Ohio

[Bitmapped]

Is there any chance the OH 32 corridor could get more interchanges and grade-separations (if they are needed)?

The part east of I-275 is slowly being converted to a freeway. East of, say, US 68, is less likely. ODOT seems more interested in converting things to RCUTs right now than building interchanges or grade separations.

[SkyPesos]

Is there any chance the OH 32 corridor could get more interchanges and grade-separations (if they are needed)?

I drove OH 32 between I-275 and US 35 about 2 years ago. East of US 68, the traffic is very low (I was the only car for more than a couple of miles at times). I think they could raise the speed limit to 65 without any changes just because of the low traffic, but I don't have a detailed analysis to back that up.

However, OhioDOT is converting 2 signaled junctions to interchanges in the section between I-275 and Batavia, and widening it to 6 lanes. Link to project page: https://www.transportation.ohio.gov/projects/projects/103954

[74/171FAN]

^Honestly, if US 30 can be mostly 70 west of Mansfield, why not OH 32 between US 68 and US 50?

[Hot Rod Hootenanny]

^Honestly, if US 30 can be mostly 70 west of Mansfield, why not OH 32 between US 68 and US 50?

Because US 30 west of Mansfield is mostly freeway and NW Ohio is flat (you might have noticed that on last two trips through Ohio)
Oh 32 is 4 lane divided highway and goes through foothills, so there are sight restrictions that limit it to only 60  MPH. Just like US 30, EAST of Mansfield.

[Hot Rod Hootenanny]

Is there any chance the OH 32 corridor could get more interchanges and grade-separations (if they are needed)?

About the same as the Univ. of Wisconsin joining the SEC.

[GCrites]

Because Governor Rhodes and Vern Riffe are dead.

[amroad17]

Is there any chance the OH 32 corridor could get more interchanges and grade-separations (if they are needed)?

The part east of I-275 is slowly being converted to a freeway. East of, say, US 68, is less likely. ODOT seems more interested in converting things to RCUTs right now than building interchanges or grade separations.

I believe a grade-separated interchange is supposed to be constructed at Brooks-Malott, about a mile west of the US 68 interchange at Mt. Orab.

If the (dormant) I-74 extension ever came to fruition, there would have to be many grade-separations, cul-de-sac'ed side roads, and interchanges constructed from I-275 to Steam Furnace Road (about 1.25 miles east of the OH 32/OH 41 intersection in Peebles), which is the area where I-74 would separate from OH 32 and head toward Lucasville and (dormant) I-73.

Current traffic flow east of Mt. Orab does not warrant an upgrade to freeway, as SkyPesos observed above.  West of Mt. Orab could possibly use some upgrading to freeway as OH 32 from there to I-275 is a mixture of freeway (around the north of Batavia, from Batavia Rd to McKeever Pike–around Williamsburg, and the US 68/Mt. Orab interchange) and limited access four-lane divided highway.  However, an RCUT was just completed at the Bauer Road intersection about 2 miles east of Batavia, so I do not foresee any upgrades to a freeway along OH 32 in the future.

[sprjus4]

^Honestly, if US 30 can be mostly 70 west of Mansfield, why not OH 32 between US 68 and US 50?

Because US 30 west of Mansfield is mostly freeway and NW Ohio is flat (you might have noticed that on last two trips through Ohio)
Oh 32 is 4 lane divided highway and goes through foothills, so there are sight restrictions that limit it to only 60  MPH. Just like US 30, EAST of Mansfield.

Still no reason it shouldn't be at least 65 mph. West Virginia is a mountainous state with a number of divided highways with hills, curves, inclines / declines, etc. with 65 mph on most of their corridors.

I recently drove the length of US-19 between I-77 and I-79, and the 65 mph speed limit was perfectly fine... it probably could've even handled 70 mph in many areas.

A 55 mph or 60 mph limit the whole way would've been unnecessarily slow.

[SkyPesos]

I've noticed a major project at the US 33/US 50 east interchange that concluded recently, and hasn't been mentioned in this thread at all when looking at Corridor D. The previous layout makes it difficult for US 50 traffic to get to/from Stimson Rd, which seems to be what they're fixing with the roundabout. Also, the US 33 NB ramps are moved to the left side of the road instead of the right side previously. This makes sense considering the concurrency between US 33 and US 50 in Athens uses US 33's mileposts and exit numbers. US 50's through traffic in this interchange got reduced from 2 lanes per direction to a single lane, which makes sense here looking at 2022 AADT data, where at the split, US 33 NB had 12.6k on its ramp, while US 50 EB had 1.6k (also showing how sparsely used Corridor D is east of the Cincy suburbs).

