You are too old if you remember.......

[Brandon]

"Pop"? 

No, 
Soda is short for baking soda, or it is a caustic substance.  Not what I'd want to drink.  Give me a pop.

[sandiaman]

That's  wierd  because  I  too  got  Channel  2  from  Midland -Odessa   Texas early  one  Saturday  morning on  what  should  have  been  KTVU  (channel 2)  in  Oakland.  California.    It  was  very fuzzy  reception  and  nobody  beleived me,   .  Must have  been  one  super  strong  signal.  This  was  back  in  the early  60's.

[Brandon]

Before  ths  days  of  cable  and  traslators,  every  metro  area  had  at  least  three  local stations ,one  for each  of  the major networks.  This  is  going  back  to  the  mid 50's.  Generally,  NBC  was  channel 4,  ABC  was channel 7 and  CBS  was  either    channel  5  or  channel 2.   PBS  was  whatever  was  leftover.  And  yes,  they  did  exit  off  the  air  with  some  sort  of  patriotic  song.  No  area  could  have  both  a  channel  3  and  channel  4 .

That could be variable depending on the area.

In Chicago, WBBM (CBS) was on 2, WMAQ (NBC) was on 5, and WLS (ABC) was on 7.  In addition, you had WGN on 9 and WTTW (PBS) on 11.  Other stuff was on UHF such as WFLD (Fox) at 32.

However, some areas got a little bit more due to their location.  Detroit could get ABC, CBS, NBC, and CBC (out of Windsor).

[PHLBOS]

There is an I-495 sign at the very beginning of the broadcast - it looks like a fairly modern font...but apparently it has been used for at least the last 35 years

In MA, most Interstate shields have used FHWA fonts (series C & D) almost from the get-go. 

The neutered (no state-name) shield shown is 1970-spec'd.  MA was fairly early in adopting using neutered I-shields for stand-alone signs.  That sign & BGS' (for US 3 & the Lowell Connector) in a later shot were probably less than a year old at the time.

[agentsteel53]

In MA, most Interstate shields have used FHWA fonts (series C & D) almost from the get-go. 

I just picked up a 91 with 10" custom font that was placed on a '57 blank.  the move to 10" numbers didn't come until ~1970 so there were definitely stragglers.

The neutered (no state-name) shield shown is 1970-spec'd.  MA was fairly early in adopting using neutered I-shields for stand-alone signs.  That sign & BGS' (for US 3 & the Lowell Connector) in a later shot were probably less than a year old at the time.

do you know if this happened in 1978, when many states adopted the neutered shield, or was it earlier?  I remember by 1986 there were hardly any state-named shields left, in stark contrast to the surrounding states.  plenty of NH and RI to be seen.

[agentsteel53]

Ability to pick up AM radio signals at locations far from the source depends on both atmospheric conditions and the output power of the station, as well as how close adjacent local stations are in frequency.  On clear winter nights at my sister's house in central Illinois, I've easily picked up signals from WBZ AM in Boston.

"Bandscanning", as it's referred to, of the AM broadcast and shortwave bands is popular with many radio hobbyists.

I was thinking that because of the Rockies in the middle, the LA-Omaha hop was unusual.

though, I suppose, given the height of the ionosphere relative to terrestrial features, the Rockies aren't much of an impediment at all.

[agentsteel53]

"Pop"? 

No, 
Soda is short for baking soda, or it is a caustic substance.  Not what I'd want to drink.  Give me a pop.

pop is a caustic substance.  have you listened to the radio recently?

[vtk]

Ability to pick up AM radio signals at locations far from the source depends on both atmospheric conditions and the output power of the station, as well as how close adjacent local stations are in frequency.  On clear winter nights at my sister's house in central Illinois, I've easily picked up signals from WBZ AM in Boston.

"Bandscanning", as it's referred to, of the AM broadcast and shortwave bands is popular with many radio hobbyists.

