Covid vaccination status?

[Scott5114]

Norman's mask mandate was last considered by the city council at the end of February. Then, they acted to extend it to June 1, believing that by then they will be in a better place to judge whether continuing it is necessary or if it will simply be allowed to expire entirely.

June 1??? I guess they've never heard of something called "vaccines."

At the time that they last deliberated the issue, vaccines weren't available for most Oklahomans. They still aren't for the general populace, only people in essential industries, though that list of industries is very large compared to most other states, and declaring you're part of one of those industries is apparently on the honor system. Additionally, it is rather difficult to get an appointment in Norman proper (or anywhere in the OKC metro for that matter)–I drove 62 miles one-way to get my first dose, two counties away. That's not an option for everyone.

The tribes have apparently reached the point where they've vaccinated enough of their populations and employees that they're giving them away to anyone who wants them, but again, there are no tribal health clinics in Cleveland County, so you have to drive to Purcell at the closest. Again, not an option for everyone.

June 1 makes sense as an expiration date as well because it is after the end of spring classes at the University of Oklahoma. To my knowledge, we haven't recorded anyone in city limits suffocating to death of having a mask on, so there's little reason to call for an early end to the mandate.

If we're using university class schedules as a basis, then every state would look at June 1.  That's not happening.

This isn't a state mask mandate, it's a city one (in the city with the state's largest university). We never had any statewide mask mandate. I'm fine with the city government being cautious–wearing a mask doesn't hurt me any.

[SSOWorld]

There should not be any need for any sort of vaccine verification, be it digital or physical. This reeks of "show me your papers."

So does showing your driver license to get alcohol, showing your passport to get on a plane, but you comply anyway.

[MikeTheActuary]

Is it even possible currently to verify if someone has been vaccinated or not? Are the names and information of all those who have been vaccinated, no matter where in the country it was done, stored in a database somewhere?

These days, within the US at least, anything medical-related is stored in several databases.

I had my first Pfizer jab this morning.  The check-in, vaccination, second-appointment, and check-out-of-observation stations at my site all had tablets.  Literally as the needle went in my arm, I got a text message reminding me to make an appointment for the second dose, and another confirmation message once I was handed a card telling me to report back at the same time, 3 weeks from today.

There should not be any need for any sort of vaccine verification, be it digital or physical. This reeks of "show me your papers."

There's been requirements to show proof of vaccination to register for school, or to travel to some locations for many years now.  If people could be trusted to do the right things, there would be no need; but they can't, so there is.

I do expect that if there is a wave of "show proof of COVID vaccination" requirements, they will be relatively short-lived at least within industrialized countries, once populations have been sufficiently vaccinated.

[Jim]

As I understand it, vaccination requirements that apply to schools, some jobs, etc., cannot be extended to the covid vaccines while they're authorized for emergency use only.  Once one or more are fully approved, assuming they're still needed given whatever prevalence the virus continues to have at that time, I expect they would become required for some purposes.

[J N Winkler]

Notwithstanding the existence of vaccination databases, I don't think we are going to be doing vaccine passports, even for a brief period.  Prioritization means that the fatality rate from recent cases of covid will fall off a cliff long before the population as a whole achieves herd immunity, because the groups most likely to die from the disease are receiving their doses first.  (Compare case fatality rates between the US military and the US population as a whole at the present very small vaccination percentage:  the US has had 524,000 deaths out of about 29 million cases, which translates to a case fatality rate of 1.8%, while the military has had 120 deaths out of 150,000 cases, or 0.08%.  This is a result of service members having an average age 10 years younger than the median age of the population as a whole and most of the comorbidities that elevate risk of death from covid also being disqualifying for military service.  As vaccination progresses, the part of the US population at large that hasn't yet received shots will look more and more like the US military--young and healthy.)

With the apparent threat receding, it is going to be an uphill battle just to retain mask mandates until a herd immunity threshold is reached:  in comparison, a vaccine passport based on secure documents is an even heavier lift.

