Study: Teens can't afford to drive

[Brandon]

This may explain some of the decline in miles driven.

Study: Teens can't afford to drive

A new study blames high teenage unemployment and the rising costs of driving for the decline in younger people getting driver licenses – not texting, cellphones and lack of interest.

"It looks like teens just can't afford to drive,"  said Matt Moore, vice president of the insurance industry-funded group. "Paying for their own cars, gas and insurance is hard if they can't find a job. At the same time, kids who count on Mom and Dad to help them also may be out of luck if their parents have been affected by the recession."

The study showed states with higher teen unemployment rates had fewer insured young drivers, Moore said.

[agentsteel53]

good.  keep the "don't enjoy driving for its own sake" crowd off the roads.

[Zeffy]

This is extremely true to me. I didn't get a job until a week ago, and it's only part time. I'm currently saving up for a car because not having my own sucks. I think it's just cruel irony that I enjoy driving more than all my other friends and they have cars. Fuck them. 

[ZLoth]

How about waiting until your 18 in California because there are less strings and restrictions in getting your license then when you are 16 and 17?

[Big John]

Was true for me, but rare in the 80s.  No family car and had to earn up to buy the car/insurance/upkeep myself unlike most teen.  Was taught a lot more responsibility that way too when i got my license at 21.

[corco]

Part of the problem is that additional cell phone bill. If I'm a teenager and I have to outlay $100/month plus just to be able to practically communicate with my friends, it becomes mighty difficult to save up for that beater pickup.

This is another example of that urban/rural split. In urban America, you've got access to alternate transportation facilities and a need to have a smartphone since all your friends do and they expect to communicate over that medium, so it's clear where monetary priorities should be. In rural America, the car becomes more important since it's basically required to survive, and the phone becomes secondary since that's just fancy new technology.

Where I live right now a lot of the kids don't have cell phones at all, let alone smartphones. Those kids have a limited amount of money and a choice between waking up at 4:30 AM for the 30 mile school bus ride with a smartphone that only sometimes works and not having the smartphone but having an old pickup they can use to get to school and up into the mountains to drink on weekends. In an urban surrounding, the opposite would hold.

[agentsteel53]

$100/month to be able to practically communicate with your friends?  that seems ... excessive. 

I suppose you just have to figure out what your priorities are.  I'll bet if you had a car, your peers would not consider you to be some kind of "lame-o" because, instead of being instantly responsive on the facebooks, you're likely to say "hey let's fucking go somewhere and do something".

and if your friends would rather be stuck behind their cell phones, then you need higher-quality friends.  wait 'til college, I suppose.

[Duke87]

Is it typical for teens to have to pay for their own cellphones? I didn't start picking up that bill until after I finished college and got a full time job. Before that it was paid by my parents. Same for everyone else in my generation in my family.

And yeah, $100/month is a lot. You can easily find a plan for half that.

[corco]

Is it typical for teens to have to pay for their own cellphones? I didn't start picking up that bill until after I finished college and got a full time job. Before that it was paid by my parents. Same for everyone else in my generation in my family.

And yeah, $100/month is a lot. You can easily find a plan for half that.

From prior conversations it sounds like you come from some money, though. Didn't your parents pay for your car too? I know a lot of folks that are entirely on the hook for both- I've been mostly fortunate on the car front (when I went to college I did have to give my parents car I used in high school to my sister and bought my own shiny 1990 Dodge Colt for $600, but my uncle died a year later and willed his car to me) but I've always had to pay my cell phone bill.

I also, and i haven't joined the smartphone generation yet, feel like it's a lot pricier than it was when we were in high school. Back then it was $30 for the basic cellphone bill and at the end I had to spring for unlimited texting for another $10 because people kept texting me. I feel like high school kids these days with smartphones need to have a really good data plan in order to instafacetwitterchat all day, but I admit I could be wrong on that.

[vdeane]

My plan is a orders of magnitude less than $100/month, but then again, my plan is to pay Mom the amount it costs her and Dad to keep me on the family phone plan.  It's a LOT cheaper to add a phone to a family plan to get your own even for the exact same service.

