Control cities that aren’t reciprocated

[JayhawkCO]

I'd defend Mason City from the north since it's where the Avenue of the Saints exits I-35. That's significantly more useful as a control point than I-90 after the US 52 and US 169/TH 60 corridors were upgraded.

What percentage of the I-35 drivers there have ever heard of Avenue of the Saints?

100% if they read the signs as soon as they cross into Iowa.

Let me clarify. What percentage of I-35 drivers there know what the Avenue of the Saints is?

[Molandfreak]

I'd defend Mason City from the north since it's where the Avenue of the Saints exits I-35. That's significantly more useful as a control point than I-90 after the US 52 and US 169/TH 60 corridors were upgraded.

What percentage of the I-35 drivers there have ever heard of Avenue of the Saints?

100% if they read the signs as soon as they cross into Iowa.

Let me clarify. What percentage of I-35 drivers there know what the Avenue of the Saints is?

"Take this exit if you want to go to Waterloo, Cedar Rapids, Iowa City, the Quad Cities, or St. Louis" should clarify why this is a useful control point. Certainly more useful than Limon, which I also defend wholeheartedly.

[JayhawkCO]

I'd defend Mason City from the north since it's where the Avenue of the Saints exits I-35. That's significantly more useful as a control point than I-90 after the US 52 and US 169/TH 60 corridors were upgraded.

What percentage of the I-35 drivers there have ever heard of Avenue of the Saints?

100% if they read the signs as soon as they cross into Iowa.

Let me clarify. What percentage of I-35 drivers there know what the Avenue of the Saints is?

"Take this exit if you want to go to Waterloo, Cedar Rapids, Iowa City, the Quad Cities, or St. Louis" should clarify why this is a useful control point. Certainly more useful than Limon, which I also defend wholeheartedly.

Fair enough.

[Roadgeekteen]

I'd defend Mason City from the north since it's where the Avenue of the Saints exits I-35. That's significantly more useful as a control point than I-90 after the US 52 and US 169/TH 60 corridors were upgraded.

What percentage of the I-35 drivers there have ever heard of Avenue of the Saints?

100% if they read the signs as soon as they cross into Iowa.

Let me clarify. What percentage of I-35 drivers there know what the Avenue of the Saints is?

"Take this exit if you want to go to Waterloo, Cedar Rapids, Iowa City, the Quad Cities, or St. Louis" should clarify why this is a useful control point. Certainly more useful than Limon, which I also defend wholeheartedly.

At least Mason City has more than 10 times more people then Limon...

[JayhawkCO]

At least Mason City has more than 10 times more people then Limon...

Won't re-hash the same argument we've all made a million times, but west of approximately 98°W, the rules on population constituting a "focal city" change.

[Molandfreak]

I'd defend Mason City from the north since it's where the Avenue of the Saints exits I-35. That's significantly more useful as a control point than I-90 after the US 52 and US 169/TH 60 corridors were upgraded.

What percentage of the I-35 drivers there have ever heard of Avenue of the Saints?

100% if they read the signs as soon as they cross into Iowa.

Let me clarify. What percentage of I-35 drivers there know what the Avenue of the Saints is?

"Take this exit if you want to go to Waterloo, Cedar Rapids, Iowa City, the Quad Cities, or St. Louis" should clarify why this is a useful control point. Certainly more useful than Limon, which I also defend wholeheartedly.

At least Mason City has more than 10 times more people then Limon...

Sometimes it isn't about that. I would totally understand if Utah started using Cove Fort as a control city on I-15. It certainly makes more sense than using Richfield on I-70, a town in the middle of nowhere with no other useful connections anywhere.

Limon being a control city isn't about Limon itself, it's about accessing Colorado Springs, Santa Fe, and Albuquerque from the east, and Amarillo, Lubbock, Wichita Falls, and maybe Dallas/Ft. Worth from the west.

[Roadgeekteen]

I'd defend Mason City from the north since it's where the Avenue of the Saints exits I-35. That's significantly more useful as a control point than I-90 after the US 52 and US 169/TH 60 corridors were upgraded.

What percentage of the I-35 drivers there have ever heard of Avenue of the Saints?

100% if they read the signs as soon as they cross into Iowa.

Let me clarify. What percentage of I-35 drivers there know what the Avenue of the Saints is?

