CBD / Downtown / City namings

[Chris]

edit: split from the Dutch freeway thread.

CBD = Central Business District, a common term in British English or East Asia and Oceania. Americans simply call it "downtown".

[agentsteel53]

CBD = Central Business District, a common term in British English or East Asia and Oceania. Americans simply call it "downtown".

I've seen it spelled out in the US, but never as an acronym.  I would have a Hell of a time decoding it; at highway speeds there's no way I'd figure it out in time, and I'd miss my exit.

[J N Winkler]

CBD = Central Business District, a common term in British English or East Asia and Oceania. Americans simply call it "downtown".

Nope, it's the other way around, at least where British usage is concerned.  "Central Business District" is an Americanism that no self-respecting British English speaker would be caught dead using.  The more usual expression in Britain is "City centre" on signs.  "Central Business District" is commonly used on American signs (for example, the exits off the downtown flyover in Wichita are so signed) but tends to be spelled out because the acronym is too obscure.

[english si]

Would it kill them to use some sort of route shield for the route numbers?  When they're all text like that, they tend to blend into the rest of the text on the sign.

Most autoroute/autosnelweg numbers in France and Benelux are in red boxes, like the N331 is one those signs in yellow. That helps matters when looking for them (I do find that France they put comparatively very small little shields at the top of signs, and then two or three flags with a couple of destinations on non-freeway routes making it really awkward for navigation). Germany, and areas influenced by Germany, have sort of shields for autobahn, the UK and RoI just use big road numbers in a different font on motorways, yellow road numbers on primary routes (green signs) and, in the UK anyway, patching for primary routes and motorways on other roads. Road numbers tend to be nice and visible in the UK as we tend to navigate by them far more than in the rest of Europe (though not as much as in the US). Continentals often complain on SSC and SABRE about UK signage and the destinations used and the visibility thereof, because we do focus on numbers and also normally don't sign places the other end of the country that the road works its way to but use vaguer terms like "The NORTH" and "The SOUTH" to cover several big cities and lots of littler places (signed when you get closer) and more local places that would be more useful for the majority of traffic currently on the road.

CBD = Central Business District, a common term in British English or East Asia and Oceania. Americans simply call it "downtown".

Common in geography textbooks and normally abbreviated after the first usage, but signage reflects the common usage of "city centre" or "town centre". Sometimes, in a multi-centred town, you'd use the district name, or the city name (only really in outliers), or "I'm going into town" (even in cities, especially London). I think the only place I've heard of where people say "I'm going to the city" is Milton Keynes, which isn't a city. They also use the term, pronounced with a more definite 't' sound ("the city" rather than "the ci'y") for going to London, which may or may not be to The City, a district, which goes get used in statements: "I work in The City" for instance.

Is US use of downtown mostly due to Manhattan? Most US cities won't have the geography that New York does, so you wouldn't normally go "down" to the city centre as it's not in the southern area, or at the bottom of a hill with the rest of the town spreading up it.

[Scott5114]

In outlying parts of the Oklahoma City metro, "the city" refers to Oklahoma City itself, as opposed to one of the suburbs. If you say "I'm going up to the city" it would mean you are visiting some indiscriminate part of Oklahoma City. If you say "I'm going downtown", that generally means downtown OKC, but may need to disambiguated to "downtown OKC" or "Bricktown" depending on which suburb you're coming from (Norman has an unusually distinct downtown area for a suburb, as does Edmond).

[TheStranger]

Scott5114: I'd say the same thing exists for San Francisco, oft-referred to as "The City".  Downtown for suburbanites would consist of much of the area from the China Basin/Mission Bay area north to Fisherman's Wharf and including the Civic Center, while for residents would more specifically mean Union Square and the Financial District.  As someone who grew up in the suburbs, I tend to think of the area north of Market and east of Van Ness/101 as downtown, and South of Market as a separate but similarly developed neighborhood.

Downtown Oakland and Downtown San Jose are referred to with the city name appended to them, and some of the suburbs have their own little downtowns as well, like the one I grew up in (South San Francisco).

Daly City between SSF and SF has a downtown-like district, but it's called "Top of the Hill."

In Sacramento, we have "downtown" and "midtown," both part of the center city area informally known as "the grid" (where the alphabet letters from A to X form east-west streets, as well as Broadway which used to be Y Street) but with rather distinct neighborhood identities.  I don't think there are really any other areas in the region (beyond the small downtown in the university city of Davis) with "downtown" appellations, though there are several suburbs with "Old Town" areas (Fair Oaks, Elk Grove, Folsom, Roseville).

[Brandon]

We usually refer to the "downtown" area here as the Loop.  Many Chicagoland expressways will have signage for "Chicago Loop" as a control city or with a distance attached.

[allniter89]

It seems I've heard CBD used in the New Orleans area, either in traffic reports or maybe a commercial advertisement on AM radio.
And I believe Philadelphia uses "center city" for the downtown area.
Someplace uses "uptown" iirc

[yanksfan6129]

in NYC, we have TWO "downtowns"==we have midtown, and we have "downtown" which is also known as the financial district.

[corco]

McCall, Idaho proudly refers to its downtown as the "Central Business District." It drives me nuts.

Laramie as far as I know is just downtown.

[TheStranger]

We usually refer to the "downtown" area here as the Loop.  Many Chicagoland expressways will have signage for "Chicago Loop" as a control city or with a distance attached.

