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Northern Virginia HOT Lanes

Started by mtantillo, August 14, 2012, 11:02:35 PM

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1995hoo

I met a client in Lorton earlier today and went a bit out of my way on the return trip to check out the Heller Road ramp to I-95. As I've previously noted, the ramp is a one-way (entry-only) ramp connecting Heller Road to the pre-existing flyover just north of Newington leading from the northbound reversible lanes to the general-purpose lanes. For practical safety reasons, the ramp is open only when the express lanes are pointed southbound. It permits access to the northbound general-purpose lanes and the southbound express lanes and it's height-restricted (interesting, since trucks aren't supposed to be on Heller Road anyway).

What I found a little peculiar was that the signs on Heller Road are all exclusively the "E-ZPass EXPRESS ONLY" signs showing toll rates down to "95-DALE" (other points listed are "RTE 123" and "PW PKWY"). There are no signs indicating you can go north on I-95. Once you're on the ramp, there's a Little Green Sign advising of that option. Then you come to a T-intersection at the pre-existing flyover. You definitely have to slow down. I took the turn a bit faster than I probably should have. That's a major reason why the ramp cannot be open, in either direction, when the express lanes are pointed northbound: Turning traffic has to slow down too much and it'd be unsafe.

Anyway, I can't really see any reason why most people, aside from folks who work at or are visiting the intelligence facility in the Fort Belvoir North area (formerly the Proving Grounds) would ever be all that likely to use this ramp because it's not particularly convenient to access, setting aside the issue of almost nobody knowing where it is. If you're in the Newington area, most people wanting to use the express lanes would use the Boudinot Drive ramp ("FC PKWY" on northbound toll-rate signs) and most people wanting to use the general-purpose lanes would use the existing cloverleaf. If you're closer to the Franconia—Springfield Parkway, people heading to the express lanes would use that road and most people wanting the general-purpose lanes would go up to Route 644. About the only members of the general public I can see finding much reason to use this ramp on a regular basis are the small number of people who live in the residential neighborhood off Backlick between the Parkway and Barta Road (simply because it eliminates going through all those long lights in Springfield) and the people who work at, or patronize, the businesses on Backlick between Barta and Fullerton Road (because it eliminates the convoluted routing you have to use from there through Newington). Of course, if you want the southbound general-purpose lanes or the northbound express lanes, this ramp does nothing for you.

(BTW, note the odd Little Blue Sign on Heller Road giving directions at about the 0:17 mark. I assume it was probably posted by the Defense Department. It's certainly not a VDOT-spec sign, although I've seen VDOT post a Little White Sign on the southbound Exit 51 offramp from the Beltway, so who knows....)


"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.


cpzilliacus

Quote from: 1995hoo on January 09, 2015, 03:27:25 PM
I met a client in Lorton earlier today and went a bit out of my way on the return trip to check out the Heller Road ramp to I-95. As I've previously noted, the ramp is a one-way (entry-only) ramp connecting Heller Road to the pre-existing flyover just north of Newington leading from the northbound reversible lanes to the general-purpose lanes. For practical safety reasons, the ramp is open only when the express lanes are pointed southbound. It permits access to the northbound general-purpose lanes and the southbound express lanes and it's height-restricted (interesting, since trucks aren't supposed to be on Heller Road anyway).

I heard about this ramp connecting to the Newington flyover when it was being planned, and was not aware that it was going to allow access to the northbound conventional (non-managed) lanes of I-95.  I thought it was for access to the managed lanes when they were pointing south - only.
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

cpzilliacus

Quote from: Mapmikey on January 08, 2015, 07:15:52 AM
Major Fail!

Gates on the express lanes were frozen and had to be opened manually.  Even with opening time at 2 a.m. they were not able to open them fully until nearly 6.

Part of the reason for how long it took to do it manually is that all the ramps now have 10-16 gates each...

Mainline 95 from Dumfries to Woodbridge does not do well at all when the lanes are closed for whatever reason...a little better north of VA 123.

Agreed.  This sounded ugly.