[PHLBOS]

Man, times have certainly changed from when I was a teenager.  I bought my first car (a 1969 Ford LTD w/a different colored hood & left front fender) for $300 in 1982.  For insurance cost reasons, the car was registered under my father's name but I was listed as the primary driver.

I basically paid for the gas and maintenance and my father helped out w/the insurance; back then it was below $500/annually in MA.  Thankfully, gas prices started leveling off and even began dropping during those years.  Side bar: Many in 1979-1980 thought that gas would be anywhere from $3 to $5 per gallon by 1985 or 1990 at the latest.

To make phone calls away from home; we either just carried some extra change for pay phones or used our parents calling card number (usually it was the home/land line number plus 4-digits).

While I'm aware that it's a completely different era now, I still have to ask the following questions to the younger generation out there:

1.  Do teenagers really need a smartphone that does everything in the book?  IMHO, one that just does calls and, maybe, text messages would be more affordable & practical.  Heck, I only got a cell phone 7 years ago because pay phones were just getting too scarce and my cell today is just a standard unit for calls and texts (no Smartphone).

2.  For a car, do they really need to have the newest vehicle around with every little nick-nack feature in it?  I viewed my first 3 vehicles that I paided only 3-digits for, even then, as simply transportation.  It may not have been the newest, shiniest around nor have all the optional gadgets (my first 3 cars had no A/C nor power windows) but it got me to points A and B; although I did some of my early highway clinching in those vehicles.  Older, put well-maintained, vehicles are likely cheaper to insure as well.  Note: one of my active vehicles today is about 16 years old and just passed the PA safety & emissions inspection last week.

Doing the above can help alleviate some of those costs but I think the biggest money issues today that didn't exist as much when I grew up are the insurance rates/policies towards younger drivers and the still-p*ss-poor, real-world economy that's impacting their chances of getting a part-time job to finance the above-expenses.

[agentsteel53]

one that just does calls and, maybe, text messages would be more affordable & practical. 

I'd actually go the other way around on that, but I generally hate talking on the phone.  "see you at 430" is a perfectly valid text.

[1995hoo]

Man, times have certainly changed from when I was a teenager.  I bought my first car (a 1969 Ford LTD w/a different colored hood & left front fender) for $300 in 1982.  For insurance cost reasons, the car was registered under my father's name but I was listed as the primary driver.

....

Same here. My parents were adamant that I had to buy a car myself because they felt if I were financially invested in it I'd be more motivated to maintain it properly and I'd learn to care for cars for when I was out on my own without them to bail me out. My first car was a 1977 Ford Granada I bought for $325 from a guy at my father's office I'd known since I was a kid. The car was a boat, but it (usually) ran, and in some ways it was a very good car for a 16-year-old because it didn't handle nearly as well as the Honda and Volvo sedans my parents drove and on which I'd learned to drive, and it was heavier and the brakes weren't as good. All that meant I had to drive a lot more carefully than I might have in a more modern car. I later sold the Granada to my brother for $400 when he turned 16; at the same time, our father bought a new car for himself and sold me (yes, he required me to pay him for it, which I did in a lump-sum cash payment) his 1982 Accord to take with me to college.

My parents were also adamant that I had to maintain my grades in school at a minimum of a "B" average if I were to be allowed to drive because that was the threshold State Farm required to maintain the "Good Student Discount" on the insurance.

I was probably one of the exceptions at my high school in terms of having to buy my own car, though. There were a lot of newer-model Japanese cars there. Funny thing is, though, kids will make fun of each other about almost anything and you'd think driving a clunker would get you made fun of, but almost nobody made fun of me for having that lousy Granada except when the fan belts started squealing periodically. Kind of surprises me when I look back 20 years later that I was not made fun of, but then I wonder if there was a grudging respect in that almost none of the other kids could have handled that car's hideous four-on-the-floor because it was a very difficult transmission to shift properly (even the mechanic who did the state inspections couldn't shift it into reverse correctly and had to ask me to do it for him).