"Take this exit if you want to go to Waterloo, Cedar Rapids, Iowa City, the Quad Cities, or St. Louis" should clarify why this is a useful control point. Certainly more useful than Limon, which I also defend wholeheartedly.

At least Mason City has more than 10 times more people then Limon...

Sometimes it isn't about that. I would totally understand if Utah started using Cove Fort as a control city on I-15. It certainly makes more sense than using Richfield on I-70, a town in the middle of nowhere with no other useful connections anywhere.

Limon being a control city isn't about Limon itself, it's about accessing Colorado Springs, Santa Fe, and Albuquerque from the east, and Amarillo, Lubbock, Wichita Falls, and maybe Dallas/Ft. Worth from the west.

Again we've gone over these arguments so much, but if you want to signify that you can get to Colorado Springs from the west, just dual sign I-70 Colorado Springs/Denver instead of signing Limon.

[Molandfreak]

I'd defend Mason City from the north since it's where the Avenue of the Saints exits I-35. That's significantly more useful as a control point than I-90 after the US 52 and US 169/TH 60 corridors were upgraded.

What percentage of the I-35 drivers there have ever heard of Avenue of the Saints?

100% if they read the signs as soon as they cross into Iowa.

Let me clarify. What percentage of I-35 drivers there know what the Avenue of the Saints is?

"Take this exit if you want to go to Waterloo, Cedar Rapids, Iowa City, the Quad Cities, or St. Louis" should clarify why this is a useful control point. Certainly more useful than Limon, which I also defend wholeheartedly.

At least Mason City has more than 10 times more people then Limon...

Sometimes it isn't about that. I would totally understand if Utah started using Cove Fort as a control city on I-15. It certainly makes more sense than using Richfield on I-70, a town in the middle of nowhere with no other useful connections anywhere.

Limon being a control city isn't about Limon itself, it's about accessing Colorado Springs, Santa Fe, and Albuquerque from the east, and Amarillo, Lubbock, Wichita Falls, and maybe Dallas/Ft. Worth from the west.

Again we've gone over these arguments so much, but if you want to signify that you can get to Colorado Springs from the west, just dual sign I-70 Colorado Springs/Denver instead of signing Limon.

Sure. All I'm saying is that Limon gets a pretty bad rap when Richfield is a control city just a state away.

[Roadgeekteen]

I'd defend Mason City from the north since it's where the Avenue of the Saints exits I-35. That's significantly more useful as a control point than I-90 after the US 52 and US 169/TH 60 corridors were upgraded.

What percentage of the I-35 drivers there have ever heard of Avenue of the Saints?

100% if they read the signs as soon as they cross into Iowa.

Let me clarify. What percentage of I-35 drivers there know what the Avenue of the Saints is?

"Take this exit if you want to go to Waterloo, Cedar Rapids, Iowa City, the Quad Cities, or St. Louis" should clarify why this is a useful control point. Certainly more useful than Limon, which I also defend wholeheartedly.

At least Mason City has more than 10 times more people then Limon...

Sometimes it isn't about that. I would totally understand if Utah started using Cove Fort as a control city on I-15. It certainly makes more sense than using Richfield on I-70, a town in the middle of nowhere with no other useful connections anywhere.

Limon being a control city isn't about Limon itself, it's about accessing Colorado Springs, Santa Fe, and Albuquerque from the east, and Amarillo, Lubbock, Wichita Falls, and maybe Dallas/Ft. Worth from the west.

Again we've gone over these arguments so much, but if you want to signify that you can get to Colorado Springs from the west, just dual sign I-70 Colorado Springs/Denver instead of signing Limon.

Sure. All I'm saying is that Limon gets a pretty bad rap when Richfield is a control city just a state away.

Richfield doesn't have an army of defenders like Limon.

[Molandfreak]

I'd defend Mason City from the north since it's where the Avenue of the Saints exits I-35. That's significantly more useful as a control point than I-90 after the US 52 and US 169/TH 60 corridors were upgraded.

What percentage of the I-35 drivers there have ever heard of Avenue of the Saints?

100% if they read the signs as soon as they cross into Iowa.

Let me clarify. What percentage of I-35 drivers there know what the Avenue of the Saints is?

"Take this exit if you want to go to Waterloo, Cedar Rapids, Iowa City, the Quad Cities, or St. Louis" should clarify why this is a useful control point. Certainly more useful than Limon, which I also defend wholeheartedly.

