Angry rant about NCDOT and their road projects (Language adjusted)

[The Ghostbuster]

I think they should do another revision to that map now that Interstates 42, 87 and 587 have been approved. And they should get rid of the Interstate 20 extension to Wilmington, since I highly doubt 20 will ever go east of Interstate 95 in Florence, SC.

[sprjus4]

And they should get rid of the Interstate 20 extension to Wilmington, since I highly doubt 20 will ever go east of Interstate 95 in Florence, SC.

It won't, and there's no need. I-95 to I-74 is an all-interstate route and is perfectly adequate.

[tolbs17]

I think they should do another revision to that map now that Interstates 42, 87 and 587 have been approved. And they should get rid of the Interstate 20 extension to Wilmington, since I highly doubt 20 will ever go east of Interstate 95 in Florence, SC.

Obviously, it's bout time for an update now. But I think using this would show the counties of the highway proposals that may happen in the future.

https://connect.ncdot.gov/projects/planning/Pages/Comprehensive-Transportation-Plans.aspx

Wake and Onslow counties need one badly IMO. Even Craven.

https://connect.ncdot.gov/projects/planning/TPBCTP/Jones%20County/5_Highway_Sheet_wALTs.pdf

This is jones, and it shows the proposed US-70 New Bern bypass.

This is duplin, and here's the 2010 plan

https://connect.ncdot.gov/projects/planning/TPBCTP/Beulaville/Beulaville_Highway_Map_FINAL.pdf

And this is the 2018 where it removes the Beulaville bypass as a freeway.

https://connect.ncdot.gov/projects/planning/TPBCTP/Duplin%20County/Recommended%20Duplin%20County%20Highway%20Maps.pdf

[tolbs17]

This plan for the US 1 corridor study, what is wrong with this document?

https://www.ncdot.gov/projects/us-1-corridor/Documents/us1_corridor_report.pdf

http://prntscr.com/qfn77u

This interchange looks so much better (with the exception of the frontage roads connecting to the ramp) than what they have right now when looking at this one.

http://prntscr.com/qfn7m1

Why is that flyover so huge and it looks like a U shape?

https://www.ncdot.gov/projects/capital-boulevard-upgrade/Documents/i-540-perry-creek-road.pdf

[tolbs17]

http://ci.winston-salem.nc.us/Portals/0/pdf/transportation/US%2052%20Land%20Use%20Trans%20Plan/Fig%207-2S.pdf?ver=2017-02-14-150223-637

Can they bring this damn project back to life? Because I'm sure it's needed! With the exception of they put a diverging diamond interchange at Salem Creek.

and for this interchange,

http://prntscr.com/qg3qg9

It needs a flyover from US 52 south to I-40 East.

And this project also shows that they would bring back the 3rd, 4th, and 5th st ramps back after they have been removed to prevent weaving.

[sprjus4]

http://ci.winston-salem.nc.us/Portals/0/pdf/transportation/US%2052%20Land%20Use%20Trans%20Plan/Fig%207-2S.pdf?ver=2017-02-14-150223-637

Can they bring this damn project back to life? Because I'm sure it's needed! With the exception of they put a diverging diamond interchange at Salem Creek.

and for this interchange,

http://prntscr.com/qg3qg9

It needs a flyover from US 52 south to I-40 East.

And this project also shows that they would bring back the 3rd, 4th, and 5th st ramps back after they have been removed to prevent weaving.

I'm pretty sure that is a future project, to upgrade US-52 to interstate standards, and convert it into I-285 up to where I-74 will tie in with the Winston-Salem Beltway.

Will not start for years though.

The Beltway should provide relief to that corridor when it's completed.

[tolbs17]

http://ci.winston-salem.nc.us/Portals/0/pdf/transportation/US%2052%20Land%20Use%20Trans%20Plan/Fig%207-2S.pdf?ver=2017-02-14-150223-637

Can they bring this damn project back to life? Because I'm sure it's needed! With the exception of they put a diverging diamond interchange at Salem Creek.

and for this interchange,

http://prntscr.com/qg3qg9

It needs a flyover from US 52 south to I-40 East.

