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Illinois Tollway Notes

Started by I-39, March 21, 2016, 10:08:41 PM

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Rick Powell

Quote from: abefroman329 on November 27, 2018, 07:25:12 AM
Quote from: Rick Powell on November 26, 2018, 10:28:15 PMWhen Metra has a cash squeeze, they usually look to the electric service where ridership has been dropping to look at service cuts.
They’ve even talked about selling it to the CTA. I don’t know why ridership should be dropping, considering the neighborhoods it travels through are rapidly gentrifying.

The Blue Island branch and South Chicago branch neighborhoods have yet to see much benefit of gentrification, and they almost cut weekend service to Blue Island in the last Metra budget. Hyde Park/U of C is definitely a high ridership area, but no stops between Kenwood and 27th, and in-close neighborhoods are notoriously low users of commuter rail and prefer CTA buses and trains. Further south, the Homewood area is one of the more vibrant areas in the south suburbs, but most of its neighbors are struggling. University Park attracts a few riders from Kankakee and the far-flung Will County suburbs/exurbs. 

The "Gray Line" proposal to use Metra Electric as a CTA-equivalent frequent service has been hanging around for a few decades but has yet to gain traction, for a variety of reasons.

Oh well, enough about this, or we'll be bounced into the Mass Transit forum.



Revive 755

The traffic signal for the new entrance to WB I-90 from Central Road west of Roselle Road has been activated and the second left turn lane to enter the ramp has been opened.

Joe The Dragon

Quote from: Revive 755 on November 28, 2018, 10:22:45 PM
The traffic signal for the new entrance to WB I-90 from Central Road west of Roselle Road has been activated and the second left turn lane to enter the ramp has been opened.

added street lighting still not installed.

Revive 755

Piers have been installed in the median of I-90 for the future I-490 interchange bridges.

abefroman329

I don't really understand the absence of ramp tolls on I-94 at Grand in Gurnee, given it's close proximity to the Waukegan toll plaza. If I'm paying 26 damn dollars to park at Great America, I'm not sweating another 75 cents, and they supposedly get millions of visitors a year. Ditto Gurnee Mills.

ChiMilNet

Quote from: Revive 755 on December 01, 2018, 10:44:09 PM
Piers have been installed in the median of I-90 for the future I-490 interchange bridges.

Any update on when construction on the ramps will start and when what remains of the oasis will be closed/demolished? I haven't been able to find much.

Brandon

#831
Quote from: abefroman329 on December 02, 2018, 06:51:11 AM
I don't really understand the absence of ramp tolls on I-94 at Grand in Gurnee, given it's close proximity to the Waukegan toll plaza. If I'm paying 26 damn dollars to park at Great America, I'm not sweating another 75 cents, and they supposedly get millions of visitors a year. Ditto Gurnee Mills.

It's due to how the tollways were originally built.  Many ramps were built with one direction of travel only to minimize the number of ramp plazas.  A few were built as cloverleafs in the middle of these interchanges.  It's where the system switches from ramp plazas in one direction to ramp plazas in the other direction.  The Grand Avenue interchange is one of these.  Going back to the original Tri-State build, the following interchanges were as follows:

