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Author Topic: Oregon - Washington Notes  (Read 6084 times)

Bickendan

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Oregon - Washington Notes
« on: May 06, 2015, 06:56:08 PM »

'OR 170' Canby-Marquam Highway
For running through farm land, this is a surprisingly windy road. Decommissioned by ODOT in 1994, persisting in the Thomas Guide for a couple years after, and helpfully still marked as OR 170 on Google maps. Originally maintained from OR 99E to OR 211, the road name Canby-Marquam Highway runs south of OR 211 through Yoder to S Kropf Rd.

OR 211 gives way from farmlands of the Willamette Valley to the woods straddling the Clackamas River before crossing the river into Estacada and along OR 224 to Eagle Creek. The overlap with OR 224 can be done at a comfortable 80, with 'Keep Right Except To Pass' at the two points it widens to four lanes, though this can be risky as this feels like a good corridor for the Oregon State Patrol and/or Clackamas County Sheriff to patrol. Oddly enough, OR 211 is signed as a North-South route, even though it's very much an East-West corridor, even between Estacada and Sandy.

OR 224 west of Eagle Creek is surprisingly windy, wooded and with traffic, including TriMet's Line 30 between Estacada and Clackamas (or Portland). It's not posted above 45. Once 224 merges with OR 212, it becomes a fairly straight, four lane road to I-205. It is part of the Sunrise Corridor project, ostensibly a freeway extension currently under construction from the Milwaukie Expressway at I-205 east, eventually to the OR 212/224 split.

WA 503 (Orchards-Battle Ground) has a business loop for Brush Prairie that has never been marked in the Thomas Guides.

WA 502 is being widened to four lanes and divided for its length.

WA 411 has no direct connection to WA 4, as WA 4 takes an odd alignment switch to favor the bridge to the north.

Even though WA 4 runs from the coast to I-5, all traffic heading beyond Kelso and Longview is directed to WA 432 to bypass the two cities, whether to continue onto WA 4 or to head to US 30 via WA 433.

WA 433 no longer has northbound trailblazer shields on the Oregon side of the Lewis and Clark Bridge. It is unclear if the exit signage from US 30 has WA 433 indicated. MapQuest (OSM) has WA 433 marked as such on the Oregon side, likewise for WA 409 on the Oregon side of the Cathelmet ferry.

OR 47 from Clatskanie to Mist is very windy, and being stuck behind someone who won't go over 50 and takes all the curves below the advisory speeds is no fun at all.

OR 202 is a surprisingly fun drive, mixing in curves with decent straightaways. Approaching Astoria, address get absurdly high -- the highest I saw just before Astoria's address grid kicked in was 936xx.

Bus US 101 is closed over the Lewis and Clark River for bridge reconstruction. The Youngs Bay Bridge is fairly narrow and and trucks and buses are directed to treat it as a one-lane facility. As a business route, it feels quite pointless, and doesn't function efficiently for to be an Alternate or Bypass route. It feels like Bus US 101 has been realigned on its west end; the road running from Bus US 101 to the RIRO with US 101 is named Alt US 101 (and actually crossed before the RIRO was put in). Bus US 101/OR 202's northern terminus with US 101 is now a roundabout. Online maps suggest that Bus 101 continues past 101 at the west end to OR 104 in Warrenton. No signage in the field reflects this. Bus US 101 does provide access to the new Lewis and Clark National Park.

OR 104S is not signed in the field. It's routed along the road named Alt US 101 on the west side of US 101.

OR 104 is signed, and serves as Warrenton and Hammond's Main Street and terminates at Ft Stevens State Park. Does not get over 35. Provides indirect access to the mouth of the Columbia River on the Oregon side.

US 101 is marked at 55 from OR 202 to Gearhart, then drops to 45 all the way to US 26. Bit long of a stretch for 45. It does have addresses in the 910xx range, making me wonder what the zero point is for both US 101 and OR 202 is. (US 30 reaches 756xx just outside of Rainier, maintaining Portland's address grid to that point).

US 26 can easily be done around 70 all the way from the coast to Portland if traffic were non-existent. However, this is a heavily patrolled route, and traffic does like to drive on the slow side, especially coming down from the David Douglas and Coast Range Summits. While I'd like to see more passing lanes along the Sunset, I'd be hard pressed to see ODOT putting them in. Any ideas of upgrading US 26 west of OR 47 is pointless, even if I'd personally like to see US 26 as four lanes from OR 6 west.

