On the future of rest areas

[GCrites]

I don't think the analysis has been performed on a nationwide basis. Unfortunately it would require someone with greater resources than me. A bunch of anecdotes will not suffice since for every Southern highway expansion in popular areas such as Georgia, the Carolinas and Florida that people point to there are tons of Appalachian and Midwestern ones that didn't help.

[hbelkins]

I don't find GCrites' argument to hold much water.  I am thinking of I-79, which my family drove multiple times from Morgantown to Charleston.  It has definitely built up over time, at least on the northern half.

Still pretty desolate between Elkview and Flatwoods. And also between Flatwoods and Weston. From Weston northward, there's quite a bit, but you're going through three decent-sized towns (Clarksburg, Fairmont, and Morgantown).

I haven't really thought about which "side"  I'm on for this, but as a born and bred New Jerseyan, the whole idea of non-commercialized rest areas is so foreign to me. Whenever I travel out of state and invariably end up looking for a rest area, I'm always shocked by the existence of these tiny little buildings with maybe a vending machine off of a major highway. Maybe I'm jus spoiled. But I almost feel... safer at a big, commercialized, populated service plaza than those little pull offs I stopped at in Virginia, for instance. And while we laugh about the cost of Turnpike gas in Jersey, at least shmucks like me who push it down to fumes sometimes are not likely to run out of gas on the turnpike, whereas I can see that being an issue on giant interstates through huge rural areas.

That's true on the toll roads, but the free interstates have standard rest areas instead of service places (or had; I know Jersey closed a lot of their rest areas after the governor got caught trolling for boyfriends at one).

[J3ebrules]

I don't find GCrites' argument to hold much water.  I am thinking of I-79, which my family drove multiple times from Morgantown to Charleston.  It has definitely built up over time, at least on the northern half.

I haven't really thought about which "side"  I'm on for this, but as a born and bred New Jerseyan, the whole idea of non-commercialized rest areas is so foreign to me. Whenever I travel out of state and invariably end up looking for a rest area, I'm always shocked by the existence of these tiny little buildings with maybe a vending machine off of a major highway. Maybe I'm jus spoiled. But I almost feel... safer at a big, commercialized, populated service plaza than those little pull offs I stopped at in Virginia, for instance. And while we laugh about the cost of Turnpike gas in Jersey, at least shmucks like me who push it down to fumes sometimes are not likely to run out of gas on the turnpike, whereas I can see that being an issue on giant interstates through huge rural areas.

That's true on the toll roads, but the free interstates have standard rest areas instead of service places (or had; I know Jersey closed a lot of their rest areas after the governor got caught trolling for boyfriends at one).

Wait what? If you're talking about McGreevy, he helped himself to his unpaid interns... a lot of them closed for remodeling because they were from the 50's and 60's, a few for getting simply insufficient traffic (the two on the Turnpike Extension, but that was in the 90's), and then the two on I295. And as for the latter, I think you're onto something with thinking about toll roads versus free interstates, although I can't figure out how that would matter. The turnpike's tolls pay for its own maintenance, policing, and emergency services. You think because they're owned by the state and don't get federal funds, so they have more leeway to contract with private companies, maybe?

[Beltway]

The newest portion of I-95 in Virginia, an upgrade of previous 4-lane non-limited-access US-301 between Emporia and Petersburg was completed in the 1980s, and despite most of the crossroads widening out to 4-lanes at the interchanges in anticipation for growth, only the interchange at Exit 33 - VA-602 - has seen any real developments. The rest are empty, surrounded by farmland and forest as they were when it was built.

The topic was services ... mainly fuel, and of the 8 interchanges on that 28-mile section, the only two that don't have any are at VA-645 Exit 24 and US-301 Exit 17.  And I think all of the stations have at least some convenience store products such as packaged food items.

Only 3 of the crossroads widen out to 4 lanes and briefly.   That segment goes thru some very rural areas, and Sussex County has only about 11,300 population today and has 493 square miles.

[GCrites]

That's why it is the role of the public sector to provide restroom, water, vending and
truck parking facilities to areas that the private sector sees no opportunity for profit -- through rest areas.

[D-Dey65]

I haven't really thought about which "side"  I'm on for this, but as a born and bred New Jerseyan, the whole idea of non-commercialized rest areas is so foreign to me. Whenever I travel out of state and invariably end up looking for a rest area, I'm always shocked by the existence of these tiny little buildings with maybe a vending machine off of a major highway. Maybe I'm jus spoiled. But I almost feel... safer at a big, commercialized, populated service plaza than those little pull offs I stopped at in Virginia, for instance. And while we laugh about the cost of Turnpike gas in Jersey, at least shmucks like me who push it down to fumes sometimes are not likely to run out of gas on the turnpike, whereas I can see that being an issue on giant interstates through huge rural areas.

