Will smartphone ownership become a de facto requirement?

[JayhawkCO]

I'm sure I'll think of something else and edit this.

Depending on one's carrier, GSM capability can be a deciding factor for international travel.  I know it has been for me.  Fortunately, I've always been able to find affordable options, even through Verizon.

I used to use the TravelPass for $10/day on Verizon. Expensive, but gives my wife peace of mind. Now I use eSims and it's more like $3/$4 a day for more data than I would get with TravelPass. Purchasing physical sims for each country on a multiple country trip is annoying and takes hours.

[kphoger]

I just make sure that any phone I purchase can roam on both CDMA and GSM networks.

[JayhawkCO]

I just make sure that any phone I purchase can roam on both CDMA and GSM networks.

Now that Sprint has gone away, are there even CDMA-only phones?

[ZLoth]

I just make sure that any phone I purchase can roam on both CDMA and GSM networks.

Now that Sprint has gone away, are there even CDMA-only phones?

Many carriers (such as AT&T and Verizon) shut down CDMA networks in 2022, rendering CDMA handsets unusable for calls, even to 911.

[kphoger]

I just make sure that any phone I purchase can roam on both CDMA and GSM networks.

Now that Sprint has gone away, are there even CDMA-only phones?

Many carriers (such as AT&T and Verizon) shut down CDMA networks in 2022, rendering CDMA handsets unusable for calls, even to 911.

Well, it's been a concern of mine for the last 14 years of cell phone ownership.  If it's a non-issue nowadays, then great.  But it has definitely narrowed down the choices for me in the past when shopping for phones.

[kalvado]

I just make sure that any phone I purchase can roam on both CDMA and GSM networks.

Now that Sprint has gone away, are there even CDMA-only phones?

Many carriers (such as AT&T and Verizon) shut down CDMA networks in 2022, rendering CDMA handsets unusable for calls, even to 911.

Did ATT ever had a CDMA network in US to begin with?
There was a shutdown of 3G network in spring 2022 for sure, that was GSM spectrum re-allocation. That did render phones unable to do voice over 4G unusable. Nothing about CDMA in that. 

[kphoger]

I'm still not quite sure how LTE, CDMA, and GSM all relate to one another...

[kalvado]

I'm still not quite sure how LTE, CDMA, and GSM all relate to one another...

https://www.usmobile.com/blog/lte-gsm-vs-cdma/
As far as I understand, LTE is still mostly an evolution of GSM.

[kphoger]

I'm still not quite sure how LTE, CDMA, and GSM all relate to one another...

https://www.usmobile.com/blog/lte-gsm-vs-cdma/
As far as I understand, LTE is still mostly an evolution of GSM.

What I'm getting from that article is that an LTE phone might use either CDMA or GSM networks for voice calls.  Considering I've seen phone spec sheets that only list LTE bands, that still doesn't help me understand the relationships.

[ZLoth]

I'm still not quite sure how LTE, CDMA, and GSM all relate to one another...

I'll use a very simplified high-level overview: LTE, CDMA (and it's cousin TDMA), and GSM are all various digital methods to send voice and data from the mobile tower to multiple mobile phones on the same frequency.

[kalvado]

I'm still not quite sure how LTE, CDMA, and GSM all relate to one another...

https://www.usmobile.com/blog/lte-gsm-vs-cdma/
As far as I understand, LTE is still mostly an evolution of GSM.

What I'm getting from that article is that an LTE phone might use either CDMA or GSM networks for voice calls.  Considering I've seen phone spec sheets that only list LTE bands, that still doesn't help me understand the relationships.

Looks like a lot of legacy support is being cut off. I don't think you get anything besides lte and 5g in US any more

[Scott5114]

And now old-style 'flip' phones are becoming popular again with the younger crowd, an older friend of mine told me a few days ago that his Android phone just died and that he'll likely be going with a flip phone because he cannot justify the $1.4K dost of a replacement android phone.

Wait, what???? Now, I don't touch the iPhones, but Androids? The fold phones ... I'm not seeing the appeal of them.

If you're seriously interested in flip phones, then chances are it's because you want a device that does one thing and does it well (phone calls, probably, maybe SMS). Which means you're not interested in:

onboard storage... latest version of the Android OS... 3-4 apps ... processor... internal storage space... audiobooks on my phone... microSD card ... professional organizer ... login security device ... remote for my garage door and security system... phone book... navigation device... media player... pager...

I would be extremely uncomfortable tying so many functions into one device because...well, I lose stuff sometimes. I wouldn't want to be locked out of all of my accounts and lose a bunch of data just because my phone happened to slip out of my pocket without me noticing.

In general, I try to avoid using a mobile device as much as is humanly possible because I find the UI decisions made by their developers distasteful. So I have it there basically only to serve as a pointer to actually handle things on a desktop/laptop at the next available opportunity. Thus, while I probably wouldn't opt for it by choice, I could probably manage more or less fine if I were to only have a flip phone.

So, if your phone dies or you lose it...  you just can't get into your home?

How is that different from loosing or damaging a metal key or plastic card?

