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Author Topic: The Worst of Road Signs  (Read 1397469 times)

J N Winkler

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Re: The Worst of Road Signs
« Reply #5125 on: May 15, 2018, 05:55:58 PM »

But if you were the employee who took it down, wouldn't you feel an acute desire to blow it up with dynamite?

Give it time.  If all the pieces of construction debris that were called "fragments of the Berlin Wall" were put together, they would amount to more concrete than in the whole of the former DDR.
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Re: The Worst of Road Signs
« Reply #5126 on: May 16, 2018, 06:27:14 PM »

ALDOT installed a new BGS sign in Birmingham, and well got some Interstate shields swapped.
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Re: The Worst of Road Signs
« Reply #5127 on: May 16, 2018, 08:36:57 PM »

ALDOT installed a new BGS sign in Birmingham, and well got some Interstate shields swapped.

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Re: The Worst of Road Signs
« Reply #5128 on: May 16, 2018, 08:49:38 PM »

ALDOT installed a new BGS sign in Birmingham, and well got some Interstate shields swapped.
Not really "worst of", IMHO. More like just erroneous, as the sign is pretty well made otherwise. But it does show no-one was paying attention when it was made...
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Re: The Worst of Road Signs
« Reply #5129 on: May 17, 2018, 05:53:00 AM »

ALDOT installed a new BGS sign in Birmingham, and well got some Interstate shields swapped.
Not really "worst of", IMHO. More like just erroneous, as the sign is pretty well made otherwise. But it does show no-one was paying attention when it was made...

It is; however, just a tad fucking huge.
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Re: The Worst of Road Signs
« Reply #5130 on: May 17, 2018, 03:15:41 PM »

ALDOT installed a new BGS sign in Birmingham, and well got some Interstate shields swapped.

Not really "worst of", IMHO. More like just erroneous, as the sign is pretty well made otherwise. But it does show no-one was paying attention when it was made...

It is; however, just a tad fucking huge.

It's a dumb-design. The "20"/59 shields could have easily been on one line, which would have greatly reduced the sign height.

APLs are large by their very nature, but it's up to individual agencies not to exacerbate the situation.
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Re: The Worst of Road Signs
« Reply #5131 on: May 17, 2018, 04:53:19 PM »

It's a dumb-design. The "20"/59 shields could have easily been on one line, which would have greatly reduced the sign height.

APLs are large by their very nature, but it's up to individual agencies not to exacerbate the situation.

I 200% agree. The 20/65 swap is stupid, but the failure to prevent the inclusion of that extra space makes this extra facepalm-inducing.
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Re: The Worst of Road Signs
« Reply #5132 on: May 17, 2018, 06:36:11 PM »

ALDOT installed a new BGS sign in Birmingham, and well got some Interstate shields swapped.
Not really "worst of", IMHO. More like just erroneous, as the sign is pretty well made otherwise. But it does show no-one was paying attention when it was made...

It is; however, just a tad fucking huge.

ARDOT basically did the same thing at the west end of I-630...



GIANT Big Green Sign by TheInstrumentalist, on Flickr
« Last Edit: May 17, 2018, 06:46:25 PM by TBKS1 »
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Re: The Worst of Road Signs
« Reply #5133 on: May 18, 2018, 08:25:41 AM »

It is; however, just a tad fucking huge.

ARDOT basically did the same thing at the west end of I-630...

GIANT Big Green Sign by TheInstrumentalist, on Flickr

there's a big difference. while the ARDOT sign is stupidly large, it's not stupidly large for an APL. you can't condense anything further without violating spec or screwing legibility.

the screwup sign, on the other hand, is stupidly large even for an APL.
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Re: The Worst of Road Signs
« Reply #5134 on: May 18, 2018, 08:48:20 AM »

It is; however, just a tad fucking huge.

ARDOT basically did the same thing at the west end of I-630...

GIANT Big Green Sign by TheInstrumentalist, on Flickr

there's a big difference. while the ARDOT sign is stupidly large, it's not stupidly large for an APL. you can't condense anything further without violating spec or screwing legibility.

the screwup sign, on the other hand, is stupidly large even for an APL.

It's huge because of the I-20/59 overlap, and the way the shields must be laid out, presumably so that thru traffic stays in the center (maybe there's unaware travelers who think that 20 and 59 will split immediately after this interchange). Ideally, you could just align the two shields side-by-side in that middle section and eliminate one-third of the sign panel height; APLs permit the white vertical stripes to denote the exits.

Not a fan of APLs and the wasted space, although it has nothing to do with the errors.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2018, 08:52:18 AM by formulanone »
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Re: The Worst of Road Signs
« Reply #5135 on: May 18, 2018, 08:54:42 AM »

It is; however, just a tad fucking huge.

ARDOT basically did the same thing at the west end of I-630...

GIANT Big Green Sign by TheInstrumentalist, on Flickr

there's a big difference. while the ARDOT sign is stupidly large, it's not stupidly large for an APL. you can't condense anything further without violating spec or screwing legibility.

the screwup sign, on the other hand, is stupidly large even for an APL.