- IL-394/I-94, end of tollway
- Halsted Street, cloverleaf with no ramp plazas
- Dixie Highway, N entry, S exit
- 163rd Stret Toll Plaza
- 159th Street, S entry, N exit
- Cicero Avenue/127th Street, cloverleaf, no ramp plazas
- 95th Street, N entry, S exit
- 83rd Street Toll Plaza
- Archer Avenue/88th Avenue, S entry, N exit
- Wolf Road (to US-66), S entry, N exit
- Joliet Road (US-66/I-55), N entry, S exit with ramp plazas
- Ogden Avenue, cloverleaf with no ramp plazas
- East-West Tollway (west), S entry, N exit
- 22nd Street, N entry, S exit
- Cermak Road Toll Plaza
- Roosevelt Road, S entry, N exit
- Eisenhower Expressway, Full Interchange, no ramp plazas
- North Avenue, N entry only
- Irving Park Road, N entry, S exit
- Irving Park Road Toll Plaza, S-only
- O'Hare, ramp plaza to exit (originally just one, now the O'Hare East Plaza)
- Northwest Tollway, Full Interchange, no ramp plazas (plazas on mainline NW Twy)
- Touhy Avenue Toll Plaza, N-only
- Touhy Avenue, S entry, N exit
- Dempster Street, S entry, N exit
- Golf Road, N entry, S exit
- Willow Road, S entry, N exit with ramp plazas
- Edens Spur, N entry, S exit (with N entry, S exit at Waukegan Road)
- Deerfield Road Toll Plaza (very infamous for the backups that would occur here - now gone)
- Deerfield Road, S entry, N exit
- Half Day Road, Full Interchange, N entry, S exit have ramp plazas
- Town Line Road, S entry, N exit
- Rockland Road, S entry, N exit
- Buckley Road, S entry, N exit
- Belvidere Road, S entry, N exit
- Milwaukee Avenue, N entry, S exit
- Grand Avenue, cloverleaf with no ramp plazas; my guess is that the ISTHC thought few would use the "free" section between Grand and Milwaukee
- Waukegan Toll Plaza
- Rosecrans Road, S entry, N exit
- US-41, end of tollway (N entry, S exit)

Thus, Grand, Ogden, Cicero/127th, and Halsted were meant as interchanges were the toll system would flip from north to south or vice versa due to the barrier system on the tollways.  halsted later had ramp plazas added (S entry, N exit)  Farnsworth Avenue was meant to be the same way until the W entry, E exit ramps were built at IL-59.

The Northwest Tollway was a bit different, having ramp plazas at the cloverleafs at IL-53 and IL-31 from the start.  Between Elgin and South Beloit; however, it was a ticket system (which is why the interchanges there are mostly trumpets).
"If you think this has a happy ending, you haven't been paying attention." - Ramsay Bolton

"Symbolic of his struggle against reality." - Reg

mgk920

One also has to realize that when the Tri-State Tollway was originally built through Lake County, it was a true bypass that was built through a mostly undeveloped, rural farming area and, IIRC, pre-dated the interstate system.

Mike

CtrlAltDel

Quote from: Revive 755 on November 28, 2018, 10:22:45 PM
The traffic signal for the new entrance to WB I-90 from Central Road west of Roselle Road has been activated and the second left turn lane to enter the ramp has been opened.

Why did they put that ramp all the way over there on Central? It seems like there's plenty of space to have put it right on Roselle.
Interstates clinched: 4, 57, 275 (IN-KY-OH), 465 (IN), 640 (TN), 985
State Interstates clinched: I-26 (TN), I-75 (GA), I-75 (KY), I-75 (TN), I-81 (WV), I-95 (NH)

Revive 755

Quote from: CtrlAltDel on December 02, 2018, 05:04:46 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on November 28, 2018, 10:22:45 PM
The traffic signal for the new entrance to WB I-90 from Central Road west of Roselle Road has been activated and the second left turn lane to enter the ramp has been opened.

Why did they put that ramp all the way over there on Central? It seems like there's plenty of space to have put it right on Roselle.

I don't think there was enough ROW to have the WB entrance from Roselle without impacting IDOT or having to use a retaining wall.  Plus it would have required adding another two lanes to the Roselle Road overpass.

abefroman329

Quote from: Revive 755 on December 01, 2018, 10:44:09 PM
Piers have been installed in the median of I-90 for the future I-490 interchange bridges.
Where are they? I traveled on I-90 west to Lee Street yesterday and didn't see them. I also noticed the on-borrowed-time remnants of the Des Plaines Oasis now have a "next Oasis 50 miles"  sign that I don't remember seeing before.

ET21

Quote from: abefroman329 on December 03, 2018, 07:27:20 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on December 01, 2018, 10:44:09 PM
Piers have been installed in the median of I-90 for the future I-490 interchange bridges.
Where are they? I traveled on I-90 west to Lee Street yesterday and didn't see them. I also noticed the on-borrowed-time remnants of the Des Plaines Oasis now have a "next Oasis 50 miles"  sign that I don't remember seeing before.

