City rivalries

[Michael in Philly]

Now, here's an interesting map:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:MLB_Blackout_Areas.png

That map has been much discussed on some other forums I visit.  Pretty much the deal is that, except for modifications related to expansion, it dates to the late 1970s, long before the regional sports network was even thought of, for radio purposes.  Each team was allowed to make whatever claim it wanted, which lead to "overlaps".  Rather than fight it out or think it through, the MLB management has just let the thing fester.  Obviously there are plenty of areas, including mine, claimed as "home territory" by teams that have no traction locally at all.

BTW the map is slightly out of date as the two Florida teams no longer divide the state, but, like the two Texas teams, just make a joint claim to the entire place now.

In that case, I wonder why the Phillies didn't claim a bit more of Pennsylvania.  There's an awful lot of Pirates-only territory right up to the midpoint of the state, and an awful lot of Pirates overlap in the east.  (Pirate fans in Pike County (the area across the Delaware from Port Jervis, N.Y., which I believe the FCC classifies as the New York City market for cable must-carry purposes)?  Seriously?)  

I road-tripped to Manassas, Va., for the anniversary of First Bull Run last month, used the Turnpike and US 15 to avoid Baltimore and Washington traffic, and was able to listen to the Phillies (who were at Wrigley that afternoon) all the way to Frederick, Md., thanks to an AM station in Gettysburg.  A place which shows up on this map as Pirates/Orioles/Nationals territory, but which is certainly much closer to us than it is to *#$%ing Pittsburgh.  Sometimes I think Philadelphians, no doubt a consequence of being so close to New York, are unaware that we're - what is it now, the 5th or 6th? - largest city in the country.  Or else they (I'm not a native) are naturally modest.

[pianocello]

I wonder why the entire state of Iowa is split 5 ways. Central Iowa, I can understand. But here in eastern Iowa, It's pretty much split between Chicago and St. Louis. Likewise, western Iowa should (never been there, so I can't justify) lean towards Kansas City, with a few St. Louis and Minnesota fans.

[SP Cook]

The following is not my work, but is the best of many attempts to normalize MLB's blackout maps, with some modifications of my own, note that "DMA" is a term for county-line based areas drawn by the Nielsen Company for TV ratings purposes, and many maps of these are on line.  Also note that the two Texas and two Florida teams have decided on their own to not try to divide their home states, but rather give the entire areas access to both teams:

ARIZONA DIAMONDBACKS
All of Arizona and New Mexico

ATLANTA BRAVES
All of Alabama, Georgia and South Carolina
All of Mississippi except counties in Memphis DMA
All of North Carolina except Counties in Norfolk and Greenville-Washington-New Bern DMAs
Eastern 2/3 of Tennessee (i.e. entrie state except counties in Memphis, Jackson and Cape Girardeau-Paducah DMAs)
FL Counties of Mobile-Pensacola DMA

BALTIMORE ORIOLES and WASHINGTON NATIONALS
All of Maryland except Garrett County (Pittsburgh DMA)
All of Virginia except counties in Bristol-Kingsport and Beckley-Bluefield DMAs
Washington DC
Sussex County DE (i.e. all of DE South of Dover)
PA counties in Harrisburg and Washington DC DMAs
WV counties in Harrisonburg VA and Washington DC DMAs
NC counties in Norfolk and Greenville-Washington-New Bern DMAs

BOSTON RED SOX
All of New England except SW Connecticut
NY Counties of Albany and Burlington VT DMAs

CHICAGO CUBS and WHITE SOX
Northern 2/3 of Illinois and Indiana (Chicago, Rockford, South Bend, Fort Wayne, Quad Cities, Peoria, Quincy, Springfield-Champaign, Terre Haute, Lafayette IN, Indianapolis DMAs)
Eastern 1/3 of Iowa (Quad Cities, Cedar Rapids, Quincy DMAs)

CINCINNATI REDS
All of Ohio except counties in Cleveland, Youngstown and Wheeling DMAs
All of West Virginia except counties in Washington DC, Harrisonburg VA, Pittsburgh and Wheeling DMAs
Southern 2/3 of Indiana (Indianapolis, Lafayette IN, Dayton, Cincinnati, Louisville DMAs)
Eastern 2/3 of Kentucky (i.e. entire state except Evansville and Cape Girardeau-Paducah DMAs)
Far SW Virginia (counties in Beckley-Bluefield and Bristol-Kingsport DMAs)

CLEVELAND INDIANS
Cleveland, Youngstown, Columbus OH, Zanesville, Lima, Erie DMAs
OH Counties of Toledo and Fort Wayne DMAs

