Interstate 87 (NC-VA)

[Beltway]

The Rocky Mount Bypass could be utilized, though some upgrades would definitely be needed, including...
- The 20 ft median would likely have to be replaced with a paved median & a jersey barrier (7-9 ft left paved shoulder, 2-4 ft jersey barrier) either that or add 4 foot paved left shoulders and have 12 ft of grass.
- The US-220 southbound bridge over the Pigg River would need to be replaced
- The US-220 / VA-40 interchange would need an overhaul, with at least the US-220 southbound bridge over VA-40 being replaced.
- The north end & south end interchanges would need some upgrades, though because of the remainder of I-73 being on mostly new location and tying in at these points, they'd have to be completely redesigned anyways.
- Most, if not all of the bridges crossing over US-220 would need to be replaced.
- Finally, you'd need to widen the shoulders on the mainline to 10 ft to the outside.

That still wouldn't prevent some states from utilizing it with nothing other than providing 10-foot paved right shoulders and the necessary tie-ins at both ends and some minor bridge improvements.

Realistically a non-Interstate freeway dating to 1971 would need extensive upgrades to use for a new Interstate highway.

[sprjus4]

That still wouldn't prevent some states from utilizing it with nothing other than providing 10-foot paved right shoulders and the necessary tie-ins at both ends and some minor bridge improvements.

As long as it meets basic interstate standards, has an interstate cross section, and FHWA approves it, it works. I've seen the practice used in a few different states, especially with newer interstate highways such as I-69, I-49, and I-14.

Realistically a non-Interstate freeway dating to 1971 would need extensive upgrades to use for a new Interstate highway.

Just as much upgrades as an interstate highway built in 1971 needs.

[Beltway]

Realistically a non-Interstate freeway dating to 1971 would need extensive upgrades to use for a new Interstate highway.

Just as much upgrades as an interstate highway built in 1971 needs.

Not necessarily.  VA I-85 was completed by 1970 in the "Interstate 3.0 era" and other than a few bridges that don't have 10 foot shoulders meets modern standards.  Wide medians, wide clear zones.

Referring to this section which doesn't include the I-85 portion of the Richmond-Petersburg Turnpike (which has had later upgrades).

The 15.2-mile-long section from the North Carolina border to US-1 just north of South Hill opened in Nov. 1965, and this was called the South Hill Bypass at the time.  The 21.3-mile-long section from VA-40 at McKenney to US-1 west of Petersburg opened in August 1969, and this joined into the RPT.  The 27.9-mile-long section from US-1 just north of South Hill to VA-40 at McKenney opened on Oct. 21, 1970, closing the last gap in I-85 and completing it through Virginia.

It won't need widening any time in the foreseeable future.

[sprjus4]

Realistically a non-Interstate freeway dating to 1971 would need extensive upgrades to use for a new Interstate highway.

Just as much upgrades as an interstate highway built in 1971 needs.

Not necessarily.  VA I-85 was completed by 1970 in the "Interstate 3.0 era" and other than a few bridges that don't have 10 foot shoulders meets modern standards. 

Referring to this section which doesn't include the I-85 portion of the Richmond-Petersburg Turnpike (which has had later upgrades).

The 15.2-mile-long section from the North Carolina border to US-1 just north of South Hill opened in Nov. 1965, and this was called the South Hill Bypass at the time.  The 21.3-mile-long section from VA-40 at McKenney to US-1 west of Petersburg opened in August 1969, and this joined into the RPT.  The 27.9-mile-long section from US-1 just north of South Hill to VA-40 at McKenney opened on Oct. 21, 1970, closing the last gap in I-85 and completing it through Virginia.

That's my point really. The Rocky Mount Bypass is an exception, but a lot of 70s non-interstate freeways are still generally in good shape and could be converted into an interstate highway with an upgrade as small as simply widening the shoulders to 10 ft.

For example, a lot of the US-64 and US-264 freeway segments east of Raleigh were built throughout the 70s, and are in good shape. All they really need is shoulder widening plus a couple bridge rehabilitation and replacements here and there.

The ~25 mile US-70 freeway from east of Kinston to New Bern was built in 70s, and is currently undergoing a project to "upgrade to interstate standards" in preparation for when I-42 is brought through there (it can't be signed until the Kinston bypass is constructed ~2028 connecting it to I-795 however). In reality though, all the project is doing is reconstructing & resurfacing the mainline, adding 10 ft full depth paved outside shoulders, and 4 ft full depth paved inside shoulders. All of the bridges however are remaining in place.

It won't need widening any time in the foreseeable future.