Center median at the DP Oasis
The local weatherman, trust me I can be 99.9% right!
"Show where you're going, without forgetting where you're from"

Clinched:
IL: I-88, I-180, I-190, I-290, I-294, I-355, IL-390
IN: I-80, I-94
SD: I-190
WI: I-90, I-94
MI: I-94, I-196
MN: I-90

Joe The Dragon

Quote from: Brandon on December 02, 2018, 09:26:56 AM
Quote from: abefroman329 on December 02, 2018, 06:51:11 AM
I don't really understand the absence of ramp tolls on I-94 at Grand in Gurnee, given it's close proximity to the Waukegan toll plaza. If I'm paying 26 damn dollars to park at Great America, I'm not sweating another 75 cents, and they supposedly get millions of visitors a year. Ditto Gurnee Mills.

It's due to how the tollways were originally built.  Many ramps were built with one direction of travel only to minimize the number of ramp plazas.  A few were built as cloverleafs in the middle of these interchanges.  It's where the system switches from ramp plazas in one direction to ramp plazas in the other direction.  The Grand Avenue interchange is one of these.  Going back to the original Tri-State build, the following interchanges were as follows:

- IL-394/I-94, end of tollway
- Halsted Street, cloverleaf with no ramp plazas
- Dixie Highway, N entry, S exit
- 163rd Stret Toll Plaza
- 159th Street, S entry, N exit
- Cicero Avenue/127th Street, cloverleaf, no ramp plazas
- 95th Street, N entry, S exit
- 83rd Street Toll Plaza
- Archer Avenue/88th Avenue, S entry, N exit
- Wolf Road (to US-66), S entry, N exit
- Joliet Road (US-66/I-55), N entry, S exit with ramp plazas
- Ogden Avenue, cloverleaf with no ramp plazas
- East-West Tollway (west), S entry, N exit
- 22nd Street, N entry, S exit
- Cermak Road Toll Plaza
- Roosevelt Road, S entry, N exit
- Eisenhower Expressway, Full Interchange, no ramp plazas
- North Avenue, N entry only
- Irving Park Road, N entry, S exit
- Irving Park Road Toll Plaza, S-only
- O'Hare, ramp plaza to exit (originally just one, now the O'Hare East Plaza)
- Northwest Tollway, Full Interchange, no ramp plazas (plazas on mainline NW Twy)
- Touhy Avenue Toll Plaza, N-only
- Touhy Avenue, S entry, N exit
- Dempster Street, S entry, N exit
- Golf Road, N entry, S exit
- Willow Road, S entry, N exit with ramp plazas
- Edens Spur, N entry, S exit (with N entry, S exit at Waukegan Road)
- Deerfield Road Toll Plaza (very infamous for the backups that would occur here - now gone)
- Deerfield Road, S entry, N exit
- Half Day Road, Full Interchange, N entry, S exit have ramp plazas
- Town Line Road, S entry, N exit
- Rockland Road, S entry, N exit
- Buckley Road, S entry, N exit
- Belvidere Road, S entry, N exit
- Milwaukee Avenue, N entry, S exit
- Grand Avenue, cloverleaf with no ramp plazas; my guess is that the ISTHC thought few would use the "free" section between Grand and Milwaukee
- Waukegan Toll Plaza
- Rosecrans Road, S entry, N exit
- US-41, end of tollway (N entry, S exit)

Thus, Grand, Ogden, Cicero/127th, and Halsted were meant as interchanges were the toll system would flip from north to south or vice versa due to the barrier system on the tollways.  halsted later had ramp plazas added (S entry, N exit)  Farnsworth Avenue was meant to be the same way until the W entry, E exit ramps were built at IL-59.

The Northwest Tollway was a bit different, having ramp plazas at the cloverleafs at IL-53 and IL-31 from the start.  Between Elgin and South Beloit; however, it was a ticket system (which is why the interchanges there are mostly trumpets).
IL-25 is an trumpet but was not under the ticket system.

I-90 is it need of better toll balancing maybe with an all ETC system like the EOE down the road.

Brandon

Quote from: Joe The Dragon on December 05, 2018, 11:39:52 AM
IL-25 is an trumpet but was not under the ticket system.

I-90 is it need of better toll balancing maybe with an all ETC system like the EOE down the road.

Ditto with IL-31 and the old Naperville Rd exits on the East-West Tollway.  Both are/were trumpet/trumpet-like interchanges never under a ticket system.