COLORADO ROCKIES
All of Colorado, Utah and Wyoming
All of Montana except Counties in Missoula and Spokane DMAs
Eastern Counties of Idaho (i.e. counties in Pocatello and SLC DMAs)
SD Counties of Rapid City DMA
Western Nebraska (counties in Denver, Rapid City and Cheyenne DMAs)
NV Counties of SLC DMA

DETROIT TIGERS
All of Michigan
Toledo DMA

FLORIDA MARLINS
Miami, West Palm Beach, Fort Myers, Orlando DMAs

HOUSTON ASTROS
Austin, Beaumont, Corpus Christi, Harlingen-Brownsville, Houston, Laredo, San Antonio, Tyler, Victoria, Waco DMAs in Texas plus TX Counties of Shreveport DMA
All of Louisiana
AR Counties in Shreveport, Monroe-El Dorado and Greenville-Greenwood DMAs
McCurtain County OK (the one OK county in the Shreveport DMA)

KANSAS CITY ROYALS
All of Missouri except Counties in St. Louis, Quincy and Cape Girardeau-Paducah DMAs
All of Kansas
All of Nebraska except Counties in Denver, Cheyenne and Rapid City DMAs
IA Counties of Omaha, Des Moines and Kirksville-Ottumwa DMAs
AR Counties in Fort Smith-Fayetteville and Springfield MO DMAs
OK Counties in Tulsa, Joplin and Fort Smith-Fayetteville DMAs

LOS ANGELES ANGELS and DODGERS
All of Southern California except San Diego County (Los Angeles, Bakersfield, Palm Springs, Santa Barbara, Yuma DMAs)
Las Vegas DMA
(All of Hawaii)

MILWAUKEE BREWERS
All of Wisconsin except counties in Minneapolis-St. Paul and Duluth DMAs

MINNESOTA TWINS
All of Minnesota
All of North and South Dakota
IA counties of Des Moines, Sioux Falls, Sioux City, Rochester-Mason City DMAs
WI counties of Minneapolis-St. Paul, Duluth and La Crosse-Eau Claire DMAs

NEW YORK METS and YANKEES
All of New York state
All of Connecticut
Northern New Jersey (Counties in NYC DMA)
Northeastern PA (Counties in NYC, Scranton, Elmira DMAs)
All of Vermont except Windham County (Boston DMA)
Berkshire County MA (Albany DMA)

OAKLAND ATHLETICS and SAN FRANCISCO GIANTS
All of Northern California (San Francisco, Sacramento, Fresno, Monterey, Chico-Redding, Eureka, Medford, Reno DMAs)
NV Counties of Reno DMA
OR Counties of Medford DMA

PHILADELPHIA PHILLIES
Philadelphia, Scranton, Harrisburg DMAs

PITTSBURGH PIRATES
Pittsburgh, Wheeling, Youngstown, Johnstown-Altoona, Erie, Clarksburg-Weston DMAs
PA Counties of Buffalo DMA

ST. LOUIS CARDINALS
All of Missouri except Counties in Kansas City, St. Joseph and Omaha DMAs
All of Illinois except Counties in Chicago and Rockford DMAs
All of Arkansas except Counties in Shreveport, Monroe-El Dorado and Greenville-Greenwood DMAs
Eastern 1/3 of Iowa (Cedar Rapids, Quad Cities, Kirksville-Ottumwa, Quincy DMAs)
Western 1/3 of Kentucky (Cape Girardeau-Paducah, Evansville DMAs)
Western 1/3 of Tennessee (Cape Girardeau-Paducah, Jackson TN, Memphis DMAs)
IN Counties of Terre Haute and Evansville DMAs
KS Counties of Joplin and Tulsa DMAs
MS Counties of Memphis DMA
OK Counties of Tulsa, Joplin and Fort Smith-Fayetteville DMAs

SAN DIEGO PADRES
San Diego and Imperial Counties in California

SEATTLE MARINERS
All of Washington State and Oregon
All of Idaho except Counties in Pocatello and SLC DMAs
MT counties of Spokane and Missoula DMAs
(All of Alaska)

TEXAS RANGERS
TX Counties of following DMAs: Dallas-Fort Worth, Sherman-Ada, Shreveport, Waco, Tyler, Wichita Falls, Abilene, San Angelo, Midland-Odessa, El Paso, Amarillo, Lubbock, Austin, San Antonio
LA Parishes of Shreveport and Monroe-El Dorado DMAs
AR Counties of Shreveport, Monroe-El Dorado and Greenville-Greenwood DMAs
All of Oklahoma except Counties in Tulsa, Joplin and Fort Smith-Fayetteville DMAs

TAMPA BAY RAYS
All of Florida except counties in Miami, Mobile and West Palm Beach DMAs

[Michael in Philly]

^^I was looking recently for on-line maps of the FCC-defined markets (which they use for must-carry purposes), which may or may not be identical to the Nielsen DMAs.  I know I saw them in a print source 20 years ago, although I forget which.  Where did you find the Nielsen maps (or have you seen an FCC map)?

