line, then no, it wouldn't connect to anything at that end.  It would be 2 miles away from US 6.

They should sign it as 931, but I doubt it will be signed at all.

[Avalanchez71]

On a recent trip through South Bend, I took a look at progress on the US 31 project. This is a 20 mile freeway upgrade project that goes from US 20 in South Bend south to US 30 in Plymouth. Of that length, 15 miles are being built on a new terrain, and from US 30 north for five miles will use the existing roadway. The new road is planned to be open in 2014.

Among the problems are peat deposits that require removal of a substantial amount of material. This is an article from a contractor, ES Wagner. Other questions are answered on the INDOT FAQ page. Some of the project can already be seen in Google Maps east of Lakeville and Lapaz.

Remaining contracts to be let:

• 02/08/2012 Jackson Road over US 31, various roads over US 20
• 03/07/2012 Connecting existing highway to new highway (half mile north of US 6) and new US 6 interchange
• 04/04/2012 Kern Road interchange
• 10/11/2012 7th Road Interchange, resurface existing US 31

1st Road overpass


Looking north from Tyler Rd.


Pierce Rd - SR 4 extension to new US 31


New US 31 crossing existing US 31

Why is good farm land being destroyed?

[billtm]

On a recent trip through South Bend, I took a look at progress on the US 31 project. This is a 20 mile freeway upgrade project that goes from US 20 in South Bend south to US 30 in Plymouth. Of that length, 15 miles are being built on a new terrain, and from US 30 north for five miles will use the existing roadway. The new road is planned to be open in 2014.

Among the problems are peat deposits that require removal of a substantial amount of material. This is an article from a contractor, ES Wagner. Other questions are answered on the INDOT FAQ page. Some of the project can already be seen in Google Maps east of Lakeville and Lapaz.

Remaining contracts to be let:

• 02/08/2012 Jackson Road over US 31, various roads over US 20
• 03/07/2012 Connecting existing highway to new highway (half mile north of US 6) and new US 6 interchange
• 04/04/2012 Kern Road interchange
• 10/11/2012 7th Road Interchange, resurface existing US 31

1st Road overpass


Looking north from Tyler Rd.


Pierce Rd - SR 4 extension to new US 31


New US 31 crossing existing US 31

Why is good farm land being destroyed?

To make way for a new highway.

[hbelkins]

I'm beginning to think that he doesn't want any new roads built. First the I-69 bridges and now this.

Of course, I'm one of those who thinks that US 31 was fine as it was as a four-lane surface route and a freeway wasn't needed.

[NWI_Irish96]

I'm beginning to think that he doesn't want any new roads built. First the I-69 bridges and now this.

Of course, I'm one of those who thinks that US 31 was fine as it was as a four-lane surface route and a freeway wasn't needed.

It is most definitely needed.  A lot of accidents involving cars slowing to make left turns getting rear-ended. 

[hbelkins]

I'm beginning to think that he doesn't want any new roads built. First the I-69 bridges and now this.

Of course, I'm one of those who thinks that US 31 was fine as it was as a four-lane surface route and a freeway wasn't needed.

It is most definitely needed.  A lot of accidents involving cars slowing to make left turns getting rear-ended.

That's why you build turning lanes or a mountable median.

[silverback1065]

I'm beginning to think that he doesn't want any new roads built. First the I-69 bridges and now this.

Of course, I'm one of those who thinks that US 31 was fine as it was as a four-lane surface route and a freeway wasn't needed.

It is most definitely needed.  A lot of accidents involving cars slowing to make left turns getting rear-ended.

That's why you build turning lanes or a mountable median.

US 31 needs to be an interstate from Indianapolis to traverse city Michigan, with the amount of traffic it gets, it is embarrassing that it has taken this long for that process to happen.  The road carries a lot of truck traffic, as well as local and tourist traffic.  I-67 in southern indiana is completely useless

[tdindy88]

There's also the whole driving through towns such as Lapaz and Lakeville with the speed traps that are in them.

[NWI_Irish96]

I'm beginning to think that he doesn't want any new roads built. First the I-69 bridges and now this.

Of course, I'm one of those who thinks that US 31 was fine as it was as a four-lane surface route and a freeway wasn't needed.

It is most definitely needed.  A lot of accidents involving cars slowing to make left turns getting rear-ended.

That's why you build turning lanes or a mountable median.

Adding a 5th lane would have cost quite a few houses, plus I'm not sure a left turn lane is really feasible with the way property entrances are spaced.  Risk of cars going opposite directions entering the turn lane at some point. 

How much have you actually traveled this stretch of road???

