Pointless concurrencies

[Roadgeek Adam]

Yeah, because it's normal practice to build a separate road for each route number. That's why US 1/9 has local and express lanes through Newark - one is officially US 1 and the other US 9.

Seriously, do you really think they'd build a second road just to eliminate an overlap?

Getting NJ to build any highway at all requires NIMBYs and environmentalists to can it, which is a very uncommon occurrence.

Also, for NJ, I am surprised the 40/322 concurrency hasn't come up. 322 should've been truncated back to the 40 junction, not concurrent entirely to Atlantic City.

[OracleUsr]

I've never been to Apalachicola, FL, but I would say the US 98/319 concurrency is pointless.

[akotchi]

Staying in New Jersey, how about U.S. 1-9 and U.S. 46? The latter ends at the GW Bridge, but should be truncated to about Broad Street.

[jwolfer]

How about County Route 530 and Nj Route 70 in burlington and ocean county, the only reason i can think of is the NJ Pinelands comission denying permission for there to be a second road through that area.

This concurrency predates the Pinelands Commission by decades.  Its not a bad concurrency at all.  Although I haven't been there in nearly 20 years, I recall it is not sighed very well.. Maybe one ancient White CR sign.  

[NE2]

I've never been to Apalachicola, FL, but I would say the US 98/319 concurrency is pointless.

Yes, especially given the exact location where US 319 ends: http://www.usends.com/10-19/319/319.html
Except for a detour along a couple minor roads through Sopchoppy, it overlaps US 98 from Tully to Apalachicola and could easily be truncated to Tully.

Also in Florida: US 23 south of Alma, Georgia. It joins US 1 there and follows it into Jacksonville, where it briefly separates onto the former alignment of US 1 to end at US 1 downtown. A US 1 Business would make a lot more sense.


On the other hand, I don't really see I-84/I-380 as problematic. They're both about equally important (remember that I-380 was I-81E) and if one were cut back it would simply be signed TO in the south/east direction. You'd probably end up with a slight savings from not having to replace both signs in the north/west direction, but not much.

[Brandon]

I-96/275 in Michigan is currently pointless given that I-275 was never extended north of the interchange in Farmington Hills/Novi.

US-52/IL-64 in Carroll County, IL.  Only reason is for a multistate SR-64.

There seemed to be a lot more in the past such as US-34/66 into Chicago and US-31/33 in SW Michigan.

[national highway 1]

US 56 & US 412 + US 64

[Brandon]

US 56 & US 412 + US 64

US-412, like US-400, is pointless here.

[njroadhorse]

Wouldn't US 17 in Winchester, Va. also count as a subject in this thread?

Yes it would, since it's multiplexed with US 522/50 until it's northern terminus.

[SteveG1988]

I had a question, who maintains a CR and a SR overlap? Does the county pay for part of it, and the state pay the rest? Also the US-130 and I-295 overlap in NJ looks somewhat pointless as US-130 ends near the delaware memorial bridge.

[jwolfer]

I had a question, who maintains a CR and a SR overlap? Does the county pay for part of it, and the state pay the rest? Also the US-130 and I-295 overlap in NJ looks somewhat pointless as US-130 ends near the delaware memorial bridge.

I believe the state maintins it.  The CR is more or less for continuation of a route.  US-130 could easily be changed to 301... Make it part of an existing multi-state route and have it northern terminus at US-1

[mightyace]

I-84 and I-380 in Pennsylvania. Why is this necessary? What is the rationale for this? Why must both routes continue signed on one roadway from their intersection to I-81? Why shouldn't I-380 end at I-84 and I-84 continue as the lone signed route? Why can't it be signed "I-84, To I-380?"

Well, IIRC, I-380 (as I-81E) was completed first.  For many years, there was a gap in I-84 in the Poconos from it's present junction with 380 to some point in the east.

I'm not 100% sure, but I think that it was signed I-380, TO I-84 back in those days at the junction with I-81.

Plus, IMHO, I don't think it's pointless for the same reason given for 95/495.  I-84 is a through route to New York state and New England.  I-380 is a connector route between I-80 and I-81 serving the Pocono resorts.  So, with the concurrency, you can simply say, take I-380 to exit 00 and get off there to go to ABC ski area.  While you'd say, take I-84 East if you're going to Boston.

[NE2]

I had a question, who maintains a CR and a SR overlap? Does the county pay for part of it, and the state pay the rest?

Depends who maintains the road. Route designations do not always imply maintenance responsibility. For example NJ 347 is county-maintained, and cities such as Trenton maintain their portions of state highways. Overlaps exist solely for the convenience of the public; had the route designations been solely for record-keeping purposes, the part of CR 530 in Ocean County would still be CR 33, CR 55, and CR 19: http://mapmaker.rutgers.edu/Ocean/OceanCo_1971.gif (note: map is actually from 1951). An overlap never indicates some sort of shared maintenance responsibility.

[Icodec]

How about I-99 and US 220? Why be both for the entire route?

[agentsteel53]

How about I-99 and US 220? Why be both for the entire route?

assholes.  you voted for 'em ... you got 'em!

[Hot Rod Hootenanny]

Oh 3(-C) with US 22 & US 62 from Cincinnati to Columbus.

[thenetwork]

I would like to nominate the I-90/SR-2 concurrency east of Elyria &/or Downtown Cleveland.  