Out of curiosity, what's the furthest out that downtown is signed on the expressways?

California comparison:

Downtown San Francisco is first signed on I-280 at the Alemany Boulevard exit (approximately mile marker 52) going northbound (and noted on the US 101 northbound exit for 280, approximately mile marker 431), both about 2 miles into the city limits.

Downtown Sacramento receives mentions on specific exits (the 275/50 split, 10th and 5th Street exits off of US 50) but is not used as a control city for any of the freeways.

Downtown San Jose is mentioned as the control city for I-280 north from US 101 in San Jose (from southbound US 101, the control city is San Francisco).  Route 87 north is signed for Downtown San Jose off of its terminus at Route 85.

Along US 101, Downtown Los Angeles is not signed at all southbound (with Los Angeles remaining the control city for many miles within the city limits), while northbound, Los Angeles Civic Center is the control city where I-5 splits off the Santa Ana Freeway outside of the city limits.  I-110 northbound (Harbor Freeway) IIRC is signed for Los Angeles until somewhere north of I-105, then for Pasadena/Hollywood from I-10 north where downtown begins; southbound Route 110 (Arroyo Seco Pkwy/Pasadena Freeway) is signed for Los Angeles until the Four-Level (where I-110 signage begins and the San Pedro control city starts).


In San Diego, Route 94 west lacks a control city for the most part except for jumbled legend referencing downtown (and several other attractions) about 2-3 miles from the terminus at I-5; I-5 at Route 15 in Bario Logan does not have any control city northbound and I-5 south at I-8 lacks a control city southbound, but is noted for "Downtown" at the 5/805 split.  Route 163 south has Downtown as a control city at the interchange with 805 south.

[agentsteel53]

I-5 south ... is noted for "Downtown" at the 5/805 split. 

that's the farthest I can think of.  About 15 miles?

[Brandon]

We usually refer to the "downtown" area here as the Loop.  Many Chicagoland expressways will have signage for "Chicago Loop" as a control city or with a distance attached.

Out of curiosity, what's the furthest out that downtown is signed on the expressways?

"Chicago Loop" is mentioned on distance signs on I-55 northbound.  One is at Mile 254, and one is at Mile 262.  That's 40 miles and 32 miles from Lake Shore Drive, respectively.  Interestingly enough, LSD appears as a control "city" on I-55 at Mile 291.

[TheStranger]

I-5 south ... is noted for "Downtown" at the 5/805 split. 

that's the farthest I can think of.  About 15 miles?

Correct - about 15 miles between the 805 and 163 junctions.  (Interestingly, 805/163 is actually the shorter route!)

[PAHighways]

In Pittsburgh it is "downtown" or "Golden Triangle" while Philadelphia uses "center city."

[tdindy88]

While most people do refer to Downtown Indianapolis as just Downtown, the term "Mile Square" has also been used for the centermost part of the city, refering to the orginial city plan for Indianapolis. As the name suggests, the region is exactly one square mile in area.

[huskeroadgeek]

Charlotte, NC uses the term "Uptown" for their business district because it is at the highest point of elevation in the city.

[golden eagle]

I've always heard downtown for Jackson.

[TheHighwayMan3561]

Minneapolis, St. Paul, and Duluth use "downtown." Many smaller cities in Minnesota use "business district," however.

In Minneapolis, "Uptown" refers to the area on and close to Lake Street south of downtown.

[SSOWorld]

Minneapolis, St. Paul, and Duluth use "downtown." Many smaller cities in Minnesota use "business district," however.

In Minneapolis, "Uptown" refers to the area on and close to Lake Street south of downtown.

Kinda backwards isn't it

[3467]

I first heard it in Geography interestingly enough @ U of Chicago.
Chicago loop was not control signed at that time Chicago milage on the interstates and US routes in has always been to the Loop exactly where I am not sure 88 has 155 miles at the Quad Cities My math puts that almost in the lake
The Ike was the only road that every said city limits and loop on a sign.

[Brandon]

^^ There's several signs out there (even on the turnpikes) with a distance to Chicago, but none of them list "Chicago Loop".  The furthest out sign for "Chicago Loop" that I know of is I-55 Mile 254 with a distance of 41 miles (double checked this morning).  That sign also lists US-30 and Interstate 294 for mileage.

[Michael in Philly]

Philadelphians say "Center City."  "Downtown," to old-timers, means South Philadelphia.  The "Center City" usage shows up - even on road signs - in some nearby cities like Reading, Pa., Allentown, Pa., Wilmington, Del.  But if we were referring to the downtown of a city outside the region, we'd just say "downtown."

[deathtopumpkins]

I've heard the acronym CBD used before, and have used it in conversation with people who knew what it meant.

As for Hampton Roads (at least the Peninsula anyway), if you're going to downtown Norfolk, you just say Norfolk, and downtown Portsmouth = Portsmouth, but Virginia Beach you always specify which specific development ("town center" or "the oceanfront"), and Hampton and Newport News are preceeded by Downtown.

Freeway signage mostly corresponds with this. Downtown Newport News and Downtown Hampton are used for exits on I-64 (in fact Downtown Norfolk is one of the control points used for I-664's exit), and I-264 uses "Va Beach Oceanfront" as a control point, but I do believe once inside the Norfolk and Portsmouth city limits I-264 uses "Downtown Norfolk".

[Mr_Northside]

In Pittsburgh it is "downtown"

Or better put... "Dahn-Tahn"