Being an ex-Long Islander, I was pretty envious of those tiny little buildings with vending machines and actual restrooms off of major highways the first time I saw them, let alone the huge commercialized rest areas on the New Jersey Turnpike and other toll roads that you're so used to. We may have had gas stations in the medians on the parkways but they were for cars only. On roads like the Long Island Expressway, Sunrise Highway, and even NY 24, all we had were those pull-off areas, occasionally with picnic tables and public grilles. After this, I spent much of my youth wondering why we can't have anything like what you have on Long Island... or even the ones they had on I-95 south of DC.

[kalvado]

While there are notable exceptions, I'm confident that an analysis of lane-miles vs. economic development dollars adjusted for inflation would highly favor road expansions performed before 1980 on a nationwide basis.

Can easily be a reverse dependence. Routes with higher demand potential were built first and attracted more business, while less premium ones have less funding priority and less attractiveness.

[Rothman]

I don't find GCrites' argument to hold much water.  I am thinking of I-79, which my family drove multiple times from Morgantown to Charleston.  It has definitely built up over time, at least on the northern half.

Still pretty desolate between Elkview and Flatwoods. And also between Flatwoods and Weston. From Weston northward, there's quite a bit, but you're going through three decent-sized towns (Clarksburg, Fairmont, and Morgantown).

Sure, but those decent-sized towns were not so decent-sized in the 1980s, at least within view of I-79.  The development, especially around Clarksburg and Fairmont, has been very, very noticeable and attributable to the building of I-79.

[jeffandnicole]

I don't think it was ever envisioned that every single exit along the interstates would see development.  Some interchanges were built to accept additional traffic, but to think that there would be some sort of metro area at every interchange is well beyond what was ever projected.

I haven't really thought about which "side"  I'm on for this, but as a born and bred New Jerseyan, the whole idea of non-commercialized rest areas is so foreign to me. Whenever I travel out of state and invariably end up looking for a rest area, I'm always shocked by the existence of these tiny little buildings with maybe a vending machine off of a major highway. Maybe I'm jus spoiled. But I almost feel... safer at a big, commercialized, populated service plaza than those little pull offs I stopped at in Virginia, for instance. And while we laugh about the cost of Turnpike gas in Jersey, at least shmucks like me who push it down to fumes sometimes are not likely to run out of gas on the turnpike, whereas I can see that being an issue on giant interstates through huge rural areas.

That's true on the toll roads, but the free interstates have standard rest areas instead of service places (or had; I know Jersey closed a lot of their rest areas after the governor got caught trolling for boyfriends at one).

Wait what? If you're talking about McGreevy, he helped himself to his unpaid interns... a lot of them closed for remodeling because they were from the 50's and 60's, a few for getting simply insufficient traffic (the two on the Turnpike Extension, but that was in the 90's), and then the two on I295. And as for the latter, I think you're onto something with thinking about toll roads versus free interstates, although I can't figure out how that would matter. The turnpike's tolls pay for its own maintenance, policing, and emergency services. You think because they're owned by the state and don't get federal funds, so they have more leeway to contract with private companies, maybe?

You're confusing the two.

Rest Areas are literally that - a place to rest for a few minutes.  They have bathrooms, maybe a tourist assistance area, and a few vending machines. 

You're mostly referring to Service Plazas, which have gas, food, a service station to repair your vehicle, and other things found in a rest area.

No governor had anything to do with the service plazas on the NJ Turnpike.  That's up to the NJTA to decide what they wanted opened or closed. 

I'm pretty sure McGreevey was caught with a boyfriend on the beach in Cape May, not lurking around the rest areas.  Their closure had nothing to do with his sexual preferences.

Basically, country-wide, if a service plaza existed before the Interstate Highway system was created, they were allowed to remain.  Connecticut is a perfect example of this.  So is Delaware and Maryland, where one can easily get to their service plazas and exit the roadway without paying a toll.

I'm a life-long NJ resident, and not surprised whatsoever when I only encounter rest areas in other states. 

[kalvado]

I don't think it was ever envisioned that every single exit along the interstates would see development.  Some interchanges were built to accept additional traffic, but to think that there would be some sort of metro area at every interchange is well beyond what was ever projected.

I would think about I-65 between Chicago and Indy. While no large metro areas, density of travel plazas at exits is impressive... I assume supply and demand are at work. 

