New Jersey Turnpike

[jeffandnicole]

The new signs are nice, but some of the mileage on the signs near the exits should be corrected. For instance, the sign pictured in the link below should say 'next right' or 'keep right' instead of 1/4 mile..since it is shorter than that.
https://www.google.com/maps/@40.4685575,-74.408315,16z

The link is only pulling up the generic overhead map.

Regardless, generic terms (keep right/next right) don't convey the distance well, and either could mean a few feet...or a few miles.

Just knowing what's done in practice, the 1/4 sign is probably from the sign to the gore point, so it's probably definitely shorter to the decal lane.

However, the NJ Turnpike has a history of using false measurements...the 2 mile and 1 mile ahead signage for Interchange 1 are actually about 1.6 and .8 miles prior to the toll plaza.

[J Route Z]

The new signs are nice, but some of the mileage on the signs near the exits should be corrected. For instance, the sign pictured in the link below should say 'next right' or 'keep right' instead of 1/4 mile..since it is shorter than that.
https://www.google.com/maps/@40.4685575,-74.408315,16z

The link is only pulling up the generic overhead map.

Regardless, generic terms (keep right/next right) don't convey the distance well, and either could mean a few feet...or a few miles.

Just knowing what's done in practice, the 1/4 sign is probably from the sign to the gore point, so it's probably definitely shorter to the decal lane.

However, the NJ Turnpike has a history of using false measurements...the 2 mile and 1 mile ahead signage for Interchange 1 are actually about 1.6 and .8 miles prior to the toll plaza.

correct link: https://www.google.com/maps/@40.5220153,-74.351034,3a,67.7y,71.13h,95.78t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1su3e9LWknYrbRAYebme9E-A!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

[jeffandnicole]

The new signs are nice, but some of the mileage on the signs near the exits should be corrected. For instance, the sign pictured in the link below should say 'next right' or 'keep right' instead of 1/4 mile..since it is shorter than that.
https://www.google.com/maps/@40.4685575,-74.408315,16z

The link is only pulling up the generic overhead map.

Regardless, generic terms (keep right/next right) don't convey the distance well, and either could mean a few feet...or a few miles.

Just knowing what's done in practice, the 1/4 sign is probably from the sign to the gore point, so it's probably definitely shorter to the decal lane.

However, the NJ Turnpike has a history of using false measurements...the 2 mile and 1 mile ahead signage for Interchange 1 are actually about 1.6 and .8 miles prior to the toll plaza.

correct link: https://www.google.com/maps/@40.5220153,-74.351034,3a,67.7y,71.13h,95.78t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1su3e9LWknYrbRAYebme9E-A!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Oh! LOL

[NJRoadfan]

Those pull-thru signs are using pre-2002 NJTP shields without the thicker border. Somebody screwed up.

[Alps]

The new signs are nice, but some of the mileage on the signs near the exits should be corrected. For instance, the sign pictured in the link below should say 'next right' or 'keep right' instead of 1/4 mile..since it is shorter than that.
https://www.google.com/maps/@40.4685575,-74.408315,16z

The link is only pulling up the generic overhead map.

Regardless, generic terms (keep right/next right) don't convey the distance well, and either could mean a few feet...or a few miles.

Just knowing what's done in practice, the 1/4 sign is probably from the sign to the gore point, so it's probably definitely shorter to the decal lane.

However, the NJ Turnpike has a history of using false measurements...the 2 mile and 1 mile ahead signage for Interchange 1 are actually about 1.6 and .8 miles prior to the toll plaza.

correct link: https://www.google.com/maps/@40.5220153,-74.351034,3a,67.7y,71.13h,95.78t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1su3e9LWknYrbRAYebme9E-A!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

I'd have to say that's about 1/8 mile at best.

[SignBridge]

The MUTCD specifies that distances are to be rounded to the nearest quarter-mile. It may not always be entirely accurate but it's reasonable. New York State DOT back in 1960's used to use the actual distance which got a little absurd. They would show 1/10, 2/10, 6/10, of a mile, etc. It used to look goofy.

[Alps]

The MUTCD specifies that distances are to be rounded to the nearest quarter-mile. It may not always be entirely accurate but it's reasonable. New York State DOT back in 1960's used to use the actual distance which got a little absurd. They would show 1/10, 2/10, 6/10, of a mile, etc. It used to look goofy.

How about 500 feet? The truth is, there are existing sign bridges at the beginning of the decel lane, which used to be the exit sign with arrow. Those were reused for advance signs, so they slapped 1/4 mile up.

[SignBridge]

It seems like the NJTA is over-applying the MUTCD to exit signing. According to the Manual, the exit-direction sign (the one with the arrow) is usually located at the beginning of the deceleration lane like NJTA had in their old system. With their new MUTCD signing, they have moved that sign to the theoretical gore-point and placed an advance sign (mileage to exit shown) where the arrow sign used to be. I don't understand why they've done this. Possibly an effort to provide a little extra signing to aid drivers, or possibly a misunderstanding of the policies in the MUTCD. Maybe jeffandnicole could shed some light on their thinking?