[US71]

Fayetteville & Springdale Arkansas

Both High Schools are the Bulldogs (Fayetteville is Purple, Springdale is Red). There seems to be a passionate dislike between the 2 schools.

[SP Cook]

^^I was looking recently for on-line maps of the FCC-defined markets (which they use for must-carry purposes), which may or may not be identical to the Nielsen DMAs.  I know I saw them in a print source 20 years ago, although I forget which.  Where did you find the Nielsen maps (or have you seen an FCC map)?

The FCC has several maps for several different purposes.  The rules for cable and sat. are different, and the rules for "must carry" are different again.  Nielsen also moves counties around from year to year, generally places on the border between two markets because viewing habits will change (for example, in my area Athens Co. moves between Huntington-Charleston and Columbus over and over, because cable carries both and its more or less random which most people watch).

In any event, a "pirate" copy, with clickable maps, can be found here:

http://www.truckads.com/licensed_affiliates1.asp#usamap

[drummer_evans_aki]

I know Portland, OR and Seattle, WA have a rivalry going on with MLS.

[Michael in Philly]

^^I was looking recently for on-line maps of the FCC-defined markets (which they use for must-carry purposes), which may or may not be identical to the Nielsen DMAs.  I know I saw them in a print source 20 years ago, although I forget which.  Where did you find the Nielsen maps (or have you seen an FCC map)?

The FCC has several maps for several different purposes.  The rules for cable and sat. are different, and the rules for "must carry" are different again.  Nielsen also moves counties around from year to year, generally places on the border between two markets because viewing habits will change (for example, in my area Athens Co. moves between Huntington-Charleston and Columbus over and over, because cable carries both and its more or less random which most people watch).

In any event, a "pirate" copy, with clickable maps, can be found here:

http://www.truckads.com/licensed_affiliates1.asp#usamap

Cool!  Thanks!

[Michael in Philly]

I know Portland, OR and Seattle, WA have a rivalry going on with MLS.

They presumably used to with the NBA as well.

[drummer_evans_aki]

I know Portland, OR and Seattle, WA have a rivalry going on with MLS.

They presumably used to with the NBA as well.

Yes they did. I believe the Minor League Baseball teams had a rivalry between Portland (San Diego's former AAA club) and Tacoma (Seattle's AAA club)

[jwolfer]

The following is not my work, but is the best of many attempts to normalize MLB's blackout maps, with some modifications of my own, note that "DMA" is a term for county-line based areas drawn by the Nielsen Company for TV ratings purposes, and many maps of these are on line.  Also note that the two Texas and two Florida teams have decided on their own to not try to divide their home states, but rather give the entire areas access to both teams:

.......

PHILADELPHIA PHILLIES
Philadelphia, Scranton, Harrisburg DMAs

......

Ocean County although part of the NYC DMA and defiantly a Giants area,  Should be included with the Phillies, there is a Phillies farm team in Lakewood( the BlueClaws) and there are quite a few Phillies fans

[huskeroadgeek]

^^I was looking recently for on-line maps of the FCC-defined markets (which they use for must-carry purposes), which may or may not be identical to the Nielsen DMAs.  I know I saw them in a print source 20 years ago, although I forget which.  Where did you find the Nielsen maps (or have you seen an FCC map)?

Here's another map-this is the one I prefer:
http://dishuser.org/TVMarkets/

[Landshark]

I live in between Portland and Seattle, and it is kind of a one sided rivalry.   Portland is always looking to compare, contrast, and measure up to Seattle while Seattle doesn't really care much about Portland, except about 4 times a year before a greedy Starbucks founder and CEO shipped the Sonics off to tornado alley.  

[xonhulu]

I live in between Portland and Seattle, and it is kind of a one sided rivalry.   Portland is always looking to compare, contrast, and measure up to Seattle while Seattle doesn't really care much about Portland, except about 4 times a year before a greedy Starbucks founder and CEO shipped the Sonics off to tornado alley.  

It's really a no-sided rivalry, as Portlanders don't really care about Seattle to the extent you imply.  Unless they have a team in the particular sport (basketball, soccer), Portlanders & Oregonians generally support the Seattle teams (Mariners, Seahawks); I've actually heard a Portland-station news anchor  refer to "our Seahawks."  And politically, socially, etc., Portland pretty much charts its own course and doesn't follow Seattle all that much.  So I don't really see this "rivalry" as very strong on this end, either.  I see a lot more animosity in Oregon aimed at California.