[Terry Shea]

On a recent trip through South Bend, I took a look at progress on the US 31 project. This is a 20 mile freeway upgrade project that goes from US 20 in South Bend south to US 30 in Plymouth. Of that length, 15 miles are being built on a new terrain, and from US 30 north for five miles will use the existing roadway. The new road is planned to be open in 2014.

Among the problems are peat deposits that require removal of a substantial amount of material. This is an article from a contractor, ES Wagner. Other questions are answered on the INDOT FAQ page. Some of the project can already be seen in Google Maps east of Lakeville and Lapaz.

Remaining contracts to be let:

• 02/08/2012 Jackson Road over US 31, various roads over US 20
• 03/07/2012 Connecting existing highway to new highway (half mile north of US 6) and new US 6 interchange
• 04/04/2012 Kern Road interchange
• 10/11/2012 7th Road Interchange, resurface existing US 31

1st Road overpass


Looking north from Tyler Rd.


Pierce Rd - SR 4 extension to new US 31


New US 31 crossing existing US 31

Why is good farm land being destroyed?

Because it's hard to find bad farmland to destroy in the area!

[hbelkins]

How much have you actually traveled this stretch of road???

I drove the entire length from the end of former IN 431 to South Bend several years ago.

[Avalanchez71]

On a recent trip through South Bend, I took a look at progress on the US 31 project. This is a 20 mile freeway upgrade project that goes from US 20 in South Bend south to US 30 in Plymouth. Of that length, 15 miles are being built on a new terrain, and from US 30 north for five miles will use the existing roadway. The new road is planned to be open in 2014.

Among the problems are peat deposits that require removal of a substantial amount of material. This is an article from a contractor, ES Wagner. Other questions are answered on the INDOT FAQ page. Some of the project can already be seen in Google Maps east of Lakeville and Lapaz.

Remaining contracts to be let:

• 02/08/2012 Jackson Road over US 31, various roads over US 20
• 03/07/2012 Connecting existing highway to new highway (half mile north of US 6) and new US 6 interchange
• 04/04/2012 Kern Road interchange
• 10/11/2012 7th Road Interchange, resurface existing US 31

1st Road overpass


Looking north from Tyler Rd.


Pierce Rd - SR 4 extension to new US 31


New US 31 crossing existing US 31

Why is good farm land being destroyed?

Because it's hard to find bad farmland to destroy in the area!

Not a traffic light in sight.  Looks like an adequate road to me.

[NWI_Irish96]

How much have you actually traveled this stretch of road???

I drove the entire length from the end of former IN 431 to South Bend several years ago.

I've driven lots of roads in Kentucky one time, and I wouldn't pretend that I know better than you what road improvements are and aren't best for Kentucky.

[NWI_Irish96]

Not a traffic light in sight.  Looks like an adequate road to me.

Current traffic lights:
Johnson Rd.
Kern Rd.
New Rd. has only a blinking yellow but is a dangerous intersection and would probably have needed a traffic light soon.
SR 4
US 6

Plus many, many houses and businesses directly accessed from the road, which leads to cars slowing to make turns in front of faster moving cars.  Union-North schools are on this road, and there are frequent problems at the beginning and end of school days.  There need to be separate routes for local and thru traffic, which is what we are not going to have. 

[hbelkins]

How much have you actually traveled this stretch of road???

I drove the entire length from the end of former IN 431 to South Bend several years ago.

I've driven lots of roads in Kentucky one time, and I wouldn't pretend that I know better than you what road improvements are and aren't best for Kentucky.

I see the same arguments for US 23 in southwestern Virginia and eastern Kentucky. "Needs to be an Interstate. Extend I-26." And for southern Ohio. "Make it I-73." And Corridor D. "Turn it into a western extension of I-68."

In general, four-lane surface routes don't need to be upgraded to Interstates along their whole length. Bypass Kokomo, fine, I can see wanting to get rid of a bunch of traffic lights, but does traffic move so poorly on the rest of the route that it has to be a full freeway?

Let's upgrade all of the US 41/IN 63 corridor next.

[NWI_Irish96]

How much have you actually traveled this stretch of road???

I drove the entire length from the end of former IN 431 to South Bend several years ago.

I've driven lots of roads in Kentucky one time, and I wouldn't pretend that I know better than you what road improvements are and aren't best for Kentucky.

I see the same arguments for US 23 in southwestern Virginia and eastern Kentucky. "Needs to be an Interstate. Extend I-26." And for southern Ohio. "Make it I-73." And Corridor D. "Turn it into a western extension of I-68."

In general, four-lane surface routes don't need to be upgraded to Interstates along their whole length. Bypass Kokomo, fine, I can see wanting to get rid of a bunch of traffic lights, but does traffic move so poorly on the rest of the route that it has to be a full freeway?