2023 GSV: https://goo.gl/maps/LDA34fu5CEJRk6z3A
Final configuration drawing: https://www.dot.state.oh.us/projects/files/Athens%2033%2050%20project%20-%20final%20layout.pdf

[Bitmapped]

^Honestly, if US 30 can be mostly 70 west of Mansfield, why not OH 32 between US 68 and US 50?

Because US 30 west of Mansfield is mostly freeway and NW Ohio is flat (you might have noticed that on last two trips through Ohio)
Oh 32 is 4 lane divided highway and goes through foothills, so there are sight restrictions that limit it to only 60  MPH. Just like US 30, EAST of Mansfield.

Still no reason it shouldn't be at least 65 mph. West Virginia is a mountainous state with a number of divided highways with hills, curves, inclines / declines, etc. with 65 mph on most of their corridors.

ODOT used a 60mph design speed for OH 32. WVDOH used a 65mph design speed for its ARC corridors.

[Hot Rod Hootenanny]

US 50's through traffic in this interchange got reduced from 2 lanes per direction to a single lane, which makes sense here looking at 2022 AADT data, where at the split, US 33 NB had 12.6k on its ramp, while US 50 EB had 1.6k (also showing how sparsely used Corridor D is east of the Cincy suburbs).

You do realize that Athens is not an eastern suburb of Cincinnati, right?

[sprjus4]

^Honestly, if US 30 can be mostly 70 west of Mansfield, why not OH 32 between US 68 and US 50?

Because US 30 west of Mansfield is mostly freeway and NW Ohio is flat (you might have noticed that on last two trips through Ohio)
Oh 32 is 4 lane divided highway and goes through foothills, so there are sight restrictions that limit it to only 60  MPH. Just like US 30, EAST of Mansfield.

Still no reason it shouldn’t be at least 65 mph. West Virginia is a mountainous state with a number of divided highways with hills, curves, inclines / declines, etc. with 65 mph on most of their corridors.

ODOT used a 60mph design speed for OH 32. WVDOH used a 65mph design speed for its ARC corridors.

What are the 85th percentile speeds? If everyone is traveling 70+ mph, the 60 mph speed limit is useless. How many of the curves are actually limited to 60 mph design in terms of radii?

If there are a few curves of concern, post the route at 65 mph and sign those specific curves with advisory speeds of 55 mph or 60 mph.

The design speed of the project shouldn’t necessarily limit the speed limit posted. For example, Texas uses a 70 mph design speed on most rural highways, yet frequently posts 75 mph after an engineering study is complete to determine it is safe.

The design speed here may well be 60 mph on the original project plans, due to functional classification (i.e. divided highway) and state law limiting speeds, but if 85th percentile speeds are greater than 65 mph and an engineering study shows it is safe, there’s no reason it shouldn’t be 65 mph.

[vtk]

Final configuration drawing: https://www.dot.state.oh.us/projects/files/Athens%2033%2050%20project%20-%20final%20layout.pdf

Why is there even a roundabout there? It only enables U-turns from Stimson back to Stimson, U-turns from westbound 50 back to eastbound 50, and a redundant path from westbound 50 to westbound 33.

[I-55]

Final configuration drawing: https://www.dot.state.oh.us/projects/files/Athens%2033%2050%20project%20-%20final%20layout.pdf

Why is there even a roundabout there? It only enables U-turns from Stimson back to Stimson, U-turns from westbound 50 back to eastbound 50, and a redundant path from westbound 50 to westbound 33.

If I were to guess, they wanted to not have to build another bridge to facilitate the WB 50 to Stimson ramp, but needed a way to slow cars down enough to not flip over on the tight radius of the ramp curve. The roundabout is often seen as a traffic calming device, which may help reduce accidents.

[vtk]

So instead of a simple sharp curve, they built a roundabout with yield signs that drivers will get accustomed to ignoring because there will basically never be anyone they have to yield to. A stop sign would have been just as effective, just as stupid, and a fair hit cheaper.

[Buck87]

Speaking of roundabouts, the new one at OH 4, OH 99 and Skadden Rd is now open (just north of the Ohio Turnpike exit 110).