It'll be decades before any expansion of I-85 will be warranted between Richmond and Durham. NCDOT just completed a full reconstruction of I-85 from the Virginia border to Henderson including increasing vertical clearance under overpasses to proper standards and replacing mainline bridges, but did not widen the highway. The only stretch I could potentially see is the part between US-460 and I-95, but that's about it. From Durham southwards, that's a different story, but that's not in Virginia.

[tolbs17]

How about replace the bridges on I-85 between Durham and the Virginia state line?

[sprjus4]

How about replace the bridges on I-85 between Durham and the Virginia state line?

The mainline bridges have been replaced from Henderson northwards. The bridges carrying side roads over I-85 have not been replaced as they are adequate, though the mainline was slightly lowered in order to provide proper vertical clearance.

[Beltway]

How about replace the bridges on I-85 between Durham and the Virginia state line?

The mainline bridges have been replaced from Henderson northwards. The bridges carrying side roads over I-85 have not been replaced as they are adequate, though the mainline was slightly lowered in order to provide proper vertical clearance.

That won't help if they drive south of Henderson.  Trucks are still governed by the lowest bridge on the route.

[sprjus4]

How about replace the bridges on I-85 between Durham and the Virginia state line?

The mainline bridges have been replaced from Henderson northwards. The bridges carrying side roads over I-85 have not been replaced as they are adequate, though the mainline was slightly lowered in order to provide proper vertical clearance.

That won't help if they drive south of Henderson.  Trucks are still governed by the lowest bridge on the route.

I don't have the exact numbers, but the bridge clearances were lower from Henderson northwards compared to south of Henderson. The segment between Henderson and US-1 near the state line was constructed in 1960 compared to 1971 south of Henderson. The $140 million rehabilitation / vertical clearance project covered that entire 1960 stretch.

[sprjus4]

The HRTPO Freight Transportation Advisory Committee will receive an approximately 10 minute briefing regarding the current status of I-87 in Virginia and updates on Wednesday, September 25.

Nothing I could find online thus far as to what specifically would be discussed.

The FTAC currently has had seeming interest in the corridor, based on multiple mentions of it in past meetings, discussion of potential inclusion in future transportation plans, etc.

https://www.hrtpo.org/uploads/docs/092019%2000%20Full%20Agenda.pdf

[sprjus4]

Hopefully they won't be passing the pot pipe around.

What if they decide to pursue it and it's put into the 2045 LRTP? The I-87 corridor has been included in a list of potential candidate projects, and something of that size would be a regional project, up there with the I-64 projects, US-58 interchanges, and tunnel expansions.

[Beltway]

Then I'll have to go to the meeting(s) and make a public comment.

[sprjus4]

https://spectrumlocalnews.com/nc/charlotte/news/2019/09/24/major-police-presence-along-us-64-in-zebulon

According to this news article...

I-87 now goes all the way to US-264 in Zebulon, is an east-west highway, and has a mile marker of 436.

There were problems before with news agencies and press releases not recognizing the segment between I-440 and US-64 Business as I-87 as it was designated in 2017, now they've just resorted to calling the entire freeway to at least US-264 as I-87.

It'd be interesting if they did something like I-26 is signed near Asheville, as "Future I-26" but on interstate-style shields and generally known as "I-26", yet not meeting interstate standards and technically not designated I-26 officially, but mostly known as such as opposed to US-23. IIRC, the same was done on US-74 near Rockingham, "Future I-74" shields, but was removed.

Such signage for a "Future I-87" could be extended all the way to Williamston, or at least I-95. Realistically, to actually get I-87 designated officially to at least I-95, they'd simply need to expand the shoulders for the 35 mile stretch. If the $30 million project near New Bern to upgrade 30 miles of freeway to interstate standards & resurface the entire roadway is any indication, plus the upcoming project on US-264 to upgrade it to interstate standards between Greenville and the existing interstate-standard segment connecting to I-795 / I-95, this could be a reasonable project. Other upgrades such as bridge replacements are ultimately needed, but for the interim, a shoulder widening project would bring it up to sufficient standards to be designated an interstate highway. This wouldn't be anything unique, certainly not for North Carolina, it's been a common practice with integrating pre-existing freeway into newer interstate highways. Go another 20 miles east and connect to the interstate-standard freeway between Tarboro and Williamston, you could have I-87 shields spanning the 97 mile stretch between Raleigh and Williamston.

[goobnav]

https://spectrumlocalnews.com/nc/charlotte/news/2019/09/24/major-police-presence-along-us-64-in-zebulon

According to this news article...

I-87 now goes all the way to US-264 in Zebulon, is an east-west highway, and has a mile marker of 436.

