Why is US-1/US-9 allowed to be US-1&9?

[dgolub]

They don't know the difference?  I guess it depends on the state then.  Not every state's residents use "route" or "highway" before every route number (a la Wisconsin where every damn thing is "highway" including the interstates).  Some actually use a separate designator for each class of route (Michigan is one - M, US, or I).

Most people are not road geeks.  If you give the average person a US or state route shield and ask which it is, they probably wouldn't know.  At least here in the Northeast.

[deathtopumpkins]

Or an interstate shield for that matter. Everything up here is just "route".

Route 95, route 1, route 1A, etc.

[jeffandnicole]

They don't know the difference?  I guess it depends on the state then.  Not every state's residents use "route" or "highway" before every route number (a la Wisconsin where every damn thing is "highway" including the interstates).  Some actually use a separate designator for each class of route (Michigan is one - M, US, or I).

Most people are not road geeks.  If you give the average person a US or state route shield and ask which it is, they probably wouldn't know.  At least here in the Northeast.

I find, at least in my area of NJ, many people think the state routes (NJ 45 for example) are maintained by the county.

What was really frustrating: A few years back, I submitted a few comments to the DVRPC as part of the NJ TIP review.  Two of my comments, regarding US 322 in Glassboro and the intersection of NJ 42 and Cross Keys Rd (CR 689), were submitted to the COUNTY for review, even though both sections of roadway are maintained by the State.  So whoever was in charge of the comments section of the DVRPC isn't even aware of the proper agency overseeing the roads in NJ.  Being the TIP is a state publication, it wouldn't have even dawned on me that the comments would be submitted to a county government for review.

Alas, the responses for those two comments were basically this: "We don't have jurisdiction for that particular area".  What a waste of time.

[roadman65]

They don't know the difference?  I guess it depends on the state then.  Not every state's residents use "route" or "highway" before every route number (a la Wisconsin where every damn thing is "highway" including the interstates).  Some actually use a separate designator for each class of route (Michigan is one - M, US, or I).

Most people are not road geeks.  If you give the average person a US or state route shield and ask which it is, they probably wouldn't know.  At least here in the Northeast.

I find, at least in my area of NJ, many people think the state routes (NJ 45 for example) are maintained by the county.

What was really frustrating: A few years back, I submitted a few comments to the DVRPC as part of the NJ TIP review.  Two of my comments, regarding US 322 in Glassboro and the intersection of NJ 42 and Cross Keys Rd (CR 689), were submitted to the COUNTY for review, even though both sections of roadway are maintained by the State.  So whoever was in charge of the comments section of the DVRPC isn't even aware of the proper agency overseeing the roads in NJ.  Being the TIP is a state publication, it wouldn't have even dawned on me that the comments would be submitted to a county government for review.

Alas, the responses for those two comments were basically this: "We don't have jurisdiction for that particular area".  What a waste of time.

I think the same thing happened with the Garden State Parkway at US 22.  Back in the day when NJDOT maintained the Parkway from US 22 to the NJ Turnpike, the southbound signage for Exits 140 and 140A were substandard with the Gore Directional guide signs and no overhead assemblies were present.  It was not until the early or mid 90s when the NJ Highway Authority installed the typical rust looking gantries, as for years both agencies the NJDOT and NJHA thought each other had jurisdiction over the exit guides at US 22 and NJ 82, so the substandard signage remained for long after both the GSP and NJDOT modernized their guides on both sides of the changeover.

[Alps]

Locals say "1-n-9."

I learned it as a local, and it could be that I learned to (verbally and mentally) slur the "n" out of existence.  This should not be taken as another example of laziness in NJ, but rather efficiency.

I'm saying it out loud. "One 'n'" comes out as one syllable. It's a little quicker than saying "Runnin'", as if the vowel disappeared but the syllable didn't.

[NJRoadfan]

To summerize.

The proper way to show this multiplexed route is to use two separate shields as shown here in Newark.

"By the book"


Back in the day, it was sometimes signed this way using a 3dus shield. Signs of this style appeared on Truck 1&9 around the old Charlotte Circle back in 2003 as well.

"The ampersand"


In the late 90s, someone decided that the ampersand and separate shields might be hard to read, so they decided to change things up with a hyphen. This is the way things are done presently.

"1 minus 9"


The truck route is simple enough to sign, but the proper signing like this one is rare and hard to come by. Most of the banners on this route say "TRUCKS", which there are plenty of on that road.

"Truck.... by the book"


Of course all those separate signs are hard to keep track of and tend to go missing, so lets just consolidate everything into one shield.

"one 'n' nine-tea"


Then of course we have..... The Mutants

The theory of how NJ-139 got its number is the ampersand in "1&9" kinda looked like the number "3". So lets just reverse it because it seems to work that way too.

"Do The Funky Ampersand"


Someone here said that one can confuse the road as being "Route 19". Perhaps they saw this ingeniously efficient design constructed with a minimum of materials formerly found in front of the Newark DMV inspection station.

"The 2dus"


Sign makers, never running out of new ideas, decided to go in a new direction.... vertical.

"2dus... stacked"


Thats all I got.
</end thread>

[_Simon]

Locals say "1-n-9."

I learned it as a local, and it could be that I learned to (verbally and mentally) slur the "n" out of existence.  This should not be taken as another example of laziness in NJ, but rather efficiency.

I'm saying it out loud. "One 'n'" comes out as one syllable. It's a little quicker than saying "Runnin'", as if the vowel disappeared but the syllable didn't.