WTOP Radio reported:  Cold weather keeps gates of 95 Express Lanes closed

QuoteThe big chill kept the new 95 Express Lanes in Virginia from opening on time for the Thursday morning rush hour, leaving drivers without an option to pay tolls for a quicker commute.

QuoteThe gates near the entrance to the northbound lanes near Garrisonville, Virginia, could not open automatically, due to the cold. So they had to be opened manually, according to Pierce Coffee, a spokeswoman for Transurban, which manages the lanes.

QuoteThe gates are normally open by 2 a.m., but they remained closed at 5 a.m.  But shortly before 6 a.m., all of the gates were opened and traffic resumed in the Express Lanes.
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

vdeane

Quote from: 1995hoo on January 09, 2015, 03:27:25 PM
You definitely have to slow down. I took the turn a bit faster than I probably should have. That's a major reason why the ramp cannot be open, in either direction, when the express lanes are pointed northbound: Turning traffic has to slow down too much and it'd be unsafe.
It's a T junction.  Is there a reason making a right there is safe but making a left there wouldn't be?  It's not really a flyover; just an overpass connecting to a frontage road.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

1995hoo

#704
Quote from: vdeane on January 10, 2015, 01:38:48 AM
Quote from: 1995hoo on January 09, 2015, 03:27:25 PM
You definitely have to slow down. I took the turn a bit faster than I probably should have. That's a major reason why the ramp cannot be open, in either direction, when the express lanes are pointed northbound: Turning traffic has to slow down too much and it'd be unsafe.
It's a T junction.  Is there a reason making a right there is safe but making a left there wouldn't be?  It's not really a flyover; just an overpass connecting to a frontage road.

It is indeed a flyover connecting two carriageways of a three-carriageway Interstate. The ramp coming from my right in that video connects the northbound express lanes (reversible center carriageway) to the northbound general-purpose lanes. People come up that ramp at high speed. Having people making a left turn in front of them at slow speed (or, alternatively, slowing to turn left to use it as an exit) would be quite dangerous.

There's no real frontage road along I-95 there in the Texas sense of a frontage road. Backlick and Loisdale Roads parallel I-95 there but don't really serve as frontage roads. Backlick, in particular, is a longer road that connects Newington and Springfield to Annandale further north. Loisdale has no direct connections to I-95.

I hope this map link works since I'm using Google Maps on my iPad. The ramp is roughly at the center, running from the left of where it says "Field Lark Branch." zoom in closer to see the flyover ramp on the right. (I use the term "flyover" to distinguish from a "slip ramp," a left-side surface-level ramp connecting the carriageways.)

https://www.google.com/maps/@38.7489368,-77.1848413,16.22z




Edited to add: I searched online for a press release or the like and found something saying if additional funding materializes in the future, the ramp may be modified to allow northbound express lane traffic to use it as an exit ramp. Currently the barriers close and prohibit that for the reason I previously noted.

http://www.army.mil/article/121493/Ramp_to_connect_Fort_Belvoir_North_to_I_95/
"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.

vdeane

Is there a reason slip ramps weren't used to connect the reversible lanes to I-95?
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

Mapmikey

There were 3 southbound prior to the recent construction and conversion to HO/T lanes.  Two were removed as part of the conversion.  One still remains for the VA 234 Dumfries exit.

I would surmise that the reason the ramp being discussed in the above few posts was that a slip ramp there would require traffic trying to get to the Beltway to cross the entirety of mainline 95 to access the ramps to either direction.  Once the Beltway interchange was reconfigured over 1998-2006 people wanting to go east on the Beltway did have to cross back over all the lanes of 95 to access that ramp.

There are a number of slip ramps for mainline traffic to access the reversible lanes, though...

Mapmikey

1995hoo

Another reason for the ramp noted above being a flyover to the right side may well be that the exit ramp to Springfield (splits to Springfield Mall and westbound Route 644)  is a short distance north of there and draws a lot of traffic. Having a flyover to the right side makes it easier for that traffic to exit.

