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Author Topic: Massachusetts  (Read 208306 times)

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Re: Massachusetts
« Reply #1225 on: August 14, 2019, 03:24:01 PM »

What about keeping I-93 as is but, make MA 24 into a spur route of I-93, such as I-193? Then nothing else but MA 24 has to change...

SM-G900P

MA 193 already exists. I recommend I-593.
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The Ghostbuster

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Re: Massachusetts
« Reply #1226 on: August 14, 2019, 05:10:57 PM »

Or maybe leave MA 24 as... MA 24. Proposals to make MA 24 an Interstate have gone nowhere over the last couple of decades, and I don't expect that to change in the future.
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Pete from Boston

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Re: Massachusetts
« Reply #1227 on: August 14, 2019, 05:55:09 PM »

Or maybe leave MA 24 as... MA 24. Proposals to make MA 24 an Interstate have gone nowhere over the last couple of decades, and I don't expect that to change in the future.

Yet they still exist, for the same reason as always – there’s always going to be a significant push in the South Coast region for economic boosts, and an Interstate connection to Boston would go a long way to satisfy that desire.

This makes me have to ask, aside from how it transitions to surface boulevards at either end, is there any significant reason why 140 between 24 and US 6 could not be an Interstate spur itself? Assuming 24 down there ever qualified as an Interstate, that is.
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Pete from Boston

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Re: Massachusetts
« Reply #1228 on: August 14, 2019, 05:56:28 PM »

Roadgeekery in the mainstream: WGBH discusses the “bookleaf” shape of Massachusetts town-line signs.

https://www.wgbh.org/news/lifestyle/2019/08/13/why-are-town-line-signs-in-massachusetts-shaped-like-a-book
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Re: Massachusetts
« Reply #1229 on: August 14, 2019, 10:41:34 PM »

What about keeping I-93 as is but, make MA 24 into a spur route of I-93, such as I-193? Then nothing else but MA 24 has to change...

SM-G900P

MA 193 already exists. I recommend I-593.
IMO Given that it would run between 2 interstates and cross a third, an even number would work better, I-293? That would be useful if there was thought of signing the more interstate ready portion north of I-495 first. Of course, we all know that if I-93 is to be rerouted, it should be down MA 3 to US 6 at the Sagamore Bridge.  :D

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Re: Massachusetts
« Reply #1230 on: August 19, 2019, 09:12:18 AM »

What about keeping I-93 as is but, make MA 24 into a spur route of I-93, such as I-193? Then nothing else but MA 24 has to change...

SM-G900P

MA 193 already exists. I recommend I-593.
IMO Given that it would run between 2 interstates and cross a third, an even number would work better, I-293? That would be useful if there was thought of signing the more interstate ready portion north of I-495 first.
I've had the thought of redesignating MA 24 as I-293 (from I-195 northward) since the 1980s.
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mb2001

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Re: Massachusetts
« Reply #1231 on: August 20, 2019, 10:33:44 PM »

What about keeping I-93 as is but, make MA 24 into a spur route of I-93, such as I-193? Then nothing else but MA 24 has to change...

SM-G900P

MA 193 already exists. I recommend I-593.
IMO Given that it would run between 2 interstates and cross a third, an even number would work better, I-293? That would be useful if there was thought of signing the more interstate ready portion north of I-495 first.
I've had the thought of redesignating MA 24 as I-293 (from I-195 northward) since the 1980s.

The only problem is that I-293 already exists up in NH. They're in separate states so it's legal, but I'd recommend choosing a different number.
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PHLBOS

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Re: Massachusetts
« Reply #1232 on: August 21, 2019, 08:25:57 AM »

What about keeping I-93 as is but, make MA 24 into a spur route of I-93, such as I-193? Then nothing else but MA 24 has to change...

MA 193 already exists. I recommend I-593.
IMO Given that it would run between 2 interstates and cross a third, an even number would work better, I-293? That would be useful if there was thought of signing the more interstate ready portion north of I-495 first.
I've had the thought of redesignating MA 24 as I-293 (from I-195 northward) since the 1980s.

