Trips "within" a country that take you out of the country.

Started by Roadgeekteen, July 05, 2020, 12:31:14 PM

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Roadgeekteen

My username has been outdated since August 2023 but I'm too lazy to change it


AlexandriaVA

Sticking to the US for now, they all appear to be on the US-Canadian border, and almost always involve bodies of water (e.g. the Great Lakes or Puget Sound) blocking what would have been high-capacity routes in the US.



*Parts of Alaska to the lower 48 via Yukon and British Columbia (assuming no ferry usage).

*Port Roberts, Washington, to anywhere in the lower 48.

*The "hat" of Minnesota (north side of Lake of the Woods), Angle Inlet, to anywhere in the lower 48.

In some cases, I think going through Canada just makes for a better route:

*Much of northern Minnesota to the Sault St Marie region, across the northern shore of Lake Superior, rather than via the Michigan Upper Peninsula, as well as the northern parts New England.






Max Rockatansky

Canada was the much better route in pretty much all of Michigan for points eastward and above the New York State Line.  Port Huron in particular is a family go-to for short cutting around Lake Erie. 

Roadgeekteen

I think that the fastest way to travel between Eastern and Western Canada is via the US.
My username has been outdated since August 2023 but I'm too lazy to change it

Flint1979

I would most certainly stay within the United States if I was traveling elsewhere in the United States regardless of how much longer it would take me. If I was going from Detroit to Buffalo I'd suck up the extra 100 miles and drive on the south side of Lake Erie rather than having to deal with customs twice and then the long delays at the border at times would probably make that extra 100 miles seem like nothing.

Flint1979

Quote from: AlexandriaVA on July 05, 2020, 12:51:58 PM
In some cases, I think going through Canada just makes for a better route:

*Much of northern Minnesota to the Sault St Marie region, across the northern shore of Lake Superior, rather than via the Michigan Upper Peninsula, as well as the northern parts New England.
The best route from International Falls to Sault Ste. Marie, Michigan is going through Wisconsin and the U.P.

Going around the north shore of Lake Superior adds about 65 miles and an hour and a half at least. And International Falls is about as far north as you can go in Minnesota (not the most northern point but it's close).

MisterSG1

Quote from: Roadgeekteen on July 05, 2020, 12:58:15 PM
I think that the fastest way to travel between Eastern and Western Canada is via the US.

Yup, even in the situation we are in, Google suggests exactly that if you want to go from Toronto/Montreal to say Vancouver.

Before the twinning of NB-2 happened, I believe it may have been slightly quicker, and this is a big may, to go from Toronto to Halifax by crossing the border at the Niagara River.

TheHighwayMan3561

Quote from: Flint1979 on July 05, 2020, 01:35:51 PM
Quote from: AlexandriaVA on July 05, 2020, 12:51:58 PM
In some cases, I think going through Canada just makes for a better route:

*Much of northern Minnesota to the Sault St Marie region, across the northern shore of Lake Superior, rather than via the Michigan Upper Peninsula, as well as the northern parts New England.
The best route from International Falls to Sault Ste. Marie, Michigan is going through Wisconsin and the U.P.

Going around the north shore of Lake Superior adds about 65 miles and an hour and a half at least. And International Falls is about as far north as you can go in Minnesota (not the most northern point but it's close).

Even from Grand Marais, it's only 10 minutes faster to go through Canada which will obviously be more than made up for by the customs clearances. Grand Portage itself is really the only place where going through Canada to SSM makes sense.

BrynM65

It's common in Europe although our borders are rather more porous than the Canada/US border (and a million times more so than the Mexico/US one).

Some common tricks include Calais to Lyon in France via Belgium and Luxembourg - avoids the tedious A26 toll road through flat terrain north east of Paris, and Lux has massively cheap fuel to boot. More mileage but saves a fortune on tolls and fuel as the A31 down to Lyon from Luxembourg is cheaper than the A26/A5 through France.

If you live in North Wales and want to get to South Wales, it's nearly always quicker to travel through England than to use the A470.