It was built off center from OH 4's alignment, slightly east of the previous 4 way intersection's location. I assume this was done to lessen the time these roads would need to be closed, since the roundabout itself was completed while 4 and 99 remained open, and then there was a 25ish day closure while the new alignments into and out of the roundabout were constructed.

[carbaugh2]

Mods: This discussion, including my response, should be moved to the US 33 Upgrades in Ohio thread.

Final configuration drawing: https://www.dot.state.oh.us/projects/files/Athens%2033%2050%20project%20-%20final%20layout.pdf
[/quote]

Why is there even a roundabout there? It only enables U-turns from Stimson back to Stimson, U-turns from westbound 50 back to eastbound 50, and a redundant path from westbound 50 to westbound 33.
[/quote]

The northern 33/50/32 split in Athens has baffled me since my childhood visits to my dad's family between Albany and Shade. Coming east on 33 from Nelsonville, there was an exit for US 50 (adding Ohio 32) West and Stimson Avenue. As we proceeded on 33 East, there was an immediate exit for County Road 25 (Rock Riffle Rd) that also listed "To Stimson Ave", likely for cars entering the freeway from the State Street exit. Going west (back towards home) on 33, the redundancy wasn't for Stimson Avenue; rather, 33 West would exit the freeway from 50/32 East and then have an immediate exit for 50/32 on the curve.

District 10 has been implementing roundabouts throughout its service area (Logan has them at the 33/664 and 33/328 interchanges), and Athens has many roundabouts near its gateways to Ohio University from 33/50/32. I think Southeast Ohio is more on board with roundabouts than the rest of the state as it cuts down on the number of traffic lights people need to sit through. I'm also thinking that ODOT is planning for future increases in traffic once 33 is expressway grade to Ravenswood.

I've noticed a major project at the US 33/US 50 east interchange that concluded recently, and hasn't been mentioned in this thread at all when looking at Corridor D. The previous layout makes it difficult for US 50 traffic to get to/from Stimson Rd, which seems to be what they're fixing with the roundabout. Also, the US 33 NB ramps are moved to the left side of the road instead of the right side previously. This makes sense considering the concurrency between US 33 and US 50 in Athens uses US 33's mileposts and exit numbers. US 50's through traffic in this interchange got reduced from 2 lanes per direction to a single lane, which makes sense here looking at 2022 AADT data, where at the split, US 33 NB had 12.6k on its ramp, while US 50 EB had 1.6k (also showing how sparsely used Corridor D is east of the Cincy suburbs).

2023 GSV: https://goo.gl/maps/LDA34fu5CEJRk6z3A
Final configuration drawing: https://www.dot.state.oh.us/projects/files/Athens%2033%2050%20project%20-%20final%20layout.pdf

We didn't address this in the Corridor D thread, but we briefly discussed it in the 33 upgrades.

I think we are missing the historical context here. US 50 was the dominant route through Athens because it was the only 4 lane highway that stayed 4 lanes for its entire length through the city. Before the Super 2 was constructed, 33 joined the freeway at the Richland Avenue interchange and made its way to Pomeroy on a narrow, curvy 2 lane road. Take another look at the approach to the exit at Richland Avenue using 50/32 East. While it appears grossly overbuilt today, it felt underbuilt prior to the Super 2 as there would be a line of traffic getting onto 33 East and Richland Avenue from 50/32. With the completion of the Super 2 in 2003 (Ravenswood) and 2004 (Darwin), more trucks began to use 33 as a viable route to I-77, and 33 evolved into the dominant route through the city. While I have not researched any historical traffic volumes, my guess is that you would see a decline in traffic on US 50 and an increase in volume on 33.

[sbeaver44]

Does anyone have any good sources or writeups you can recommend about the history of Corridor D in Ohio (or both OH/WV?) I find it interesting that Corridor D doesn't generally follow US 50 in Ohio, but it is US 50 in WV.

I'm not sure what the rationale on routing Corridor D on OH 32 instead of US 50 west of Athens is, but what is now OH 32 used to be a mess of various state route numbers that got unified under the OH 32 number.

Well, Oh 32 was Oh 74 prior to the interstates...
But yeah, Corridor D was Oh 32, Oh 124, Oh 346, then US 50 for a short time in the 1980s, then ODOT dropped OH 346 and made it Oh 32 from Cincy to Albany (with an overlap with Oh 124 in the middle).
I think overlap of Oh 32 & US 50 came about around the turn of the millennium, after US 50 was finished being widened between Athens and Belpre.
----
Yeah, I realize that doesn't answer sbeaver's question as to why US 50 was avoided, between Cincy & Athens, but I don't know. I've never reasearched that question.