The only problem is that I-293 already exists up in NH. They're in separate states so it's legal, but I'd recommend choosing a different number.
MA 24 is far enough away from NH's I-293 so that (if it were to ever happen) redesignating it as such will not cause any confusion between those two routes.  The two I-291s in MA & CT are in much closer proximity and there's no confusion/mix-up issues regarding those two routes that I'm aware of.  If we were discussion doing such with MA 213 OTOH; your concern for confusion would be more warranted.

Truth be told, I don't believe there is a hard, fast rule regarding the minimum distance that two separate 3dis bearing the same route number in adjacent states can be from each other.
« Last Edit: August 21, 2019, 08:28:38 AM by PHLBOS »
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bob7374

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Re: Massachusetts
« Reply #1233 on: August 21, 2019, 12:17:58 PM »

What about keeping I-93 as is but, make MA 24 into a spur route of I-93, such as I-193? Then nothing else but MA 24 has to change...

MA 193 already exists. I recommend I-593.
IMO Given that it would run between 2 interstates and cross a third, an even number would work better, I-293? That would be useful if there was thought of signing the more interstate ready portion north of I-495 first.
I've had the thought of redesignating MA 24 as I-293 (from I-195 northward) since the 1980s.

The only problem is that I-293 already exists up in NH. They're in separate states so it's legal, but I'd recommend choosing a different number.
MA 24 is far enough away from NH's I-293 so that (if it were to ever happen) redesignating it as such will not cause any confusion between those two routes.  The two I-291s in MA & CT are in much closer proximity and there's no confusion/mix-up issues regarding those two routes that I'm aware of.  If we were discussion doing such with MA 213 OTOH; your concern for confusion would be more warranted.

Truth be told, I don't believe there is a hard, fast rule regarding the minimum distance that two separate 3dis bearing the same route number in adjacent states can be from each other.
This article from earlier this year talks about safety problems on Route 24 brings up current planned projects and the past proposals to upgrade the road to interstate standards. A member of the organization that pushed for an interstate designation about 10 years ago says that now it would be long-term and expensive project, if MassDOT decides to proceed.
https://www.heraldnews.com/news/20190304/road-from-hell-route-24-is-dangerous-deadly-highway

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Re: Massachusetts
« Reply #1234 on: August 30, 2019, 01:37:32 PM »

Roadgeekery in the mainstream: WGBH discusses the “bookleaf” shape of Massachusetts town-line signs.

https://www.wgbh.org/news/lifestyle/2019/08/13/why-are-town-line-signs-in-massachusetts-shaped-like-a-book

Gotta love how the very question posed by the headline, that is to say the whole central premise of the article, is off-handedly thrown away as unknown once you actually read it. :-D
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Re: Massachusetts
« Reply #1235 on: August 30, 2019, 02:09:47 PM »

Roadgeekery in the mainstream: WGBH discusses the “bookleaf” shape of Massachusetts town-line signs.

https://www.wgbh.org/news/lifestyle/2019/08/13/why-are-town-line-signs-in-massachusetts-shaped-like-a-book

Gotta love how the very question posed by the headline, that is to say the whole central premise of the article, is off-handedly thrown away as unknown once you actually read it. :-D
It's worth noting, and such is not mentioned in the above-article, that prior to the mid-1970s(?); the bookleaf design motif ran along the bottom of the sign as well. 
Example.
I don't believe that one has to have a Facebook account to view.