Dublin to Donegal is quicker through Northern Ireland - at least it has been since border checks vanished, although who knows what Brexit will see happen. I expect the Irish M4/N4 will be improved over the N2/A5 route as a result.

The road giveth, and the road taketh away...

Flint1979

Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on July 05, 2020, 02:28:44 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on July 05, 2020, 01:35:51 PM
Quote from: AlexandriaVA on July 05, 2020, 12:51:58 PM
In some cases, I think going through Canada just makes for a better route:

*Much of northern Minnesota to the Sault St Marie region, across the northern shore of Lake Superior, rather than via the Michigan Upper Peninsula, as well as the northern parts New England.
The best route from International Falls to Sault Ste. Marie, Michigan is going through Wisconsin and the U.P.

Going around the north shore of Lake Superior adds about 65 miles and an hour and a half at least. And International Falls is about as far north as you can go in Minnesota (not the most northern point but it's close).

Even from Grand Marais, it's only 10 minutes faster to go through Canada which will obviously be more than made up for by the customs clearances. Grand Portage itself is really the only place where going through Canada to SSM makes sense.
I don't know why Google keeps suggesting that you take US-2 between Wakefield, MI and Newberry, MI as an alternate route when taking M-28 is faster and shorter. This is for between Grand Portage and SSM. M-28 is 65 mph most of the way and you can bypass Marquette as well by taking CR-480 and Cherry Creek Road. However the route you mentioned going through Canada is the best way only from Grand Portage though. I'm thinking I could easily make the time up by punching it a little bit especially going across the U.P.

Roadgeekteen

Quote from: MisterSG1 on July 05, 2020, 01:42:26 PM
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on July 05, 2020, 12:58:15 PM
I think that the fastest way to travel between Eastern and Western Canada is via the US.

Yup, even in the situation we are in, Google suggests exactly that if you want to go from Toronto/Montreal to say Vancouver.

Before the twinning of NB-2 happened, I believe it may have been slightly quicker, and this is a big may, to go from Toronto to Halifax by crossing the border at the Niagara River.
Still faster to go through America for Niagra Falls-Halifax
https://www.google.com/maps/dir/Niagara+Falls,+ON,+Canada/Halifax,+NS,+Canada/@44.0511505,-75.6759454,6z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m14!4m13!1m5!1m1!1s0x89d3445eec824db9:0x46d2c56156bda288!2m2!1d-79.0849436!2d43.0895577!1m5!1m1!1s0x4b5a211407dbfac1:0x666be3a6438b2ddc!2m2!1d-63.5727683!2d44.6475811!3e0
My username has been outdated since August 2023 but I'm too lazy to change it

Brandon

"If you think this has a happy ending, you haven't been paying attention." - Ramsay Bolton, "Game of Thrones"

"Symbolic of his struggle against reality." - Reg, "Monty Python's Life of Brian"

Road Hog

Quote from: Brandon on July 05, 2020, 04:41:59 PM
How about this mess along the German-Belgian border? https://goo.gl/maps/gRJQyAej5Ptzvdx56
Forget that ... follow the border between the Netherlands and Belgium west. There are exclaves of one country in the other in a number of places. The border takes crazy zigs and zags and bisects houses, farmfields and towns with no discernible presence.

CNGL-Leudimin

Europe is the prime territory for this thread, thanks to Schengen area :sombrero:. However due to the Pyrenees there are no practical routes from a point in Spain to another that involves entering France or vice-versa.

One great example from Spain is Os de Civis. If you want to reach it from anywhere else on paved roads you have to go through Andorra. Due to that, Os de Civis is the only village in Spain that is de facto not part of Schengen area (since Andorra officially isn't).
Supporter of the construction of several running gags, including I-366 with a speed limit of 85 mph (137 km/h) and the Hypotenuse.

Please note that I may mention "invalid" FM channels, i.e. ending in an even number or down to 87.5. These are valid in Europe.

ftballfan

Winnipeg to Toronto (and anywhere in ON west of there). The quickest route according to Google involves crossing into the US at Pembina, using the Lake Express ferry between Milwaukee and Muskegon, and crossing back into Canada at the Blue Water Bridge.