[GCrites]

While there are notable exceptions, I'm confident that an analysis of lane-miles vs. economic development dollars adjusted for inflation would highly favor road expansions performed before 1980 on a nationwide basis.

Can easily be a reverse dependence. Routes with higher demand potential were built first and attracted more business, while less premium ones have less funding priority and less attractiveness.

Yes. The controls that were established early were the important ones and, for the most part, continue to be the important ones today.

[PHLBOS]

Rest Areas are literally that - a place to rest for a few minutes.  They have bathrooms, maybe a tourist assistance area, and a few vending machines.

What you're describing is more of a state's Welcome Centers that are typically located in Rest Areas.  I'm not sure of NJ, but many Rest Areas in other states at least in MA are just simply just a parking lot with maybe a picnic table or two and typically don't have sanitary facilities (not even porta-johns).

This bare-bones Rest Area along I-84 eastbound in Sturbridge, MA is signed as both a Picnic Area as well as a Rest Area.

In addition to Service Plazas, the PA Turnpike (at least the East-West Turnpike) used to have pull-off areas with a picnic table/bench or two.  Those have since been converted to Emergency Stopping/Pull-Off spots.

I'm pretty sure McGreevey was caught with a boyfriend on the beach in Cape May, not lurking around the rest areas.  Their closure had nothing to do with his sexual preferences.

IIRC, those Rest Area closures occurred in 2003/during the McGreevey Administration due to funding issues.  Such included the infamous Howard Stern Rest Stop (dedicated in 1995) along I-295 northbound in Springfield Township, Burlington County..

Basically, country-wide, if a service plaza existed before the Interstate Highway system was created, they were allowed to remain.

In short, grandfathered. 

Connecticut is a perfect example of this.  So is Delaware and Maryland, where one can easily get to their service plazas and exit the roadway without paying a toll.

In MA, such grandfathering wasn't just for toll roads that received Interstate designations either from the get-go or years later; several free highways in MA had Service Areas/Plazas that were allowed to stay even after such received Interstate designations years later.  Two of such that are still remaining (more on that below) are the ones along the portion of MA 128 that's now part of I-95 in Newton & Lexington. 

However, if such highway was widened and overhauled; the service plazas were usually eliminated.  The mid-70s overhaul of I-95 between Topsfield & Newburyport (originally constructed as Relocated US 1 in the 1950s) eliminated all Rest Areas as well as Service Areas.  Note: the Weigh Stations between the MA 97/Exit 53 & MA 133/Exit 54 interchanges were added during the 1980s.  When the Southeast Expressway, originally built in the 1950s & designated as I-93 since 1975, underwent a full-blown overhaul during the mid-80s; the Service Plaza in Braintree, just north of the Split that included a Howard Johnson's, was torn down.

To my knowledge, two free non-Interstate highways in eastern MA still have Service Areas/Plazas: MA 24 has two of them, one on each side, at the I-495 interchange in Bridgewater and MA 128 northbound in Beverly just beyond Exit 19 (Sohier Rd./Brimbal Ave.) has one as well.

[Brandon]

Rest Areas are literally that - a place to rest for a few minutes.  They have bathrooms, maybe a tourist assistance area, and a few vending machines.

What you're describing is more of a state's Welcome Centers that are typically located in Rest Areas.  I'm not sure of NJ, but many Rest Areas in other states are just simply just a parking lot with maybe a picnic table or two and typically don't have sanitary facilities (not even porta-johns).

This bare-bones Rest Area along I-84 eastbound in Sturbridge, MA is signed as both a Picnic Area as well as a Rest Area.

Actually, that's quite common for a rest area west of the Appalachians.  You have restrooms, a parking area, some picnic tables, vending machines, and a bit of tourist information.  A welcome center typically has a staff running it and far more tourist information.  And, believe it or not, these are actually open 24/7, unlike in the Northeast, where I guess they expect you to use a port-a-potty after banker's hours.

Examples:
Illinois: https://goo.gl/maps/FwTfbNz7Ss865SUs5 Three Rivers westbound on I-80.
Indiana: https://goo.gl/maps/GrxAmJYPdk8sN19H8 & https://goo.gl/maps/zDzEug959UojjBw89 I-94 westbound, the hut off to the side is for the vending machines.
Wisconsin: https://goo.gl/maps/pSvWRzXDtG4tHECX8 Portage eastbound on I-90/94 (& I-39).
Michigan: https://goo.gl/maps/RntJWBGYfV6zb7e59 Galesburg, westbound on I-94.
Iowa: https://goo.gl/maps/jYLPNbPUCj9FG18V7 Davenport, I-80 westbound (not the welcome center - that's the next rest area after I-280 merges in).
Missouri: https://goo.gl/maps/XcHUzMaN1QfZ21GB9 St. Clair, I-44.
Minnesota: https://goo.gl/maps/qpLMSFCFNDp138gGA Cass Lake, US-2.