[jeffandnicole]

Not really!!

The Turnpike historically had a 2 mile ahead sign, 1 mile ahead, then the arrow sign (exceptions exist based on various conditions). The decel lanes tended to be unusually long.  Steve probably has the best guess/knowledge above.

[Alps]

It seems like the NJTA is over-applying the MUTCD to exit signing. According to the Manual, the exit-direction sign (the one with the arrow) is usually located at the beginning of the deceleration lane like NJTA had in their old system. With their new MUTCD signing, they have moved that sign to the theoretical gore-point and placed an advance sign (mileage to exit shown) where the arrow sign used to be. I don't understand why they've done this. Possibly an effort to provide a little extra signing to aid drivers, or possibly a misunderstanding of the policies in the MUTCD. Maybe jeffandnicole could shed some light on their thinking?

Most of the figures show arrow signs directly over the gore. Only the last three in the chapter do not, but they are schematic. The ones preceding it are more authoritative in showing the actual gantry locations.

[storm2k]

The new signs are nice, but some of the mileage on the signs near the exits should be corrected. For instance, the sign pictured in the link below should say 'next right' or 'keep right' instead of 1/4 mile..since it is shorter than that.
https://www.google.com/maps/@40.4685575,-74.408315,16z

The real issue is that they're not applying this consistently. 9, 10, 11, 12 use the 1/4 mile for those signs, 13, 13A, and 14 are using Next Right, signs on both spurs are using 1/4 mile. Not sure why they're not consistent.

[Steve D]

The new signs are nice, but some of the mileage on the signs near the exits should be corrected. For instance, the sign pictured in the link below should say 'next right' or 'keep right' instead of 1/4 mile..since it is shorter than that.
https://www.google.com/maps/@40.4685575,-74.408315,16z

The real issue is that they're not applying this consistently. 9, 10, 11, 12 use the 1/4 mile for those signs, 13, 13A, and 14 are using Next Right, signs on both spurs are using 1/4 mile. Not sure why they're not consistent.

The world is not perfect and the NJTP is not either - although they actually try.  My biggest peeve is with the inconsistencies of the  new "Parkway" references on the NJTP - I've heard at exit 11 they now correctly use "Garden State Parkway" in standard font (not caps) but as shown above in a picture for the Palisades Parkway they've continued to use (on the new signs) the old-style PALISADES PARKWAY (with PALISADES in smaller font).  Different contracts, different engineers, different management, etc...

[roadman65]

As long as there are different signing contracts expect inconsistencies to happen.

[SignBridge]

"Next right" is not even shown or approved in the MUTCD anymore. The last Manual that allowed it in place of an arrow on the "exit-direction" sign was the 1971 edition. All conventional type signs (not APL or diagrammatic) should have either a distance message or an arrow. So why it would be used in new signing on the NJTP in 2016 is a puzzle.

[Pete from Boston]

at night, the cops can see the glow of the cell phone against the driver's face.  In NJ...no hand-held cell phone use.  Thus, a driver trying to keep out of a $85 ticket is now facing themselves with a $200 ticket!

Ain't necessarily so.  That same glow can be caused by a cell phone mounted in a holder, affixed to the dash...IOW, not in the driver's hand.  Depending on the exact wording of the law, that may not be a violation.

While technically correct, there's usually a pretty big difference. If a cop were to be behind someone, they would probably clearly see a phone on the dash.

I'm not a cop and I can see the difference, mainly because the drivers head is turned down and to the right, and they are drifting left and right all over the place.

[storm2k]

so i was on the turnpike on saturday night after we had gotten a light snowfall, and the vms's had the usual warnings about winter driving conditions, but the authority had set the speed limits at 50. 50 is weird for them. usually when there are hazardous conditions on the roadway, they will post a 45 mph speed limit, or 35 if it's really bad (especially when it's snowing very hard and the spreaders and plows are in operation). it's been that way for time immortal as far as i know, at least through out my 35 years on this rock. just thought that 50 was arbitrarily weird for this event.

[SignBridge]

50 mph is probably a more realistic number that larger numbers of drivers might come close to following. I can remember as a kid seeing those 35 mph limits posted that my Dad would scoff at as he drove at 50 and many other drivers went flying past us.

[jeffandnicole]

50, while not used all the time, isn't completely unusual.  It's been used most notably at the onset of a storm before conditions worsen.