One n nine.  One n-nine.  Oneannine.  Wunnannine.  It's definitely locally pronounced "WUN-ən-nïne"

[bugo]

Those shields look like US 169 shields at first glance, a road that I am very familiar with.

What about US 56/412 signed in the same shield?

[Brandon]

Those shields look like US 169 shields at first glance, a road that I am very familiar with.

What about US 56/412 signed in the same shield?

Hell, we've got US-45/52 in the same shield in multiple locations in Kankakee, IL.

I have yet to see a US-12/20, US-12/45, or US-12/20/45 on La Grange Road or 95th Street in the same shield.

[agentsteel53]

12/20 did exist, a while back anyway. 

[Brandon]

^^ Cool.  I've yet to see a current one a la the US-45/52s in Kankakee.  I believe Peoria/East Peoria have a few IL-8-116s around.

[Pete from Boston]

Locals say "1-n-9."

I learned it as a local, and it could be that I learned to (verbally and mentally) slur the "n" out of existence.  This should not be taken as another example of laziness in NJ, but rather efficiency.

I'm saying it out loud. "One 'n'" comes out as one syllable. It's a little quicker than saying "Runnin'", as if the vowel disappeared but the syllable didn't.

One n nine.  One n-nine.  Oneannine.  Wunnannine.  It's definitely locally pronounced "WUN-ən-nïne"

What can I say, I lived 15 miles away from it, but it was folks right along it who got me saying simply "one nine."

Never did hear anyone say "One nine forty-six," though, because as everyone knows, that's simply "Route forty-six."

[D-Dey65]

Almost makes me glad that NYSDOT won't re-extend NY 100 and 22 back into Manhattan. People might incorrectly pronounce it as "Route 122."

Reviving NY 22 in Manhattan would be okay, though.

[dgolub]

Almost makes me glad that NYSDOT won't re-extend NY 100 and 22 back into Manhattan. People might incorrectly pronounce it as "Route 122."

Reviving NY 22 in Manhattan would be okay, though.

Yeah, that would be really messed up if people called NY 100/NY 22 "Route 122."

For us road geeks, extending NY 22 back down into Manhattan would be really cool, but in practice it doesn't make sense to route long-distance traffic through the heart of a major city unless the alternate route is so roundabout that a lot of people wouldn't want to use it anyway.  I recently did a post about adding NY 495 across Midtown to connect the Lincoln Tunnel and the Long Island Expressway.  I would also support reinstating NY 27 across Canal Street and the Manhattan Bridge, since it's the most direct route between Brooklyn and New Jersey.  However, using any of the north/south avenues in Manhattan doesn't really make sense unless you have a destination in Manhattan.  The truck route network follows this idea.  Trucks can use 34 Street to cross Manhattan in Midtown, and they can use Canal Street and some of the other streets in the area to get from the Holland Tunnel (I-78) to the Williamsburg Bridge and the Manhattan Bridge.  However, they can't use any north/south roadway in Manhattan other than NY 9A unless they have a destination in the borough.

[roadman65]

Having an actual street designation of NY 495 would be an excellent idea.  It does have merit, but like you said 34th Street would have to be designated as TRUCK NY 495.  NYSDOT does not have to maintain it as there are plenty of examples in NYS where a state route is either county or municipally maintained.

The Bronx River Parkway could be NY 22 if needed to be extended back into the city.  NY Routes can be on Parkways as the case for NY 9A.  NY 100 could become the lower part of the Saw Mill while NY 9A gets truncated.  Since Business US 1 & 9 in New Jersey became NJ 139, NY 9A no longer serves as an alternate to US 9 so having NY 100 end at the Battery Tunnel would be a better routing than present NY 9A south of US 9 uptown.

[southshore720]

At least it's not as ugly as this interstate shield combo I saw near Lucas Oil Stadium in Indianapolis, back on August 22, 2010:



P.S. Wish those gas prices were still around now. Better than $3.919 up the street from me!

I kind of like this shield, actually...it's the first of its kind that I've ever seen.  It certainly saves on assembly space!

[dgolub]

The Bronx River Parkway could be NY 22 if needed to be extended back into the city.  NY Routes can be on Parkways as the case for NY 9A.  NY 100 could become the lower part of the Saw Mill while NY 9A gets truncated.  Since Business US 1 & 9 in New Jersey became NJ 139, NY 9A no longer serves as an alternate to US 9 so having NY 100 end at the Battery Tunnel would be a better routing than present NY 9A south of US 9 uptown.

Why not just resurrect the old route across East 233 Street and then down Jerome Avenue to the Macombs Dam Bridge?

As far as NY 9A goes, if anything, I'd advocate for keeping it as is and adding Truck NY 9A along Broadway up into the Bronx.

[roadman65]

Was not NY 22 originally along the Grand Concourse?  Then it went down Park Avenue in Manhattan to Grand Central to terminate there.  Unfortunatlely I do not have my old maps, as it was years ago I read it as I am now 50.  My dad never thought road maps would be worth anything to keep back in the 70's, so it was never saved.

What about resurrecting NY 1A again?  It I remember used the Bronx River Parkway south of Fordham Road and onto Bruckner Blvd/ Expwy, then across on the Willis Avenue and Macombs Dam Bridge combo, to First and Second Avenues to Houston Street, and 6th Avenue/ Varick Street pair to the Holland Tunnel.  It would keep US 1 in the city more even if it is a state route spur.