[PHLBOS]

A welcome center typically has a staff running it and far more tourist information.  And, believe it or not, these are actually open 24/7, unlike in the Northeast, where I guess they expect you to use a port-a-potty after banker's hours.

That debacle in CT has thankfully been rescinded; shortly after Lamont become Governor.  At least the bathroom portion of the Welcome Centers are now open 24/7 again.

[GaryV]

In Michigan, rest areas started as having pit toilets in an outhouse - just a little bit glorified from the one out back of the farmhouse with the moon cutout on the door.  When I was a kid and we traveled to Florida in the winter, we tried our best to "hold it" until we reached Indiana.

Some time in the 70's or maybe still late 60's we started getting indoor bathrooms.  The one pictured from Galesburg above looks like it's probably the 2nd or 3rd generation style of buildings.  Often these will have a rack with tourist brochures.

Michigan Welcome Centers are located along 4 freeways near the IN and OH border with access and parking similar to rest areas, at the first exit on I-75 south in Sault Ste Marie, and along 3 US or State highways coming in from WS.  There are also some "welcome" centers in the interior of the State - in the median of US-10/US-127 near Clare, along US-41 east of Marquette, and at both St Ignace (rest area type access) and Mackinaw City (exit).  These have attended (daytime) desks where you can ask for information, and extensive racks of tourist info.

Edit:  None of the centers have restaurants or gas stations.

[vdeane]

To my knowledge, two free non-Interstate highways in eastern MA still have Service Areas/Plazas: MA 24 has two of them, one on each side, at the I-495 interchange in Bridgewater and MA 128 northbound in Beverly just beyond Exit 19 (Sohier Rd./Brimbal Ave.) has one as well.

There's also one on MA 3 around Plymouth.

[roadman]

To my knowledge, two free non-Interstate highways in eastern MA still have Service Areas/Plazas: MA 24 has two of them, one on each side, at the I-495 interchange in Bridgewater and MA 128 northbound in Beverly just beyond Exit 19 (Sohier Rd./Brimbal Ave.) has one as well.

There's also one on MA 3 around Plymouth.

Within the Long Pond Road (Exit 5) interchange to be exact.

[jeffandnicole]

Rest Areas are literally that - a place to rest for a few minutes.  They have bathrooms, maybe a tourist assistance area, and a few vending machines.

What you're describing is more of a state's Welcome Centers that are typically located in Rest Areas.  I'm not sure of NJ, but many Rest Areas in other states are just simply just a parking lot with maybe a picnic table or two and typically don't have sanitary facilities (not even porta-johns).

All up and down I-95 from Virginia to Florida - every rest area has actual bathrooms in buildings and vending machines.  Many are Welcome Centers or more extensive than just empty buildings..

https://goo.gl/maps/btKX7bzECCjbyeJ89 brings you here... https://goo.gl/maps/oZFQ5k6gdKQD1a2A9

https://goo.gl/maps/EfHWmedi8pharfbx5 brings you here... https://goo.gl/maps/nGecvUV9ziYsHGi38

https://goo.gl/maps/oFtTH4SoEQWgK7Lg9 brings you here... https://goo.gl/maps/dskSHQ97MD5Xb6ra9

[PHLBOS]

To my knowledge, two free non-Interstate highways in eastern MA still have Service Areas/Plazas: MA 24 has two of them, one on each side, at the I-495 interchange in Bridgewater and MA 128 northbound in Beverly just beyond Exit 19 (Sohier Rd./Brimbal Ave.) has one as well.

There's also one on MA 3 around Plymouth.

Within the Long Pond Road (Exit 5) interchange to be exact.

Based on Historic Aerials (between 1995 & 1971), that one was constructed sometime during the early 1990s.  The last time I was on that stretch of MA 3 was 1989 (a week prior to my job layoff) and that service area/plaza was not there back then.  That's why I didn't remember/recall it.  Placing such there makes sense to the summer gridlock of Cape-bound traffic.

[RobbieL2415]

Rest Areas are literally that - a place to rest for a few minutes.  They have bathrooms, maybe a tourist assistance area, and a few vending machines.