Nowadays, accessing the Beltway from the northbound express lanes no longer requires exiting to the mainline since the massive HOV ramp opened in November 2012, though using said ramp may, as of last week, require a steeper toll.

The slip ramp Mapmikey notes near Route 234 is better than a flyover there because a truck weigh station would interfere with a flyover.
"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.

mrsman

Quote from: cpzilliacus on January 09, 2015, 02:38:14 PM
Quote from: mrsman on January 09, 2015, 02:17:46 PM
Quote from: 1995hoo on January 08, 2015, 09:12:23 AM
I just came back down I-395 from DC. I suppose this was to be expected:

As I passed Turkeycock at about 8:53 AM, I glanced left into the northbound express lanes at their terminus. About six or seven SOVs all stopped on the gore area for the flyover back to the local lanes with their hazard flashers on. One was so brazen he was reading the paper. You guessed it–they were obviously waiting for 9:00 AM when HOV ends, just like people do at the Pentagon. I think this is arguably more dangerous than near the Pentagon because they were stopped on the gore area rather than on a shoulder, meaning you get traffic going by on either side.

I'll see later today whether the camera picked them up. Between sun glare and the location, I kind of doubt it.

Yes, another hazard due to the inconsistent treatment of the lanes in Arlington County and in the rest of NoVa.  The drivers should be ticketed if there is no safe place for them to wait.

Another idea might be to extend HOV hours (Arlington County section).  Perhaps until 9:30 a.m. in the morning and 6:30 p.m. in the evening.

In my personal opinion, an even better idea - just extend the 95 Express lanes all the way up to the Potomac River, and encourage D.C. to make a deal with Transurban for crossing the river on the (former) HOV lane spans.

Of course, all of these problems are becuase of the Arlington County lawsuit and Transurban's quick acquiescence on the issue.  If the entire corridor from Pentagon SOUTH (and ideally from DC SOUTH) had the same rules, we wouldn't have any of these issues.

I remember some posts either here or on Dr G's column with how many people would use the HOV lanes at exactly 6 p.m.  Well, rush hour does not end at 6 p.m. anymore and it should be later.

Of course, one nice thing about HOT treatment is that there is no longer a hybrid exception.  Everybody is treated the same.  If you are HOV-3 and have a Flex you get to use the lanes for free.  If not, you can pay for the privelege.

Perhaps there can be legislation to fix this issue and have the entire section be HOT.

froggie

QuoteAnyway, I can't really see any reason why most people, aside from folks who work at or are visiting the intelligence facility in the Fort Belvoir North area (formerly the Proving Grounds) would ever be all that likely to use this ramp because it's not particularly convenient to access,

It's the reciprocal of this ramp (coincidentally the same ramp you were on at the start of your video).  Combined, the two allow direct access between NGA and 95 North.  It's effectively a half-interchange to/from the north.

1995hoo

#710
Quote from: froggie on January 11, 2015, 09:05:03 AM
QuoteAnyway, I can't really see any reason why most people, aside from folks who work at or are visiting the intelligence facility in the Fort Belvoir North area (formerly the Proving Grounds) would ever be all that likely to use this ramp because it's not particularly convenient to access,

It's the reciprocal of this ramp (coincidentally the same ramp you were on at the start of your video).  Combined, the two allow direct access between NGA and 95 North.  It's effectively a half-interchange to/from the north.


Sure, but that doesn't change the validity of my conclusion that most people will not have a use for it.

(Edited to add: Nor did I ever mean to imply it needs to be useful for most members of the public.)
"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.

mrsman

The area is filled with special on-ramps that primarily serve federal facilities.  This is similar to the special ramps to NSA, Goddard from the BW Pkwy or the ramp to CIA from GW Pkwy. 

Those ramps probably get significant traffic from agency employees, even though the general public won't use them.

Here, it's the same way, except that the exit is technically accesible to the public.  But most people won't use it unless they are reaching Ft Belvoir or  are trying to avoid a jam.