It's huge because of the I-20/59 overlap, and the way the shields must be laid out, presumably so that thru traffic stays in the center (maybe there's unaware travelers who think that 20 and 59 will split immediately after this interchange).
However, given the width of the APL sign-board; it looks to me that the 20 WEST/59 SOUTH layout could've been done differently.  Either a single-line (20 WEST 59 SOUTH) layout or have the direction cardinals on one line and the route shields on the other (stacked layout as shown below)

WEST   SOUTH
   20        59


would've reduced the overall sign height.
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odditude

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Re: The Worst of Road Signs
« Reply #5136 on: May 18, 2018, 01:11:22 PM »

It is; however, just a tad fucking huge.

ARDOT basically did the same thing at the west end of I-630...

GIANT Big Green Sign by TheInstrumentalist, on Flickr

there's a big difference. while the ARDOT sign is stupidly large, it's not stupidly large for an APL. you can't condense anything further without violating spec or screwing legibility.

the screwup sign, on the other hand, is stupidly large even for an APL.

It's huge because of the I-20/59 overlap, and the way the shields must be laid out, presumably so that thru traffic stays in the center (maybe there's unaware travelers who think that 20 and 59 will split immediately after this interchange).
However, given the width of the APL sign-board; it looks to me that the 20 WEST/59 SOUTH layout could've been done differently.  Either a single-line (20 WEST 59 SOUTH) layout or have the direction cardinals on one line and the route shields on the other (stacked layout as shown below)

WEST   SOUTH
   20        59


would've reduced the overall sign height.
precisely.
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jakeroot

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Re: The Worst of Road Signs
« Reply #5137 on: May 18, 2018, 01:25:33 PM »

It's huge because of the I-20/59 overlap, and the way the shields must be laid out, presumably so that thru traffic stays in the center (maybe there's unaware travelers who think that 20 and 59 will split immediately after this interchange). Ideally, you could just align the two shields side-by-side in that middle section and eliminate one-third of the sign panel height; APLs permit the white vertical stripes to denote the exits.

I've had trouble with this in my APL designs in the past (over on the illustrations board). I generally prefer shields to be between arrows, but when you have two through routes, it's tough to decide where to place the two shields. Do you place two between each arrow? Align them respective to their eventual split? Throw them up there without any thought? I personally prefer the "aligned based on eventual split", since it reduces the number of shields, and lets traffic know how the split will eventually line up.

The last time I faced this issue, I placed two shields between each arrow. But this looks rather crowded in retrospect:

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Re: The Worst of Road Signs
« Reply #5138 on: May 19, 2018, 04:00:33 AM »

https://goo.gl/maps/FeKtkpLdwbG2

These freeway entrance signs look like they were vomited out of MS Paint.
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Re: The Worst of Road Signs
« Reply #5139 on: May 19, 2018, 07:05:07 AM »

https://goo.gl/maps/FeKtkpLdwbG2

These freeway entrance signs look like they were vomited out of MS Paint.

What am I looking at? The signs look perfectly normal to me.
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Re: The Worst of Road Signs
« Reply #5140 on: May 19, 2018, 01:18:30 PM »

The freeway entrance sign and shield.


iPhone
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Re: The Worst of Road Signs
« Reply #5141 on: May 19, 2018, 02:45:50 PM »

https://goo.gl/maps/FeKtkpLdwbG2

These freeway entrance signs look like they were vomited out of MS Paint.

Yikes, that is bad. Typically Californian in that it uses a slightly wider text than a typical WSDOT style freeway entrance sign, but it's still nowhere near standard. Never mind that US-50 shield.
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Re: The Worst of Road Signs
« Reply #5142 on: May 19, 2018, 04:15:15 PM »

I cringed when I saw that Freeway Entrance sign. Since California signs practically every freeway entrance, you could tell it looks very different than what it should be. Also the US 50 shield has no black outline and no direction placard, and the font is wrong. If you go to exit 39 those signs are correct.
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Re: The Worst of Road Signs
« Reply #5143 on: May 19, 2018, 04:34:48 PM »

The freeway entrance sign still looks perfectly normal to me. Maybe a bit of wasted space at the top and bottom, but that's it.
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Re: The Worst of Road Signs
« Reply #5144 on: May 19, 2018, 04:43:38 PM »

It's huge because of the I-20/59 overlap, and the way the shields must be laid out, presumably so that thru traffic stays in the center (maybe there's unaware travelers who think that 20 and 59 will split immediately after this interchange). Ideally, you could just align the two shields side-by-side in that middle section and eliminate one-third of the sign panel height; APLs permit the white vertical stripes to denote the exits.

I've had trouble with this in my APL designs in the past (over on the illustrations board). I generally prefer shields to be between arrows, but when you have two through routes, it's tough to decide where to place the two shields. Do you place two between each arrow? Align them respective to their eventual split? Throw them up there without any thought? I personally prefer the "aligned based on eventual split", since it reduces the number of shields, and lets traffic know how the split will eventually line up.