What you're describing is more of a state's Welcome Centers that are typically located in Rest Areas.  I'm not sure of NJ, but many Rest Areas in other states at least in MA are just simply just a parking lot with maybe a picnic table or two and typically don't have sanitary facilities (not even porta-johns).

This bare-bones Rest Area along I-84 eastbound in Sturbridge, MA is signed as both a Picnic Area as well as a Rest Area.

In addition to Service Plazas, the PA Turnpike (at least the East-West Turnpike) used to have pull-off areas with a picnic table/bench or two.  Those have since been converted to Emergency Stopping/Pull-Off spots.

I'm pretty sure McGreevey was caught with a boyfriend on the beach in Cape May, not lurking around the rest areas.  Their closure had nothing to do with his sexual preferences.

IIRC, those Rest Area closures occurred in 2003/during the McGreevey Administration due to funding issues.  Such included the infamous Howard Stern Rest Stop (dedicated in 1995) along I-295 northbound in Springfield Township, Burlington County..

Basically, country-wide, if a service plaza existed before the Interstate Highway system was created, they were allowed to remain.

In short, grandfathered. 

Connecticut is a perfect example of this.  So is Delaware and Maryland, where one can easily get to their service plazas and exit the roadway without paying a toll.

In MA, such grandfathering wasn't just for toll roads that received Interstate designations either from the get-go or years later; several free highways in MA had Service Areas/Plazas that were allowed to stay even after such received Interstate designations years later.  Two of such that are still remaining (more on that below) are the ones along the portion of MA 128 that's now part of I-95 in Newton & Lexington. 

However, if such highway was widened and overhauled; the service plazas were usually eliminated.  The mid-70s overhaul of I-95 between Topsfield & Newburyport (originally constructed as Relocated US 1 in the 1950s) eliminated all Rest Areas as well as Service Areas.  Note: the Weigh Stations between the MA 97/Exit 53 & MA 133/Exit 54 interchanges were added during the 1980s.  When the Southeast Expressway, originally built in the 1950s & designated as I-93 since 1975, underwent a full-blown overhaul during the mid-80s; the Service Plaza in Braintree, just north of the Split that included a Howard Johnson's, was torn down.

To my knowledge, two free non-Interstate highways in eastern MA still have Service Areas/Plazas: MA 24 has two of them, one on each side, at the I-495 interchange in Bridgewater and MA 128 northbound in Beverly just beyond Exit 19 (Sohier Rd./Brimbal Ave.) has one as well.

I would also consider the service area at Exit 6 on the Mid-Cape Highway to be a service plaza.  Its access isn't limited but its obvious that its there to serve travelers.

[PHLBOS]

I would also consider the service area at Exit 6 on the Mid-Cape Highway to be a service plaza.  Its access isn't limited but its obvious that its there to serve travelers.

That's actually the Cape Cod Chamber of Commerce office/headquarters; which is likely why access to it is not limited to just US 6/Mid-Cape Highway. 

While such indeed offers traveler services; it's not either a state-run or toll-road agency-run service plaza.  One could argue whether such counts as a highway rest area/service plaza/area. 

[MNHighwayMan]

And, believe it or not, these are actually open 24/7, unlike in the Northeast, where I guess they expect you to use a port-a-potty after banker's hours.

It blows my mind that rest areas would actually close at all. What in the world? Highways have travelers at all hours, not just when it's convenient to be open.

[D-Dey65]

And, believe it or not, these are actually open 24/7, unlike in the Northeast, where I guess they expect you to use a port-a-potty after banker's hours.

It blows my mind that rest areas would actually close at all. What in the world? Highways have travelers at all hours, not just when it's convenient to be open.

What I often find on the ones along I-95 from Florida to Virginia are that the rest areas and welcome centers are open 24/7, but the welcome centers are only open during "banker's hours" as Brandon puts it. The rest of the time, they close up their tourist info buildings, and you can simply use them like the other rest areas. At least that seems to be the deal in North Carolina.

[sprjus4]

US-301 in Maryland has a rest area facility in a fairly rural area with limited services, and the restrooms are only open until 5 pm. If you come after that, sucks to be you.

Should be 24/7 IMO. The whole situation with a welcome / visitors center only being open certain hours is fine, as long as the restrooms are 24/7.

[Beltway]

US-301 in Maryland has a rest area facility in a fairly rural area with limited services, and the restrooms are only open until 5 pm. If you come after that, sucks to be you.
Should be 24/7 IMO. The whole situation with a welcome / visitors center only being open certain hours is fine, as long as the restrooms are 24/7.

Any outhouses there?  I will gladly take that over not having anything.