• Truncate SR-2 at Dead Mans Curve/Innerbelt.  You can also argue the point that SR-2 could also be truncated all the way back to it's first junction with I-90 at the Ohio Turnpike in Elyria, since nearly all of SR-2 between Elyria and Cleveland multiplexes with at least one other I-, US- or State Route (The only exception would be the 3-4 miles of the West Shoreway between the Innerbelt and the west end of the Main Avenue Bridge over the Cuyahoga River (W. 25th/W. 28th))
  
  



• Renumber the predominantly-Lake County stretch of SR-2 (aka the Lakeland Freeway north & east of I-90) as an I-590 or I-790 to SR-2's current eastern terminus at US-20 in Painesville.  It's a full freeway, and the only "interstate-standard" upgrade I can find that might be needed is the Lloyd Road Exit.

[Bickendan]

Here's one. I-84 and US 30, I-86 and US 30. You could easily truncate I-84 all the way back to the current I-84/86 junction, eliminate I-86, sign the entire freeway as US 30, and make the current non-freeway segments of US 30 into Bus. US 30's

[huskeroadgeek]

US 56 & US 412 + US 64

US 412 could easily have its western endpoint at Woodward, OK-it's multiplexed with at least 1 other route west of there to its terminus at I-25. I would also add that US 270 W. of Oklahoma City is mostly superfluous as well-the only portion W. of Oklahoma City that is not multiplexed with another route is the short portion between I-40 and Geary. It seems to me that could easily be downgraded to a state route, and have US 270's western endpoint moved to its junction with I-40 at Shawnee.

[hbelkins]

How about I-99 and US 220? Why be both for the entire route?

Well, US 220 does continue in both directions beyond the end of the Interstate designation.

Another nomination -- US 43, US 412 and TN 99. US 43 and US 412 join west of Columbia and run together to US 31, where US 43 ends and US 412 continues east to I-65. Then US 412 ends and its hidden Tennessee state route (TN 99) continues.

[mightyace]

Another nomination -- US 43, US 412 and TN 99. US 43 and US 412 join west of Columbia and run together to US 31, where US 43 ends and US 412 continues east to I-65. Then US 412 ends and its hidden Tennessee state route (TN 99) continues.

It's not that bad, IMHO.  The 43/412 concurrency is only 6.7 miles (per Google) and brings US 43 to end at US 31.  For ease of directions, that makes a lot of sense to me.  (See I-84 and I-380 in PA)  And, the 43/412 junction west of town is a quarter diamond pseudo interchange.

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=columbia,+tn&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=53.080379,114.169922&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Columbia,+Maury,+Tennessee&ll=35.615285,-87.118535&spn=0.013188,0.012596&t=h&z=16

You'd have mainline 412 jumping off there as it does today but the through, divided-highway route would change from 43 to 412.  And, in this  region, 43 is a more important route.

The simple solution would be to get rid of the abomination that is US 412.

Of course, I would consider the hidden TN state designations that accompany US highways in TN to be pointless concurrences.

And when I travel through the US 31, 43, 412 intersection (5 - 8 times a month), I look at turning right from 31 South to be US 43.

[Scott5114]

US 56 & US 412 + US 64

US 412 could easily have its western endpoint at Woodward, OK-it's multiplexed with at least 1 other route west of there to its terminus at I-25. I would also add that US 270 W. of Oklahoma City is mostly superfluous as well-the only portion W. of Oklahoma City that is not multiplexed with another route is the short portion between I-40 and Geary. It seems to me that could easily be downgraded to a state route, and have US 270's western endpoint moved to its junction with I-40 at Shawnee.

Interesting story...not too long after EB I-40 picks up US 270, there's a BGS reading "{270} EAST/Follow I-40 EAST/Next 66 Miles".

[jwolfer]

I had a question, who maintains a CR and a SR overlap? Does the county pay for part of it, and the state pay the rest?

Depends who maintains the road. Route designations do not always imply maintenance responsibility. For example NJ 347 is county-maintained, and cities such as Trenton maintain their portions of state highways. Overlaps exist solely for the convenience of the public; had the route designations been solely for record-keeping purposes, the part of CR 530 in Ocean County would still be CR 33, CR 55, and CR 19: http://mapmaker.rutgers.edu/Ocean/OceanCo_1971.gif (note: map is actually from 1951). An overlap never indicates some sort of shared maintenance responsibility.

I grew up in Ocean County.  I remember having that map as a kid.  Some of the CR numbers are still the same.  the State Secondary 500 number are not on there... Brings back memories

[jwolfer]

I had a question, who maintains a CR and a SR overlap? Does the county pay for part of it, and the state pay the rest?

Depends who maintains the road. Route designations do not always imply maintenance responsibility. For example NJ 347 is county-maintained, and cities such as Trenton maintain their portions of state highways. Overlaps exist solely for the convenience of the public; had the route designations been solely for record-keeping purposes, the part of CR 530 in Ocean County would still be CR 33, CR 55, and CR 19: http://mapmaker.rutgers.edu/Ocean/OceanCo_1971.gif (note: map is actually from 1951). An overlap never indicates some sort of shared maintenance responsibility.

Keeping in NJ.  I have read that parts of US 202 are maintained by Morris County

[Anthony_JK]

How about US 69/96/287 through Beaumont?? You could just as easily make the segment from I-10 to Port Arthur an I-x10/US 69 South and simply sign the northern segment N of the downtown split as US 69 North.


Anthony