Regarding text messages–one reason I jealously guard my mobile phone number is because of people who think it's OK to send text messages without asking first. I don't have an unlimited text-message thing on my mobile plan because I don't use them. Verizon charges me something like 20¢ per message sent or received. They tried to get me to sign up for 250 messages per month for $5.00, but that's a waste of money because I've only topped $5.00 on a per-message basis one time. In a pinch it can be fine–last year during the derecho I was OK with my father sending me text messages to save his battery when their power was out (that was the month when I topped $5.00), and if I'm at a noisy place like a Caps game I agree it can be easier to communicate that way than by phone. But on the other hand, if I know the other person has a smartphone, I'd rather they just send me e-mail. It's free. Plus text-message users often write in cryptic gibberish fashion and I'm not willing to take the time to decipher their weird abbreviations. If you expect me to read something, you owe me the courtesy of making it legible. The big thing is, I don't appreciate the idea that someone else should feel entitled to run up my bill by sending me messages in a form I do not like and do not wish to use. My father started sending me text messages when he first got a smartphone and I had to tell him I'd block him if he didn't quit it (he did quit, at least, except in emergencies, and now he uses e-mail instead). Then you have the idiots who think they're entitled to some kind of timely response to a text message and they get pushy if you don't reply and send you three or four. I don't care what the idiot kids do these days–there is no excuse whatsoever for reading or writing text messages when you're driving, so if someone sends me any kind of message (text or e-mail) when I'm in the car, that person will be left waiting for a reply.

[nexus73]

Teenage me got my first car in June 1973, a 1964 Rambler Classic, for $100.  Title transfer was $2.  Insurance through Farmer's was $90 for 6 months.  A few dollars made for a full tank.  There went my first paycheck of $200 from my summer job when I graduated!  That was fun and it was cheap for a kid to get a car, keep it legal and filled up with gas.

Now if a kid wanted a decent beater that passes inspection, I'm figuring $2500.  Title/tax/registration fees are all going to be higher than I had to deal with in Oregon so let's say an outlay of another $300.  Then let's see what the insurance agent says.  OMG!  We're getting in the high 3 figure range!  Tack on another $800 for half a year.  Then fill that puppy up for another $50 or so.  Total cost: $3650.

Now show me how many kids make $3650 in one month on a summer job?  Oh sure, you might save a bit from those numbers but it is still going to be a whole lot more than kids make and even more than many adults make for take home pay in a month just to get that first car.

Computers, cellphones and video games are much cheaper and they're lots of fun.  Where's the incentive for a kid to own a car?  Besides, so many rigs are buttugly appliancemobiles.  When I grew up we had tons of cool cars to make us drool!  Not the case today...

It makes me sad.

Rick

[PHLBOS]

one that just does calls and, maybe, text messages would be more affordable & practical. 

I'd actually go the other way around on that, but I generally hate talking on the phone.  "see you at 430" is a perfectly valid text.

But not while one's driving.  Talking on a phone usually doesn't involve taking one's eyes off the road while doing so while texting does.  I realize some will disagree w/me on the former but truckers have been doing so on their CB mikes for decades.

Now show me how many kids make $3650 in one month on a summer job?

You might want to make your last word plural (jobs).  Additionally, prior to getting a summer job, don't most teenagers either have a part-time job during the school year and/or get an allowance (of sorts) from their parents?  While they may not be able to earn enough money in one month to buy a car; they can start setting (read saving) money aside for it beforehand.  Maybe sacrifice getting that computer, Smartphone and/or video game and use the money saved towards a car.

Where's the incentive for a kid to own a car?

Mobility & ubiquity.  Not all regions have adequate mass transit systems covers where and when people want to go.

Besides, so many rigs are buttugly appliancemobiles.  When I grew up we had tons of cool cars to make us drool!  Not the case today...

I agree with you on that one; but that's another topic for another day.  But, again, what rule out there exists that require a teenager to own a car younger than 5 to 10 years old?

[agentsteel53]

I'd actually go the other way around on that, but I generally hate talking on the phone.  "see you at 430" is a perfectly valid text.

But not while one's driving.  Talking on a phone usually doesn't involve taking one's eyes off the road while doing so while texting does.  I realize some will disagree w/me on the former but truckers have been doing so on their CB mikes for decades.
[/quote]

that's two completely different discussions wrapped into one.

actually, with my iphone, I don't trust myself to make a phone call, or even answer one, without having to look at the screen; the tactile feedback on touchscreen phones is pure shit.  that's the main reason I gave up phone use while driving - I realized I just could never, ever get the hang of fiddling with it blind, as with the radio or the A/C controls or the whatever else that is actually a physical knob.