I was thinking that because of the Rockies in the middle, the LA-Omaha hop was unusual.

though, I suppose, given the height of the ionosphere relative to terrestrial features, the Rockies aren't much of an impediment at all.

The mountains are fairly insignificant compared to planetary curvature over such long distances.  That's the real obstacle.

[PHLBOS]

In MA, most Interstate shields have used FHWA fonts (series C & D) almost from the get-go. 

I just picked up a 91 with 10" custom font that was placed on a '57 blank.  the move to 10" numbers didn't come until ~1970 so there were definitely stragglers.

Reread my post again.  I was referring to fonts not letter heights.  The sign you're describing is likely a one-off repair job; probably by an independent contractor.

The neutered (no state-name) shield shown is 1970-spec'd.  MA was fairly early in adopting using neutered I-shields for stand-alone signs.  That sign & BGS' (for US 3 & the Lowell Connector) in a later shot were probably less than a year old at the time.

do you know if this happened in 1978, when many states adopted the neutered shield, or was it earlier?

I started seeing neutered I-shields along I-95 (between Topsfield & Boxford) circa 1973-74. 

[agentsteel53]

In MA, most Interstate shields have used FHWA fonts (series C & D) almost from the get-go. 

I just picked up a 91 with 10" custom font that was placed on a '57 blank.  the move to 10" numbers didn't come until ~1970 so there were definitely stragglers.

Reread my post again.  I was referring to fonts not letter heights.  The sign you're describing is likely a one-off repair job; probably by an independent contractor.

by 10" custom font I mean "not FHWA".

[HurrMark]

There is an I-495 sign at the very beginning of the broadcast - it looks like a fairly modern font...but apparently it has been used for at least the last 35 years

In MA, most Interstate shields have used FHWA fonts (series C & D) almost from the get-go. 

The neutered (no state-name) shield shown is 1970-spec'd.  MA was fairly early in adopting using neutered I-shields for stand-alone signs.  That sign & BGS' (for US 3 & the Lowell Connector) in a later shot were probably less than a year old at the time.

I didn't see the US 3 sign...I do find it interesting that even today, they still use the "California style" cutouts on sign posts.

By the way, another question...the video shows the "infamous" shot that most people who have read about the Blizzard of 78 has seen, with cars buried on 93 at route 138. The exit number is 64N...which is now 2B. I thought that the exit numbers along 93/128 changed by 1978 to the current numbering system. Or did the MassDOT just not get to changing at particular sign by that point?

[roadman]

There is an I-495 sign at the very beginning of the broadcast - it looks like a fairly modern font...but apparently it has been used for at least the last 35 years

In MA, most Interstate shields have used FHWA fonts (series C & D) almost from the get-go. 

The neutered (no state-name) shield shown is 1970-spec'd.  MA was fairly early in adopting using neutered I-shields for stand-alone signs.  That sign & BGS' (for US 3 & the Lowell Connector) in a later shot were probably less than a year old at the time.

I didn't see the US 3 sign...I do find it interesting that even today, they still use the "California style" cutouts on sign posts.

By the way, another question...the video shows the "infamous" shot that most people who have read about the Blizzard of 78 has seen, with cars buried on 93 at route 138. The exit number is 64N...which is now 2B. I thought that the exit numbers along 93/128 changed by 1978 to the current numbering system. Or did the MassDOT just not get to changing at particular sign by that point?

The US 3 shields between Burlington and Tyngsborough, which were installed as part of the late 1990s sign update project and reset during the subsequent widening, were made as cutouts so they could be mounted on twin telescopic posts.  If the current MUTCD standard for stand-alone M1-4 shields were followed, the sign assemblies would have been too large in area for the posts to hold them (triple telescopic posts are not considered to be an acceptable breakaway support and can only be used in protected areas).

Note that the US 3 sign work predated MassHighway's eventual adoption of single steel beam posts in concrete foundations for larger route assemblies on freeway mainlines(like those installed on the I-95/128 overlap section) by just over a decade.