OR 22 is an expressway from OR 223 (spur) all the way into Salem, with an exit number (16) at OR 233 and 99W. The freeway portion in West Salem does not have exit numbers.

OR 194 (Monmouth Highway; west of OR 99W) is not signed at this time.

OR 223 apparently has two spurs. The main leg runs north from Dallas to OR 22. The spur runs east from Dallas to OR 22 exit 16. The spur has a spur along Rickreall Rd to OR 99W. All are signed as OR 223.

OR 154 and 155 are not signed in the field.

No signs of the Newberg-Dundee Bypass have been noted at this time.

OR 99W should be reconsidered reinstated along SW Barbur Blvd, Naito Parkway, N Interstate and Denver Aves per an ODOT construction project along N Denver Ave from I-5. No trailblazers along Naito, Interstate or Denver, however.

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nexus73

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Re: Oregon - Washington Notes
« Reply #1 on: May 06, 2015, 07:30:17 PM »

US 26 should be a freeway all the way to US 101 as should 99W/18.  There is so much traffic going to and from PDX/Salem and the coast that the improvement is justified.  25 years ago ODOT had plans to upgrade all the busiest sections of US 101 to 4-lane but that got abandoned.  Their next step was parkways but after a mile of it was built in Lincoln County, no one else wanted anything to do with that style of highway.  Since then the coast has been a real orphan for ODOT.  As a citizen of the coast I am most certainly not amused.

Rick
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US 101 is THE backbone of the Pacific coast from Bandon OR to Willets CA.  Industry, tourism and local traffic would be gone or severely crippled without it being in functioning condition in BOTH states.

Bruce

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Re: Oregon - Washington Notes
« Reply #2 on: May 06, 2015, 07:40:25 PM »

Another oddity from the area: WA-100 is a circular route with a short section that connects the loop to US 101, thus it terminates at itself. It is also signed with a "LOOP" banner.

corco

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Re: Oregon - Washington Notes
« Reply #3 on: May 06, 2015, 11:53:42 PM »

Quote
It is unclear if the exit signage from US 30 has WA 433 indicated.

Can confirm as of three weeks ago it does not. Also of note in Longview/Kelso is that SR 432 is far less liberally signed as "TO US-30" than it used to be- the "TO US-30" signage doesn't begin appearing until west of the SR 411 junction, where it used to be signed that way from I-5.

TEG24601

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Re: Oregon - Washington Notes
« Reply #4 on: May 07, 2015, 03:36:12 PM »

US 26 should be a freeway all the way to US 101 as should 99W/18.  There is so much traffic going to and from PDX/Salem and the coast that the improvement is justified.  25 years ago ODOT had plans to upgrade all the busiest sections of US 101 to 4-lane but that got abandoned.  Their next step was parkways but after a mile of it was built in Lincoln County, no one else wanted anything to do with that style of highway.  Since then the coast has been a real orphan for ODOT.  As a citizen of the coast I am most certainly not amused.

Rick


And if 26 is upgraded to the coast, it should be co-signed with I-84, then have I-84 be signed counter-clockwise around Portland... just to be quirky.


Also, OR 35 continues across the Hood River Bridge to Bingen/White Salmon, WA as SR 35.
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They said take a left at the fork in the road.  I didn't think they literally meant a fork, until plain as day, there was a fork sticking out of the road at a junction.

Bickendan

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Re: Oregon - Washington Notes
« Reply #5 on: May 07, 2015, 10:23:54 PM »

US 26 should be a freeway all the way to US 101 as should 99W/18.  There is so much traffic going to and from PDX/Salem and the coast that the improvement is justified.
Disagree on US 26. Seaside, Warrenton and Astoria aren't big enough to warrant a full freeway along the length of the Sunset. At most a case can be made for four-laning it, but it functions well enough as it it. I-5 and US 30 also provide a very good alternate route from Portland to Astoria, where the main improvement needed would be straightening some of the curves around the John Day River. The one near Astoria, not east Central Oregon.

OR 18-99W, however, is the principal route between Portland and the central coast, and should be upgraded from what it is, as it also serves two casinos which are decent traffic generators in their own right.

Quote from: TEG24601
And if 26 is upgraded to the coast, it should be co-signed with I-84, then have I-84 be signed counter-clockwise around Portland... just to be quirky.
What's with the obsession to putting I-84 on the Sunset?
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nexus73

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Re: Oregon - Washington Notes
« Reply #6 on: May 08, 2015, 12:43:47 AM »

Controlled access freeways with center dividers are safer than 4-lane expressways.  Since PDX is the largest metro area in Oregon on one end and the Cannon Beach/Seaside/Astoria US 101 corridor was considered by ODOT 25 years ago to be busy enough to warrant a 4-lane facility primarily due to the tourist crush, I would build a genuine freeway out of US 26 between those two points.  It's not like there will be less tourism to the coast as the years go by after all! 