The EU has been talking about vaccine passports, but I don't think they will get a scheme off the ground, even though conditions there are more favorable for it, with greater centralization of recordkeeping (national identity cards can function as a substrate), slower progress of vaccination, greater use of vaccines with lower headline efficacy numbers, more travel from countries such as Russia and China where the vaccines in use have not been approved in the West, and so on.

[SectorZ]

Notwithstanding the existence of vaccination databases, I don't think we are going to be doing vaccine passports, even for a brief period.  Prioritization means that the fatality rate from recent cases of covid will fall off a cliff long before the population as a whole achieves herd immunity, because the groups most likely to die from the disease are receiving their doses first.  (Compare case fatality rates between the US military and the US population as a whole at the present very small vaccination percentage:  the US has had 524,000 deaths out of about 29 million cases, which translates to a case fatality rate of 1.8%, while the military has had 120 deaths out of 150,000 cases, or 0.08%.  This is a result of service members having an average age 10 years younger than the median age of the population as a whole and most of the comorbidities that elevate risk of death from covid also being disqualifying for military service.  As vaccination progresses, the part of the US population at large that hasn't yet received shots will look more and more like the US military--young and healthy.)

With the apparent threat receding, it is going to be an uphill battle just to retain mask mandates until a herd immunity threshold is reached:  in comparison, a vaccine passport based on secure documents is an even heavier lift.

The EU has been talking about vaccine passports, but I don't think they will get a scheme off the ground, even though conditions there are more favorable for it, with greater centralization of recordkeeping (national identity cards can function as a substrate), slower progress of vaccination, greater use of vaccines with lower headline efficacy numbers, more travel from countries such as Russia and China where the vaccines in use have not been approved in the West, and so on.

By the time the bureaucracy of any vaccine passport system is hashed out, we're going to be well past herd immunity. It'll just be a moot point by then.

[dkblake]

Notwithstanding the existence of vaccination databases, I don't think we are going to be doing vaccine passports, even for a brief period.  Prioritization means that the fatality rate from recent cases of covid will fall off a cliff long before the population as a whole achieves herd immunity, because the groups most likely to die from the disease are receiving their doses first.  (Compare case fatality rates between the US military and the US population as a whole at the present very small vaccination percentage:  the US has had 524,000 deaths out of about 29 million cases, which translates to a case fatality rate of 1.8%, while the military has had 120 deaths out of 150,000 cases, or 0.08%.  This is a result of service members having an average age 10 years younger than the median age of the population as a whole and most of the comorbidities that elevate risk of death from covid also being disqualifying for military service.  As vaccination progresses, the part of the US population at large that hasn't yet received shots will look more and more like the US military--young and healthy.)

With the apparent threat receding, it is going to be an uphill battle just to retain mask mandates until a herd immunity threshold is reached:  in comparison, a vaccine passport based on secure documents is an even heavier lift.

The EU has been talking about vaccine passports, but I don't think they will get a scheme off the ground, even though conditions there are more favorable for it, with greater centralization of recordkeeping (national identity cards can function as a substrate), slower progress of vaccination, greater use of vaccines with lower headline efficacy numbers, more travel from countries such as Russia and China where the vaccines in use have not been approved in the West, and so on.

By the time the bureaucracy of any vaccine passport system is hashed out, we're going to be well past herd immunity. It'll just be a moot point by then.

I was reading an interview about this in one of the local Vermont papers, and the idea was to start with carrots more than sticks. The dogmatic anti-vaxxers get the most airspace, sure, but there are a decent population of people who just don't know for various reasons, and soft diplomacy (e.g. reassuring them that the technology is safe, that their own doctor has gotten it/will get it, that family members or other people got it and are fine and the world keeps spinning) will probably go a long way toward convincing enough people to get it in order to achieve herd immunity.

[vdeane]

NY is already working on an app to be used as a vaccine/testing passport to be used for things that require such.  If people don't want to use the app, they'll have to download/print a document (which I think will have a QR code).

[hotdogPi]

NY is already working on an app to be used as a vaccine/testing passport to be used for things that require such.  If people don't want to use the app, they'll have to download/print a document (which I think will have a QR code).