From the movie Alice's Restaurant: See 1:13:30 for old-style bookleaf sign.
« Last Edit: August 30, 2019, 02:21:40 PM by PHLBOS »
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jp the roadgeek

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Re: Massachusetts
« Reply #1236 on: August 30, 2019, 03:33:21 PM »

Roadgeekery in the mainstream: WGBH discusses the “bookleaf” shape of Massachusetts town-line signs.

https://www.wgbh.org/news/lifestyle/2019/08/13/why-are-town-line-signs-in-massachusetts-shaped-like-a-book

Gotta love how the very question posed by the headline, that is to say the whole central premise of the article, is off-handedly thrown away as unknown once you actually read it. :-D
It's worth noting, and such is not mentioned in the above-article, that prior to the mid-1970s(?); the bookleaf design motif ran along the bottom of the sign as well. 
Example.
I don't believe that one has to have a Facebook account to view.

From the movie Alice's Restaurant: See 1:13:30 for old-style bookleaf sign.

I've always wondered where that NY border crossing at 1:13:54 is located.  There's really no spot that I'm familiar with where a highway runs so close parallel to the CT/NY border like that.  At least the MA/CT crossing looks like US 7 between Sheffield and North Canaan.
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Re: Massachusetts
« Reply #1237 on: August 30, 2019, 06:22:36 PM »

The only one I'm aware of NY Route 120A by Greenwich. The bridge for it spans the state line over the Hutchinson River Parkway/Merritt Parkway (CT Route 15). Also note the change in median style by the bridge.

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Re: Massachusetts
« Reply #1238 on: August 31, 2019, 10:43:06 AM »

MassDOT has advertised for bids for the US 1 Chelsea to Danvers Sign Replacement Project, winning bidder to be announced on November 19. The project page with a link to the Notice to Contractors is at:
https://www.commbuys.com/bso/external/bidDetail.sdo?docId=BD-20-1030-0H100-0H002-43289&external=true&parentUrl=bid

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Re: Massachusetts
« Reply #1239 on: September 01, 2019, 12:42:12 AM »

Roadgeekery in the mainstream: WGBH discusses the “bookleaf” shape of Massachusetts town-line signs.

https://www.wgbh.org/news/lifestyle/2019/08/13/why-are-town-line-signs-in-massachusetts-shaped-like-a-book

Gotta love how the very question posed by the headline, that is to say the whole central premise of the article, is off-handedly thrown away as unknown once you actually read it. :-D
It's worth noting, and such is not mentioned in the above-article, that prior to the mid-1970s(?); the bookleaf design motif ran along the bottom of the sign as well. 
Example.
I don't believe that one has to have a Facebook account to view.

From the movie Alice's Restaurant: See 1:13:30 for old-style bookleaf sign.

I've always wondered where that NY border crossing at 1:13:54 is located.  There's really no spot that I'm familiar with where a highway runs so close parallel to the CT/NY border like that.  At least the MA/CT crossing looks like US 7 between Sheffield and North Canaan.
That seems like a movie setup. The sign just smacks of unofficialness.

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Re: Massachusetts
« Reply #1240 on: September 01, 2019, 05:20:15 PM »

I'm also pretty sure that the bookleaf sign on route 7 in the 1960s coming to/from from Connecticut was on the US 7 North side of the road (same as it is today), and not the southbound side as seen in the movie. Michael Summa has a pic of the entering Mass side of this very sign that's up on Steve's site, and it's on the opposite side of their van.

I'm also fairly certain even the old bookleafs would say "Welcome to Town Name, ST" and not just "CONNECITCUT."
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Re: Massachusetts
« Reply #1241 on: September 04, 2019, 09:39:09 AM »

I'm also pretty sure that the bookleaf sign on route 7 in the 1960s coming to/from from Connecticut was on the US 7 North side of the road (same as it is today), and not the southbound side as seen in the movie. Michael Summa has a pic of the entering Mass side of this very sign that's up on Steve's site, and it's on the opposite side of their van.

I'm also fairly certain even the old bookleafs would say "Welcome to Town Name, ST" and not just "CONNECITCUT."

