Francis Scott Key Bridge (I-695) complete collapse after large ship hits it

[vdeane]

And if they didn't raise the clearance, you'd blame them for being not forward-thinking enough...given the eventual replacement of the Bay Bridge...

That post reads to me as just a bunch of words to re-affirm his already well-known and much-stated opinion that the only satisfactory (to him) alternatives are a tunnel or no build.

[Max Rockatansky]

And if they didn't raise the clearance, you'd blame them for being not forward-thinking enough...given the eventual replacement of the Bay Bridge...

That post reads to me as just a bunch of words to re-affirm his already well-known and much-stated opinion that the only satisfactory (to him) alternatives are a tunnel or no build.

I decided a long time ago that I wasn't going have a bunch of personal opinions mixed into what I write on GN.  Most people who read road pages generally already have their own opinions on most major projects.  I tend to believe with whatever subject I'm writing about that I am the least interesting part of it.  That being the case the least I can do is respect the reader to decide what they think for themselves. 

I'm failing to see how Beltway is going to convince anyone to change their opinion one way or another on the Key Bridge replacement (especially here).  This is a lot of effort to wait several weeks just to give the same opinion in a slightly different wrapper. 

[NE2]

🐐🐐🐐

[jeffandnicole]

And if they didn't raise the clearance, you'd blame them for being not forward-thinking enough...given the eventual replacement of the Bay Bridge...

That post reads to me as just a bunch of words to re-affirm his already well-known and much-stated opinion that the only satisfactory (to him) alternatives are a tunnel or no build.

Without going back to read his AI sounding posts or rants, I'm thinking he's arguing against himself at times.

[74/171FAN]

People love to cause chaos on the forum whenever I take a day off to do some roadgeeking.

[roadman65]

This wouldn't be AA Roads if there wasn't a chaotic argument. 🤣

The point is if people are weary, they should just ignore it, but it is what it is.

[jmacswimmer]

Just to mix in some lighthearted content to this thread, here's an aerial shot of what remains of the Key Bridge while on approach to BWI last week:




Meanwhile, the Key Bridge Rebuild posted on their facebook page yesterday that all of the bridge deck has now been removed and is, for the moment, stockpiled on-site (from the photos, it appears to be on the closed mainline lanes in the area of the former toll plaza).

https://www.facebook.com/p/Key-Bridge-Rebuild-61558692757377/

[Henry]

And if they didn't raise the clearance, you'd blame them for being not forward-thinking enough...given the eventual replacement of the Bay Bridge...

That post reads to me as just a bunch of words to re-affirm his already well-known and much-stated opinion that the only satisfactory (to him) alternatives are a tunnel or no build.

I decided a long time ago that I wasn't going have a bunch of personal opinions mixed into what I write on GN.  Most people who read road pages generally already have their own opinions on most major projects.  I tend to believe with whatever subject I'm writing about that I am the least interesting part of it.  That being the case the least I can do is respect the reader to decide what they think for themselves. 

I'm failing to see how Beltway is going to convince anyone to change their opinion one way or another on the Key Bridge replacement (especially here).  This is a lot of effort to wait several weeks just to give the same opinion in a slightly different wrapper. 

Only he can air his grievances about this forum on his personal webpage. Just imagine all those visitors reading that bit and saying under their breath, "who cares?"

[Max Rockatansky]

And if they didn't raise the clearance, you'd blame them for being not forward-thinking enough...given the eventual replacement of the Bay Bridge...

That post reads to me as just a bunch of words to re-affirm his already well-known and much-stated opinion that the only satisfactory (to him) alternatives are a tunnel or no build.

I decided a long time ago that I wasn't going have a bunch of personal opinions mixed into what I write on GN.  Most people who read road pages generally already have their own opinions on most major projects.  I tend to believe with whatever subject I'm writing about that I am the least interesting part of it.  That being the case the least I can do is respect the reader to decide what they think for themselves. 

I'm failing to see how Beltway is going to convince anyone to change their opinion one way or another on the Key Bridge replacement (especially here).  This is a lot of effort to wait several weeks just to give the same opinion in a slightly different wrapper. 

Only he can air his grievances about this forum on his personal webpage. Just imagine all those visitors reading that bit and saying under their breath, "who cares?"

Heh, I was amused that he selectively omitted sharing those here.  His comments about this forum, road groups and for reason breakfast/meals are contained in the page link in Beltway's last reply if anyone cares to get a good laugh. 

That whole bit about "legacy stewardship" in regard to the hobby of road fandom is quite something.  This is very small hobby to begin with and nobody outside of it cares what happens here nor is affected by it.  It struck me as being completely divorced from the reality in regard to the actual scale of what goes on with road pages and groups.

[Scott5114]

In nearly 30 years of online presence in a whole variety of forums, I've witnessed nearly every imaginable form of bizarre forum behavior. This ranks among the worst.

