The universe according to MMM

[Roadgeekteen]

I'm shocked that this thread has survived so long without getting locked, given that this seems to be one users personal sandbox. I feel like if I created "The universe according to Roadgeekteen" it would be locked within 5 pages.

[Scott5114]

The FritzOwl thread is one user's personal sandbox too. And this thread exists for the same reason that one does.

[Roadgeekteen]

The FritzOwl thread is one user's personal sandbox too. And this thread exists for the same reason that one does.

At least FritzOwl is posting road related content that is relevent to the forum. This thread is just pointless rambling and usless conversations.

[LilianaUwU]

The FritzOwl thread is one user's personal sandbox too. And this thread exists for the same reason that one does.

At least FritzOwl is posting road related content that is relevent to the forum. This thread is just pointless rambling and usless conversations.

I mean, I can't say my personal sandbox is exactly road-related either (though it's meant to represent a road network). As for useless conversations, isn't that the whole point of the forum?

[Roadgeekteen]

The FritzOwl thread is one user's personal sandbox too. And this thread exists for the same reason that one does.

At least FritzOwl is posting road related content that is relevent to the forum. This thread is just pointless rambling and usless conversations.

I mean, I can't say my personal sandbox is exactly road-related either (though it's meant to represent a road network). As for useless conversations, isn't that the whole point of the forum?

This thread doesn't technically break the rules, so I'm fine with it existing. I'm just suprised that it has lasted over 30 pages without getting locked.

[Scott5114]

The FritzOwl thread is one user's personal sandbox too. And this thread exists for the same reason that one does.

At least FritzOwl is posting road related content that is relevent to the forum. This thread is just pointless rambling and usless conversations.

I mean, I can't say my personal sandbox is exactly road-related either (though it's meant to represent a road network). As for useless conversations, isn't that the whole point of the forum?

This thread doesn't technically break the rules, so I'm fine with it existing. I'm just suprised that it has lasted over 30 pages without getting locked.

And if you weren't fine with it existing, what would happen, exactly?

[Roadgeekteen]

The FritzOwl thread is one user's personal sandbox too. And this thread exists for the same reason that one does.

At least FritzOwl is posting road related content that is relevent to the forum. This thread is just pointless rambling and usless conversations.

I mean, I can't say my personal sandbox is exactly road-related either (though it's meant to represent a road network). As for useless conversations, isn't that the whole point of the forum?

This thread doesn't technically break the rules, so I'm fine with it existing. I'm just suprised that it has lasted over 30 pages without getting locked.

And if you weren't fine with it existing, what would happen, exactly?

Nothing cuz I'm not a mod lol. Although I could bitch about it more.

[Scott5114]

Nothing cuz I'm not a mod lol. Although I could bitch about it more.

So I suppose this falls under

just pointless rambling and usless conversations.

doesn't it?

[kalvado]

Why should someone get an advantage in life just because they won the birth lottery and had rich parents?

And honestly, MMM being born with a silver spoon in his mouth explains a LOT.  He's never lived in the real world.  Ever.  No wonder all his ideas are fantastical.  He is Example A for why we need a national service requirement... perhaps a year in a small town and a year in a big city doing community service.  Could help bring people in this country together to understand each other.

There is a birth lottery wether you like it or not. It's about money, it's about family role models, health, citizenship and what not.
What MMM wants here is parent's support extending past the childhood into the years when building up of career foundation - skills, connections, work ethics - should happen.
Would be interesting to see what his education really is - something real world, or something that provides little benefit beyond clicking the "college degree" checkbox.

[SectorZ]

Just perusing the last two pages, I can't understand how someone can call a service requirement fascist and then simultaneously say humans don't have a right to reproduce. You cannot be more contradictory than that.

[Max Rockatansky]

Just perusing the last two pages, I can't understand how someone can call a service requirement fascist and then simultaneously say humans don't have a right to reproduce. You cannot be more contradictory than that.