So if someone from New Jersey wants to do something in New York City (or anything else across the state line)?

[hbelkins]

NY is already working on an app to be used as a vaccine/testing passport to be used for things that require such.  If people don't want to use the app, they'll have to download/print a document (which I think will have a QR code).

So if someone from New Jersey wants to do something in New York City (or anything else across the state line)?

Requiring a vaccination to travel across state lines probably won't survive a court challenge. They tried a travel ban in Kentucky and the federal courts shot it down.

[oscar]

NY is already working on an app to be used as a vaccine/testing passport to be used for things that require such.  If people don't want to use the app, they'll have to download/print a document (which I think will have a QR code).

So if someone from New Jersey wants to do something in New York City (or anything else across the state line)?

Requiring a vaccination to travel across state lines probably won't survive a court challenge. They tried a travel ban in Kentucky and the federal courts shot it down.

OTOH, New York and even Vermont are exempting at least some vaccinated visitors from other states from their usual quarantine requirements. (Make sure to read the fine print -- NY's new rules have a lot of it.) Somehow, the quarantine requirements have escaped court challenges. If the requirements are valid, exemptions based on vaccination status would probably be OK too.

Whether those states will be able to readily and reliably verify vaccination status, for visitors claiming to have been vaccinated in other states, is unclear at best.

[Scott5114]

I think the question is "if NY implements a vaccination credential of some kind, will there be reciprocity with an NJ credential that allows it to be used in NY, and what if NJ (or another state) doesn't bother to issue such credentials?"

Another question is what if someone from another country comes bearing a credential for a vaccine not approved by the US? Obviously, there are concerns about the Sinovac and Sputnik vaccines (since the countries promulgating those vaccines have not been transparent about how they got their effectiveness numbers), but how does one legally distinguish between those and things like the AstraZeneca vaccine (which is apparently effective, but has been held up in the US because it may cause a danger to those receiving it)? Have a tier that is "well, the FDA didn't approve it but we're gonna call it good anyway?" What would the criteria for that be?

By the time the bureaucracy of any vaccine passport system is hashed out, we're going to be well past herd immunity. It'll just be a moot point by then.

This, I think, will be the ultimate answer. Particularly in this part of the country, so many businesses are keen to pretend the pandemic is over already, I think that if OK ends up issuing me some kind of vaccination credential, I would expect nobody to ever want to look at it. The state line between OK and adjoining states is so porous (road crossings about once a mile for the entire border with KS, for instance) that setting up a checkpoint between states would be impractical, and TX in particular is even more indifferent about the pandemic than OK is.

OTOH, New York and even Vermont are exempting at least some vaccinated visitors from other states from their usual quarantine requirements. (Make sure to read the fine print -- NY's new rules have a lot of it.) Somehow, the quarantine requirements have escaped court challenges. If the requirements are valid, exemptions based on vaccination status would probably be OK too.

I always got the impression that the quarantine requirements in states that passed them were more or less done on the honor system. If I were to drive to New York right now and stayed at a private home for three days before returning to Oklahoma, how would the state even know I was there? I mean, sure, if someone narced on me to the state health department, I could potentially run into problems, but I wonder whether the state would even have the resources to follow up on such a report (we sure as hell wouldn't in OK; when I actually tested positive I never got so much as a contact-tracing call from OSDH).

[Duke87]

Man I don't look at the forum for a couple weeks and there's a new thread here already on page 11...

So, my wife already got shot 1 of Pfizer and will be going back for shot 2 next week. She had to provide ID when she showed up for her appointment but was not asked for any other documentation verifying her eligibility.

I am not yet eligible but this tentatively changes on April 5 when CT plans to remove all prerequisites and let anyone 16 and up book an appointment.
I have not yet decided whether I want to be online at midnight on April 5 and try to book an appointment ASAP, or whether I'd rather let the initial stampede pass and more casually book an appointment when it doesn't require frantically hitting refresh hoping to get through in order to do so. But either way, I do intend to get jabbed - and while given a choice I'd like J&J for the sake of being one and done, I'll take whatever is offered and not complain.

