Tolling Non-Freeways

[PColumbus73]

Would it be feasible to open-road toll non-freeway divided highways? I had an idea to toll US 17 in the Myrtle Beach area. Honestly, it's more of me complaining about tourists and slow-pokes on US 17. But what if there electronic tolling gantries placed at locations where shun-piking would add enough time and and inconvenience that it would encourage traffic to use the highway all together?

Using US 17 as an example and place toll gantries:

Near Glenns Bay / Holmestown Rd intersection (future interchange)

Just north of the SC 544 interchange

Between SC 707 and Harrelson Blvd

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.5878148,-79.0286562,15z

I can see this possibly working on a highway like US 17 because trying to go around toll booths would require lengthy detours.

[kalvado]

And what exactly you want to achieve with the tolls?
More money? May not work exactly like you expect.
Penalize locals? Always a good idea...

[1995hoo]

Osceola Parkway.

[hotdogPi]

And what exactly you want to achieve with the tolls?

A loophole in the 24th amendment.

[NE2]

Osceola Parkway.

Which is essentially a toll bridge over Shingle Creek (plus some ramp tolls that can be avoided by U-turning at a new subdivision entrance).

[Max Rockatansky]

Card Sound Road down in the Florida Keys is a County Toll Road, granted I know the concept you are talking about isn't the same.  Basically it's the old alignment of Florida 4A which Monroe County took over and rebuilt.  Great alternate if you really can't stand all the BS that takes places on US 1 through the 18 Mile Stretch, totally worth the $1 dollar to get over the Card Sound Bridge.

Funny, this actually used to be a big concept on early automotive roadways or even back to wagon roads.  Out here in California you have a ton of roads that have "Old Toll Road" or some variant of that all over the place. 

[NE2]

Card Sound Road down in the Florida Keys is a County Toll Road

Er no. It's a toll bridge with free approaches.

[Bickendan]

This was the idea behind the Newberg-Dundee Bypass. IIRC they realized they'd have to toll OR 99W as well or kill the tolls completely because everyone would shunpike to avoid the tolls, thus completely defeating the idea behind the bypass to begin with.

[epzik8]

Well, up in Maryland the Nice Bridge over the Potomac River along the non-freeway U.S. 301 is tolled. So is U.S. 40's Hatem Bridge over the Susquehanna River. So yes, there are tolled segments of non-freeways.

[plain]

Like this one in Utah?

https://goo.gl/maps/xTvfmNcco692

[PHLBOS]

Well, up in Maryland the Nice Bridge over the Potomac River along the non-freeway U.S. 301 is tolled. So is U.S. 40's Hatem Bridge over the Susquehanna River. So yes, there are tolled segments of non-freeways.

Tolled water crossings, yes; toll roads themselves, no.

[jeffandnicole]

Would it be feasible to open-road toll non-freeway divided highways? I had an idea to toll US 17 in the Myrtle Beach area. Honestly, it's more of me complaining about tourists and slow-pokes on US 17. But what if there electronic tolling gantries placed at locations where shun-piking would add enough time and and inconvenience that it would encourage traffic to use the highway all together?

Using US 17 as an example and place toll gantries:

Near Glenns Bay / Holmestown Rd intersection (future interchange)

Just north of the SC 544 interchange

Between SC 707 and Harrelson Blvd

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.5878148,-79.0286562,15z

I can see this possibly working on a highway like US 17 because trying to go around toll booths would require lengthy detours.

So you're solution is to have the tourists and slowpokes use the free Business 17, allowing the locals the ability to pay a toll?

Please - bring that up at a local resident meeting.  Bring your own ton of bricks.

[TXtoNJ]

Funny, this actually used to be a big concept on early automotive roadways or even back to wagon roads.  Out here in California you have a ton of roads that have "Old Toll Road" or some variant of that all over the place. 

There are plenty of roads called "(Something) Pike" up in the Northeast. They all were turnpikes at some point. Most highways were until the 20th Century - intercity travel was infrequent enough that it would have been a waste of tax dollars to pay for construction and maintenance for anything other than post roads, while rail travel was much faster, safer (less risk of banditry), and more comfortable before macadamized roads and pneumatic shock absorption.

[vdeane]

It depends on how easy the toll is to shunpike.  In fact, part of the Move NY plan was to toll every north-south street across Manhattan to create a zone that one would have to pay a congestion fee to enter.

[PColumbus73]

Would it be feasible to open-road toll non-freeway divided highways? I had an idea to toll US 17 in the Myrtle Beach area. Honestly, it's more of me complaining about tourists and slow-pokes on US 17. But what if there electronic tolling gantries placed at locations where shun-piking would add enough time and and inconvenience that it would encourage traffic to use the highway all together?

Using US 17 as an example and place toll gantries:

Near Glenns Bay / Holmestown Rd intersection (future interchange)

Just north of the SC 544 interchange

Between SC 707 and Harrelson Blvd

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.5878148,-79.0286562,15z

I can see this possibly working on a highway like US 17 because trying to go around toll booths would require lengthy detours.

So you're solution is to have the tourists and slowpokes use the free Business 17, allowing the locals the ability to pay a toll?

Please - bring that up at a local resident meeting.  Bring your own ton of bricks.

This was a hypothetical idea of mine while grumbling in rush hour traffic. In reality, this would go over like a lead balloon, but it got me thinking about the concept of tolling non-freeways.

Myrtle Beach has only 2 major arteries (US 17 and US 501) which get congested during the summer. Adding open-road tolling (and toll-by-plate) onto US 501 could encourage tourists to use the toll-free SC 22, which is a freeway for it's entire length. Same for US 17, adding ORT with toll-by-plate could encourage people to use SC 31, which is also a freeway.

vdeane: I think New York was trying to do what London does with 'congestion charging', which basically tolls all entry-points into the London area.

[Rothman]

vdeane: I think New York was trying to do what London does with 'congestion charging', which basically tolls all entry-points into the London area.

That was exactly the idea.  Now that Sadik-Khan is no longer with NYCDOT, the idea seems to have stalled.

KHAAAAAAAN!!!

[SteveG1988]

WV Turnpike, two lanes until the 80s. Tolled road.

[vdeane]

My understanding was that NYC was going to use a flat rate fee, so it wouldn't be true congestion pricing.

[NE2]

WV Turnpike, two lanes until the 80s. Tolled road.

Still a freeway.

[Brandon]

WV Turnpike, two lanes until the 80s. Tolled road.

A better choice might have been the Daniel Boone Parkway in Kentucky.  Maybe someone (HB?) can correct me, but did that not have at-grade intersections while it was tolled?

[Avalanchez71]

I don't remember at grades.  Maybe HB can advise.

[plain]

WV Turnpike, two lanes until the 80s. Tolled road.

A better choice might have been the Daniel Boone Parkway in Kentucky.  Maybe someone (HB?) can correct me, but did that not have at-grade intersections while it was tolled?

Yes, it had at-grade intersections at two of its toll plazas. Interesting setup too

[hbelkins]

At-grades for the first few miles at both ends (London and Hazard.) The toll booth intersections at KY 118 and KY 66 were at-grades. I haven't looked to see if any aerial photos exist of the setup, but I have photos of the toll booths and the interchange setups at http://millenniumhwy.net/oldtollbooths/danielboone.html.

Now that the tolls have been removed, a few at-grades have been added in Leslie, Clay and Laurel counties. And there are plans in the works to build a couple of interchanges in Perry County.

Because of the at-grades that have been added, I would no longer classify the Hal Rogers (Daniel Boone) as a super-2.