[PHLBOS]

By the way, another question...the video shows the "infamous" shot that most people who have read about the Blizzard of 78 has seen, with cars buried on 93 at route 138. The exit number is 64N...which is now 2B. I thought that the exit numbers along 93/128 changed by 1978 to the current numbering system. Or did the MassDOT just not get to changing at particular sign by that point?

The current exit numbers along I-93 (including the YDH/128 section) didn't occur until 1987. 

The exit number changes along the I-95 section of YDH/128 coincided with the opening of the I-95/128 interchange (Exit 45/29) in Peabody circa 1988.

One needs to remember that in 1978, blizzard or no blizzard, very few BGS' along YDH/128 had yet sported I-95 or I-93 shields.  One or two of those old Canton photos show the then-brand-new 95 NORTH Dedham N.H.-Maine pull-through BGS' that were erected about a year earlier along with a back-side view of a then-new I-93 reassurance shield.  Plus, one still needed to do a Breezewood from YDH/128 onto US 1 North (old Exit 30N(B), current Exit 44B) in Peabody in order to get-on I-95 North Proper back then.  That's likely the real reason why the MassDPW (predecessor to MassHighway & MassDOT) held off on changing the exit numbers.  Full-blown BGS' directing motorists of such weren't erected until 1982.

Many early 70s-vintage BGS' that only show 128 shields (obviously predating the I-95/93 redesignations) survived into the 1990s; well after the exit number changes (the old exit tabs were either covered up or completely replaced).

[HurrMark]

By the way, another question...the video shows the "infamous" shot that most people who have read about the Blizzard of 78 has seen, with cars buried on 93 at route 138. The exit number is 64N...which is now 2B. I thought that the exit numbers along 93/128 changed by 1978 to the current numbering system. Or did the MassDOT just not get to changing at particular sign by that point?

The current exit numbers along I-93 (including the YDH/128 section) didn't occur until 1987. 

Surprised it was that late.

Many early 70s-vintage BGS' that only show 128 shields (obviously predating the I-95/93 redesignations) survived into the 1990s; well after the exit number changes (the old exit tabs were either covered up or completely replaced).

There is still at least one in existance...along Route 9 going eastbound towards 128 in Newton.

[agentsteel53]

I was browsing through some of the Boston logos and came across this...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=i7Co26eXgNg

There is an I-495 sign at the very beginning of the broadcast - it looks like a fairly modern font...but apparently it has been used for at least the last 35 years

the "breathing" of that video is completely unnerving.  I can't stand 30 seconds, never mind the full 13 minutes.

anyone want to screen-shot me the US 3 shield?

[agentsteel53]

The US 3 shields between Burlington and Tyngsborough, which were installed as part of the late 1990s sign update project and reset during the subsequent widening, were made as cutouts so they could be mounted on twin telescopic posts.  If the current MUTCD standard for stand-alone M1-4 shields were followed, the sign assemblies would have been too large in area for the posts to hold them (triple telescopic posts are not considered to be an acceptable breakaway support and can only be used in protected areas).

a 36x36 square is too heavy for twin telescope posts, but a 45x36 interstate shield is not?  apparently there is that much cut away to make an interstate shield?

[PHLBOS]

I was browsing through some of the Boston logos and came across this...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=i7Co26eXgNg

There is an I-495 sign at the very beginning of the broadcast - it looks like a fairly modern font...but apparently it has been used for at least the last 35 years

the "breathing" of that video is completely unnerving.  I can't stand 30 seconds, never mind the full 13 minutes.

anyone want to screen-shot me the US 3 shield?

The I-495 is shown at around 0:30, the BGS' are shown at around 0:40 0:34.  Just move the "scroll" to that time interval.

[agentsteel53]

I can barely make out that that is a 3 shield.  if you can say that that is California style (with US above the number) I will assume you saw the sign in a different context, because from that video one simply cannot tell.