At state borders, Massachusetts-installed bookleaf signs typically read 'ENTERING (town and state) - without a state shield or an EST (or INC) date - for the adjacent state.
« Last Edit: September 04, 2019, 01:56:42 PM by roadman »
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Re: Massachusetts
« Reply #1242 on: September 04, 2019, 02:10:30 PM »

The state seal is usually missing when entering the bordering state. This was MA Route 111, coming in from Pepperell, MA in August of 2018.

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Re: Massachusetts
« Reply #1243 on: September 04, 2019, 03:03:46 PM »

At state borders, Massachusetts-installed bookleaf signs typically read 'ENTERING (town and state) - without a state shield or an EST (or INC) date - for the adjacent state.

With at least one exception:  Where I-95 enters Rhode Island, the side of the bookleaf sign which says "ENTERING PAWTUCKET R.I." also has the RI state shield.

A bit hard to see, but here it is on GSV:  https://www.google.com/maps/@41.8944795,-71.3758556,3a,75y,210.2h,99.76t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1siMaLHgeG6pwUpJmVPA7rXg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
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Re: Massachusetts
« Reply #1244 on: September 04, 2019, 03:12:24 PM »

Managed to get a better shot for you! :)

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Re: Massachusetts
« Reply #1245 on: September 04, 2019, 03:14:35 PM »

At state borders, Massachusetts-installed bookleaf signs typically read 'ENTERING (town and state) - without a state shield or an EST (or INC) date - for the adjacent state.

With at least one exception:  Where I-95 enters Rhode Island, the side of the bookleaf sign which says "ENTERING PAWTUCKET R.I." also has the RI state shield.

A bit hard to see, but here it is on GSV:  https://www.google.com/maps/@41.8944795,-71.3758556,3a,75y,210.2h,99.76t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1siMaLHgeG6pwUpJmVPA7rXg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
Managed to get a better shot for you! :)


It would appear that the rusted sign post is as old as this overhead gantry and sign panels.  Such dates back to 1977.  While the bookleaf sign is newer; one has to wonder if such was a match-in-kind replacement.
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jp the roadgeek

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Re: Massachusetts
« Reply #1246 on: September 04, 2019, 04:35:08 PM »

Looks like there's a few at the MA/NY border.  The ones for MA/NY 23 and MA/NY 71 are pretty blurry, but I found this one on US 20. 

Found this one with the CT symbol at the border on CT/MA 8.  The newer ones, such as the one just south of Six Flags on CT/MA 159, omit the CT state shield.
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Re: Massachusetts
« Reply #1247 on: September 05, 2019, 08:33:30 AM »

Looks like there's a few at the MA/NY border.  The ones for MA/NY 23 and MA/NY 71 are pretty blurry, but I found this one on US 20. 

Found this one with the CT symbol at the border on CT/MA 8.
It's interesting that those signs feature the Massachusetts shield on the side listing another state's town.
« Last Edit: September 05, 2019, 08:40:07 AM by PHLBOS »
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AMLNet49

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Re: Massachusetts
« Reply #1248 on: September 14, 2019, 11:54:01 PM »

MassDOT has advertised for bids for the US 1 Chelsea to Danvers Sign Replacement Project, winning bidder to be announced on November 19. The project page with a link to the Notice to Contractors is at:
https://www.commbuys.com/bso/external/bidDetail.sdo?docId=BD-20-1030-0H100-0H002-43289&external=true&parentUrl=bid

Would love to see exit numbers on this part of US 1. And on Route 1A between I-93 and MA 145
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Pete from Boston

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Re: Massachusetts
« Reply #1249 on: September 15, 2019, 08:04:21 AM »

MassDOT has advertised for bids for the US 1 Chelsea to Danvers Sign Replacement Project, winning bidder to be announced on November 19. The project page with a link to the Notice to Contractors is at:
https://www.commbuys.com/bso/external/bidDetail.sdo?docId=BD-20-1030-0H100-0H002-43289&external=true&parentUrl=bid

Would love to see exit numbers on this part of US 1. And on Route 1A between I-93 and MA 145

Both have a fair number of side streets. I’m assuming you don’t number those.
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