The SR 32 alignment is within about 3 miles of what a US 50-based alignment would be, so distance is about a toss-up. I've not seen anything definitive, but my reasoned guess would be a couple items were in play:
- The SR 32 alignment better matches up with the planned Corridor B section that would have followed SR 73 heading northwest out of Portsmouth. Extending Corridor B up to Hillsboro would have added a lot of mileage.
- The Portsmouth Gaseous Diffusion Plant is just off SR 32. This was an important site in producing enriched uranium for the military and commercial nuclear power programs.
- The state had already started widening SR 32 (out to Batavia) by the time the ADHS came along, so they could reuse some existing mileage.
- By virtue of its location and some spot upgrades, US 50 was already a pretty decent through route aside from having to go through towns. Building on that corridor wouldn't significantly improve access. Building on the SR 32 corridor, on the other hand, significantly improved access to that area.

This is a very good answer.  I just learned about the proposed OH 73/B extension, so that makes sense.  I didn't think about the Uranium plant connection either.

I'm hopefully going to drive OH 32 end to end in about 5 weeks.  I have been wanting to do all of D for a long time.  This will also be the first time driving Corridor D in WV in the daytime.

I think 60 is fairly appropriate for what I have seen on Google Street View of OH 32 given the hills and the traffic lights, although I note that that doesn't stop WV from doing 65 on Corridor D.  I was always interested in how some of US 24 and US 30 in western Ohio was 70 despite crossroads (albeit not at a light).  I'm certainly not complaining – In Pennsylvania the mere idea of a single at grade is cause for dozens of miles of 55.  I find US 24 (west of I-475) and US 30 (west of Mansfield) to be high-quality non-interstates.

[TempoNick]

With the completion of the Super 2 in 2003 (Ravenswood) and 2004 (Darwin), more trucks began to use 33 as a viable route to I-77, and 33 evolved into the dominant route through the city. While I have not researched any historical traffic volumes, my guess is that you would see a decline in traffic on US 50 and an increase in volume on 33.

That's what I use. Overall, I think it's the best way to I-77, at least from the east side of Columbus. I wish I could wave my magic wand and turn it all into Interstate-style freeway, but that's the road geek in me. Otherwise, it's a fantastic road. I can't wait until it is four-laned all the way through. US 35 is also a fantastic road for West Virginia destinations, but for some reason, US 33 strikes me as cleaner and more direct. I think it's all the US 23 congestion between Columbus and Ross County that ruins US 35 for me.

[SkyPesos]

This sign at the I-74/I-275 concurrency split got replaced at some point recently. Note the larger exit tab and Series C 275 numerals (was Series B in the previous version). Though this replacement goes with my issue of OhioDOT really trying as hard as they could to avoid using APLs, with this and a few much more egregious APL avoidance examples in the Columbus area. Anyone know why OhioDOT seem to have something against APLs so much?

[seicer]

Does anyone have any good sources or writeups you can recommend about the history of Corridor D in Ohio (or both OH/WV?) I find it interesting that Corridor D doesn't generally follow US 50 in Ohio, but it is US 50 in WV.

I'm not sure what the rationale on routing Corridor D on OH 32 instead of US 50 west of Athens is, but what is now OH 32 used to be a mess of various state route numbers that got unified under the OH 32 number.

Well, Oh 32 was Oh 74 prior to the interstates...
But yeah, Corridor D was Oh 32, Oh 124, Oh 346, then US 50 for a short time in the 1980s, then ODOT dropped OH 346 and made it Oh 32 from Cincy to Albany (with an overlap with Oh 124 in the middle).
I think overlap of Oh 32 & US 50 came about around the turn of the millennium, after US 50 was finished being widened between Athens and Belpre.
----
Yeah, I realize that doesn't answer sbeaver's question as to why US 50 was avoided, between Cincy & Athens, but I don't know. I've never reasearched that question.