[dlsterner]

Well, if I were just 2½ years older, I would be eligible right now.  As it stands, I will easily be in the next phase (Phase 2) that Maryland opens up (hopefully soon), and I plan to get the vaccine as soon as practical.

Update - was able to reposition from Phase 2 to Phase 1C; will be getting the first dose of the Pfizer vaccine this coming Saturday and the second dose three weeks later.

[webny99]

OTOH, New York and even Vermont are exempting at least some vaccinated visitors from other states from their usual quarantine requirements. (Make sure to read the fine print -- NY's new rules have a lot of it.) Somehow, the quarantine requirements have escaped court challenges. If the requirements are valid, exemptions based on vaccination status would probably be OK too.

I always got the impression that the quarantine requirements in states that passed them were more or less done on the honor system. If I were to drive to New York right now and stayed at a private home for three days before returning to Oklahoma, how would the state even know I was there? I mean, sure, if someone narced on me to the state health department, I could potentially run into problems, but I wonder whether the state would even have the resources to follow up on such a report (we sure as hell wouldn't in OK; when I actually tested positive I never got so much as a contact-tracing call from OSDH).

For surface travelers, it is more or less done on the honor system, although you might want to be careful driving around with license plates from another state, because you never know what unsuspecting passerby might decide to report you, especially if it's someone down the street that can see where you're staying.

Of course, the big caveat is that a lot of long-distance travel is done by air, and although some airports are more lax than others, you will generally have to pass a checkpoint before leaving the airport where you'll be asked what state you're arriving from, and if it's on the quarantine list, you'll have to fill out quarantine papers. Tracing is quite a bit more advanced here: I'm not sure if this is still ongoing now, but it has been that anyone that tested positive for COVID or had arrived from a state on the quarantine list would receive a call from the state every day for two weeks to make sure they were staying in quarantine.

[MikeTheActuary]

Man I don't look at the forum for a couple weeks and there's a new thread here already on page 11...

So, my wife already got shot 1 of Pfizer and will be going back for shot 2 next week. She had to provide ID when she showed up for her appointment but was not asked for any other documentation verifying her eligibility.

I am not yet eligible but this tentatively changes on April 5 when CT plans to remove all prerequisites and let anyone 16 and up book an appointment.
I have not yet decided whether I want to be online at midnight on April 5 and try to book an appointment ASAP, or whether I'd rather let the initial stampede pass and more casually book an appointment when it doesn't require frantically hitting refresh hoping to get through in order to do so. But either way, I do intend to get jabbed - and while given a choice I'd like J&J for the sake of being one and done, I'll take whatever is offered and not complain.

When availability opened for 45+ on Friday, I checked the sites I had bookmarked at midnight, and they mostly hadn't captured the change in eligibility requirements.   The update went in sometime in the middle of the night.

VAMS did start taking email addresses the day before, and I got my appointment by jumping on their email notification when it came through in the 8am hour.  They do have a mechanism to let you choose which vaccine you want (subject to appointment availability, of course).   I did keep an eye out for J&J vaccine times after I made my initial appointment because I liked the idea of "one and done"....but keep in mind that the trade-off is that there is a longer wait-time after the J&J jab to achieve full efficacy, and the J&J vaccine has a lower reported effectiveness rate.   

Those downsides aren't so "down" that a person should refuse J&J in favor of Pfizer or Moderna....but they do have me thinking it doesn't make much sense to deviate from a "first available, and then see if an earlier appointment can be found" strategy.

FWIW, my wife isn't yet eligible.  We've been preparing for the rush of the next wave by making sure she has accounts with all the different iterations of MyCharts in the state, and getting in the habit of checking VAMS for a change in their pre-registration.  (We're planning to visit family with health issues as soon as our vaccines have taken full effect...thus the emphasis on getting it done as soon as possible.)