Let's upgrade all of the US 41/IN 63 corridor next.

We're not talking about the entire length of US 31.  We're talking about the portion from US 20 to US 30.  That portion needs to be a freeway.  The portion between US 30 and US 24 does not need to be a freeway, and thus, US 31 does not need to be an interstate.  I know others have suggested that, and that may be causing your reaction, but the particular portion of US 31 that this particular thread is about most definitely needs upgrading. 

[theline]

How much have you actually traveled this stretch of road???

I drove the entire length from the end of former IN 431 to South Bend several years ago.

I see the same arguments for US 23 in southwestern Virginia and eastern Kentucky. "Needs to be an Interstate. Extend I-26." And for southern Ohio. "Make it I-73." And Corridor D. "Turn it into a western extension of I-68."

In general, four-lane surface routes don't need to be upgraded to Interstates along their whole length. Bypass Kokomo, fine, I can see wanting to get rid of a bunch of traffic lights, but does traffic move so poorly on the rest of the route that it has to be a full freeway?

Let's upgrade all of the US 41/IN 63 corridor next.

We're not talking about the entire length of US 31.  We're talking about the portion from US 20 to US 30.  That portion needs to be a freeway.  The portion between US 30 and US 24 does not need to be a freeway, and thus, US 31 does not need to be an interstate.  I know others have suggested that, and that may be causing your reaction, but the particular portion of US 31 that this particular thread is about most definitely needs upgrading.

I've driven lots of roads in Kentucky one time, and I wouldn't pretend that I know better than you what road improvements are and aren't best for Kentucky.

As a South Bend resident, I've got to agree with cabiness here. The problem is way too many private drives on a high-speed, heavily-trafficked highway. Adding a center turn lane might have helped, but the land acquisition would have been a nightmare. Going with new terrain was the only reasonable choice. If you're going new terrain anyway, building to interstate standards makes a lot sense, considering the traffic level.

(Edited to fix the quotes. I had managed to mangle them somehow.)

[Avalanchez71]

How much have you actually traveled this stretch of road???

I drove the entire length from the end of former IN 431 to South Bend several years ago.

I've driven lots of roads in Kentucky one time, and I wouldn't pretend that I know better than you what road improvements are and aren't best for Kentucky.

I see the same arguments for US 23 in southwestern Virginia and eastern Kentucky. "Needs to be an Interstate. Extend I-26." And for southern Ohio. "Make it I-73." And Corridor D. "Turn it into a western extension of I-68."

In general, four-lane surface routes don't need to be upgraded to Interstates along their whole length. Bypass Kokomo, fine, I can see wanting to get rid of a bunch of traffic lights, but does traffic move so poorly on the rest of the route that it has to be a full freeway?

Let's upgrade all of the US 41/IN 63 corridor next.

I think this has come up heretofore, why isn't SR 63 US 41 or ALT US 41?

[Brandon]

How much have you actually traveled this stretch of road???

I drove the entire length from the end of former IN 431 to South Bend several years ago.

I've driven lots of roads in Kentucky one time, and I wouldn't pretend that I know better than you what road improvements are and aren't best for Kentucky.

I see the same arguments for US 23 in southwestern Virginia and eastern Kentucky. "Needs to be an Interstate. Extend I-26." And for southern Ohio. "Make it I-73." And Corridor D. "Turn it into a western extension of I-68."

In general, four-lane surface routes don't need to be upgraded to Interstates along their whole length. Bypass Kokomo, fine, I can see wanting to get rid of a bunch of traffic lights, but does traffic move so poorly on the rest of the route that it has to be a full freeway?

Let's upgrade all of the US 41/IN 63 corridor next.

I think this has come up heretofore, why isn't SR 63 US 41 or ALT US 41?

InDOT doesn't do Alts.

[Avalanchez71]

Seems like I saw a map with US 31E and US 31W in IN.  Maybe they could do that.

[tdindy88]

And old map maybe, there's been no suffixed routes like that in years. Indiana just doesn't do things like they do in Tennessee or Kentucky, end of story.

[NWI_Irish96]

Seems like I saw a map with US 31E and US 31W in IN.  Maybe they could do that.

Yeah, US 31 used to split at Sellersburg with 31E following the current routing of 31 through Jeffersonville and over the Clark bridge.  31W followed what until recently was 311 through New Albany and across the K&I bridge (which no longer carries cars).

However, as this applies to US 41 and SR 63, I don't see any usage of Alt or E/W being an option.  Really AASHTO needs to decide that US 41 needs to be rerouted onto SR 63 and then INDOT would need to create a new designation for old 41 (SR 141?)