Seriously? Dude must be hanging out on some really milquetoast forums if Kyle doing word-association with his posts is "among the worst" forum behavior he's seen. He's obviously never set foot in a true Internet cesspool like 4chan, which makes AARoads look like a TED Talk.

What's striking is the silence from allies. Despite repeated pushback, no direct support has surfaced, while I know offline that it is there. That silence isn't necessarily disagreement -- it's strategic restraint. Many readers may agree but choose not to enter the fray, wary of the cost of principled engagement in a spectacle-driven environment. Silence, in this context, becomes a form of quiet witness.

Ah, yes, when you can't get anyone to agree with you, it's because everyone else who agrees is part of a mysterious Silent Majority™ whose existence cannot be proven because of how silent they are. Coolidge got away with it in 1919, it was sort of ridiculous by the time Nixon tried it in 1969, and its bogosity has only become more recognized since then. (Which is why it became "angry white males", "soccer moms", "NASCAR dads", "Joe the Plumber", or any other flavor of vague-but-still-slightly-specific appelation since then.)

[Max Rockatansky]

FWIW, off forum he wasn't finding agreement either on this matter.  Similarly there was a claim of "being picked on" rather than a realization that maybe his thoughts just weren't compelling.  Then again, I can't say I'm surprised that someone who claims to be a hobby "legacy steward" thinks highly of his own opinions. 

[Rothman]

In nearly 30 years of online presence in a whole variety of forums, I've witnessed nearly every imaginable form of bizarre forum behavior. This ranks among the worst.

Seriously? Dude must be hanging out on some really milquetoast forums if Kyle doing word-association with his posts is "among the worst" forum behavior he's seen. He's obviously never set foot in a true Internet cesspool like 4chan, which makes AARoads look like a TED Talk.

Did he mention 4chan before or after you posted this?

[Max Rockatansky]

Dan posted drone photos today of the Key Bridge site on the Gribblenation Facebook page:

https://www.facebook.com/100063655972258/posts/pfbid02sZwfEZSyAfL7hcWEnWg4g8M5xEHQ6zzZ5xEafidggnbcHwdswMHzPVCiT1Hzmvool/?mibextid=wwXIfr

The summary:

"Pictured is the site of the Francis Scott Key Bridge in Baltimore, MD as the first operations are now underway on site on the path to building a new Outer Harbor Crossing for the Baltimore Beltway (I-695).

There are two major items of interest going on at the moment. Removal of the existing bridge superstructure is in progress, with the old concrete deck removed from the surviving spans and steel girders now being removed from the Hawkins Point approach.

The test pile program for the replacement bridge is also in progress, with a pair of large crane barges operating in the Patapsco River as part of this operation. Since there was already a bridge at this site, why is there a need for subsurface exploration and testing? Can't engineers just recycle the knowledge and information from its predecessor? Answer: not really. While engineers already have a decent idea of what's down there from the first project, the knowledge of what's there from 50 years ago doesn't necessarily translate from one era to another. For one thing, the replacement bridge is being built to heftier standards than its predecessor and so therefore will experience heavier loadings. How those expected new loadings will interact with the proposed foundation design and its surrounding subsurface needs to be studied before construction can begin. Secondly, the foundation design for the new bridge will be different than that of its predecessor. The foundation of the bridge is its more important component and it's a critical step in the process to go through the works of making sure that everything has been accounted for before construction can get underway in earnest."

[PColumbus73]

And if they didn't raise the clearance, you'd blame them for being not forward-thinking enough...given the eventual replacement of the Bay Bridge...

That post reads to me as just a bunch of words to re-affirm his already well-known and much-stated opinion that the only satisfactory (to him) alternatives are a tunnel or no build.

I decided a long time ago that I wasn't going have a bunch of personal opinions mixed into what I write on GN.  Most people who read road pages generally already have their own opinions on most major projects.  I tend to believe with whatever subject I'm writing about that I am the least interesting part of it.  That being the case the least I can do is respect the reader to decide what they think for themselves. 

I'm failing to see how Beltway is going to convince anyone to change their opinion one way or another on the Key Bridge replacement (especially here).  This is a lot of effort to wait several weeks just to give the same opinion in a slightly different wrapper. 

Only he can air his grievances about this forum on his personal webpage. Just imagine all those visitors reading that bit and saying under their breath, "who cares?"

Heh, I was amused that he selectively omitted sharing those here.  His comments about this forum, road groups and for reason breakfast/meals are contained in the page link in Beltway's last reply if anyone cares to get a good laugh. 

That whole bit about "legacy stewardship" in regard to the hobby of road fandom is quite something.  This is very small hobby to begin with and nobody outside of it cares what happens here nor is affected by it.  It struck me as being completely divorced from the reality in regard to the actual scale of what goes on with road pages and groups.

Where are the aliens when we need them?