[PHLBOS]

The only US 3 shield I'm referring to is on the BGS at 0:34 and it has no U.S. heading.  Yes, it's a bit hard to read given the weather conditions and age of the news footage but it was filmed along I-495 Northbound just outside of Lowell and near the US 3 & Lowell Connector interchanges (then Exits 35A-B & 36/current Exits 35-A-B-C).

The monolithic/dual-BGS' read:

     EXIT 36                        EXITS 35A-B

      Lowell                                 3
    Connector                       Burlington
                                       Nashua, N.H.
______________________________________________
           RIGHT *can't read/recall the rest*

I believe that the cut-out US 3 shields that roadman's referring are ones installed in the 1990s and obviously wouldn't be shown in a 1978 news video.

[agentsteel53]

I believe that the cut-out US 3 shields that roadman's referring are ones installed in the 1990s and obviously wouldn't be shown in a 1978 news video.

those are not "California style" either.  they, in fact, are just shields designed for BGS application but mounted on posts.  they have no outer border. 



that looks to be a 48 inch shield.  why would MassDOT install such huge shields, as opposed to just going with standard 36x36?

[PHLBOS]

those are not "California style" either.

Neither I nor roadman ever said they were.

The California style reference came from HurrMark and I think he was just referring to the usage of cut-out US shields for trailblazer/reassurance signs in general and not how Caltrans details their US shields per say.

Cut him some slack, he's fairly new here.

Surprised it was that late.

If you look through past threads, especially in the Northeast section, you'll get a more comprehesive history of the 95-93-128 controversey and why many locals still refer to it as Route 128 decades after most of it received Interstate designations.  The late exit number changes were part of that.

There is still at least one in existance...along Route 9 going eastbound towards 128 in Newton.

And that is likely the only one I'm aware of that's still around (at least as of last November).

[HurrMark]

Thanks PHLBOS...that's what I meant. I should have been more specific.

[roadman]

The US 3 shields between Burlington and Tyngsborough, which were installed as part of the late 1990s sign update project and reset during the subsequent widening, were made as cutouts so they could be mounted on twin telescopic posts.  If the current MUTCD standard for stand-alone M1-4 shields were followed, the sign assemblies would have been too large in area for the posts to hold them (triple telescopic posts are not considered to be an acceptable breakaway support and can only be used in protected areas).

a 36x36 square is too heavy for twin telescope posts, but a 45x36 interstate shield is not?  apparently there is that much cut away to make an interstate shield?

The US 3 shields north of Burlington are indeed 48" X 48".  Using a cutout instead of a square loses enough material to account for the cardinal direction plate and keep the overall area at 20 square feet or under (MassDOT standard for twin telescopic posts).  And the issue with telescopic posts is not so much weight (dead load) as it is wind loading.  Note that this project was done in the era before MassHighway started requiring slip bases for twin telescopic post installations.

As the 48" x 48" shields are shown on the Route 3 Burlington to Tyngsborough project plans (Project #601167), I can only presume this was a designer error that went unnoticed during the project review stage.

[roadman]

There is still at least one in existance...along Route 9 going eastbound towards 128 in Newton.

And that is likely the only one I'm aware of that's still around (at least as of last November).

You are both correct, that is the last remaining overhead BGS panel within the Canton to Peabody overlap section with a 128 shield instead of I-95.  BTW, that panel (and the structure) will eventually be replaced under the final (Needham to Wellesley) section of the I-95 "Add-a-Lane" project scheduled for advertisement later this fall.

[roadman]

More from television.  You are too old if you remember a) when a "season" for a television show consisted of at least 24 new episodes and b) when no more than two minutes of a half-hour program was devoted to commericals (I believe the industry average now for commercials is ten to twelve minutes per half hour).

And, with the exception of automobiles, not only did product placement in shows not exist, but producers went out of their way to use fake brand names for common products shown.