One thing you can certainly say is that MMM's opinions certainly are his own.  To an extent I can respect when someone has drawn conclusions which are all over the board and don't adhere traditional ideologies.  But yes, the contradiction you mention is what caught my eye last night.

[kalvado]

Just perusing the last two pages, I can't understand how someone can call a service requirement fascist and then simultaneously say humans don't have a right to reproduce. You cannot be more contradictory than that.

One thing you can certainly say is that MMM's opinions certainly are his own.  To an extent I can respect when someone has drawn conclusions which are all over the board and don't adhere traditional ideologies.  But yes, the contradiction you mention is what caught my eye last night.

conclusions on their own is a great thing if there is an underlying reasoning. Here it is more about "that is the way I want it to be for me!"
Of course, I also want to have lots of money, no work, and ipads growing on trees. I am slightly more realistic, so I may dial down my expectations - I want my job to be interesting and well-paid.

[MultiMillionMiler]

Just perusing the last two pages, I can't understand how someone can call a service requirement fascist and then simultaneously say humans don't have a right to reproduce. You cannot be more contradictory than that.

And how exactly would this mandatory service requirement be implemented/enforced? Thank God Canada is only a 350 mile drive away if that ever happened.

[Max Rockatansky]

Just perusing the last two pages, I can't understand how someone can call a service requirement fascist and then simultaneously say humans don't have a right to reproduce. You cannot be more contradictory than that.

And how exactly would this mandatory service requirement be implemented/enforced? Thank God Canada is only a 350 mile drive away if that ever happened.

Being fearful of military service definitely seems on brand for you.  That said, I believe the suggestions cited in the prior replies were more along the lines of mandatory community services.

[SectorZ]

Just perusing the last two pages, I can't understand how someone can call a service requirement fascist and then simultaneously say humans don't have a right to reproduce. You cannot be more contradictory than that.

And how exactly would this mandatory service requirement be implemented/enforced? Thank God Canada is only a 350 mile drive away if that ever happened.

I agree with your sentiment, forced service is fascism, but then you suggest something that is just as fascist.

[MultiMillionMiler]

Just perusing the last two pages, I can't understand how someone can call a service requirement fascist and then simultaneously say humans don't have a right to reproduce. You cannot be more contradictory than that.

And how exactly would this mandatory service requirement be implemented/enforced? Thank God Canada is only a 350 mile drive away if that ever happened.

Being fearful of military service definitely seems on brand for you.  That said, I believe the suggestions cited in the prior replies were more along the lines of mandatory community services.

Thats only legal if you commit a crime.

@SectorZ no I didnt.

[Max Rockatansky]

Just perusing the last two pages, I can't understand how someone can call a service requirement fascist and then simultaneously say humans don't have a right to reproduce. You cannot be more contradictory than that.

And how exactly would this mandatory service requirement be implemented/enforced? Thank God Canada is only a 350 mile drive away if that ever happened.

Being fearful of military service definitely seems on brand for you.  That said, I believe the suggestions cited in the prior replies were more along the lines of mandatory community services.

Thats only legal if you commit a crime.

@SectorZ no I didnt.

Oh, but you did:

Eugenics is deliberately desining babies the way you want. I think that's ridiculous. I'm saying the number of babies coming out should be lower, period, certainly not that rich people should be able to choose the gender or hair/eye color of their offspring. Deleting harmful mental illness/physical illness generating genes, sure, but that's it. Nothing beyond that.

Deleting harmful mental illness/physical fitness genes is very much on brand with traditional fascist beliefs.  It's a very quick leap from that to "deleting people" who are alive over what is deemed to be "harmful genes."

To be clear, I'm not insinuating that you are promoting "deleting people."  What I am saying is that you fail to recognize how universally reviled Eugenics became after it was horrifically abused by several governments.  You might be optimistic another state or individuals wouldn't abuse genetic manipulation again but almost nobody with a healthy world view agrees. 

[kalvado]

Eugenics is deliberately desining babies the way you want. I think that's ridiculous. I'm saying the number of babies coming out should be lower, period, certainly not that rich people should be able to choose the gender or hair/eye color of their offspring. Deleting harmful mental illness/physical illness generating genes, sure, but that's it. Nothing beyond that.