[J N Winkler]

Another question is what if someone from another country comes bearing a credential for a vaccine not approved by the US? Obviously, there are concerns about the Sinovac and Sputnik vaccines (since the countries promulgating those vaccines have not been transparent about how they got their effectiveness numbers), but how does one legally distinguish between those and things like the AstraZeneca vaccine (which is apparently effective, but has been held up in the US because it may cause a danger to those receiving it)? Have a tier that is "well, the FDA didn't approve it but we're gonna call it good anyway?" What would the criteria for that be?

It is conceptually possible to accept vaccines that are not currently approved in the US for purposes of avoiding quarantine on the basis of their being approved by a WHO-designated Stringent Regulatory Authority.  This would cover the Oxford/AstraZeneca vaccine since the MHRA in the UK is a SRA.

Countries with SRAs form a more restrictive club than countries where the tap water can be assumed to be safe to drink.  Russia and New Zealand are in one and not the other, for example.

NY is already working on an app to be used as a vaccine/testing passport to be used for things that require such.  If people don't want to use the app, they'll have to download/print a document (which I think will have a QR code).

How is this qualitatively different from, say, taking a photo of one's CDC vaccine reminder card once it has been populated with dates and batch numbers for a full course of shots, and showing that with proof of identity such as a driver's license?  How is the state addressing equal protection concerns that arise from New Yorkers receiving vaccines through channels (such as the VA, Native American tribes, etc.) that bypass the state vaccination database?

[vdeane]

One thing to keep in mind with NY's app is that it's not for travel per se (though they might use it for such if it gets rolled out before the quarantine order is due to end on April 1, and it never applied to adjacent states); it's for things like concerts and sporting events.

Also of note: all travelers are required to fill out the traveler health form regardless of whether their state is subject to the requirement and regardless of mode of transport (if not air, you're supposed to fill it out online after arrival, though I don't know how that's enforced).

NY just dropped the eligibility age to 50 starting tomorrow.  It kinda boggles the mind that some states are already opening eligibility to the general public, but then, maybe they're more willing to force people to go through a stampede pass where you constantly reload to try to get through and come out with an appointment weeks or months in the future.

Another question is what if someone from another country comes bearing a credential for a vaccine not approved by the US? Obviously, there are concerns about the Sinovac and Sputnik vaccines (since the countries promulgating those vaccines have not been transparent about how they got their effectiveness numbers), but how does one legally distinguish between those and things like the AstraZeneca vaccine (which is apparently effective, but has been held up in the US because it may cause a danger to those receiving it)? Have a tier that is "well, the FDA didn't approve it but we're gonna call it good anyway?" What would the criteria for that be?

My understanding is that the reason we didn't approve AstraZeneca is because there were questions regarding its trail that made us question if it was effective, not because of the blood clots.  Although Cuomo made it sound like we're going to approve it, so maybe they fixed that.  Regarding the others, my understanding is that this is one reason why the EU is developing a system - so they can exclude them.

How is this qualitatively different from, say, taking a photo of one's CDC vaccine reminder card once it has been populated with dates and batch numbers for a full course of shots, and showing that with proof of identity such as a driver's license?  How is the state addressing equal protection concerns that arise from New Yorkers receiving vaccines through channels (such as the VA, Native American tribes, etc.) that bypass the state vaccination database?

The system doesn't show those at all.  Just a QR code that can verify eligibility.  My understanding is that it's a supplement, not a replacement, for existing processes to streamline things.
https://www.governor.ny.gov/news/governor-cuomo-announces-pilot-program-testing-excelsior-pass-madison-square-garden-and
https://www.governor.ny.gov/sites/governor.ny.gov/files/atoms/files/COVID-19_App.pdf

[Scott5114]

One thing to keep in mind with NY's app is that it's not for travel per se (though they might use it for such if it gets rolled out before the quarantine order is due to end on April 1, and it never applied to adjacent states); it's for things like concerts and sporting events.

Again, though, that raises the question of equal protection–suppose a fully vaccinated OK resident were to attend a concert in NY. Could they use an OK vaccine credential? What if OK offers no vaccine credential, or the patient was vaccinated by a tribal health authority?