At least Mason City has more than 10 times more people then Limon...

Sometimes it isn't about that. I would totally understand if Utah started using Cove Fort as a control city on I-15. It certainly makes more sense than using Richfield on I-70, a town in the middle of nowhere with no other useful connections anywhere.

Limon being a control city isn't about Limon itself, it's about accessing Colorado Springs, Santa Fe, and Albuquerque from the east, and Amarillo, Lubbock, Wichita Falls, and maybe Dallas/Ft. Worth from the west.

Again we've gone over these arguments so much, but if you want to signify that you can get to Colorado Springs from the west, just dual sign I-70 Colorado Springs/Denver instead of signing Limon.

Sure. All I'm saying is that Limon gets a pretty bad rap when Richfield is a control city just a state away.

Richfield doesn't have an army of defenders like Limon.

I suppose I understand a little more, but what would you sign north of Madison instead of Tomah using this method? La Crosse and Eau Claire? La Crosse and Minneapolis/St. Paul? Rochester and MSP? Sioux Falls and MSP? I do consider Eau Claire and La Crosse to be worthy control cities even if they aren't taken to mean "you may be exiting here," but apparently not everyone sees it that way. Should it be taken to the extreme and use Sioux Falls/MSP/Superior?

[Roadgeekteen]

I'd defend Mason City from the north since it's where the Avenue of the Saints exits I-35. That's significantly more useful as a control point than I-90 after the US 52 and US 169/TH 60 corridors were upgraded.

What percentage of the I-35 drivers there have ever heard of Avenue of the Saints?

100% if they read the signs as soon as they cross into Iowa.

Let me clarify. What percentage of I-35 drivers there know what the Avenue of the Saints is?

"Take this exit if you want to go to Waterloo, Cedar Rapids, Iowa City, the Quad Cities, or St. Louis" should clarify why this is a useful control point. Certainly more useful than Limon, which I also defend wholeheartedly.

At least Mason City has more than 10 times more people then Limon...

Sometimes it isn't about that. I would totally understand if Utah started using Cove Fort as a control city on I-15. It certainly makes more sense than using Richfield on I-70, a town in the middle of nowhere with no other useful connections anywhere.

Limon being a control city isn't about Limon itself, it's about accessing Colorado Springs, Santa Fe, and Albuquerque from the east, and Amarillo, Lubbock, Wichita Falls, and maybe Dallas/Ft. Worth from the west.

Again we've gone over these arguments so much, but if you want to signify that you can get to Colorado Springs from the west, just dual sign I-70 Colorado Springs/Denver instead of signing Limon.

Sure. All I'm saying is that Limon gets a pretty bad rap when Richfield is a control city just a state away.

Richfield doesn't have an army of defenders like Limon.

I suppose I understand a little more, but what would you sign north of Madison instead of Tomah using this method? La Crosse and Eau Claire? La Crosse and Minneapolis/St. Paul? Rochester and MSP? Sioux Falls and MSP? I do consider Eau Claire and La Crosse to be worthy control cities even if they aren't taken to mean "you may be exiting here," but apparently not everyone sees it that way. Should it be taken to the extreme and use Sioux Falls/MSP/Superior?

I would sign either MSP/Rochester, MSP/La Crosse, or Eau Claire/La Crosse. And the difference is that in Wisconsin, it's an interstate junction so it's important to sign both. For I-70 in Colorado, it's just a 2 lane road splitting off (US 24) so it's not as major.

Edit: or honestly, just "Minnesota" would be fine.

[tman]

Minnesota does some strange things. I-94 is a mess as well, with them not really wanting to use Fargo.

Well Moorhead is a core city in the area and the twin city to Fargo. Minnesota there just wanted to use a city in their own state. At that point they could just sign Billings and that'd be fine lol.

I will say, Moorhead isn't the worst control city in the world, but Fargo is the more famous of the 2 so I would sign Fargo.

It's stupid provincialism.  Moorhead has a population of 43,000 and is basically a suburb of Fargo. Fargo has a population of 136,000, is an important city regionally, and is the largest city in ND.

Control cities on interstates should be the next major city/metro when leaving a metro area.

For example, I-35 should be: Duluth, Minneapolis-St.Paul (a unique case), Des Moines, Kansas City, Oklahoma City, Dallas-Ft. Worth (similar unique case), Austin, San Antonio, Laredo. No Albert Lea or Mason City or Waco or any other such crap.