And this project also shows that they would bring back the 3rd, 4th, and 5th st ramps back after they have been removed to prevent weaving.

I'm pretty sure that is a future project, to upgrade US-52 to interstate standards, and convert it into I-285 up to where I-74 will tie in with the Winston-Salem Beltway.

Will not start for years though.

The Beltway should provide relief to that corridor when it's completed.

They should have left space at this interchange

https://www.ncdot.gov/projects/wsnb/Documents/eastern-section-7-map-2.pdf

For this.

http://prntscr.com/qg3u3j

I'm sure this would relieve congestion greatly.

Also, I-74 can get moved back on its old alignment and go like this.

And just call the northern beltway I-274.

[sprjus4]

They should have left space at this interchange

https://www.ncdot.gov/projects/wsnb/Documents/eastern-section-7-map-2.pdf

For this.

http://prntscr.com/qg3u3j

It appears there's plenty of room to tie in another freeway if desired in the future.

Also, I-74 can get moved back on its old alignment and go like this.

And just call the northern beltway I-274.

I don't see why I-74 would need to be routed through Downtown.

[tolbs17]

They should have left space at this interchange

https://www.ncdot.gov/projects/wsnb/Documents/eastern-section-7-map-2.pdf

For this.

http://prntscr.com/qg3u3j

It appears there's plenty of room to tie in another freeway if desired in the future.

Also, I-74 can get moved back on its old alignment and go like this.

And just call the northern beltway I-274.

I don't see why I-74 would need to be routed through Downtown.

Because usually parent routes go through downtown and 3di's are spurs or bypasses.

[The Ghostbuster]

Once Interstate 74 is rerouted onto its proposed route along the Winston-Salem Beltway, the orphaned portion of 74 should be designated Interstate 474. Also, maybe the portion of future Interstate 274 between US 158 and Interstate 40 should be signed as NC 274 since it will not connect with another Interstate at its southern end.

[Mapmikey]

Once Interstate 74 is rerouted onto its proposed route along the Winston-Salem Beltway, the orphaned portion of 74 should be designated Interstate 474. Also, maybe the portion of future Interstate 274 between US 158 and Interstate 40 should be signed as NC 274 since it will not connect with another Interstate at its southern end.

Currently the orphaned piece is slated to become NC 192...

[Roadsguy]

Once Interstate 74 is rerouted onto its proposed route along the Winston-Salem Beltway, the orphaned portion of 74 should be designated Interstate 474. Also, maybe the portion of future Interstate 274 between US 158 and Interstate 40 should be signed as NC 274 since it will not connect with another Interstate at its southern end.

It's already been confirmed that the orphaned section of I-74 will become NC 192. Not sure where that number in particular came from, but if the US 311 truncation was a recent development, it was probably expected to return to just being US 311. It's not really long enough to be worth applying for an Interstate designation, and making it NC 192 leaves open the possibility to just extend it up the future surface boulevard to US 421 at the US 158 split (if that project ever sees the light of day) without yet another goofy I-X/NC X setup.

The approved Future I-274 already covers the entire western section down to US 158, but that doesn't mean plans can't change when proper I-274 is ultimately approved. Leaving that last section as NC 452 (the interim designation until it's all finished) seems like a very NCDOT thing to do, but I don't see that happening.

[sprjus4]

since it will not connect with another Interstate at its southern end.

I-264 in Virginia...

[tolbs17]

since it will not connect with another Interstate at its southern end.

I-264 in Virginia...

I'm sure he's talking about this.

I say don't call it NC 274, just name it "I-274 Connector" or something.

Something similar to this or it could just be unnamed and they would probably call it just ramps to I-274 and I-40.

[sprjus4]

I'm sure he's talking about this.

I say don't call it NC 274, just name it "I-274 Connector" or something.

That's what I'm referring to... an even route number can continue on once crossing two interstate routes and have a terminus at a non-interstate route

Something similar to this or it could just be unnamed and they would probably call it just ramps to I-274 and I-40.

