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[Hot Rod Hootenanny]

the question then is why dignify that disaster with I-70 signage?  Just take the 70 signs down, or slap TO banners over them.

There are no I-70 trailblazers anywhere on 30 between the two limited-access sections.

I think what Agentsteel may be referring to is this:

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=breezewood,+pa&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=27.976484,76.904297&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Breezewood,+Bedford,+Pennsylvania&ll=39.999093,-78.238803&spn=0.003296,0.009388&z=17&layer=c&cbll=39.999183,-78.238769&panoid=FBx_gt_LDz-dAVYlt6etpQ&cbp=12,37.17,,0,1.81

and

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=breezewood,+pa&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=27.976484,76.904297&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Breezewood,+Bedford,+Pennsylvania&ll=39.999454,-78.238707&spn=0.003296,0.009388&z=17&layer=c&cbll=39.99946,-78.238859&panoid=gQeKhPo2PjOHJZh50rMEIg&cbp=12,92.71,,0,6.23

and

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=breezewood,+pa&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=27.976484,76.904297&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Breezewood,+Bedford,+Pennsylvania&ll=39.999389,-78.236185&spn=0.003296,0.009388&z=17&layer=c&cbll=39.999386,-78.236063&panoid=r8jmjH9DiobAR1T57pYfrw&cbp=12,107.73,,0,-2.1

I-70 shields on a map versus I-70 shields in actual practice?!?

[InterstateNG]

I didn't know that fast food chains and DOT's were participants in the same market.

[agentsteel53]

There are no I-70 trailblazers anywhere on 30 between the two limited-access sections.

these green signs certainly indicate that I-70 is the mainline.

[agentsteel53]

Breezewood will become a ghost town

sounds good to me.  "Breezewood" sounds like a synonym for "tumbleweed" already.

[mightyace]

Breezewood will become a ghost town

Which IIRC, is what Breezewood was before this mess started.

What would probably happen if direct ramps were built and they bypassed Breezewood is that many of the businesses would relocate to a convenient exit on the new route say here:

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Breezewood,+PA&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=50.424342,49.921875&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Breezewood,+Bedford,+Pennsylvania&ll=39.9786,-78.245444&spn=0.01202,0.012188&t=h&z=16

So if we're gonna have to live with Government Pork on this, how about paying the business to relocate that can't afford to.  I'm not saying that we should, but it might be the only way to get this done.

[agentsteel53]

So if we're gonna have to live with Government Pork on this, how about paying the business to relocate that can't afford to.  I'm not saying that we should, but it might be the only way to get this done.

oh Hell no - Breezewood should be paying for the bypass out of their own pockets.  Every year since 1975 or so that they have been in business has been a gift.  Literally every other town-by-the-interstate in America has adapted.  Breezewood is nothing but an entitlement farm. 

[mightyace]

oh Hell no - Breezewood should be paying for the bypass out of their own pockets.  Every year since 1975 or so that they have been in business has been a gift.  Literally every other town-by-the-interstate in America has adapted.  Breezewood is nothing but an entitlement farm. 

I agree with you, they should pay.  I was just stating what my be one of the few practical, albeit distasteful, ways to resolve it.  (Devil's advocate.  )

[Mr_Northside]

these green signs certainly indicate that I-70 is the mainline.

They could add insult to injury and stick an Exit Tab on the US 30 BGS.

[mightyace]

They could add insult to injury and stick an Exit Tab on the US 30 BGS.

Oh, the agony! 

Let's not give them any ideas.

I just looked at Google Streetview and it doesn't look like the I-70 West "End" at US 30 is signed as an exit.

[PAHighways]

these green signs certainly indicate that I-70 is the mainline.

It's just a sign indicating which of the three lanes people should be in to make the turn onto 70, like there would be at any major junction.

Like I said, there are no 70 trailblazers along that section and as I've said many times, the SR designation for the Lincoln Highway is "SR 0030" not "SR 0070" which is what it would be using PennDOT's system of lowest number of highest classification to determine the SR.

[PAHighways]

What would probably happen if direct ramps were built and they bypassed Breezewood is that many of the businesses would relocate to a convenient exit on the new route say here:

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Breezewood,+PA&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=50.424342,49.921875&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Breezewood,+Bedford,+Pennsylvania&ll=39.9786,-78.245444&spn=0.01202,0.012188&t=h&z=16

They wouldn't move and wouldn't need to considering people know Breezewood is a mile-long service plaza.

[agentsteel53]

It's just a sign indicating which of the three lanes people should be in to make the turn onto 70, like there would be at any major junction.

well, that far back, it should be signed with a "to".  The distant sign with the arrow left is fine without a "to", but the one in the immediate foreground, if it is to be interpreted as a trailblazer, should be signed as "to I-70", otherwise the implication is that - bizarrely enough - you are on I-70.

the last green sign on the eastbound freeway segment is "west US-30 to east I-70".  That is correct if I-70 is not on that surface street.

[exit322]

I know it's worse, but I see this much like I see the "interchange" between the Pike and I-81 in Carlisle.  Another mile-long service plaza.

[Alps]

Like I said, there are no 70 trailblazers along that section and as I've said many times, the SR designation for the Lincoln Highway is "SR 0030" not "SR 0070" which is what it would be using PennDOT's system of lowest number of highest classification to determine the SR.

Are you saying PennDOT never screws up?  I would assume that I-70 is not a discontiguous highway, therefore it must follow US 30.  Because it's not up to Interstate standards, it doesn't surprise me that this segment would still be numbered 0030.