Another question is what if someone from another country comes bearing a credential for a vaccine not approved by the US? Obviously, there are concerns about the Sinovac and Sputnik vaccines (since the countries promulgating those vaccines have not been transparent about how they got their effectiveness numbers), but how does one legally distinguish between those and things like the AstraZeneca vaccine (which is apparently effective, but has been held up in the US because it may cause a danger to those receiving it)? Have a tier that is "well, the FDA didn't approve it but we're gonna call it good anyway?" What would the criteria for that be?

My understanding is that the reason we didn't approve AstraZeneca is because there were questions regarding its trail that made us question if it was effective, not because of the blood clots.  Although Cuomo made it sound like we're going to approve it, so maybe they fixed that.  Regarding the others, my understanding is that this is one reason why the EU is developing a system - so they can exclude them.

WaPo has an article today stating that a US trial showed the AstraZeneca vaccine to be 79% effective, and the trial "found no suggestion that the vaccine carried an increased risk of clotting," so it's possible that they could get emergency authorization if they apply for it.

[J N Winkler]

The system doesn't show those at all.  Just a QR code that can verify eligibility.  My understanding is that it's a supplement, not a replacement, for existing processes to streamline things.

https://www.governor.ny.gov/news/governor-cuomo-announces-pilot-program-testing-excelsior-pass-madison-square-garden-and

https://www.governor.ny.gov/sites/governor.ny.gov/files/atoms/files/COVID-19_App.pdf

Thanks for the links.  The press release is unclear on how the underlying Health Pass solution verifies that the app user has in fact received the vaccination or negative test result that he or she claims to have in hand.  Does this rely on self-certification?

[Rothman]

I'm amazed that there are states out there not doing what NY is doing:  Automatically setting up your second appointment after you complete the first -- exactly three weeks from when you get your first dose.

[Duke87]

Also of note: all travelers are required to fill out the traveler health form regardless of whether their state is subject to the requirement and regardless of mode of transport (if not air, you're supposed to fill it out online after arrival, though I don't know how that's enforced).

This feeds back into what was stated above where what's technically legally required may be far more broad than what can feasibly be enforced, which in turn may also be more broad than what actually is enforced.

I can state through empirical experience that New York sometimes has the national guard at LGA checking to make sure everyone leaving the gate area has filled out a form. But only sometimes. And of course, all this does is check that someone has filled out the form, it does nothing to ensure that people actually follow up on the required actions after they leave the airport. Meanwhile Cuomo himself has straight up admitted it's basically impossible for the state to enforce anything on people who arrive by car.

That said, Warren and Essex counties specifically have actually been enforcing the rules real hard: not letting people check into hotels without the form filled out, and they've even had random checkins on residents to ensure they are quarantining as required. NYC was doing this for hotels but not for residents. The rest of the state never did much of anything as far as I can tell.


Over here in CT, we handed out about a dozen fines for breaking the rules at the end of last summer just to make a public example and try to scare people. But, all but one of the fines were only for failing to fill out the form. One person got a second fine because one of his coworkers narced on him for loudly bragging about how he had traveled and was refusing to quarantine. 

Otherwise... the only place there has ever really been anything resembling enforcement is at doctor's offices. Go to the doctor and you will be asked if you've traveled in the last two weeks. Answer yes and they will require you provide proof of having received a negative test.

[Scott5114]

I'm amazed that there are states out there not doing what NY is doing:  Automatically setting up your second appointment after you complete the first -- exactly three weeks from when you get your first dose.

In Oklahoma, I've heard that some people are being automatically scheduled for their second dose. I was not. Of course, it may be better in my case that I wasn't–I only went to a large vaccination site in a rural county because all of the sites nearer were booked solid, so I may be able to get my 2nd dose closer to home. Additionally, my wife now has a job she didn't have at the time of our vaccination, so we are now going to have to schedule at least her 2nd dose around her work schedule.

[jeffandnicole]

I got my first dose Friday; go for my 2nd dose 3 weeks from then.