Different, because that was originally apart of a pre-existing US-29 bypass built in the 1950s before I-85 through the Charlotte area... Most of it was upgraded and incorporated into I-85 by 1958 from the airport eastwards to the present day stub, though when I-85 was extended further north by 1972 on new alignment, that segment was left over and is merely a ramp. In the case of I-274, it's still a continuous route, not a ramp.

[wdcrft63]

They should have left space at this interchange

https://www.ncdot.gov/projects/wsnb/Documents/eastern-section-7-map-2.pdf

For this.

http://prntscr.com/qg3u3j

It appears there's plenty of room to tie in another freeway if desired in the future.

Also, I-74 can get moved back on its old alignment and go like this.

And just call the northern beltway I-274.

I don't see why I-74 would need to be routed through Downtown.

Because usually parent routes go through downtown and 3di's are spurs or bypasses.

Well not so much in North Carolina, where the major 2-di interstates (I-40, I-85, and I-95) have all been routed away from downtowns.

[sprjus4]

Well not so much in North Carolina, where the major 2-di interstates (I-40, I-85, and I-95) have all been routed away from downtowns.

I-73 was routed away from Greensboro (follows the loop rather than US-220 and I-40), and now I-74 will be with Winston-Salem.

IMO, it works either way. As long as there's a bypass route and a route thru, that's all that matters. What it's numbered is beyond me as a motorist.

I think the point of routing the 2-di's on the bypasses is to divert as much thru traffic as possible. With the case of I-40 around Winston-Salem, I-85 around Greensboro, and now I-74 around Winston-Salem, it's all designed with continuity for thru traffic to follow the bypass.

[tolbs17]

I-40 still goes through Greensboro.

Well I mean it's not like too close to what Winston-Salem is, but it goes close to the downtown area.

[Finrod]

I-40 still goes through Greensboro.

Well I mean it's not like too close to what Winston-Salem is, but it goes close to the downtown area.

They tried moving I-40 onto the loop in 2008, but there was so much bad noise made about it that they moved it back.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greensboro_Urban_Loop#Interstate_40_relocation

[tolbs17]

I-40 still goes through Greensboro.

Well I mean it's not like too close to what Winston-Salem is, but it goes close to the downtown area.

They tried moving I-40 onto the loop in 2008, but there was so much bad noise made about it that they moved it back.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greensboro_Urban_Loop#Interstate_40_relocation

I guessential it's fine the way it is. It's not worth it to move it onto the loop again.

[tolbs17]

https://connect.ncdot.gov/projects/planning/FeasibilityStudiesDocuments/I-5110_Feasibility-Study-0507A_Report_2008.pdf

When looking at this, wouldn't alternative 4 be better than 1 so it's not a big mess?

Alternatives 2 and 3 would both be non-starters though.

[sprjus4]

https://connect.ncdot.gov/projects/planning/FeasibilityStudiesDocuments/I-5110_Feasibility-Study-0507A_Report_2008.pdf

When looking at this, wouldn't alternative 4 be better than 1 so it's not a big mess?

Alternatives 2 and 3 would both be non-starters though.

Alternative 1 would be the best alternative...

...because that's what got built.

https://www.google.com/maps/@36.1310515,-79.9494572,4295m/data=!3m1!1e3!5m1!1e1

[Finrod]

Interesting that they planned for a future airport connector to the west towards Winston-Salem.  I don't think I've seen any mention of that anywhere else previously.

[tolbs17]

Interesting that they planned for a future airport connector to the west towards Winston-Salem.  I don't think I've seen any mention of that anywhere else previously.

It looks like it got scrapped.

[tjcreasy]

I'm glad the airport connect was scrapped. The only useful connection would have been at the I-40/ Salem Parkway split. There just simply isn't enough traffic demand. At this point the Triad should start focusing on meaningful non-freeway projects like widening US 70 between Burlington and Greensboro, the Jamestown Bypass, and the widening of Market Street/ E Mountain Street in Kernersville. I would even like to see an extension of Cone Blvd to the east that ties into NC 100 north of Gibsonville. These projects improve connectivity, improve safety by reducing freeway traffic, and enhance regional cohesion which is something the Triad doesn't have.