94 should be: Billings, Bismarck, Fargo, Minneapolis-St.Paul, Madison, Milwaukee, Chicago, Detroit, Port Huron.

Do you also think Illinois should use Davenport (by far the largest of the Quad Cities) as a control city rather than Rock Island and Moline? Should Iowa sign Omaha instead of Council Bluffs? Favoritism isn't exclusive here.

I'm not a fan of the favoritism/provincialism at all, but Minnesota seems to do it more than most states (Iowa included), with the aforementioned Moorhead instead of Fargo, Albert Lea instead of Des Moines. I don't think Illinois is as bad, either (although the use of control states is a bit odd, they are at least out-of-state). Consider Memphis, St. Louis, and Wisconsin used in Chicago. I can't see Minnesota using those.

Iowa seems to be switching to Omaha for newer signage in Des Moines (on-ramp signage is still Council Bluffs/Des Moines between the two), and mileage signs west of Des Moines use Omaha frequently. Council Bluffs on I-80 is Iowa's only questionable choice in my opinion.

Consider that, in Des Moines, mostly out-of-state cities are used: Chicago (along with Davenport) for I-80 east, plus Kansas City and Minneapolis, and Omaha at the 35/80 split. 

[Roadgeekteen]

Minnesota does some strange things. I-94 is a mess as well, with them not really wanting to use Fargo.

Well Moorhead is a core city in the area and the twin city to Fargo. Minnesota there just wanted to use a city in their own state. At that point they could just sign Billings and that'd be fine lol.

I will say, Moorhead isn't the worst control city in the world, but Fargo is the more famous of the 2 so I would sign Fargo.

It's stupid provincialism.  Moorhead has a population of 43,000 and is basically a suburb of Fargo. Fargo has a population of 136,000, is an important city regionally, and is the largest city in ND.

Control cities on interstates should be the next major city/metro when leaving a metro area.

For example, I-35 should be: Duluth, Minneapolis-St.Paul (a unique case), Des Moines, Kansas City, Oklahoma City, Dallas-Ft. Worth (similar unique case), Austin, San Antonio, Laredo. No Albert Lea or Mason City or Waco or any other such crap.

94 should be: Billings, Bismarck, Fargo, Minneapolis-St.Paul, Madison, Milwaukee, Chicago, Detroit, Port Huron.

Do you also think Illinois should use Davenport (by far the largest of the Quad Cities) as a control city rather than Rock Island and Moline? Should Iowa sign Omaha instead of Council Bluffs? Favoritism isn't exclusive here.

I'm not a fan of the favoritism/provincialism at all, but Minnesota seems to do it more than most states (Iowa included), with the aforementioned Moorhead instead of Fargo, Albert Lea instead of Des Moines. I don't think Illinois is as bad, either (although the use of control states is a bit odd, they are at least out-of-state). Consider Memphis, St. Louis, and Wisconsin used in Chicago. I can't see Minnesota using those.

Iowa seems to be switching to Omaha for newer signage in Des Moines (on-ramp signage is still Council Bluffs/Des Moines between the two), and mileage signs west of Des Moines use Omaha frequently. Council Bluffs on I-80 is Iowa's only questionable choice in my opinion.

Consider that, in Des Moines, mostly out-of-state cities are used: Chicago (along with Davenport) for I-80 east, plus Kansas City and Minneapolis, and Omaha at the 35/80 split. 

Iowas really only other mistake is Mason City. I think that they should use Omaha on I-29 instead of Council Bluffs but since I-29 doesn't actually enter Omaha isn't not as bad.

[Molandfreak]

Minnesota does some strange things. I-94 is a mess as well, with them not really wanting to use Fargo.

Well Moorhead is a core city in the area and the twin city to Fargo. Minnesota there just wanted to use a city in their own state. At that point they could just sign Billings and that'd be fine lol.

I will say, Moorhead isn't the worst control city in the world, but Fargo is the more famous of the 2 so I would sign Fargo.

It's stupid provincialism.  Moorhead has a population of 43,000 and is basically a suburb of Fargo. Fargo has a population of 136,000, is an important city regionally, and is the largest city in ND.

Control cities on interstates should be the next major city/metro when leaving a metro area.