The SR 32 alignment is within about 3 miles of what a US 50-based alignment would be, so distance is about a toss-up. I've not seen anything definitive, but my reasoned guess would be a couple items were in play:
- The SR 32 alignment better matches up with the planned Corridor B section that would have followed SR 73 heading northwest out of Portsmouth. Extending Corridor B up to Hillsboro would have added a lot of mileage.
- The Portsmouth Gaseous Diffusion Plant is just off SR 32. This was an important site in producing enriched uranium for the military and commercial nuclear power programs.
- The state had already started widening SR 32 (out to Batavia) by the time the ADHS came along, so they could reuse some existing mileage.
- By virtue of its location and some spot upgrades, US 50 was already a pretty decent through route aside from having to go through towns. Building on that corridor wouldn't significantly improve access. Building on the SR 32 corridor, on the other hand, significantly improved access to that area.

This is a very good answer.  I just learned about the proposed OH 73/B extension, so that makes sense.  I didn't think about the Uranium plant connection either.

I'm hopefully going to drive OH 32 end to end in about 5 weeks.  I have been wanting to do all of D for a long time.  This will also be the first time driving Corridor D in WV in the daytime.

I think 60 is fairly appropriate for what I have seen on Google Street View of OH 32 given the hills and the traffic lights, although I note that that doesn't stop WV from doing 65 on Corridor D.  I was always interested in how some of US 24 and US 30 in western Ohio was 70 despite crossroads (albeit not at a light).  I'm certainly not complaining – In Pennsylvania the mere idea of a single at grade is cause for dozens of miles of 55.  I find US 24 (west of I-475) and US 30 (west of Mansfield) to be high-quality non-interstates.

Most traffic flows at 65 MPH or higher on OH 32, especially the further east you go. I'm probably in the minority these days going just 65 MPH - I am seemingly lapped by every other vehicle out there. Given it has the same frequency of intersections as other expressways in Ohio that have the same or higher speed limits (some at 70 MPH), there is no reason why it must remain at 60 MPH. Design speeds are not maximums and can always be overridden by new engineering studies and political whims.

I was just on OH 32 earlier today and traffic was flowing exceptionally well at Eastgate now that it's down to two traffic lights with some movements already axed and replaced by new ramps. I was kind of intrigued at the ramp's location in the middle of a residential neighborhood, but those houses were almost all demolished: https://maps.app.goo.gl/pz4GDTrSysVHTKf86

There is also now a ramp or two open at Bach Buxton Road/Elick Lane. I can't remember which ones.

The OH 32/I-275 modification project is also progressing. This should have been done with the earlier project to revamp that interchange, but it involves making an elongated ramp from OH 32 westbound to I-275 southbound, bypassing one traffic light.

Work is also progressing on the new interchange west of Mt. Orab, with the south abutment of the new overpass showing progress.

[TempoNick]

This sign at the I-74/I-275 concurrency split got replaced at some point recently. Note the larger exit tab and Series C 275 numerals (was Series B in the previous version). Though this replacement goes with my issue of OhioDOT really trying as hard as they could to avoid using APLs, with this and a few much more egregious APL avoidance examples in the Columbus area. Anyone know why OhioDOT seem to have something against APLs so much?

If you're talking about the arrows, the ones they do use don't always line up well with the lane depending on your sight lines and how the road is laid out. I-70 eastbound has a number of signs like that. (Ones with regular arrows.)

[jt4]

This sign at the I-74/I-275 concurrency split got replaced at some point recently. Note the larger exit tab and Series C 275 numerals (was Series B in the previous version). Though this replacement goes with my issue of OhioDOT really trying as hard as they could to avoid using APLs, with this and a few much more egregious APL avoidance examples in the Columbus area. Anyone know why OhioDOT seem to have something against APLs so much?

If you're talking about the arrows, the ones they do use don't always line up well with the lane depending on your sight lines and how the road is laid out. I-70 eastbound has a number of signs like that.

Given the larger signs for APLs, I wonder if cost is a significant factor.

[seicer]

ODOT isn't that frugal for money. But these really could have been better laid out or designed, with Exit 101 divided up into Exit 101 A and B with control cities added: https://maps.app.goo.gl/bY4vpmwPST4eNCri8

And this is a complete disaster: https://maps.app.goo.gl/LfrdyAs5FDacCXUU9

[SkyPesos]

Given the larger signs for APLs, I wonder if cost is a significant factor.

It shouldn't be too much more expensive; otherwise they wouldn't be so commonly used in other states.

It isn't even the first traffic control related thing that I feel like Ohio is at least 15 years behind on; there's a lack of FYA signals (only a few one-offs in some areas) in the state too.