There were problems before with news agencies and press releases not recognizing the segment between I-440 and US-64 Business as I-87 as it was designated in 2017, now they've just resorted to calling the entire freeway to at least US-264 as I-87.

It'd be interesting if they did something like I-26 is signed near Asheville, as "Future I-26" but on interstate-style shields and generally known as "I-26", yet not meeting interstate standards and technically not designated I-26 officially, but mostly known as such as opposed to US-23. IIRC, the same was done on US-74 near Rockingham, "Future I-74" shields, but was removed.

Such signage for a "Future I-87" could be extended all the way to Williamston, or at least I-95. Realistically, to actually get I-87 designated officially to at least I-95, they'd simply need to expand the shoulders for the 35 mile stretch. If the $30 million project near New Bern to upgrade 30 miles of freeway to interstate standards & resurface the entire roadway is any indication, plus the upcoming project on US-264 to upgrade it to interstate standards between Greenville and the existing interstate-standard segment connecting to I-795 / I-95, this could be a reasonable project. Other upgrades such as bridge replacements are ultimately needed, but for the interim, a shoulder widening project would bring it up to sufficient standards to be designated an interstate highway. This wouldn't be anything unique, certainly not for North Carolina, it's been a common practice with integrating pre-existing freeway into newer interstate highways. Go another 20 miles east and connect to the interstate-standard freeway between Tarboro and Williamston, you could have I-87 shields spanning the 97 mile stretch between Raleigh and Williamston.

Not so simple, past the 264/Future 587 split, there are several bridges recommended for replacement, for both clearance and to widen, thank you bob7374:

http://www.malmeroads.net/ncfutints/fut87.html

[MNHighwayMan]

Hopefully they won't be passing the pot pipe around.

I hope they take a lot of pot and overdose.

[Beltway]

Hopefully they won't be passing the pot pipe around.

I hope they take a lot of pot and overdose.

The problem is that some of that pot has PCP and meth and coke and ecstasy worked into it.

They don't know until they have smoked it.

[LM117]

Google Streetview is now showing the new BGS's with I-87 shields on westbound I-440 and the Knightdale Bypass.

[sprjus4]

Google Streetview is now showing the new BGS's with I-87 shields on westbound I-440 and the Knightdale Bypass.

It appears there's updated Street View on Poole Rd (the interchange just prior to the I-87 / I-440 split) from July 2019, and ground-mounted I-440 shields at the ramp entrances have been replaced with ground-mounted guide signage indicating I-87, I-440, and US-64 on all approaches, along with Rocky Mount as the northbound control city.

https://www.google.com/maps/@35.7678653,-78.5734517,3a,37.5y,129.35h,84.08t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1seNuFLpDkigSD1_VEjolXAw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

Signage has also been posted from the I-440 East approach indicating I-87, I-440, and US-64.

https://www.google.com/maps/@35.7879078,-78.5744949,3a,75y,157.88h,87.45t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1su_lS6v5OZPGnVIsSLD0_mA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

[LM117]

Does anybody know if VDOT ever finished their study of I-87 or if it was postponed?

From October 8, 2017:

http://www.dailyadvance.com/News/2017/10/08/NCDOT-mulls-I-87-route-to-Currituck.html

Virginia Transportation Commissioner Charlie Kilpatrick said in an email Friday that Virginia Department of Transportation have discussed the proposed I-87 with their counterparts in North Carolina.

"We have also discussed the corridor with NCDOT leadership about a year ago,"  Kilpatrick said. "They made us aware of this east-west connector option and the connection to Virginia Route 168 near the state line."

Asked if he had any preference about the route for I-87, he indicated VDOT isn't close to any decision yet.

"We have not yet engaged the interested parties regarding potential alignments. We are just beginning the study process,"  he said.

[sprjus4]

Does anybody know if VDOT ever finished their study of I-87 or if it was postponed?

From October 8, 2017:

http://www.dailyadvance.com/News/2017/10/08/NCDOT-mulls-I-87-route-to-Currituck.html

Virginia Transportation Commissioner Charlie Kilpatrick said in an email Friday that Virginia Department of Transportation have discussed the proposed I-87 with their counterparts in North Carolina.

"We have also discussed the corridor with NCDOT leadership about a year ago,"  Kilpatrick said. "They made us aware of this east-west connector option and the connection to Virginia Route 168 near the state line."

Asked if he had any preference about the route for I-87, he indicated VDOT isn't close to any decision yet.

"We have not yet engaged the interested parties regarding potential alignments. We are just beginning the study process,"  he said.

I haven't been able to find much information on VDOT's study of I-87.