For example, I-35 should be: Duluth, Minneapolis-St.Paul (a unique case), Des Moines, Kansas City, Oklahoma City, Dallas-Ft. Worth (similar unique case), Austin, San Antonio, Laredo. No Albert Lea or Mason City or Waco or any other such crap.

94 should be: Billings, Bismarck, Fargo, Minneapolis-St.Paul, Madison, Milwaukee, Chicago, Detroit, Port Huron.

Do you also think Illinois should use Davenport (by far the largest of the Quad Cities) as a control city rather than Rock Island and Moline? Should Iowa sign Omaha instead of Council Bluffs? Favoritism isn't exclusive here.

I'm not a fan of the favoritism/provincialism at all, but Minnesota seems to do it more than most states (Iowa included), with the aforementioned Moorhead instead of Fargo, Albert Lea instead of Des Moines. I don't think Illinois is as bad, either (although the use of control states is a bit odd, they are at least out-of-state). Consider Memphis, St. Louis, and Wisconsin used in Chicago. I can't see Minnesota using those.

Iowa seems to be switching to Omaha for newer signage in Des Moines (on-ramp signage is still Council Bluffs/Des Moines between the two), and mileage signs west of Des Moines use Omaha frequently. Council Bluffs on I-80 is Iowa's only questionable choice in my opinion.

Consider that, in Des Moines, mostly out-of-state cities are used: Chicago (along with Davenport) for I-80 east, plus Kansas City and Minneapolis, and Omaha at the 35/80 split. 

Iowas really only other mistake is Mason City. I think that they should use Omaha on I-29 instead of Council Bluffs but since I-29 doesn't actually enter Omaha isn't not as bad.

What about Nevada instead of Marshalltown on US 30? Or ironically, Waverly instead of Mason City on the Avenue of the Saints?

[Roadgeekteen]

Minnesota does some strange things. I-94 is a mess as well, with them not really wanting to use Fargo.

Well Moorhead is a core city in the area and the twin city to Fargo. Minnesota there just wanted to use a city in their own state. At that point they could just sign Billings and that'd be fine lol.

I will say, Moorhead isn't the worst control city in the world, but Fargo is the more famous of the 2 so I would sign Fargo.

It's stupid provincialism.  Moorhead has a population of 43,000 and is basically a suburb of Fargo. Fargo has a population of 136,000, is an important city regionally, and is the largest city in ND.

Control cities on interstates should be the next major city/metro when leaving a metro area.

For example, I-35 should be: Duluth, Minneapolis-St.Paul (a unique case), Des Moines, Kansas City, Oklahoma City, Dallas-Ft. Worth (similar unique case), Austin, San Antonio, Laredo. No Albert Lea or Mason City or Waco or any other such crap.

94 should be: Billings, Bismarck, Fargo, Minneapolis-St.Paul, Madison, Milwaukee, Chicago, Detroit, Port Huron.

Do you also think Illinois should use Davenport (by far the largest of the Quad Cities) as a control city rather than Rock Island and Moline? Should Iowa sign Omaha instead of Council Bluffs? Favoritism isn't exclusive here.

I'm not a fan of the favoritism/provincialism at all, but Minnesota seems to do it more than most states (Iowa included), with the aforementioned Moorhead instead of Fargo, Albert Lea instead of Des Moines. I don't think Illinois is as bad, either (although the use of control states is a bit odd, they are at least out-of-state). Consider Memphis, St. Louis, and Wisconsin used in Chicago. I can't see Minnesota using those.

Iowa seems to be switching to Omaha for newer signage in Des Moines (on-ramp signage is still Council Bluffs/Des Moines between the two), and mileage signs west of Des Moines use Omaha frequently. Council Bluffs on I-80 is Iowa's only questionable choice in my opinion.

Consider that, in Des Moines, mostly out-of-state cities are used: Chicago (along with Davenport) for I-80 east, plus Kansas City and Minneapolis, and Omaha at the 35/80 split. 

Iowas really only other mistake is Mason City. I think that they should use Omaha on I-29 instead of Council Bluffs but since I-29 doesn't actually enter Omaha isn't not as bad.

What about Nevada instead of Marshalltown on US 30? Or ironically, Waverly instead of Mason City on the Avenue of the Saints?

Not an expert on non interstates. Marshalltown is obviously the better choice, but honestly I'd go straight to Cedar Rapids.