Generally you don't leave the house with a key that works and then come back to find that the same key, which you've had in your pocket the entire time, no longer works.

[Bruce]

And now old-style 'flip' phones are becoming popular again with the younger crowd, an older friend of mine told me a few days ago that his Android phone just died and that he'll likely be going with a flip phone because he cannot justify the $1.4K dost of a replacement android phone.  I'm also wondering how this will mesh with major sports stadia that have gone to all-smartphone based game ticketing.

Mike

If you have a home computer with a printer or have use of one, you can usually print out the barcode/QR code if you need to.

Doesn't work for Ticketmaster and some other platforms, as they will require the QR code to be able to display the moving watermark or whatever.

[ZLoth]

And now old-style 'flip' phones are becoming popular again with the younger crowd, an older friend of mine told me a few days ago that his Android phone just died and that he'll likely be going with a flip phone because he cannot justify the $1.4K dost of a replacement android phone.

Wait, what???? Now, I don't touch the iPhones, but Androids? The fold phones ... I'm not seeing the appeal of them.

If you're seriously interested in flip phones, then chances are it's because you want a device that does one thing and does it well (phone calls, probably, maybe SMS).

Not flip phones, sir, FOLD phones. There is the Samsung Galaxy Z Flip3 5G and Samsung Galaxy Z Flip4 which start at $1,050, then there is the Samsung Galaxy Z Fold3 5G and Samsung Galaxy Z Fold4 which start at $1,900. Those prices sting, and I'm not exactly trusting the technology that has some moving parts.

onboard storage... latest version of the Android OS... 3-4 apps ... processor... internal storage space... audiobooks on my phone... microSD card ... professional organizer ... login security device ... remote for my garage door and security system... phone book... navigation device... media player... pager...

I would be extremely uncomfortable tying so many functions into one device because...well, I lose stuff sometimes. I wouldn't want to be locked out of all of my accounts and lose a bunch of data just because my phone happened to slip out of my pocket without me noticing.

In general, the items that I need "on the go" aren't stored on the phone exclusively, but on the cloud which can be accessed from multiple devices such as my mobile phone, tablet, or through a web browser or client on my desktop. Updating my contact list, for example, is much easier on my desktop through the web browser than it is on my mobile device, but then the data is easily available and updated. I can also look up a destination on my desktop and then send it to my phone. Tap tap, and now it's time to drive and navigate to my destination.

As for the two-factor authentication (2FA) accounts, I use Authy which stores the 2FA data encrypted on the cloud, but is accessible from my phone as well as the desktop client. (Shame on Google for taking thirteen years to have Gooogle Authenticator backup on the cloud). Same with my passwords.... they are stored encrypted on the web, and only decrypted at the device level.

Am I afraid of losing my stuff on the cloud? Nope. The material that I have stored on online storage (e.g. Google Drive, Dropbox, Box, OneDrive) is backed up to a local NAS server on a nightly basis. It is then uploaded to encrypted folders on two different storage services (Storj, Backblaze) afterwards.

[kalvado]

I would be extremely uncomfortable tying so many functions into one device because...well, I lose stuff sometimes. I wouldn't want to be locked out of all of my accounts and lose a bunch of data just because my phone happened to slip out of my pocket without me noticing.

It's not too different from losing a wallet with ID, credit and debit cards, and what not.

Generally you don't leave the house with a key that works and then come back to find that the same key, which you've had in your pocket the entire time, no longer works.

Depending on how many beers you opened during the day party.
Losing keys is also not that uncommon. Your particular key scenario may depend on having a car, with key either on the same ring or a fob kept separately  - but  I do see  "found some keys" on local socials all the time.

[Scott5114]

I would be extremely uncomfortable tying so many functions into one device because...well, I lose stuff sometimes. I wouldn't want to be locked out of all of my accounts and lose a bunch of data just because my phone happened to slip out of my pocket without me noticing.

It's not too different from losing a wallet with ID, credit and debit cards, and what not.

Generally you don't leave the house with a key that works and then come back to find that the same key, which you've had in your pocket the entire time, no longer works.

Depending on how many beers you opened during the day party.
Losing keys is also not that uncommon. Your particular key scenario may depend on having a car, with key either on the same ring or a fob kept separately  - but  I do see  "found some keys" on local socials all the time.

If I am about to leave my house and I can't find my keys, I know this pretty quickly, and don't leave the house until I find the keys.

If I am about to leave my house and my phone is, I don't necessarily know this before I leave the house (unknowingly locking myself out) because a dead phone looks and feels the same as a live one.

"maybe you should check your phone before you bla bla bla"  Yeah, but sometimes I don't because I'm not thinking about it. Why should I be locked out of my house for that? How does adding yet another thing to check on before leaving actually benefit me?

[kalvado]

I would be extremely uncomfortable tying so many functions into one device because...well, I lose stuff sometimes. I wouldn't want to be locked out of all of my accounts and lose a bunch of data just because my phone happened to slip out of my pocket without me noticing.

It's not too different from losing a wallet with ID, credit and debit cards, and what not.

Generally you don't leave the house with a key that works and then come back to find that the same key, which you've had in your pocket the entire time, no longer works.