[1995hoo]

one that just does calls and, maybe, text messages would be more affordable & practical. 

I'd actually go the other way around on that, but I generally hate talking on the phone.  "see you at 430" is a perfectly valid text.

But not while one's driving.  Talking on a phone usually doesn't involve taking one's eyes off the road while doing so while texting does.  I realize some will disagree w/me on the former but truckers have been doing so on their CB mikes for decades.

that's two completely different discussions wrapped into one.

actually, with my iphone, I don't trust myself to make a phone call, or even answer one, without having to look at the screen; the tactile feedback on touchscreen phones is pure shit.  that's the main reason I gave up phone use while driving - I realized I just could never, ever get the hang of fiddling with it blind, as with the radio or the A/C controls or the whatever else that is actually a physical knob.

This is a major reason for handsfree devices. My Acura has a built-in Bluetooth system (trademarked name is HandsFree Link) that lets you voice-control a Bluetooth phone using buttons on the steering wheel; the call comes over the stereo speakers. My wife and I have noise-cancelling earpieces for use when we drive the other cars. I really see no excuse for someone who talks on a phone when driving not to have an earpiece, or at a bare minimum not to turn on the speakerphone and set the phone down somewhere. There are plenty of earpieces that give decent enough performance for relatively little cost (less expensive than our noise-cancelling units, which are outstanding earpieces but are from Bang & Olufsen, so they weren't cheap).

I really don't understand the people who drive along holding the phone out some distance away above the steering wheel with it on speaker. Just makes no sense to me to do that. If you have the speaker on, set the phone down. I also don't understand the people who are barely out of the driveway in the morning and are already yakking on the phone. If the call is that important, stay home and make the call there.

None of that is to suggest, though, that a handsfree device is the panacea some people portray it as being. It's not. Talking on the phone is still distracting if it's anything more than the most trivial and perfunctory of calls. I've long thought the reason is that, unlike the passenger in the car, the other person on the call can't see what you're seeing and react to it. When you're talking to a passenger, anyone will understand why you might break off if you're paying attention to something in particular on the road. The person on the phone may not and will likely start talking if you break off what you're saying. It's totally different from talking to a passenger.

[PHLBOS]

actually, with my iphone, I don't trust myself to make a phone call, or even answer one, without having to look at the screen; the tactile feedback on touchscreen phones is pure shit.  that's the main reason I gave up phone use while driving - I realized I just could never, ever get the hang of fiddling with it blind, as with the radio or the A/C controls or the whatever else that is actually a physical knob.

No offense, but the above sounds more of a personal issue here.

Let's be perfectly honest, do you really need to have an iPhone or can you get by w/a standard cell phone w/a regular telephone keypad?  IMHO, that would eliminate any touch-screen issues you have while calling right there; which is why I personally abhor these new touch-screen controls on cars but that's another topic for another thread.

While it's your decision and personal preference to have the phone that you have, which is fine, but one needs to take the advantages with the disadvantages here.

This is a major reason for handsfree devices. My Acura has a built-in Bluetooth system (trademarked name is HandsFree Link) that lets you voice-control a Bluetooth phone using buttons on the steering wheel; the call comes over the stereo speakers.

Do keep in mind that not all cars, especially older ones that teens will likely get as their first car, are equipped w/built-in Bluetooth systems.

Second & IIRC, some states don't even want/allow teenage drivers talking on any phone device, handsfree or not while in motion.

[Henry]

My daughter, who is now a sophomore at UCLA, has a 1997 Chevy Cavalier, and she is on my policy. I make sure she does not use her phone while she's driving, and since she loves to talk and text, driving is what she does little of anyway.

[agentsteel53]

Let's be perfectly honest, do you really need to have an iPhone or can you get by w/a standard cell phone w/a regular telephone keypad?  IMHO, that would eliminate any touch-screen issues you have while calling right there; which is why I personally abhor these new touch-screen controls on cars but that's another topic for another thread.

1) I make like 4 phone calls a month.  "talking on the phone while driving" is, in my world, about as frequent as "identifying species of rare jellyfish while driving".
2) I do use the additional "smart" phone features all the time.
3) if I still had a phone with a keyboard, I'd very likely quit using it while driving, just with a 2-3 month lag. 