Most of Saskatchewan and Alberta to Toronto would involve crossing into the US at Portal and crossing back into Canada at the Blue Water Bridge.

From Vancouver to Toronto, one would cross into the US at Blaine, remaining in the US (via I-5, I-405, I-90, I-94, the Lake Express Ferry, I-96, I-69, and then I-94 again) until crossing back into Canada at the Blue Water Bridge.

A trip from Sault Ste. Marie to Windsor, both in Ontario, would mostly involve I-75 and take about five hours. Staying in Canada doubles the drive time (via ON 17, ON 69, ON 400, and ON 401).

A few years ago, there was a period of time that the only road connecting western Canada to eastern Canada (in Ontario between Thunder Bay and Nipigon) was closed due to a bridge collapse.

jp the roadgeek

Estcourt Station, ME to anywhere in the US.  Unless you don't mind hundreds of miles of logging roads.
Interstates I've clinched: 97, 290 (MA), 291 (CT), 291 (MA), 293, 295 (DE-NJ-PA), 295 (RI-MA), 384, 391, 395 (CT-MA), 395 (MD), 495 (DE), 610 (LA), 684, 691, 695 (MD), 695 (NY), 795 (MD)

oscar

Quote from: AlexandriaVA on July 05, 2020, 12:51:58 PM
Sticking to the US for now, they all appear to be on the US-Canadian border, and almost always involve bodies of water (e.g. the Great Lakes or Puget Sound) blocking what would have been high-capacity routes in the US.

*Parts of Alaska to the lower 48 via Yukon and British Columbia (assuming no ferry usage).

From Hyder, Alaska to anywhere else, including the rest of Alaska. No ferry to Hyder, and the Alaska state ferry route to nearby Stewart BC was terminated (just as I was going to take it) in 1994.
my Hot Springs and Highways pages, with links to my roads sites:
http://www.alaskaroads.com/home.html

kphoger

From Ciudad Juárez to Ciudad Acuña, México:

Mexico-only routes = 888 miles
Via I-10 (USA) = 430 miles

Google Maps currently estimates a savings of 11 hours by crossing through the USA.  Even if you figure a total of 3 hours for border crossing fun, that's still amazing.

He Is Already Here! Let's Go, Flamingo!
Dost thou understand the graveness of the circumstances?
Deut 23:13
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: PKDIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

Roadgeekteen

Quote from: kphoger on July 06, 2020, 02:11:57 PM
From Ciudad Juárez to Ciudad Acuña, México:

Mexico-only routes = 888 miles
Via I-10 (USA) = 430 miles

Google Maps currently estimates a savings of 11 hours by crossing through the USA.  Even if you figure a total of 3 hours for border crossing fun, that's still amazing.
No roads nearish to the rio grande on the Mexico side?
My username has been outdated since August 2023 but I'm too lazy to change it

kphoger

Quote from: Roadgeekteen on July 06, 2020, 03:40:57 PM

Quote from: kphoger on July 06, 2020, 02:11:57 PM
From Ciudad Juárez to Ciudad Acuña, México:

Mexico-only routes = 888 miles
Via I-10 (USA) = 430 miles

Google Maps currently estimates a savings of 11 hours by crossing through the USA.  Even if you figure a total of 3 hours for border crossing fun, that's still amazing.

No roads nearish to the rio grande on the Mexico side?

Do you see any?

He Is Already Here! Let's Go, Flamingo!
Dost thou understand the graveness of the circumstances?
Deut 23:13
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: PKDIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

ozarkman417

The fastest way between Innsbruck, Austria and Salzburg, Austria is to go through Bavaria in Germany, because the Autobahn follows the Inn River out of the Alps. 

Roadgeekteen

Quote from: kphoger on July 06, 2020, 03:46:58 PM
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on July 06, 2020, 03:40:57 PM

Quote from: kphoger on July 06, 2020, 02:11:57 PM
From Ciudad Juárez to Ciudad Acuña, México:

Mexico-only routes = 888 miles
Via I-10 (USA) = 430 miles

Google Maps currently estimates a savings of 11 hours by crossing through the USA.  Even if you figure a total of 3 hours for border crossing fun, that's still amazing.

