Mandated HOV-3+ returning to Manhattan

[empirestate]

Wait, the HOV-3 restriction is about bus flow?  I thought it was about forcing carpools to replace the subway.

I read it a bit differently...because the subways were out of service, they wanted to make driving into an equally unsatisfactory option so that people would tend not to replace subway service with private vehicle commuting; i.e., they'd just stay home.

Basically, the same idea, just stating the motivation a little differently.

[deathtopumpkins]

Clearly I don't understand the NYC driving culture.  If they want to regulate how much traffic is in Manhattan, they have some pretty big holes now.  If I wanted to drive solo in, I'd just go around.  It would be like enforcing a HOV road by placing a cop car at one entrance ramp and announcing to the world that that is all the enforcement you're doing - violators would just go around.

It sounds like you don't realize that Manhattan is an island, i.e. you can't just drive around the checkpoint.

Coming from the west there are exactly 3 ways to enter Manhattan: The Lincoln Tunnel, the Holland Tunnel, and the GWB. That's only 3 checkpoints and the entire state of New Jersey is cut off. Then on the east side you have the Williamsburg, Manhattan, and Brooklyn Bridges (the Battery and Queens-Midtown Tunnels are closed), plus the Queensboro Bridge, so only 4 ways to enter Manhattan from Queens and Brooklyn (without going through the Bronx). Admittedly there are 11 bridges between the Bronx and Manhattan, many of them just city streets, so that edge would be harder to actually enforce, but that's still less than 20 crossings into Manhattan, and a fair number of them would involve going significantly out of your way to avoid the major ones. So it's really not that difficult to enforce.

[vdeane]

Clearly I don't understand the NYC driving culture.  If they want to regulate how much traffic is in Manhattan, they have some pretty big holes now.  If I wanted to drive solo in, I'd just go around.  It would be like enforcing a HOV road by placing a cop car at one entrance ramp and announcing to the world that that is all the enforcement you're doing - violators would just go around.

It sounds like you don't realize that Manhattan is an island, i.e. you can't just drive around the checkpoint.

Coming from the west there are exactly 3 ways to enter Manhattan: The Lincoln Tunnel, the Holland Tunnel, and the GWB. That's only 3 checkpoints and the entire state of New Jersey is cut off. Then on the east side you have the Williamsburg, Manhattan, and Brooklyn Bridges (the Battery and Queens-Midtown Tunnels are closed), plus the Queensboro Bridge, so only 4 ways to enter Manhattan from Queens and Brooklyn (without going through the Bronx). Admittedly there are 11 bridges between the Bronx and Manhattan, many of them just city streets, so that edge would be harder to actually enforce, but that's still less than 20 crossings into Manhattan, and a fair number of them would involve going significantly out of your way to avoid the major ones. So it's really not that difficult to enforce.

They rescinded the order at 5 PM local time today (Friday).

I believe that only applies to the Lincoln Tunnel.  Other crossings that were restricted to HOV-3 remain restricted.

The Lincoln HAS NO CHECKPOINT.  Thus the drivers can go around the checkpoints on other crossings.

[Alps]

The GWB has no checkpoint either. There was a checkpoint on the Henry Hudson, and possibly the FDR, but no way could they enforce on every avenue. Take the first exit and just head down an avenue, problem solved.

[jeffandnicole]

It sounds like you don't realize that Manhattan is an island, i.e. you can't just drive around the checkpoint.

Actually, it's a peninsula - there's no water on the north side of Manhattan.

It sounds like you don't realize that Manhattan is an island, i.e. you can't just drive around the checkpoint.

Actually, it's a peninsula - there's no water on the north side of Manhattan.

Clearly I don't understand the NYC driving culture.  If they want to regulate how much traffic is in Manhattan, they have some pretty big holes now.  If I wanted to drive solo in, I'd just go around.  It would be like enforcing a HOV road by placing a cop car at one entrance ramp and announcing to the world that that is all the enforcement you're doing - violators would just go around.

It sounds like you don't realize that Manhattan is an island, i.e. you can't just drive around the checkpoint.

Coming from the west there are exactly 3 ways to enter Manhattan: The Lincoln Tunnel, the Holland Tunnel, and the GWB. That's only 3 checkpoints and the entire state of New Jersey is cut off. Then on the east side you have the Williamsburg, Manhattan, and Brooklyn Bridges (the Battery and Queens-Midtown Tunnels are closed), plus the Queensboro Bridge, so only 4 ways to enter Manhattan from Queens and Brooklyn (without going through the Bronx). Admittedly there are 11 bridges between the Bronx and Manhattan, many of them just city streets, so that edge would be harder to actually enforce, but that's still less than 20 crossings into Manhattan, and a fair number of them would involve going significantly out of your way to avoid the major ones. So it's really not that difficult to enforce.

They rescinded the order at 5 PM local time today (Friday).

I believe that only applies to the Lincoln Tunnel.  Other crossings that were restricted to HOV-3 remain restricted.

The Lincoln HAS NO CHECKPOINT.  Thus the drivers can go around the checkpoints on other crossings.

A little confused there...Yes, the checkpoint at the Lincoln was lifted Friday.

While the bridges/tunnels aren't too far away from each other, the time to drive to and from them can literally be an hour or more.  So for someone to want to skip the checkpoint would involve a lot of congestion.  Can it be done?  Sure.  Are most people familiar with NYC going to bother?  No.

[deathtopumpkins]

It sounds like you don't realize that Manhattan is an island, i.e. you can't just drive around the checkpoint.

Actually, it's a peninsula - there's no water on the north side of Manhattan.

It sounds like you don't realize that Manhattan is an island, i.e. you can't just drive around the checkpoint.

Actually, it's a peninsula - there's no water on the north side of Manhattan.

Then what's this bluish brown stuff all these bridges cross over? http://goo.gl/maps/QvZO5

It sounds like you don't realize that Manhattan is an island, i.e. you can't just drive around the checkpoint.

Actually, it's a peninsula - there's no water on the north side of Manhattan.

It sounds like you don't realize that Manhattan is an island, i.e. you can't just drive around the checkpoint.

Actually, it's a peninsula - there's no water on the north side of Manhattan.

Then what's this bluish brown stuff all these bridges cross over? http://goo.gl/maps/QvZO5

[vdeane]

The GWB has no checkpoint either. There was a checkpoint on the Henry Hudson, and possibly the FDR, but no way could they enforce on every avenue. Take the first exit and just head down an avenue, problem solved.

Quite understandable, since the GWB mostly servers thru traffic to the Bronx.

[empirestate]

It sounds like you don't realize that Manhattan is an island, i.e. you can't just drive around the checkpoint.

Actually, it's a peninsula - there's no water on the north side of Manhattan.

It certainly is an island (otherwise, Circle Line would be in hot water for falsely advertising a cruise around it!). The confusion may arise from the fact that there is a land border with the Bronx at Marble Hill, the island's original margin.

And don't worry, around here everyone knows Long Island is also a peninsula.

[SidS1045]

Actually, it's a peninsula - there's no water on the north side of Manhattan.

Google "Harlem River" to see why you're wrong.

[empirestate]

Actually, it's a peninsula - there's no water on the north side of Manhattan.

Google "Harlem River" to see why you're wrong.

More specifically, Harlem River Ship Canal.

[jeffandnicole]

Yeah, I see now.  Never noticed that little river there.