And I agree that I-90 needs better toll balancing.  It used to be balanced like I-88, I-355, and I-94/294, but I have no idea how/why it got so screwed up.
"If you think this has a happy ending, you haven't been paying attention." - Ramsay Bolton

"Symbolic of his struggle against reality." - Reg

Joe The Dragon

#839
Quote from: Brandon on December 05, 2018, 11:54:09 AM
Quote from: Joe The Dragon on December 05, 2018, 11:39:52 AM
IL-25 is an trumpet but was not under the ticket system.

I-90 is it need of better toll balancing maybe with an all ETC system like the EOE down the road.

Ditto with IL-31 and the old Naperville Rd exits on the East-West Tollway.  Both are/were trumpet/trumpet-like interchanges never under a ticket system.

And I agree that I-90 needs better toll balancing.  It used to be balanced like I-88, I-355, and I-94/294, but I have no idea how/why it got so screwed up.
I-88 has a few more
dekalb il

dixon il

sterling IL / us 30 (free zone)




It was till they removed the IL-53 ramp toll.

But IL-47 WTF!
YOU JUST PAID AN MAIN LINE TOLL and now it's an PAY ECT ONLY EXIT??

Brandon

Quote from: Joe The Dragon on December 05, 2018, 12:53:51 PM
Quote from: Brandon on December 05, 2018, 11:54:09 AM
Quote from: Joe The Dragon on December 05, 2018, 11:39:52 AM
IL-25 is an trumpet but was not under the ticket system.

I-90 is it need of better toll balancing maybe with an all ETC system like the EOE down the road.

Ditto with IL-31 and the old Naperville Rd exits on the East-West Tollway.  Both are/were trumpet/trumpet-like interchanges never under a ticket system.

And I agree that I-90 needs better toll balancing.  It used to be balanced like I-88, I-355, and I-94/294, but I have no idea how/why it got so screwed up.
I-88 has a few more
dekalb il

dixon il

sterling IL / us 30 (free zone)

The first two were locations of mainline toll plazas.  A strange design with ramp plazas on the ramps (where a typical ticket-type plaza would go) and the mainline plaza between the exit and loop entry ramps.
"If you think this has a happy ending, you haven't been paying attention." - Ramsay Bolton

"Symbolic of his struggle against reality." - Reg

Joe The Dragon

Quote from: abefroman329 on December 02, 2018, 06:51:11 AM
I don't really understand the absence of ramp tolls on I-94 at Grand in Gurnee, given it's close proximity to the Waukegan toll plaza. If I'm paying 26 damn dollars to park at Great America, I'm not sweating another 75 cents, and they supposedly get millions of visitors a year. Ditto Gurnee Mills.
on I-88
IL-251 to I-39/US51 is the other free zone.

Brandon

Quote from: Joe The Dragon on December 05, 2018, 03:51:44 PM
Quote from: abefroman329 on December 02, 2018, 06:51:11 AM
I don't really understand the absence of ramp tolls on I-94 at Grand in Gurnee, given it's close proximity to the Waukegan toll plaza. If I'm paying 26 damn dollars to park at Great America, I'm not sweating another 75 cents, and they supposedly get millions of visitors a year. Ditto Gurnee Mills.
on I-88
IL-251 to I-39/US51 is the other free zone.

That may be intentional as a way to get from I-39/US-51 to Rochelle.  Not that it matters much as most traffic doesn't just go between those two interchanges.
"If you think this has a happy ending, you haven't been paying attention." - Ramsay Bolton

"Symbolic of his struggle against reality." - Reg

ET21

Quote from: Joe The Dragon on December 05, 2018, 03:51:44 PM
Quote from: abefroman329 on December 02, 2018, 06:51:11 AM
I don't really understand the absence of ramp tolls on I-94 at Grand in Gurnee, given it's close proximity to the Waukegan toll plaza. If I'm paying 26 damn dollars to park at Great America, I'm not sweating another 75 cents, and they supposedly get millions of visitors a year. Ditto Gurnee Mills.
on I-88
IL-251 to I-39/US51 is the other free zone.