Depending on how many beers you opened during the day party.
Losing keys is also not that uncommon. Your particular key scenario may depend on having a car, with key either on the same ring or a fob kept separately  - but  I do see  "found some keys" on local socials all the time.

If I am about to leave my house and I can't find my keys, I know this pretty quickly, and don't leave the house until I find the keys.

If I am about to leave my house and my phone is, I don't necessarily know this before I leave the house (unknowingly locking myself out) because a dead phone looks and feels the same as a live one.

"maybe you should check your phone before you bla bla bla"  Yeah, but sometimes I don't because I'm not thinking about it. Why should I be locked out of my house for that? How does adding yet another thing to check on before leaving actually benefit me?

You never lived with an entry door that locks automatically as you leave, right? Not a common arrangement for residential, but I had a door snap behind me at work with key(card) still inside more than once. It's resolvable, but still a mess...
A family member locking the door as you leave is another plausible scenario.

[Scott5114]

I park in the garage, so I leave through a garage door. The garage door opener doesn't ever leave the car, so it's more or less impossible for me to leave the house without it. If the batteries die, I have a physical metal key to get in the front door as a backup. I can't leave the house without my metal key, as it's on the same ring as the key that starts the car.

[kalvado]

I park in the garage, so I leave through a garage door. The garage door opener doesn't ever leave the car, so it's more or less impossible for me to leave the house without it. If the batteries die, I have a physical metal key to get in the front door as a backup. I can't leave the house without my metal key, as it's on the same ring as the key that starts the car.

Same here, actually. I also have a spare metal key somewhere on the property. But I also have lived in a dorm, rental apartments, with and without a car, with and without building security.
So I experienced many different scenarios of being locked out. Loose knot on necklace and key disappearing somewhere on a playground with lace still there as a... Probably pre-teen? was the most embarrassing.

[mgk920]

Long ago I got into the habit of using the metal key to lock the doors of my residence, car, etc.  It ensures that I have them.  The fob for my current car is part of the metal key, so I now use that to lock the car door.

Mike

[JayhawkCO]

I guess it just comes down to for me, the things I check I have when I walk into the garage are keys, wallet, and phone. It's not quite "spectacles, testicles, wallet, and watch," but close enough. It's not hard for me to remember my phone. I'll be honest and don't understand why it is for others.

[kalvado]

I guess it just comes down to for me, the things I check I have when I walk into the garage are keys, wallet, and phone. It's not quite "spectacles, testicles, wallet, and watch," but close enough. It's not hard for me to remember my phone. I'll be honest and don't understand why it is for others.

A wise man said that you should forget your phone at home once in a while, so when you really need to forget it - things don't look too suspicious...

[JayhawkCO]

I guess it just comes down to for me, the things I check I have when I walk into the garage are keys, wallet, and phone. It's not quite "spectacles, testicles, wallet, and watch," but close enough. It's not hard for me to remember my phone. I'll be honest and don't understand why it is for others.

A wise man said that you should forget your phone at home once in a while, so when you really need to forget it - things don't look too suspicious...

I don't have the time for those kind of shenanigans. My wife can follow my location on GMaps too, because I don't care.

[kphoger]

You never lived with an entry door that locks automatically as you leave, right? Not a common arrangement for residential, but I had a door snap behind me at work with key(card) still inside more than once. It's resolvable, but still a mess...
A family member locking the door as you leave is another plausible scenario.

I've lived in an apartment building whose door locked behind me.  And I've locked myself out of that building before.  Fortunately, I knew a side door that I could jimmy open with my Blockbuster card...

But, what Scott had said originally was that 'you don't leave the house with a key that works and then come back to find that the same key, which you've had in your pocket the entire time, no longer works'.  He means leaving home with a fully functional cell phone, then returning home with a dead battery.  This does not happen with metal keys or plastic keycards:  if it worked when you left home, then it will work when you get back.

[kalvado]

You never lived with an entry door that locks automatically as you leave, right? Not a common arrangement for residential, but I had a door snap behind me at work with key(card) still inside more than once. It's resolvable, but still a mess...
A family member locking the door as you leave is another plausible scenario.

I've lived in an apartment building whose door locked behind me.  And I've locked myself out of that building before.  Fortunately, I knew a side door that I could jimmy open with my Blockbuster card...

But, what Scott had said originally was that 'you don't leave the house with a key that works and then come back to find that the same key, which you've had in your pocket the entire time, no longer works'.  He means leaving home with a fully functional cell phone, then returning home with a dead battery.  This does not happen with metal keys or plastic keycards:  if it worked when you left home, then it will work when you get back.

Of course that is fairly optimistic thought. Key can get damaged - opening beer bottles is one possible cause. Loosing something that passively sits in the pocket all day is also possible.
It may be less common thing, though.
Then, there are cars with chargers in case you bring up car key into discussion. 

My point is, if you are using a physical object for access - you can misplace or damage it, or it can be stollen. GRegardless of what that object is.  Pin code can be forgotten, fingerprint damaged by minor - or not so minor - trauma; retina... ok, let me skip that.
So things are tough without a plan B!