The last time I faced this issue, I placed two shields between each arrow. But this looks rather crowded in retrospect:



With signage, clarity is important; maybe more important than size.   Think of the normal STOP sign.  One could cut over 50% of the material out by getting rid of the part above and below 'STOP' and just make it a 4 sided rectangle sign.  The importance of the shape, combined with the red material, encourages the larger sign.  Now, before anyone says "but stop signs aren't that big"...you're right.  But they're plentiful.  If a town has several hundred STOP signs throughout the town, material usage could be significantly reduced on those hundreds of signs.

So, that said, sometimes bigger is perfectly fine.  An APL has a lot of wasted space, but they are very clear to understand.  I don't know of anyone who's actually had a problem with the understanding of such a sign; they just want a smaller sign.  By reducing the height of the arrows by a foot or so, the same clarity can be received.
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Re: The Worst of Road Signs
« Reply #5145 on: May 19, 2018, 07:15:36 PM »

It's huge because of the I-20/59 overlap, and the way the shields must be laid out, presumably so that thru traffic stays in the center (maybe there's unaware travelers who think that 20 and 59 will split immediately after this interchange). Ideally, you could just align the two shields side-by-side in that middle section and eliminate one-third of the sign panel height; APLs permit the white vertical stripes to denote the exits.

I've had trouble with this in my APL designs in the past (over on the illustrations board). I generally prefer shields to be between arrows, but when you have two through routes, it's tough to decide where to place the two shields. Do you place two between each arrow? Align them respective to their eventual split? Throw them up there without any thought? I personally prefer the "aligned based on eventual split", since it reduces the number of shields, and lets traffic know how the split will eventually line up.

The last time I faced this issue, I placed two shields between each arrow. But this looks rather crowded in retrospect:


(NOTE: image halved in size)

Here's my take on the APL (in text):

  • Separate exit 124B onto its own sign
  • Widen the APL a little to create some separation
  • Align I-20 and Atlanta between the left arrow (on the pull-through) and the middle arrow
  • Align I-59 and Gadsden between the middle arrow and the right arrow
That way, traffic knows I-20 goes to the left, and that's the way to Atlanta, while I-59 goes to the right, and that's the way to Gadsden.
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US71

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Re: The Worst of Road Signs
« Reply #5146 on: May 19, 2018, 10:52:19 PM »


ARDOT basically did the same thing at the west end of I-630...



GIANT Big Green Sign by TheInstrumentalist, on Flickr

Considering Big Rock Interchange was just rebuilt a couple years ago, the signs may have been made larger so motorists were aware of the changes.
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Re: The Worst of Road Signs
« Reply #5147 on: May 20, 2018, 02:28:22 AM »

It's huge because of the I-20/59 overlap, and the way the shields must be laid out, presumably so that thru traffic stays in the center (maybe there's unaware travelers who think that 20 and 59 will split immediately after this interchange). Ideally, you could just align the two shields side-by-side in that middle section and eliminate one-third of the sign panel height; APLs permit the white vertical stripes to denote the exits.

I've had trouble with this in my APL designs in the past (over on the illustrations board). I generally prefer shields to be between arrows, but when you have two through routes, it's tough to decide where to place the two shields. Do you place two between each arrow? Align them respective to their eventual split? Throw them up there without any thought? I personally prefer the "aligned based on eventual split", since it reduces the number of shields, and lets traffic know how the split will eventually line up.

The last time I faced this issue, I placed two shields between each arrow. But this looks rather crowded in retrospect:

https://i.imgur.com/dIAlxNA.png
(NOTE: image halved in size)

Here's my take on the APL (in text):

  • Separate exit 124B onto its own sign
  • Widen the APL a little to create some separation
  • Align I-20 and Atlanta between the left arrow (on the pull-through) and the middle arrow
  • Align I-59 and Gadsden between the middle arrow and the right arrow
That way, traffic knows I-20 goes to the left, and that's the way to Atlanta, while I-59 goes to the right, and that's the way to Gadsden.

To address each point...

1) Can't separate Exit 124B because the exit involves an option lane. The #4 lane can either exit or go straight, so the exit sign and the through sign (as per APL regulations) must be one.
2) Could, but wouldn't be necessary if...
3 & 4) I originally did this, but was worried about traffic needlessly using the left lane. Alas, it's probably not a big deal.
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Re: The Worst of Road Signs
« Reply #5148 on: May 23, 2018, 10:14:01 PM »

This is exiting the Legoland Florida parking lot.
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Re: The Worst of Road Signs
« Reply #5149 on: May 24, 2018, 10:38:40 AM »

The last time I faced this issue, I placed two shields between each arrow. But this looks rather crowded in retrospect:


Something got lost in translation in your alternate design.  If the Left Exit 124C does not have an additional shared-lane with the through-I-20/59 movement; it should not be an APL (nor part of one).
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