Think of what there is now for traffic count, which can pile up on the popular "go to the coast" days and figure only more folks are going to follow.  4-lane expressway gets to be VERY dangerous as was seen on US 26 to the east of Gresham.  That is why ODOT recently installed the cable divider on that section of the route.  Had US 26 eastbound to Mt. Hood been built as an Interstate-grade freeway to begin with, many fatal accidents would have been avoided and higher speeds would be safely possible.

Rick

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US 101 is THE backbone of the Pacific coast from Bandon OR to Willets CA.  Industry, tourism and local traffic would be gone or severely crippled without it being in functioning condition in BOTH states.

Kacie Jane

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Re: Oregon - Washington Notes
« Reply #7 on: May 08, 2015, 07:13:19 PM »

Also, OR 35 continues across the Hood River Bridge to Bingen/White Salmon, WA as SR 35.

No, it doesn't.  You're thinking of a provision written into law a while back that if a new Hood River bridge was built, WSDOT would maintain the approach to the new bridge as SR 35.  But that hasn't happened, and WSDOT doesn't maintain the approach to the current bridge, so there's no current highway by that number on this side of the river.
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TEG24601

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Re: Oregon - Washington Notes
« Reply #8 on: May 10, 2015, 01:00:42 PM »

Quote from: TEG24601
And if 26 is upgraded to the coast, it should be co-signed with I-84, then have I-84 be signed counter-clockwise around Portland... just to be quirky.
What's with the obsession to putting I-84 on the Sunset?


Because the freeway is already there, we don't need to extend 84 down the gorge, and we want 84 to become 80, and would have a strong case if it went to the coast, not to mention there is no freeway access to the coast anywhere in the NW.
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They said take a left at the fork in the road.  I didn't think they literally meant a fork, until plain as day, there was a fork sticking out of the road at a junction.

Bickendan

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Re: Oregon - Washington Notes
« Reply #9 on: May 10, 2015, 05:11:58 PM »

Quote from: TEG24601
And if 26 is upgraded to the coast, it should be co-signed with I-84, then have I-84 be signed counter-clockwise around Portland... just to be quirky.
What's with the obsession to putting I-84 on the Sunset?


Because the freeway is already there,
Only from OR 6 to I-405. That's over 50 miles that would need to be four laned and divided from US 101 to OR 6, with a bridge and a tunnel that drops the speed limit to 30 mph when bikes are traversing those segments.
Quote
we don't need to extend 84 down the gorge,
Uh, what?
Quote
and we want 84 to become 80, and would have a strong case if it went to the coast,
Since when? Outside for opening more east west numbers to maintain a 'pure' grid and 'fixing' 82 being north of 84, complete non-issue.
Quote
not to mention there is no freeway access to the coast anywhere in the NW.
OR 18? OR 22? US 12/WA 8? While none of these are limited access, they have more reason to be piece-meal upgraded than US 26 does, especially since OR 18 or 99W is in fact in that process with the Newberg-Dundee Bypass.
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Sub-Urbanite

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Re: Oregon - Washington Notes
« Reply #10 on: May 11, 2015, 07:02:57 PM »


No signs of the Newberg-Dundee Bypass have been noted at this time.



It kind of exists…

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Dundee,+OR+97115/@45.271177,-123.016896,3a,75y,294.39h,84.92t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sotUTxTmzvBjx8qNcBMgvIA!2e0!4m2!3m1!1s0x5495410a8482f90d:0xf05d52e84b3b53bc!6m1!1e1]https://www.google.com/maps/place/Dundee,+OR+97115/@45.271177,-123.016896,3a,75y,294.39h,84.92t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sotUTxTmzvBjx8qNcBMgvIA!2e0!4m2!3m1!1s0x5495410a8482f90d:0xf05d52e84b3b53bc!6m1!1e1
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Tarkus

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Re: Oregon - Washington Notes
« Reply #11 on: May 11, 2015, 09:04:39 PM »

Bus US 101/OR 202's northern terminus with US 101 is now a roundabout.

