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Author Topic: ODOT: ‘Strong opposition’ from public on I-205 tolling  (Read 3932 times)

US 89

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Re: ODOT: ‘Strong opposition’ from public on I-205 tolling
« Reply #50 on: December 21, 2020, 07:42:07 PM »

https://www.oregon.gov/odot/tolling/Documents/2020_0430_ODOT_I-5_I-205_TollProjects_FAQs.pdf

"The Keep Oregon Moving legislation (House Bill 2017) established a Congestion Relief Fund which would receive any net proceeds from tolling. The Oregon Constitution (Article IX, Section 3a) specifies that revenues collected from the use or operation of motor vehicles is spent on roadway projects, which could include construction or reconstruction of travel lanes, as well as bicycle and pedestrian facilities or transit improvements in or along the roadway."

Relevant part highlighted. Given ODOT's track record I find it very hard to believe they would spend toll revenue on projects to benefit auto traffic.

Sub-Urbanite

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Re: ODOT: ‘Strong opposition’ from public on I-205 tolling
« Reply #51 on: December 22, 2020, 09:50:04 AM »

https://www.oregon.gov/odot/tolling/Documents/2020_0430_ODOT_I-5_I-205_TollProjects_FAQs.pdf

"The Keep Oregon Moving legislation (House Bill 2017) established a Congestion Relief Fund which would receive any net proceeds from tolling. The Oregon Constitution (Article IX, Section 3a) specifies that revenues collected from the use or operation of motor vehicles is spent on roadway projects, which could include construction or reconstruction of travel lanes, as well as bicycle and pedestrian facilities or transit improvements in or along the roadway."

Relevant part highlighted. Given ODOT's track record I find it very hard to believe they would spend toll revenue on projects to benefit auto traffic.

Hard disagree, if only because they're going to bond out the construction costs of the 205 widening from Stafford to Oregon City and the Abernethy Bridge improvements. Assuming that they've bonded against toll revenue, they'll be legally obligated to use that toll revenue for the bond payments first.

After they've paid down legal obligations, then the fuzzy math can begin.
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stevashe

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Re: ODOT: ‘Strong opposition’ from public on I-205 tolling
« Reply #52 on: December 22, 2020, 05:23:42 PM »

Personally I'd be much more worried about the tracking devices that literally everyone carries around with them in their pockets much more than tolling gantries that might be collecting a few sparse data points that could infer a travel pattern.
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vdeane

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Re: ODOT: ‘Strong opposition’ from public on I-205 tolling
« Reply #53 on: December 22, 2020, 08:58:02 PM »

Personally I'd be much more worried about the tracking devices that literally everyone carries around with them in their pockets much more than tolling gantries that might be collecting a few sparse data points that could infer a travel pattern.
Given that the end game for people who advocate tolls is to toll everything (seriously, ideas like expanding tolling on existing interstates and VMT taxes have bipartisan support), it won't remain a few sparse data points forever.  As for phones, one can always turn it off or not take it with them if they're really concerned, the government would have to go to the phone company for info rather than looking into its own records, and I actually have kept location services turned off when not needed during the pandemic (and I might just keep it that way afterwards), which makes it harder to track since then one would have to triangulate the position from cell tower data, which is harder and less precise.
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Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

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Re: ODOT: ‘Strong opposition’ from public on I-205 tolling
« Reply #54 on: December 23, 2020, 12:01:44 AM »

Personally I'd be much more worried about the tracking devices that literally everyone carries around with them in their pockets much more than tolling gantries that might be collecting a few sparse data points that could infer a travel pattern.
Given that the end game for people who advocate tolls is to toll everything (seriously, ideas like expanding tolling on existing interstates and VMT taxes have bipartisan support), it won't remain a few sparse data points forever.  As for phones, one can always turn it off or not take it with them if they're really concerned, the government would have to go to the phone company for info rather than looking into its own records, and I actually have kept location services turned off when not needed during the pandemic (and I might just keep it that way afterwards), which makes it harder to track since then one would have to triangulate the position from cell tower data, which is harder and less precise.

… just as one can choose to commute by other methods, such as bicycle, bus, foot or even taxi / ride share.

Where you drive just isn't that interesting, except for the purposes of figuring out how much to charge you for road usage.
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kalvado

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Re: ODOT: ‘Strong opposition’ from public on I-205 tolling
« Reply #55 on: December 23, 2020, 01:10:23 AM »

Personally I'd be much more worried about the tracking devices that literally everyone carries around with them in their pockets much more than tolling gantries that might be collecting a few sparse data points that could infer a travel pattern.
Given that the end game for people who advocate tolls is to toll everything (seriously, ideas like expanding tolling on existing interstates and VMT taxes have bipartisan support), it won't remain a few sparse data points forever.  As for phones, one can always turn it off or not take it with them if they're really concerned, the government would have to go to the phone company for info rather than looking into its own records, and I actually have kept location services turned off when not needed during the pandemic (and I might just keep it that way afterwards), which makes it harder to track since then one would have to triangulate the position from cell tower data, which is harder and less precise.

… just as one can choose to commute by other methods, such as bicycle, bus, foot or even taxi / ride share.

Where you drive just isn't that interesting, except for the purposes of figuring out how much to charge you for road usage.
"If you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear!". Any specific reason you're using a nickname, as opposed to a full legal name, on this forum, then?
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vdeane

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Re: ODOT: ‘Strong opposition’ from public on I-205 tolling
« Reply #56 on: December 23, 2020, 04:33:44 PM »

"If you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear!". Any specific reason you're using a nickname, as opposed to a full legal name, on this forum, then?
Unfortunately, there are now people old enough to vote who weren't even alive in a time when the US government wasn't spying on everyone in violation of the 4th Amendment.
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Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

 


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