[jeffandnicole]

In regards to the NJ/PA Turnpike Closure:

Going Northbound, the 2 VMSs prior to Interchange 5 showed the following message:  "(I-276 Shield) Closed Use Exit 5 For Burlington Brstl Br"  Surprisingly, no direct mention of Interchange 6 being closed which means you can't get to 130 as well, so you would have to know that I-276 was Interchange 6.  I have a pic that I have to figure out how to upload, since Photobucket decided to make their app completely useless for uploading pics from an android phone.

Approaching Interchange 6, the VMS was in all red (I believe), stating Interchange 6 was closed.

At Interchange 6, the decal lanes are blocked off with cones.  At the gore point, a Turnpike pickup truck is stationed there blocking the ramp with its yellow strobes flashing (and no one in the vehicle).

Also, a few months back, another greenout fell off one of the advanced signs for Exit 6, revealing 'South 95'.  I've seen this, and was hoping it would be there for me to take a pic.  I got distracted, and forgot to take the pic!  I'll hopefully have another opportunity this week to be on the Turnpike for another shot at it.

[Alps]

In regards to the NJ/PA Turnpike Closure:

Going Northbound, the 2 VMSs prior to Interchange 5 showed the following message:  "(I-276 Shield) Closed Use Exit 5 For Burlington Brstl Br"  Surprisingly, no direct mention of Interchange 6 being closed which means you can't get to 130 as well, so you would have to know that I-276 was Interchange 6.  I have a pic that I have to figure out how to upload, since Photobucket decided to make their app completely useless for uploading pics from an android phone.

Approaching Interchange 6, the VMS was in all red (I believe), stating Interchange 6 was closed.

At Interchange 6, the decal lanes are blocked off with cones.  At the gore point, a Turnpike pickup truck is stationed there blocking the ramp with its yellow strobes flashing (and no one in the vehicle).

Also, a few months back, another greenout fell off one of the advanced signs for Exit 6, revealing 'South 95'.  I've seen this, and was hoping it would be there for me to take a pic.  I got distracted, and forgot to take the pic!  I'll hopefully have another opportunity this week to be on the Turnpike for another shot at it.

The MPT is going to be upgraded soon. Can't speak to detour signage though.

[tckma]

However, the NJ Turnpike has a history of using false measurements...the 2 mile and 1 mile ahead signage for Interchange 1 are actually about 1.6 and .8 miles prior to the toll plaza.

Might that have something to do with the sorta-recent relocation of the toll plaza at exit 1?

[tckma]

In regards to the NJ/PA Turnpike Closure:

Going Northbound, the 2 VMSs prior to Interchange 5 showed the following message:  "(I-276 Shield) Closed Use Exit 5 For Burlington Brstl Br"  Surprisingly, no direct mention of Interchange 6 being closed which means you can't get to 130 as well, so you would have to know that I-276 was Interchange 6.  I have a pic that I have to figure out how to upload, since Photobucket decided to make their app completely useless for uploading pics from an android phone.

Approaching Interchange 6, the VMS was in all red (I believe), stating Interchange 6 was closed.

At Interchange 6, the decal lanes are blocked off with cones.  At the gore point, a Turnpike pickup truck is stationed there blocking the ramp with its yellow strobes flashing (and no one in the vehicle).

Also, a few months back, another greenout fell off one of the advanced signs for Exit 6, revealing 'South 95'.  I've seen this, and was hoping it would be there for me to take a pic.  I got distracted, and forgot to take the pic!  I'll hopefully have another opportunity this week to be on the Turnpike for another shot at it.

On the 25th, when I drove up to Monmouth County from Maryland on a business trip, I noticed that they changed the suggested alternate route from Exit 5 to "Use (I-195 Shield) to (I-295 Shield)" (which you'd have to know means Exit 7A) on VMSs north of Exit 4.  I was confused by the change, especially since the original suggested alternate used Exit 5 -- this would confuse people, I think, to change the suggested alternate before non-local travelers used the original alternate!  Returning from NJ on the 26th I did not use the NJTP (used I-195 to NJ-29 to US-1 to PA Turnpike instead). 

I noticed the Turnpike pickup trucks at the Exit 6 ramps WERE occupied, at least in the driver's seat.  I thought this was a waste of resources; having the unmanned truck there accomplishes the same thing.

[jeffandnicole]

In regards to the NJ/PA Turnpike Closure:

Going Northbound, the 2 VMSs prior to Interchange 5 showed the following message:  "(I-276 Shield) Closed Use Exit 5 For Burlington Brstl Br"  Surprisingly, no direct mention of Interchange 6 being closed which means you can't get to 130 as well, so you would have to know that I-276 was Interchange 6.  I have a pic that I have to figure out how to upload, since Photobucket decided to make their app completely useless for uploading pics from an android phone.

Approaching Interchange 6, the VMS was in all red (I believe), stating Interchange 6 was closed.

At Interchange 6, the decal lanes are blocked off with cones.  At the gore point, a Turnpike pickup truck is stationed there blocking the ramp with its yellow strobes flashing (and no one in the vehicle).