Deleting harmful mental illness/physical fitness genes is very much on brand with traditional fascist beliefs.

On the other hand, there are definitely legitimate medical services to test an unborn child for certain problems, and that can be the reason for abortion.
Down syndrome is one such test. Osteogenesis imperfect is another one, especially if parents have those disorders themselves. There is probably more.
The purpose of those tests is not to ban a woman from having kids, but to give her another chance to give birth to a healthy kid.
It is a delicate question, sure, but many parents don't want their kids to inherit their health problems. 

[MultiMillionMiler]

Alright, how about this: A universal bill of rights specifically for people under the age of 21:

1. Ratification of the United Nations Convention of the Rights of the Child in the US.

2. Minimum age of adult criminal responsibility set at age 21 without exceptions

3. Child Marriage Banned (its just a legalized excuse to get around age of consent laws)

4.Remove the requirement for parental consent/minimum age limits to receive (or refuse) medical care/psychiatric treatment/contraception/prescription medication/surgery (too many states have laws that allow parents to refuse kids medical care against their will for personal belief/religious reasons)

5. Criminalize Corporal Punishment of children/minors, classifying it as felony/misdemeanor assault just as one would be charged for doing the same thing to an adult.

6. Mandate that all scheduling in society, in terms of work/school...etc, the ability to get full night sleeps is prioritized for people under the age of 21, due to the increased need for sleep for continuing brain development. In other words, companies would be required to give hour preferences to people under the age of 21 under the law.

7. Make any form of Child Abuse, not just sexual, a non-expungeable criminal offense on people's permanent records.

8. Ban cousin marriage, it's unbelievable that it is still allowed in some states, it's extremely selfish to risk genetic problems in offspring at any level that are avoidable. Things like drinking while pregnant should also be criminalized.

9. Lower the minimum compulsory education requirement to 10th grade, with the exception of math and science, and the high school drop out age from 16 to 15.

10. Enshrine a mandatory minimum family financial support statute, similar to the chart I posted earlier, into federal law, and lower the minimum age to access a custodial bank account from 21 to 15.

[Roadgeekteen]

Alright, how about this: A universal bill of rights specifically for people under the age of 21:

1. Ratification of the United Nations Convention of the Rights of the Child in the US.

2. Minimum age of adult criminal responsibility set at age 21 without exceptions

3. Child Marriage Banned (its just a legalized excuse to get around age of consent laws)

4.Remove the requirement for parental consent/minimum age limits to receive (or refuse) medical care/psychiatric treatment/contraception/prescription medication/surgery (too many states have laws that allow parents to refuse kids medical care against their will for personal belief/religious reasons)

5. Criminalize Corporal Punishment of children/minors, classifying it as felony/misdemeanor assault just as one would be charged for doing the same thing to an adult.

6. Mandate that all scheduling in society, in terms of work/school...etc, the ability to get full night sleeps is prioritized for people under the age of 21, due to the increased need for sleep for continuing brain development. In other words, companies would be required to give hour preferences to people under the age of 21 under the law.

7. Make any form of Child Abuse, not just sexual, a non-expungeable criminal offense on people's permanent records.

8. Ban cousin marriage, it's unbelievable that it is still allowed in some states, it's extremely selfish to risk genetic problems in offspring at any level that are avoidable. Things like drinking while pregnant should also be criminalized.

9. Lower the minimum compulsory education requirement to 10th grade, with the exception of math and science, and the high school drop out age from 16 to 15.

10. Enshrine a mandatory minimum family financial support statute, similar to the chart I posted earlier, into federal law, and lower the minimum age to access a custodial bank account from 21 to 15.

Some of these things are good ideas, but adulthood begins at 18, not 21.

[Max Rockatansky]

Eugenics is deliberately desining babies the way you want. I think that's ridiculous. I'm saying the number of babies coming out should be lower, period, certainly not that rich people should be able to choose the gender or hair/eye color of their offspring. Deleting harmful mental illness/physical illness generating genes, sure, but that's it. Nothing beyond that.