[1995hoo]

....

This is a major reason for handsfree devices. My Acura has a built-in Bluetooth system (trademarked name is HandsFree Link) that lets you voice-control a Bluetooth phone using buttons on the steering wheel; the call comes over the stereo speakers.

Do keep in mind that not all cars, especially older ones that teens will likely get as their first car, are equipped w/built-in Bluetooth systems.

Second & IIRC, some states don't even want/allow teenage drivers talking on any phone device, handsfree or not while in motion.

No offense, but you engaged in a really selective quotation of what I said. Notice the rest of that paragraph talked about earpieces and speakerphones. Obviously I know most cars don't have built-in systems: Two of ours don't and that's why we have earpieces! I think my point stands: If you want to talk on a mobile phone in the car, there is no excuse for not using some sort of handsfree device.

Your comment about states banning kids from using any sort of mobile device, handsfree or not, is valid, although since we don't have kids I don't generally pay a lot of attention to those laws. I do notice that the kids I see driving seem to think those laws don't apply to them, as they all CONSTANTLY have a phone in one hand pretty much all the time (they're also prime culprits in the latest stupid fad of leaving three or four car lengths when stopped at a red light because they're so eager to start playing with their dopey phones....I'm always tempted to cut into one of those gaps).

[bugo]

This is another example of that urban/rural split. In urban America, you've got access to alternate transportation facilities and a need to have a smartphone since all your friends do and they expect to communicate over that medium, so it's clear where monetary priorities should be. In rural America, the car becomes more important since it's basically required to survive, and the phone becomes secondary since that's just fancy new technology.

It's not necessarily an urban/rural split.  Here in Tulsa, a car is basically required to get around town.  The bus system is terrible, and basically unusable.

[PHLBOS]

My apologies.  The primary purpose of my earlier comment where I quoted just your first sentence was an attempt (a poor one in retrospect) to keep the thread focused on teens & driving rather than car phone equipment in general (which most cars teens purchase won't have). 

Side bar & this can qualify for the "You're too old if your remember..." thread: early car phones were all of the handheld variety:





So handhelds were once the only way to go for decades for car phones; though the first pic clearly shows that the driver is stopped or parked.  I've not yet seen hands-free CB mikes as of yet.

Your comment about states banning kids from using any sort of mobile device, handsfree or not, is valid,

It's worth noting that there are some groups out there that want to extend such no phone use bans while driving to all drivers not just teens.  I know, another topic for another thread.

I do notice that the kids I see driving seem to think those laws don't apply to them, as they all CONSTANTLY have a phone in one hand pretty much all the time (they're also prime culprits in the latest stupid fad of leaving three or four car lengths when stopped at a red light because they're so eager to start playing with their dopey phones....I'm always tempted to cut into one of those gaps).

Personally, I've not yet seen nor heard of that fad.  Interesting.

[bugo]

I'd actually go the other way around on that, but I generally hate talking on the phone.  "see you at 430" is a perfectly valid text.

I don't like talking on the phone.  I'd much rather text.  There are no awkward silences during texting.

[bugo]

Same here. My parents were adamant that I had to buy a car myself because they felt if I were financially invested in it I'd be more motivated to maintain it properly and I'd learn to care for cars for when I was out on my own without them to bail me out. My first car was a 1977 Ford Granada I bought for $325 from a guy at my father's office I'd known since I was a kid. The car was a boat, but it (usually) ran, and in some ways it was a very good car for a 16-year-old because it didn't handle nearly as well as the Honda and Volvo sedans my parents drove and on which I'd learned to drive, and it was heavier and the brakes weren't as good. All that meant I had to drive a lot more carefully than I might have in a more modern car. I later sold the Granada to my brother for $400 when he turned 16; at the same time, our father bought a new car for himself and sold me (yes, he required me to pay him for it, which I did in a lump-sum cash payment) his 1982 Accord to take with me to college.

The Granada a "boat"?  It was based on the compact Maverick, which was based on the compact Falcon.  My mom had a '75 and while it would be considered a larger car today, it didn't feel big at all to me.