Seems like majority use IL-38 anyways
The local weatherman, trust me I can be 99.9% right!
"Show where you're going, without forgetting where you're from"

Clinched:
IL: I-88, I-180, I-190, I-290, I-294, I-355, IL-390
IN: I-80, I-94
SD: I-190
WI: I-90, I-94
MI: I-94, I-196
MN: I-90

Revive 755

Quote from: ChiMilNet on December 02, 2018, 08:33:37 AM
Any update on when construction on the ramps will start and when what remains of the oasis will be closed/demolished? I haven't been able to find much.

December 6 press release from the Tollway regarding the rest of the Des Plains Oasis closing on December 14.

ChiMilNet

Quote from: Revive 755 on December 07, 2018, 09:52:52 PM
Quote from: ChiMilNet on December 02, 2018, 08:33:37 AM
Any update on when construction on the ramps will start and when what remains of the oasis will be closed/demolished? I haven't been able to find much.

December 6 press release from the Tollway regarding the rest of the Des Plains Oasis closing on December 14.

Well, there goes one of my main fuel stops when heading back to the city from the burbs. However, the improvement of mobility in the area will be a huge benefit. It's just too bad they can't consider rebuilding even a trimmed down version of the oasis somewhere (though I guess there is the issue of where would they even have the room to do it now).

abefroman329

Quote from: ChiMilNet on December 08, 2018, 06:00:00 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on December 07, 2018, 09:52:52 PM
Quote from: ChiMilNet on December 02, 2018, 08:33:37 AM
Any update on when construction on the ramps will start and when what remains of the oasis will be closed/demolished? I haven't been able to find much.

December 6 press release from the Tollway regarding the rest of the Des Plains Oasis closing on December 14.

Well, there goes one of my main fuel stops when heading back to the city from the burbs. However, the improvement of mobility in the area will be a huge benefit. It's just too bad they can't consider rebuilding even a trimmed down version of the oasis somewhere (though I guess there is the issue of where would they even have the room to do it now).
There may not be a financial incentive for them to do so. The fact is, as the Tollways are used for commuting more often and for long-distance travel less often, the Oases are going to start disappearing.

ChiMilNet

Quote from: abefroman329 on December 09, 2018, 10:12:16 AM
Quote from: ChiMilNet on December 08, 2018, 06:00:00 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on December 07, 2018, 09:52:52 PM
Quote from: ChiMilNet on December 02, 2018, 08:33:37 AM
Any update on when construction on the ramps will start and when what remains of the oasis will be closed/demolished? I haven't been able to find much.

December 6 press release from the Tollway regarding the rest of the Des Plains Oasis closing on December 14.

Well, there goes one of my main fuel stops when heading back to the city from the burbs. However, the improvement of mobility in the area will be a huge benefit. It's just too bad they can't consider rebuilding even a trimmed down version of the oasis somewhere (though I guess there is the issue of where would they even have the room to do it now).
There may not be a financial incentive for them to do so. The fact is, as the Tollways are used for commuting more often and for long-distance travel less often, the Oases are going to start disappearing.

Well, the Belvidere and DeKalb ones likely aren't going anywhere (and hopefully not the Lake Forest one either), especially considering that they are more on long distance routes (plus, there are hardly any other fuel stops and services on I-88 for miles). Still, I always liked the "perk" of having the oasis on the tollways, but, I admit, as more of a weekend thing. However, I understand the reason for closing the Des Plaines and O'Hare Oasis.

SSOWorld

One can probably expect the Hinsdale Oasis to be ripped out as well given the restrictions it puts on adding lanes.  Of course that depends on the NIMBY battle going on nearby.
Scott O.

Not all who wander are lost...
Ah, the open skies, wind at my back, warm sun on my... wait, where the hell am I?!
As a matter of fact, I do own the road.
Raise your what?

Wisconsin - out-multiplexing your state since 1918.

ChiMilNet

Quote from: SSOWorld on December 09, 2018, 11:47:49 AM
One can probably expect the Hinsdale Oasis to be ripped out as well given the restrictions it puts on adding lanes.  Of course that depends on the NIMBY battle going on nearby.

The Tollway already confirmed that the Hinsdale Oasis is to be removed, though Hinsdale is trying to fight it. I hate to say it, that is one that actually they could have made a case to remove it 25+ years ago when they redid 294 through there then. For that one, it's really a matter of when, and since the tollway owns the land, I don't know that they honestly have much of case.



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