It was actually one of the first true modern roundabouts built in the state (definitely the first multi-lane one), having opened in October 2002.  And it's absolute garbage, despite what ODOT's Lou Torres might try to tell you.  Accidents increased long-term by 150%, with no decrease in severity over pre-roundabout conditions (which were a mess).
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jakeroot

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Re: Oregon - Washington Notes
« Reply #12 on: May 12, 2015, 10:43:28 PM »

Bus US 101/OR 202's northern terminus with US 101 is now a roundabout.

It was actually one of the first true modern roundabouts built in the state (definitely the first multi-lane one), having opened in October 2002.  And it's absolute garbage, despite what ODOT's Lou Torres might try to tell you.  Accidents increased long-term by 150%, with no decrease in severity over pre-roundabout conditions (which were a mess).

Oregon isn't building enough roundabouts. Driver familiarity is key to their success.
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Bickendan

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Re: Oregon - Washington Notes
« Reply #13 on: May 12, 2015, 11:32:03 PM »

Coe Circle at 39th and Glisan's much older than US 101/OR 202's roundabout.
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jakeroot

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Re: Oregon - Washington Notes
« Reply #14 on: May 13, 2015, 12:24:30 AM »

Coe Circle at 39th and Glisan's much older than US 101/OR 202's roundabout.

Coe Circle is a glorified four-way stop (with lots of potential).
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nexus73

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Re: Oregon - Washington Notes
« Reply #15 on: May 13, 2015, 12:58:05 AM »

Coe Circle at 39th and Glisan's much older than US 101/OR 202's roundabout.

Coe Circle is a glorified four-way stop (with lots of potential).

Lots of potential for collisions...LOL!  I went through that circle and figured I was lucky to get out of it in one piece.

Rick
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US 101 is THE backbone of the Pacific coast from Bandon OR to Willets CA.  Industry, tourism and local traffic would be gone or severely crippled without it being in functioning condition in BOTH states.

jakeroot

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Re: Oregon - Washington Notes
« Reply #16 on: May 13, 2015, 01:43:40 AM »

Coe Circle at 39th and Glisan's much older than US 101/OR 202's roundabout.

Coe Circle is a glorified four-way stop (with lots of potential).

Lots of potential for collisions...LOL!  I went through that circle and figured I was lucky to get out of it in one piece.

If it was signed and marked properly, there wouldn't be nearly as many issues.
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Bruce

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Re: Oregon - Washington Notes
« Reply #17 on: May 13, 2015, 04:34:11 PM »

Coe Circle at 39th and Glisan's much older than US 101/OR 202's roundabout.

Coe Circle is a glorified four-way stop (with lots of potential).

Lots of potential for collisions...LOL!  I went through that circle and figured I was lucky to get out of it in one piece.

If it was signed and marked properly, there wouldn't be nearly as many issues.

It would probably also help to relocate the bus stop shelters, which are located in the roundabout itself.

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2015/02/troubleshooter_trimet_bus_shel.html

jakeroot

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Re: Oregon - Washington Notes
« Reply #18 on: May 13, 2015, 04:40:11 PM »

Coe Circle at 39th and Glisan's much older than US 101/OR 202's roundabout.

Coe Circle is a glorified four-way stop (with lots of potential).

Lots of potential for collisions...LOL!  I went through that circle and figured I was lucky to get out of it in one piece.

If it was signed and marked properly, there wouldn't be nearly as many issues.

It would probably also help to relocate the bus stop shelters, which are located in the roundabout itself.

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2015/02/troubleshooter_trimet_bus_shel.html

That is absolutely moronic. What a bunch of pillocks.
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Baloo Uriza

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Re: Oregon - Washington Notes
« Reply #19 on: May 28, 2015, 06:49:23 AM »

Coe Circle at 39th and Glisan's much older than US 101/OR 202's roundabout.

Coe Circle is a glorified four-way stop (with lots of potential).

Lots of potential for collisions...LOL!  I went through that circle and figured I was lucky to get out of it in one piece.

If it was signed and marked properly, there wouldn't be nearly as many issues.

This.  As a recovering Portland native, Coe Circle would be more clear if the outside lane were properly identified as a bus lane and used yields instead of stop signs.  But, judging by how people handle the existing yield signs there (mostly at especially short freeway ramps), I can't imagine that'd go well.  It's so much worse if you're on a bicycle, as well, since Portland drivers are extremely impatient and generally selfish (probably owing to much higher surface street speed limits and constant congestion), making the transition to the inside lane from the end of the bike lane to continue through the roundabout straight ahead or left difficult and dangerous.
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