[exit322]

Could also go with the thought that it's numbered 30 because it was 30 before 70 was even around?  Not sure when PA put in the "SR 0030" type numbers together.

[PAHighways]

well, that far back, it should be signed with a "to".  The distant sign with the arrow left is fine without a "to", but the one in the immediate foreground, if it is to be interpreted as a trailblazer, should be signed as "to I-70", otherwise the implication is that - bizarrely enough - you are on I-70.

It's only about 500 feet from the intersection which is less distance than other locations of guides or gantries on two intersecting roads, end of a multiplex or not.

[PAHighways]

Are you saying PennDOT never screws up?  I would assume that I-70 is not a discontiguous highway, therefore it must follow US 30.  Because it's not up to Interstate standards, it doesn't surprise me that this segment would still be numbered 0030.

No, but they are consistent when it comes to cataloging roads.  There is also no classification for the old Turnpike segment between 76 and 30 which would be a 2 1/2 mile "gap" of 70 between 76 and the 30/70 intersection.  In addition, the PTC signs the Breezewood Interchange as "30 TO 70 EAST" rather than "70 EAST 30" or "70 EAST TO 30."

[PAHighways]

Could also go with the thought that it's numbered 30 because it was 30 before 70 was even around?  Not sure when PA put in the "SR 0030" type numbers together.

The SR (State Route) system replaced the archaic LR (Legislative Route) system in 1985.

[J N Winkler]

Some thoughts:

*  Is the (notional) Breezewood connection still on the Interstate system as chargeable mileage?  If it is and if it were built, would it be eligible for Interstate Construction funds at the traditional 90% federal, 10% state ratio?

*  Does Breezewood have formal status as a "temporary routing" of I-70?

*  Interstate designations are a FHWA/AASHTO function, while route numbering and logging is a state function.  PennDOT therefore does not have to satisfy an external requirement to use "SR 0070" mileposting through Breezewood even if it is considered a temporary routing of I-70.  Similarly, if the Breezewood connection were built as a US 30 relocation and incorporated into the Interstate system as a built length of I-70, FHWA and AASHTO won't care if PennDOT milepoints it as SR 0030.  Business 80 in Sacramento is on point here.

[english si]

Given WV plan on extending I-68 to Wheeling, when (if) they do, could the powers that be push for I-70 to go on the continuous interstate route, taking the route out of PA, unless Breezewood is sorted, in a blackmail PA/Breezewood to sort themselves out kind of way?

You'd have to have a 3di up old I-70 to Breezewood, plus the bit to the south of Pittsburg. The cost of resigning would probably be as much as adding two ramps to the south of Breezewood, but it might force something to be done.

[sammack]

It's criminal.  I'm sick and tired of crybaby companies that want to maintain the status quo to maintain their bottom line.

Notice to crybaby companies: we live in a free market system (well, we're supposed to).  You adapt to your environment.  If you can't adapt, YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO DIE.  Live with it.

"money is the mother's milk of politics"

My guess would be said businesses in Breezewood have the money.

As long as they have the money as well as power to control the local politics, no matter how much you rant, it will never change.

[mightyace]

"money is the mother's milk of politics"

My guess would be said businesses in Breezewood have the money.

As long as they have the money as well as power to control the local politics, no matter how much you rant, it will never change.

That's why I made my suggestion of basically "bribing" the businesses in Breezewood to allow a better connection to be built.   (A practical but not necessarily moral matter of getting things accomplished.)

[sammack]

"money is the mother's milk of politics"

My guess would be said businesses in Breezewood have the money.

As long as they have the money as well as power to control the local politics, no matter how much you rant, it will never change.

That's why I made my suggestion of basically "bribing" the businesses in Breezewood to allow a better connection to be built.   (A practical but not necessarily moral matter of getting things accomplished.)

As long as they have the attitude that a direct connection would cause them to "dry up"  be assured no amount of money will change it.

For the most part the history of building the interstate hwy system, hundreds of towns were bypassed.  Towns like Tucumcari used billboards hundreds of miles from the town "Tucumcari Tonight".

It appears to be a simple matter.  A flyover from "nb" I-70 to the tpk entrance and a simple ramp connection from the tpk entrance to "sb" I-70.  Not really that expensive. My guess would be the row is either already owned by PENNDOT or the PTC.

But no matter, as long as the town has the political power they do as has been so aptly stated over and over again, 20-30-40 years from now, it will be the same.

As an aside, I will not buy gas there as their gas prices are much higher then PGH or Hburg.

[froggie]

It appears to be a simple matter.  A flyover from "nb" I-70 to the tpk entrance and a simple ramp connection from the tpk entrance to "sb" I-70.  Not really that expensive. My guess would be the row is either already owned by PENNDOT or the PTC.

It's not that easy.  While the right-of-way is there, the topography of the area would make building the connections as you suggest very difficult, and a lot more expensive than you'd think.

[Hot Rod Hootenanny]

It appears to be a simple matter.  A flyover from "nb" I-70 to the tpk entrance and a simple ramp connection from the tpk entrance to "sb" I-70.  Not really that expensive. My guess would be the row is either already owned by PENNDOT or the PTC.

It's not that easy.  While the right-of-way is there, the topography of the area would make building the connections as you suggest very difficult, and a lot more expensive than you'd think.

Was it Micheal Koerner who drew up a map of a proposed "Breezewood fix?" Mind you I'm talking about 10-12 years ago when he did this.