Also, a few months back, another greenout fell off one of the advanced signs for Exit 6, revealing 'South 95'.  I've seen this, and was hoping it would be there for me to take a pic.  I got distracted, and forgot to take the pic!  I'll hopefully have another opportunity this week to be on the Turnpike for another shot at it.

On the 25th, when I drove up to Monmouth County from Maryland on a business trip, I noticed that they changed the suggested alternate route from Exit 5 to "Use (I-195 Shield) to (I-295 Shield)" (which you'd have to know means Exit 7A) on VMSs north of Exit 4.  I was confused by the change, especially since the original suggested alternate used Exit 5 -- this would confuse people, I think, to change the suggested alternate before non-local travelers used the original alternate!  Returning from NJ on the 26th I did not use the NJTP (used I-195 to NJ-29 to US-1 to PA Turnpike instead). 

I noticed the Turnpike pickup trucks at the Exit 6 ramps WERE occupied, at least in the driver's seat.  I thought this was a waste of resources; having the unmanned truck there accomplishes the same thing.

I got on the Turnpike at Interchange 5 today and saw the signs North of there, which now say:

  (276)    |  USE (195)
CLOSED |   EXIT 7A

I had to get off at Exit 7A for work anyway....traffic was slow after the toll plaza...but there was an accident contributing to that.

The VMS on 195 said "PA Turnpike Customers (yes, customers), Take I-95 to Pennsylvania" (or something close to that).  195 to 29 was packed...but fairly normal for a rush hour.

I have since noticed those turnpike pickups have had someone in them....maybe they were laying down the first time I passed. Not only a waste of resorces, but that has got to be boring as all hell.

However, the NJ Turnpike has a history of using false measurements...the 2 mile and 1 mile ahead signage for Interchange 1 are actually about 1.6 and .8 miles prior to the toll plaza.

Might that have something to do with the sorta-recent relocation of the toll plaza at exit 1?

No.  They were all built specifically for the new plaza.

[Alps]

Those pickups are getting replaced with traffic control devices soon enough.

[bzakharin]

In regards to the NJ/PA Turnpike Closure:

Going Northbound, the 2 VMSs prior to Interchange 5 showed the following message:  "(I-276 Shield) Closed Use Exit 5 For Burlington Brstl Br"  Surprisingly, no direct mention of Interchange 6 being closed which means you can't get to 130 as well, so you would have to know that I-276 was Interchange 6.  I have a pic that I have to figure out how to upload, since Photobucket decided to make their app completely useless for uploading pics from an android phone.

Approaching Interchange 6, the VMS was in all red (I believe), stating Interchange 6 was closed.

At Interchange 6, the decal lanes are blocked off with cones.  At the gore point, a Turnpike pickup truck is stationed there blocking the ramp with its yellow strobes flashing (and no one in the vehicle).

Also, a few months back, another greenout fell off one of the advanced signs for Exit 6, revealing 'South 95'.  I've seen this, and was hoping it would be there for me to take a pic.  I got distracted, and forgot to take the pic!  I'll hopefully have another opportunity this week to be on the Turnpike for another shot at it.

On the 25th, when I drove up to Monmouth County from Maryland on a business trip, I noticed that they changed the suggested alternate route from Exit 5 to "Use (I-195 Shield) to (I-295 Shield)" (which you'd have to know means Exit 7A) on VMSs north of Exit 4.  I was confused by the change, especially since the original suggested alternate used Exit 5 -- this would confuse people, I think, to change the suggested alternate before non-local travelers used the original alternate!  Returning from NJ on the 26th I did not use the NJTP (used I-195 to NJ-29 to US-1 to PA Turnpike instead). 

I noticed the Turnpike pickup trucks at the Exit 6 ramps WERE occupied, at least in the driver's seat.  I thought this was a waste of resources; having the unmanned truck there accomplishes the same thing.

I got on the Turnpike at Interchange 5 today and saw the signs North of there, which now say:

  (276)    |  USE (195)
CLOSED |   EXIT 7A

I had to get off at Exit 7A for work anyway....traffic was slow after the toll plaza...but there was an accident contributing to that.

The VMS on 195 said "PA Turnpike Customers (yes, customers), Take I-95 to Pennsylvania" (or something close to that).  195 to 29 was packed...but fairly normal for a rush hour.

I have since noticed those turnpike pickups have had someone in them....maybe they were laying down the first time I passed. Not only a waste of resorces, but that has got to be boring as all hell.

The VMS's on NJ 42 North just say "Turnpike Exit 6 Closed / Use Alternate Route". Presumably they expect people to still get on the Turnpike where the alternate route is spelled out. But from that far south, would taking I-76 (and/or I-95 North depending on where you're headed) be a better alternate to the PA Turnpike? Or does going through Philly negate any benefits of taking that route?