No roads nearish to the rio grande on the Mexico side?

Do you see any?
No, I guess not many people live there.
My username has been outdated since August 2023 but I'm too lazy to change it

hotdogPi

Quote from: kphoger on July 06, 2020, 03:46:58 PM
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on July 06, 2020, 03:40:57 PM

Quote from: kphoger on July 06, 2020, 02:11:57 PM
From Ciudad Juárez to Ciudad Acuña, México:

Mexico-only routes = 888 miles
Via I-10 (USA) = 430 miles

Google Maps currently estimates a savings of 11 hours by crossing through the USA.  Even if you figure a total of 3 hours for border crossing fun, that's still amazing.

No roads nearish to the rio grande on the Mexico side?

Do you see any?

I see some.
Clinched

Traveled, plus
US 13, 50
MA 22, 35, 40, 53, 79, 107, 109, 126, 138, 141, 159
NH 27, 78, 111A(E); CA 90; NY 366; GA 42, 140; FL A1A, 7; CT 32, 320; VT 2A, 5A; PA 3, 51, 60, WA 202; QC 162, 165, 263; 🇬🇧A100, A3211, A3213, A3215, A4222; 🇫🇷95 D316

Lowest untraveled: 36

Roadgeekteen

Quote from: 1 on July 06, 2020, 04:00:24 PM
Quote from: kphoger on July 06, 2020, 03:46:58 PM
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on July 06, 2020, 03:40:57 PM

Quote from: kphoger on July 06, 2020, 02:11:57 PM
From Ciudad Juárez to Ciudad Acuña, México:

Mexico-only routes = 888 miles
Via I-10 (USA) = 430 miles

Google Maps currently estimates a savings of 11 hours by crossing through the USA.  Even if you figure a total of 3 hours for border crossing fun, that's still amazing.

No roads nearish to the rio grande on the Mexico side?

Do you see any?

I see some.
I'm guessing that some of these roads are dirt roads.
My username has been outdated since August 2023 but I'm too lazy to change it

kphoger

Quote from: Roadgeekteen on July 06, 2020, 04:10:02 PM

Quote from: 1 on July 06, 2020, 04:00:24 PM

Quote from: kphoger on July 06, 2020, 03:46:58 PM

Quote from: Roadgeekteen on July 06, 2020, 03:40:57 PM

Quote from: kphoger on July 06, 2020, 02:11:57 PM
From Ciudad Juárez to Ciudad Acuña, México:

Mexico-only routes = 888 miles
Via I-10 (USA) = 430 miles

Google Maps currently estimates a savings of 11 hours by crossing through the USA.  Even if you figure a total of 3 hours for border crossing fun, that's still amazing.

No roads nearish to the rio grande on the Mexico side?

Do you see any?

I see some.

I'm guessing that some of these roads are dirt roads.

In the past, that was certainly true.  However, a bell started ringing in my head when 1 posted that.  I have no idea what the progress is on the projects referenced below:

Quote from: Jbte on February 06, 2016, 11:28:17 PM
At Coahuila state all route is paved to Chihuahua border, you can get really close to Boquillas del Carmen by paved road, only like 20 miles of unpaved route to Boquillas, it's unknown if there are plans to pave the last branch to Boquillas. At Chihuahua side its unpaved (41 miles), from Manuel Benavides to Coahuila state border, that's due some legal changes must be done over the protected area, once its done it'll be replaced by Federal route 53 from Monterrey to Ojinaga. Google maps reference its wrong over this area and must be corrected. The only interesting place in this new route is "La Cuesta de Malena" its an scenic desert drive with a tunnel, nearby La Encantada open pit mine and Maderas del Carmen mountain range.

Another route under construction near to this area its the Coahuila state route 20, from Ocampo to San Miguel (T junction to the new Federal route 53), you'll be able to drive from Torreón to (near) Boquillas in a paved route passing by Cuatro Cienegas, i'm eager to see this completed.

He Is Already Here! Let's Go, Flamingo!
Dost thou understand the graveness of the circumstances?
Deut 23:13
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: PKDIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.



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