1995hoo

From southbound I-395 this morning just before 9:00 I noted intense State Police activity in the express lanes at Turkeycock–at least three cop cars, maybe four, all ticketing the gore-stoppers and shoulder-waiters (I say "shoulder" for lack of a better term since there isn't really a full shoulder in there on either side). Good job by the authorities of dealing with it promptly, though it'll take a sustained effort to show they mean business. 
"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.

NE2

So now what? People will drive slowly so they don't reach the transition before 9? Fine by me.
pre-1945 Florida route log

I accept and respect your identity as long as it's not dumb shit like "identifying as a vaccinated attack helicopter".

jeffandnicole

Maybe they'll leave later. 

And that's why I found odd.  People leaving early just to sit on the road?  Why not spend another 10 minutes at home???

oscar

#715
Quote from: jeffandnicole on January 13, 2015, 12:34:32 PM
Maybe they'll leave later. 

And that's why I found odd.  People leaving early just to sit on the road?  Why not spend another 10 minutes at home???

I think they planned for traffic delays between home and getting on the express lanes, and when those delays didn't happen they wound up with a few extra minutes when they got to Turkeycock.  Once they figure out exactly how long it'll normally take them from getting on the express lanes to Turkeycock, they might do their shoulder (or safer place) wait just before entering the express lanes.  Or, as NE2 suggests, dial back their speed a little in the express lanes to make sure they reach Turkeycock just after 9am. 
my Hot Springs and Highways pages, with links to my roads sites:
http://www.alaskaroads.com/home.html

1995hoo

Quote from: NE2 on January 13, 2015, 12:31:13 PM
So now what? People will drive slowly so they don't reach the transition before 9? Fine by me.

That's what I'd do–stay in the far right lane and go 50 or 55 mph. The law doesn't require you to go 65 just because the sign permits it, although I saw an argument elsewhere saying that if you go below the speed limit, you should be ticketed for obstructing traffic. If you're driving in the left lane for no reason and going slowly I'd be inclined to agree with that, but that's why I said "stay in the far right lane." I try pretty hard to keep right except to pass when I'm on a relatively open highway (recognizing crowded urban highways are often a different situation due to traffic volume), regardless of my speed, and I wish other people would learn to do the same (except of course in places where you drive on the left).
"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.

1995hoo

Interesting news item from Dr. Gridlock: HO/T lane tolls were suspended for a time Sunday night, and again last night, to encourage people to use them prior to forecast bad weather. The increased traffic evidently improves the performance of whatever they use to pre-treat the road surface.

(Last night's free period was definitely not during rush hour–we paid $5.20 from I-66 to Springfield at about 5:48 PM.)
"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.

jeffandnicole

Quote from: 1995hoo on January 13, 2015, 02:16:01 PM
Quote from: NE2 on January 13, 2015, 12:31:13 PM
So now what? People will drive slowly so they don't reach the transition before 9? Fine by me.

That's what I'd do—stay in the far right lane and go 50 or 55 mph. The law doesn't require you to go 65 just because the sign permits it, although I saw an argument elsewhere saying that if you go below the speed limit, you should be ticketed for obstructing traffic. If you're driving in the left lane for no reason and going slowly I'd be inclined to agree with that, but that's why I said "stay in the far right lane." I try pretty hard to keep right except to pass when I'm on a relatively open highway (recognizing crowded urban highways are often a different situation due to traffic volume), regardless of my speed, and I wish other people would learn to do the same (except of course in places where you drive on the left).

In the long run, driving 10 mph slower won't matter. 

Let's say it's 10 miles to get from the starting point to the HOT lanes.

At 60 mph, it'll take you 10 minutes.

At 50 mph, it'll take you 12 minutes.

If the people on the shoulder are there long enough to read a paper, driving a bit slower isn't going to matter all that much.  Even driving 30 miles just to reach that point, going 10 mph slower the whole way will take them an additional 6 minutes.  And if the point of leaving earlier is to account for potential delays, they're probably not going to want to drive slower and potentially hit those potential delays.