In December 2017, a memorandum was sent to Chesapeake city council that discussed the proposed interstate and the initiation to the "Route 17 Interchange Feasibility Study", and is probably the most detailed document I've so far been able to find regarding I-87 in Virginia. Since this, there's been no official documentation released regarding any updates, developments, etc. with this "study".

This memorandum is provided in response to a recent inquiry by City Council regarding potential impacts to development patterns along the Dominion Boulevard corridor resulting from the proposed upgrade of Route 17 to interstate status (i.e. Interstate I-87). In particular, Council was interested in where the interstate interchanges might be located and how this could affect planned development under the adopted Dominion Boulevard Corridor Study & Economic Development Strategic Plan.

The Dominion Boulevard Corridor Study was adopted by City Council on November 15, 2016 following a nearly three year planning process, including significant stakeholder input. While the construction of the Dominion Boulevard Bridge Replacement & Roadway Improvement Project was the primary catalyst for the Study, efforts by many stakeholders in North Carolina and Virginia to upgrade Route 17 to interstate status also factored into the Study's strategic economic development recommendations. The Study contains a number of direct references to the proposed interstate.

The Study's master land use plan, proposed street network, stormwater management, and other planning frameworks contemplated possible interstate interchanges along Dominion Boulevard, based on existing and planned traffic intersections allowed under the Virginia Department of Transportation (VDOT) Access Management Plan for Route 17. The Study planning team tried to cluster more non-residential land uses around possible interchange locations in the two urban core development areas. The proposed street network also makes accommodations for traffic circulation in the vicinity of possible interstate interchanges, in order to maintain internal connections within the study area and to surrounding neighborhoods.

It was mentioned during City Council's October 10, 2017 Work Session recap of the September Council Retreat that public meetings/hearings should be held to facilitate identification of interchange locations and appropriate land uses around them. It was mentioned that revisions to the Dominion Boulevard Corridor Study might also be needed to better promote commercial uses. In this regard, at the City's request, the Hampton Roads District Office of VDOT has agreed to take the lead in initiating a feasibility study to identify the general limits and future interchanges along the Dominion Boulevard/Route 17 corridor. The Hampton Roads Transportation Planning Organization (HRTPO) is also being requested to participate in the study.

City staff will maintain contact with VDOT and HRTPO to facilitate initiation of the Route 17 interstate interchange feasibility study and will be prepared to help coordinate the study's implementation, including organizing and promoting citizen input opportunities. Staff will keep City Council apprised of key upcoming steps in this process once formulated. The feasibility study should provide valuable guidance as to the need to amend the 2035 Comprehensive Plan to revise the Dominion Boulevard Corridor Study.

There's been a lot of support / interest in the corridor from the HRTPO's Freight Transportation Advisory Committee, and the latest mention of I-87 in Virginia comes from their September 25, 2019 meeting where an update was presented, though I've not been able to find anything on what specific "updates" were talked about as there's been no minutes published. If previous minutes from meetings by the FTAC are any indication, minutes from this meeting will be released sometime in January - February 2020.

So far, the entire study process for I-87 in Virginia seems to be closed door talks that gets mentioned in documentation every once and a while. Hopefully within a year there will more detailed information / potential plans & alternatives released publicly.

[LM117]

^ Thanks for the 411!

[sprjus4]

Two major projects along I-87 in the Raleigh area have been suspended indefinitely for any preliminary engineering activities with the ongoing funding issues around the state.

I-6005 - Widening I-87 from 4 to 6 lanes between US-64 Business and US-264.
I-6007 - Conversion of Exit 9 (Smithfield Rd) to a diverging diamond interchange.

https://connect.ncdot.gov/projects/Project-Management/Documents/Suspension%20Memo%20List%20-%20Revised%20%28November%201%2c%202019%29%20by%20County.pdf

[LM117]

Two major projects along I-87 in the Raleigh area have been suspended indefinitely for any preliminary engineering activities with the ongoing funding issues around the state.

I-6005 - Widening I-87 from 4 to 6 lanes between US-64 Business and US-264.
I-6007 - Conversion of Exit 9 (Smithfield Rd) to a diverging diamond interchange.

https://connect.ncdot.gov/projects/Project-Management/Documents/Suspension%20Memo%20List%20-%20Revised%20%28November%201%2c%202019%29%20by%20County.pdf

Damn. That widening project is badly needed.

[ARMOURERERIC]

I just went to your link.  I found the NCDot title confusing, are the items that are scratched out back in progress?

[sprjus4]

I just went to your link.  I found the NCDot title confusing, are the items that are scratched out back in progress?

Yes.

[ARMOURERERIC]

Thank you, oddly that little bridge job in Burke over Rock Creek is walking distance from my home.