In NJ, while they haven't opened it up to everyone, the age groups are 65+, and 16-64 with 'certain medical conditions', one of which is if you have a BMI of 25 or above.  Which means, just about everyone is eligible.

I went to one of the Megasites, which was extremely well run.  I had taken my mom there twice, so I knew what to expect when I went. Before you get in the door, they ask you: Do you have an appointment, and are you available on such-and-such date for your 2nd shot. That was the most often asked question...they asked it 6 times total.  And they were very willing to assist you if you didn't have their app/website to schedule it yourself.  Everyone was extremely friendly.  A fair amount of walking was done inside what was a former Lord & Taylor, but the only line longer than 1 or 2 people was the first one, which was about a 5 - 10 minute wait.

I'm amazed that there are states out there not doing what NY is doing:  Automatically setting up your second appointment after you complete the first -- exactly three weeks from when you get your first dose.

It depends on where you go in NJ.  As mentioned, the place I went they checked with you multiple times that you scheduled your 2nd appointment.  But from what I read, some CVSs and Rite-Aids force you to call or go online to schedule it yourself, and don't give you any assistance in the store.

[vdeane]

Also of note: all travelers are required to fill out the traveler health form regardless of whether their state is subject to the requirement and regardless of mode of transport (if not air, you're supposed to fill it out online after arrival, though I don't know how that's enforced).

This feeds back into what was stated above where what's technically legally required may be far more broad than what can feasibly be enforced, which in turn may also be more broad than what actually is enforced.

I can state through empirical experience that New York sometimes has the national guard at LGA checking to make sure everyone leaving the gate area has filled out a form. But only sometimes. And of course, all this does is check that someone has filled out the form, it does nothing to ensure that people actually follow up on the required actions after they leave the airport. Meanwhile Cuomo himself has straight up admitted it's basically impossible for the state to enforce anything on people who arrive by car.

That said, Warren and Essex counties specifically have actually been enforcing the rules real hard: not letting people check into hotels without the form filled out, and they've even had random checkins on residents to ensure they are quarantining as required. NYC was doing this for hotels but not for residents. The rest of the state never did much of anything as far as I can tell.


Over here in CT, we handed out about a dozen fines for breaking the rules at the end of last summer just to make a public example and try to scare people. But, all but one of the fines were only for failing to fill out the form. One person got a second fine because one of his coworkers narced on him for loudly bragging about how he had traveled and was refusing to quarantine. 

Otherwise... the only place there has ever really been anything resembling enforcement is at doctor's offices. Go to the doctor and you will be asked if you've traveled in the last two weeks. Answer yes and they will require you provide proof of having received a negative test.

Wasn't NYC setting up random checkpoints at some point?

Even doctors vary by quite a bit.  My eye doctor has only a simple temperature check.  That's it.  Supercuts is more restrictive.  My retina specialist, on the other hand, won't see you if you've been anywhere outside of the area any time even remotely soon.  This was true even for travel to rural podunk PA exactly two weeks before during the month of July, back when cases were really low (and lower there than here), and during which I only got out of the car for a lunch/gas/bathroom stop at a Sheetz.  Rather than applying nuance they just had a blanket ban.  I found that out the hard way.  My other doctors are in between.

I'm amazed that there are states out there not doing what NY is doing:  Automatically setting up your second appointment after you complete the first -- exactly three weeks from when you get your first dose.

In Oklahoma, I've heard that some people are being automatically scheduled for their second dose. I was not. Of course, it may be better in my case that I wasn't–I only went to a large vaccination site in a rural county because all of the sites nearer were booked solid, so I may be able to get my 2nd dose closer to home. Additionally, my wife now has a job she didn't have at the time of our vaccination, so we are now going to have to schedule at least her 2nd dose around her work schedule.

On the other hand, you run the risk of not being able to schedule the appointment on time.  I don't think we have hard numbers for our approved vaccines, but the Chinese one is known to basically be worthless if the second dose is administered more than 2-3 weeks out.