1995hoo

Most of the people who sit on the shoulder will not have been going as slowly as you suggest if they're going full-speed! Over the years I've generally found that, during HOV hours, if you're going 75, you're one of the slower cars on the road (speed limit is 65). Going 50 mph versus 80 mph is a more significant difference than 50 versus 60. A 12-minute difference in driving the full length of the lanes is potentially enough in terms of the timing.
"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.

jeffandnicole

Quote from: 1995hoo on January 14, 2015, 10:23:12 AM
Most of the people who sit on the shoulder will not have been going as slowly as you suggest if they're going full-speed! Over the years I've generally found that, during HOV hours, if you're going 75, you're one of the slower cars on the road (speed limit is 65). Going 50 mph versus 80 mph is a more significant difference than 50 versus 60. A 12-minute difference in driving the full length of the lanes is potentially enough in terms of the timing.

If someone is used to going 80 mph, they are definitely not going to change their habits and start driving 50 mph!!!  I know that example is a bit of an exaggeration, but in general people that drive fast simply can't drive slower, even if they wanted to.

1995hoo

Quote from: jeffandnicole on January 14, 2015, 10:26:48 AM
Quote from: 1995hoo on January 14, 2015, 10:23:12 AM
Most of the people who sit on the shoulder will not have been going as slowly as you suggest if they're going full-speed! Over the years I've generally found that, during HOV hours, if you're going 75, you're one of the slower cars on the road (speed limit is 65). Going 50 mph versus 80 mph is a more significant difference than 50 versus 60. A 12-minute difference in driving the full length of the lanes is potentially enough in terms of the timing.

If someone is used to going 80 mph, they are definitely not going to change their habits and start driving 50 mph!!!  I know that example is a bit of an exaggeration, but in general people that drive fast simply can't drive slower, even if they wanted to.

Yeah, I know it's not easy. I still think it's utterly irresponsible and unacceptable to stop on the gore area or the shoulder, though.
"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.

jeffandnicole

So, I roadtripped it from NJ to FL Thursday night. It allowed to be view the completed HO/T lanes for the first time too.

I was in the area around 9pm. Toll for the entire length would've been about $4.25-$4.50. Overall, very few were using the lanes. They appeared to be preparing for lane closures in the general use lanes.  4 cops were scattered along the right shoulder. A broken down 18 wheeler was on the left shoulder, ready to be towed. An arrow truck was being used to temporarily close that left lane to help move the truck away.

Huge banners hung over the HO/T lanes, reminding people they need an EZ Pass, and for the HOV-3, they need an EZ Pass Flex. The banners were mostly hung at the top of overpasses.

They really loaded up on the variable speed limit signs. If there were open/closed lane indicators, there was a VSLS. Too many, in my opinion, as close to every quarter mile from each other. The NJ Turnpike, for comparisons sake, has them every 3-4 miles on average.

If there's congestion issues at the southern end, I can see why. That's a pretty lousy setup. And how long were those condos/apts there? It's like I can go for miles without seeing anything off on the right shoulder, and then right at the merge there's housing.

froggie

QuoteAnd how long were those condos/apts there?

Based on aerial imagery, looks like construction on them began in 2008, a few years before the HO/T lane project was finalized and begun.

1995hoo

Quote from: froggie on January 17, 2015, 11:31:48 AM
QuoteAnd how long were those condos/apts there?

Based on aerial imagery, looks like construction on them began in 2008, a few years before the HO/T lane project was finalized and begun.

If I recall, around then the project was under discussion but there was still talk of running it all the way to Massaponax. Perhaps a different configuration around Aquia was envisioned?

Jeff, it's worth noting that part of the reason you pass next to nothing north of there is that once you pass Route 234 on your way south, you pass Prince William Forest Park (west of the highway), Forest Greens Golf Course (also west of the highway and part of a county-owned park; it's fairly easy to see from the road during winter), and Marine Corps Base Quantico (both sides of the highway). So those things all preclude much development through that area and Exit 143 is the first place south of all that where stuff could grow up.
"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.



Opinions expressed here on belong solely to the poster and do not represent or reflect the opinions or beliefs of AARoads, its creators and/or associates.