Deleting harmful mental illness/physical fitness genes is very much on brand with traditional fascist beliefs.

On the other hand, there are definitely legitimate medical services to test an unborn child for certain problems, and that can be the reason for abortion.
Down syndrome is one such test. Osteogenesis imperfect is another one, especially if parents have those disorders themselves. There is probably more.
The purpose of those tests is not to ban a woman from having kids, but to give her another chance to give birth to a healthy kid.
It is a delicate question, sure, but many parents don't want their kids to inherit their health problems.

Yes, to be clear I understand the concern in those circumstances is legitimate. I also understand why someone may conclude aborting the pregnancy as being the most viable option.

[MultiMillionMiler]

@roadgeekteen, fine, but then ALL adult privileges should be available at age 18, none should have to wait until 21. Including, drinking, gambling, renting hotel rooms, interstate trucking, accessing/opening a bank account, car insurance rates dropping to normal, running for political positions..etc

[Roadgeekteen]

@roadgeekteen, fine, but then ALL adult privileges should be available at age 18, none should have to wait until 21. Including, drinking, gambling, renting hotel rooms, interstate trucking, accessing/opening a bank account, car insurance rates dropping to normal, running for political positions..etc

I agree for the most part.

[jeffandnicole]

Alright, how about this: A universal bill of rights specifically for people under the age of 21:

1. Ratification of the United Nations Convention of the Rights of the Child in the US.

2. Minimum age of adult criminal responsibility set at age 21 without exceptions

3. Child Marriage Banned (its just a legalized excuse to get around age of consent laws)

4.Remove the requirement for parental consent/minimum age limits to receive (or refuse) medical care/psychiatric treatment/contraception/prescription medication/surgery (too many states have laws that allow parents to refuse kids medical care against their will for personal belief/religious reasons)

5. Criminalize Corporal Punishment of children/minors, classifying it as felony/misdemeanor assault just as one would be charged for doing the same thing to an adult.

6. Mandate that all scheduling in society, in terms of work/school...etc, the ability to get full night sleeps is prioritized for people under the age of 21, due to the increased need for sleep for continuing brain development. In other words, companies would be required to give hour preferences to people under the age of 21 under the law.

7. Make any form of Child Abuse, not just sexual, a non-expungeable criminal offense on people's permanent records.

8. Ban cousin marriage, it's unbelievable that it is still allowed in some states, it's extremely selfish to risk genetic problems in offspring at any level that are avoidable. Things like drinking while pregnant should also be criminalized.

9. Lower the minimum compulsory education requirement to 10th grade, with the exception of math and science, and the high school drop out age from 16 to 15.

10. Enshrine a mandatory minimum family financial support statute, similar to the chart I posted earlier, into federal law, and lower the minimum age to access a custodial bank account from 21 to 15.

Some of these things are good ideas, but adulthood begins at 18, not 21.

Yep.  If you want to insist Adulthood begins at 21, then we should take the right to vote away from children between 18 & 20.  And since they're children, it's probably unsafe for them to drive, so take away their ability to drive until they're 21.  Maybe take away their ability to access a gun until they're 21 also.  That includes hunting.  Also, they can't enter into contracts as kids, so they won't be able to own a house or car or rent anything by themselves, so it will be prohibited they live on their own until they're 21.  Numbers 9 and 10 should be the opposite:  Since they're kids, it's mandatory they remain in school until they're 21.  They can't have their own bank account until they're 21 either.

[Max Rockatansky]

@roadgeekteen, fine, but then ALL adult privileges should be available at age 18, none should have to wait until 21. Including, drinking, gambling, renting hotel rooms, interstate trucking, accessing/opening a bank account, car insurance rates dropping to normal, running for political positions..etc

I agree for the most part.

I don't disagree with any of that from the perspective of government authority.  However, things like rental car agencies not renting to people under 25 is a private business decision.